Why is Shai Gilgeous-Alexander considered an “international” player?

[MakeItSplash]

I’ve even seen people call Karl Towns an international player because his mom is Dominican, even though he was was born and raised in New Jersey. .

People seem to be confusing heritage and dual-citizenship.

Karl Anthony-Towns simply chose to play for another national team, under FIBA.

Jahlil Okafor has represented USA and Nigeria
Jordan Clarkson has represented the Philippines.

[Black Jack]

What ? Toronto Metro is 6.6 mil, while whole Canada is 39 mil. I'm outraged by your ignorant statement and I'm not even a Canadian

Fine I was wrong. But still, "just over 60 percent of Canadians live in just two provinces: Ontario and Quebec."

Basically they mostly live right next to the US. calling it "foreign" is stretching it. It's just an imaginary line.

Anyone who lives in Texas or Los Angeles should be classified as Mexican. It's only an imaginary line that divides those 2 states and Mexico.

Meh, I been all over Mexico and trust me USA and Canada are a LOT more similar than the USA is to Mexico.

That said parts of Socal and Texas will have you thinking it's Mexico.

[madskillz8]

Next you’re going to tell me Kyle Anderson isn’t Chinese?!?

He's definitely more Chinese than Embiid is French. But he is less Chinese than SGA is an international player. Or IDK, I'm confused.

He's partially (maternal grandparent).

Lol, I know, that's why I said he's definitely more Chinese than Embiid is French.

[Doctor MJ]

Because he plays for Canada? I've always seen Nash as international because he played for Canada. Ewing and Duncan are seen as American because they played for USA. I go off their national team representation.

So I think the OP has a good point but also want to acknowledge that SGA has chosen to play for Canada and I don't want to take that away from the Canucks.

I've thought a good amount about what the most correct definition for a player's "Origin" is, and I've generally concluded that it has to with where the guy plays high school. There are exceptions to this, particularly in the deeper past, but it's generally in adolescence where players really develop their basketball game.

So with Patrick Ewing, he really doesn't seem to have been focused on basketball until he moved to the US, and that makes it a simple case.

Duncan? Well, he's an American player because he's from the US Virgin Islands, but I would consider those Islands his origin and if they weren't part of the US, I wouldn't call him an American player.

Nash by contrast is quite clearly foreign he came of age in Canadian schools, and this was actually a huge problem for him when he tried to American college scholarships.

SGA, if we're simply considering national borders, is a borderline case here because he was playing basketball in Canada before he went to the US in his sophomore year to get a stronger basketball background. The fact he was thinking in terms of basketball while still being in Canada is an argument to see him as an international player...but the fact that he wasn't even playing varsity high school basketball in Canada makes him a very different case study than Nash who the dominant player of his Canadian province.

There's another factor here that I'm not sure the perfect way to present:

The implication of being an international player is that you grew up in a different basketball culture from American basketball players, and so when any other country gets to the point where their athletes move to the US once they start taking basketball seriously, I don't think they still represent a distinct culture.

Or to put it another way: When you get a scholarship offer to Kentucky, not because you're a 7 foot project with unknown ceiling, but because they've already seen you play against other American prospects and are ranked on all sorts of top recruit lists, you're not really a foreign product.

Now, I want to emphasize that this is true of all countries, but the fact that Canada is right next to the US, and Toronto has emerged as the great city of Canada because it speaks the US language and is super-close to major American cities, made this all the more likely to happen. Modern Canada is built around its most American city, and so those growing up there are likely to be able to jump into American development systems when those are advantageous.

As I say all this, Canadian friends, let me emphasize that I'm a big fan of your country and some of the decisions your country has made that deviate from the US. It's just it's not really a coincidence that your biggest city is so tied to the US.

[srhcan]

Shai was born in Canada, went to high school in Tennessee and played college ball at Kentucky. How this any different than Patrick Ewing, who was born in Jamaica, went to high school in Massachusetts and played college ball at Georgetown? Why isn’t Ewing considered an international player?

Why aren’t Steve Nash and Tim Duncan considered international players? Nash was born in South Africa and raised in Canada. Duncan was born and raised in the Virgin Islands. Shouldn’t they be apart of the so-called “international takeover” that I keep hearing about?

Seems like most people don’t consider them foreign since played in the NCAA. Yet Embiid, Sabonis, and Shai all played in the NCAA and are all considered foreign players.

I’ve even seen people call Karl Towns an international player because his mom is Dominican, even though he was was born and raised in New Jersey. So should Kareem be considered an international player since his parents are from Trinidad?

We might as well call Shaq an international player since his stepdad is Jamaican.

It seems like the definition of “international” has been changed to inflate the dominance of foreign players on today’s league. Jokic, Luka, and Giannis are the only purely foreign superstars in the league right now.

Any player who was brought up in US school & college system, should not be considered an international player. So I dont consider Shai an international player.

So 2 years of high school and 1 year of college supersede 16 years in Toronto and Hamilton? The guy spends his summers in Toronto, plays for the Canadian national team,

If you want to play in the best league in the world, you eventually have to come to the US. In fact, if you aspire to the highest level in many professions, you need to get to the US. Tons of Canadian kids come to the US for college, post grad, and end up working here. Does that make them not-Canadian?

I think we may have found Mark Jones' realgm account.

who said Shai is not Canadian? He is pride of Canada. But he has a north american identity (Canadian + US) so I would not call him international player as far as NBA is concerned. For NBA, an international player is someone whose base is outside of North America where he learn and develop his game.

[ForeverTFC]

Any player who was brought up in US school & college system, should not be considered an international player. So I dont consider Shai an international player.

So 2 years of high school and 1 year of college supersede 16 years in Toronto and Hamilton? The guy spends his summers in Toronto, plays for the Canadian national team,

If you want to play in the best league in the world, you eventually have to come to the US. In fact, if you aspire to the highest level in many professions, you need to get to the US. Tons of Canadian kids come to the US for college, post grad, and end up working here. Does that make them not-Canadian?

I think we may have found Mark Jones' realgm account.

who said Shai is not Canadian? He is pride of Canada. But he has a north american identity (Canadian + US) so I would not call him international player as far as NBA is concerned. For NBA, an international player is someone whose base is outside of North America where he learn and develop his game.

Ah alright. I misunderstood your post. Sorry for calling you Mark Jones.

I agree with your take that it's a north american league and so Canadians shouldn't be called international players, but outside the Canadian flag and a few games here or there, the league rarely recognizes that it's also a Canadian league.

[Ssj16]

Fine I was wrong. But still, "just over 60 percent of Canadians live in just two provinces: Ontario and Quebec."

Basically they mostly live right next to the US. calling it "foreign" is stretching it. It's just an imaginary line.

Anyone who lives in Texas or Los Angeles should be classified as Mexican. It's only an imaginary line that divides those 2 states and Mexico.

Meh, I been all over Mexico and trust me USA and Canada are a LOT more similar than the USA is to Mexico.

That said parts of Socal and Texas will have you thinking it's Mexico.

Just because two countries are similar or are close in proximity, it doesn't mean they should be merged into 1. Your "Canada should be part of America" take is hilariously bad, for this reason.

[dhsilv2]

Why aren’t Steve Nash and Tim Duncan considered international players? Nash was born in South Africa and raised in Canada. Duncan was born and raised in the Virgin Islands. Shouldn’t they be apart of the so-called “international takeover” that I keep hearing about?

The Virgin Islands are a part of america...

[D.Brasco]

I think OP is over complicating things. For a basketball standpoint at least it's very much based on which national team you play for. I think that's how it's viewed in soccer as well when defining a players nationality.

For anyone who brings up Embiid, yeah he's an outlier in that he's sought out to play for Team USA but he's the exception to the rule.

[azcatz11]

Why aren’t Steve Nash and Tim Duncan considered international players? Nash was born in South Africa and raised in Canada. Duncan was born and raised in the Virgin Islands. Shouldn’t they be apart of the so-called “international takeover” that I keep hearing about?

The Virgin Islands are a part of america...

I’ve been to st croix a few times. Such an awesome place and yes, no passport needed.

[Lalouie]

Shai was born in Canada, went to high school in Tennessee and played college ball at Kentucky. How this any different than Patrick Ewing, who was born in Jamaica, went to high school in Massachusetts and played college ball at Georgetown? Why isn’t Ewing considered an international player?

Why aren’t Steve Nas,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I’ve even seen people call Karl Towns an international player because his mom is Dominican, even though he was was born and raised in New Jersey. So should Kareem be considered an international player since his parents are from Trinida,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
It seems like the definition of “international” has been changed to inflate the dominance of foreign players on today’s league. Jokic, Luka, and Giannis are the only purely foreign superstars in the league right now.

didn't those other guys opt to play for the usa and shai opted for canada?. it could be as simple as actions speaking louder than words

[binjumper]

I see some valid points, but the NBA has a Canadian team, so Canadians shouldn't be considered international players imo. This the only country outside the US that should be able to make that claim because of the team.

[dhsilv2]

Shai was born in Canada, went to high school in Tennessee and played college ball at Kentucky. How this any different than Patrick Ewing, who was born in Jamaica, went to high school in Massachusetts and played college ball at Georgetown? Why isn’t Ewing considered an international player?

Why aren’t Steve Nas,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
I’ve even seen people call Karl Towns an international player because his mom is Dominican, even though he was was born and raised in New Jersey. So should Kareem be considered an international player since his parents are from Trinida,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
It seems like the definition of “international” has been changed to inflate the dominance of foreign players on today’s league. Jokic, Luka, and Giannis are the only purely foreign superstars in the league right now.

didn't those other guys opt to play for the usa and shai opted for canada?. it could be as simple as actions speaking louder than words

People can call me names all they want. KAT was born in the US, raised in the US, and has never lived anywhere else. Playing for another country isn't going to make me consider him international. I'd be more open to Kobe being international given he did grow up a good part of his life outside of the states. Still wouldn't agree, but it's at least something we have room to talk about.

[JasonStern]

Players should be able to represent whatever country they identify with - within reason. If Shai wants to identify as 'Merican, glad to have you. If he wants to identify as Canadian, that's cool too. Nobody complained when Chris Kaman, born in Michigan, claimed close ties to his German roots and played for them.

[jkvonny]

He's definitely more Chinese than Embiid is French. But he is less Chinese than SGA is an international player. Or IDK, I'm confused.

He's partially Chinese (maternal grandparent).

Lol, I know, that's why I said he's definitely more Chinese than Embiid is French.

Gotcha!

[Pointgod]

Despite what our neighbours to the South believe, no Canada is not a U.S. state.

[Clyde Frazier]

This is one of the most misguided threads I've ever read

[Mirotic12]

Tim Duncan actually is considered an international player. He is from the US Virgin Islands, so a US citizen, but basketball wise, he's considered an international player because the US Virgin Islands has its own national basketball team. Virgin Islands was his de facto national team, and he chose to instead switch to the USA team, which was not his natural default national team. Therefore, he is considered an international player.

It's the same exact thing with how guys like Carlos Arroyo or JJ Barea are considered to be international players. Because even though they are US citizens, Puerto Rico has its own national team, and because of that, it's their default national team. So that makes them international players, just like Duncan.

[Frankie]

I'm not from NA but it has always seemed weird that Americans and Canadians viewed each other as foreigners. I know they are but still. It's like meeting an Irishman from Dublin here in London. Yes technically he's a foreigner but it doesn't feel like he is one.

[Black Jack]

SGA is entirely alien to American culture. Why I bet he doesn't even speak the same language. SGA not like us!