Miami Heat Offseason Thread vol. 2 : We Running it Back.. (WITH MITCHELL!)

[twix2500]

Each year you have to spend 90% of the cap and just because you have space doesn't mean good players will come. So who are you spending that money on that is better than either of those? Maybe Miami will find its next D.Waiters or J.Johnson? You'd also be flushing a few years of Bam's prime down the toilet.

I don't mind seeing Miami go back to what they were building before Butler forced his way to Miami which greatly helped the franchise.

Not a 37 year old. I will spend the money on someone whose best days aren't far in his rear-view mirror.

The alternative to an obviously bad decision isn't only other bad decisions. For example, you could make good ones instead.

You mean like the ones they were doing before Butler forced his way to Miami, handing multi-year contracts out to guys like Waiters, Johnson or maxing out Whiteside? That to me seems a way worse decision since you have to spend the money every year and Miami loves to overpay midlevel talent.

At least with Butler there's a chance he can be a difference maker, even in his mid 30s. If Miami can find a new #1, move Butler, but don't do it before and risk half a decade or more of first round outs with little to no hope of doing better.

Whiteside contract got Jimmy Butler. The point of signing Waiters, Whiteside and Johnson was to trade them. The Heat didnt have draft picks to trade. They had to make trade pawns out of projects which they did. They turned Whiteside, Waiters and Johnson into Butler, Iggy and Crowder.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Love a potential deal with Houston for that 3rd pick. Give me Nikola Topic with that pick. Topic and Jovic would be fun for the future.

[DayofMourning]

Love a potential deal with Houston for that 3rd pick. Give me Nikola Topic with that pick. Topic and Jovic would be fun for the future.

You think Houston would be willing to give more than the 3rd pick for Butler?

[greg4012]

Read on Twitter

Here we go

Give us a star and we'll give you the least valuable #3 pick of all time! How does a Super Mario Chalmers sound?

Nikola Topic to team with Jovic could be interesting no?

Topic is def interesting. I'd love to have him on the team. I wouldn't be thrilled at the prospect of trading Jimmy Butler for Nikola Topic. In an average draft, I don't think Topic has shown enough to be a top 10 pick. His 3-ball is purely theoretical and his defense is a question mark. He's a GREAT playmaker inside the arc and is very good scoring around the rim. Right now he's a long-necked young Dragic without a 3 ball. Plus, his injury concerns are starting to become a thing.

[Beenie]

I’m not advocating for moving Jimmy or anything but his impact on the regular season just wasn’t anything to speak of. You can allocate his $50M elsewhere and pretty easily find ourselves back into the play in tourney worst case. There weren’t any games where he was just willing us to wins. As annoying as he is in the regular season it’s fine I guess as long as he shows up when it matters, he didn’t this season and in return it was a wasted season mostly on his shoulders

I'm not convinced that replacing Jimmy with discardable role players wouldnt result in a steep drop off.

The team would struggle to get 30 wins.

Since he’s been in a Heat jersey he’s missed 100 games, we’re 50-50 in those games. 41 win rate.

The last 3 seasons he’s missed 65 games, we’re 37-28 in those games. 47 win rate.

If you allocated his $50M to another all star and a role player or 3-4 very solid role players they’d worst case be in the same regular season situation we’re currently in. Nothing points to struggling to win 30 games.

Adding an allstar and a role player is very different than adding 2 role players.

Regarding the W/L rate without Jimmy, this reminds me of a couple years ago when Memphis won a bunch of games w/o Ja - they went something like 21-5 when he was inactive; and some people actually argued that they were better without him.

We saw what happened to them this season.

[Beenie]

Give us a star and we'll give you the least valuable #3 pick of all time! How does a Super Mario Chalmers sound?

Nikola Topic to team with Jovic could be interesting no?

Topic is def interesting. I'd love to have him on the team. I wouldn't be thrilled at the prospect of trading Jimmy Butler for Nikola Topic. In an average draft, I don't think Topic has shown enough to be a top 10 pick. His 3-ball is purely theoretical and his defense is a question mark. He's a GREAT playmaker inside the arc and is very good scoring around the rim. Right now he's a long-necked young Dragic without a 3 ball.

Stephon Castle reminds me of Jimmy.

If Mia does indeed trade Jimmy, Id rather him go out west.

Getting the 3rd pick and taking Castle and maybe getting one of Hou's young players at least wouldnt be the abomination of trading him to Philly.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

I'm not convinced that replacing Jimmy with discardable role players wouldnt result in a steep drop off.

The team would struggle to get 30 wins.

Since he’s been in a Heat jersey he’s missed 100 games, we’re 50-50 in those games. 41 win rate.

The last 3 seasons he’s missed 65 games, we’re 37-28 in those games. 47 win rate.

If you allocated his $50M to another all star and a role player or 3-4 very solid role players they’d worst case be in the same regular season situation we’re currently in. Nothing points to struggling to win 30 games.

Adding an allstar and a role player is very different than adding 2 role players.

Regarding the W/L rate without Jimmy, this reminds me of a couple years ago when Memphis won a bunch of games w/o Ja - they went something like 21-5 when he was inactive; and some people actually argued that they were better without him.

We saw what happened to them this season.

You’re getting 3-4 high level role players with $50M lol. Regardless you could take Jimmy off this team and do nothing and they’re in the play in tourney with over 30 wins.

Thats 1 season, grizzlies are like 53-76 without Ja since he’s been there.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Any Jimmy trade has to have a younger all star heading our way in a 3 teamer or as a follow up move. We’re not punting Bams prime hoping players from crapshoot drafts are ready to heavily contribute to winning championships in 3 years

[MettaWorldPanda]

Read on Twitter

[MettaWorldPanda]

Love a potential deal with Houston for that 3rd pick. Give me Nikola Topic with that pick. Topic and Jovic would be fun for the future.

You think Houston would be willing to give more than the 3rd pick for Butler?

If we get them in a bidding war with the Sixers yes

[MettaWorldPanda]

Nikola Topic to team with Jovic could be interesting no?

Topic is def interesting. I'd love to have him on the team. I wouldn't be thrilled at the prospect of trading Jimmy Butler for Nikola Topic. In an average draft, I don't think Topic has shown enough to be a top 10 pick. His 3-ball is purely theoretical and his defense is a question mark. He's a GREAT playmaker inside the arc and is very good scoring around the rim. Right now he's a long-necked young Dragic without a 3 ball.

Stephon Castle reminds me of Jimmy.

If Mia does indeed trade Jimmy, Id rather him go out west.

Getting the 3rd pick and taking Castle and maybe getting one of Hou's young players at least wouldnt be the abomination of trading him to Philly.

Castle would be highly interesting as well. He’s being a baby about not working out with teams that have starting PG’s already.

[RexBoyWonder]

Read on Twitter

I want to keep Jimmy and add a star.

But if we can't - Paul George staying with Clippers is a good important thing.

Philly will be left with no other star to go after, Embbid's prime getting shorter - and desperate teams will offer a pretty coin for Jimmy.

We just might pull off a quick retool of

Trey young or Mitchell to Mia
Jimmy to Philly
Picks and filler to Hawks or Cavs

[3ammy3uck3ts]

How desperate are you Philly? Well let you all keep a 1st if you throw in Maxey and we’ll even send you Herro

[Beenie]

Read on Twitter

I want to keep Jimmy and add a star.

But if we can't - Paul George staying with Clippers is a good important thing.

Philly will be left with no other star to go after, Embbid's prime getting shorter - and desperate teams will offer a pretty coin for Jimmy.

We just might pull off a quick retool of

Trey young or Mitchell to Mia
Jimmy to Philly
Picks and filler to Hawks or Cavs

Philly can still settle for signing Derozan or trading for Ingram

[greg4012]

Read on Twitter

I want to keep Jimmy and add a star.

But if we can't - Paul George staying with Clippers is a good important thing.

Philly will be left with no other star to go after, Embbid's prime getting shorter - and desperate teams will offer a pretty coin for Jimmy.

We just might pull off a quick retool of

Trey young or Mitchell to Mia
Jimmy to Philly
Picks and filler to Hawks or Cavs

Philly can go offer OG Anunoby a max and f**k with the Knicks

[twix2500]

IF the Heat decide to explore trading Butler, Pelicans and Houston likely would be on the list. However I would assume the Suns, Mavs and Lakers would be calling. There would be a lot of suitors

[VaDe255]

It's ideal if Jimmy gets traded, I just don't see how they could build a contender with Jimmy/Bam and the limited assets that they have.

I prefer 76ers, because I think he has a real shot winning a ring there and I'd be really happy if he can get one.
Castle looks very promising indeed, but I don't really see why Jimmy would want to go to Houston that would be doing him dirty.
Trae is an amazing fit, if they could get Castle, but this is highly improbable.

Getting more assets, evaluate the young players (and those you get extra in the draft), fix the cap space and if a high impact player shakes looks then get him. This should really be the plan, but I doubt they do it.

[TroubleS0me]

Watch on YouTube

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[Grumpy Heat Fan]

Love a potential deal with Houston for that 3rd pick. Give me Nikola Topic with that pick. Topic and Jovic would be fun for the future.

At that point, we should make a move for Joker too. Get the triple crown of Jovic, Jokic, and Topic, and mess with broadcasters trying to keep them organized during the announcing

[AirP.]

Not a 37 year old. I will spend the money on someone whose best days aren't far in his rear-view mirror.

The alternative to an obviously bad decision isn't only other bad decisions. For example, you could make good ones instead.

You mean like the ones they were doing before Butler forced his way to Miami, handing multi-year contracts out to guys like Waiters, Johnson or maxing out Whiteside? That to me seems a way worse decision since you have to spend the money every year and Miami loves to overpay midlevel talent.

At least with Butler there's a chance he can be a difference maker, even in his mid 30s. If Miami can find a new #1, move Butler, but don't do it before and risk half a decade or more of first round outs with little to no hope of doing better.

Whiteside contract got Jimmy Butler. The point of signing Waiters, Whiteside and Johnson was to trade them. The Heat didnt have draft picks to trade. They had to make trade pawns out of projects which they did. They turned Whiteside, Waiters and Johnson into Butler, Iggy and Crowder.

Well, they traded Whiteside once the Dallas trade fell through, up to that point Miami was keeping him. It took Miami sending out an additional 1st to get Whiteside traded by rerouting Harkless to the Clippers.

Whiteside was signed to the max so Miami didn't lose him for nothing.
Waiters and Johnson resigned because of that good 2nd half of season Miami had.

Without Butler forcing his way to Miami, that 19-20 season and for the next few seasons probably would have been really bad and more than likely Iggy wouldn't have showed up in Miami like he didn't show up in Memphis nor would Miami probably make that Memphis trade. You could still be looking at the future of the big 3 of Bam, Herro and Winslow.