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'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target?

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'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#1 » by torsport » Sun Jun 9, 2024 2:09 pm

How Boston acquired KP and a pick because he was considered a 'toxic asset' made me wonder what the Raps could do similarly to acquire depth and future picks.

Are there players/teams out there that the Raps can target to use their financial flexibility.

I was thinking Lakers:
Gabe Vincent/Rui along with future 1st round pick.

Sacramento:
Huerter/Barnes along with future 1st or 2nd rounders.

Phoenix:
They're going to have to do something if they keep their core together. The only problem is that their core are the toxic assets.

Milwaukee:
Similar to Phoenix, Middleton is a core piece, but also a contract preventing them from adding depth around Dame/Giannis.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#2 » by freamon » Sun Jun 9, 2024 2:15 pm

Just because Porzingis worked out for Boston doesn't mean it's the right strategy for us.

We are looking for pieces that complement our 22-to-24 year old core. The lens for any move involving Middleton, Harrison Barnes, etc, has to be: how does this help us build the core? Thus, any trade where we take on salary would have to:
  • Include young assets we want, like Keegan Murray, who they don't seem willing to part with
  • Maybe include draft picks, although we'd prefer players who fit the timeline and aren't 3 years away
  • Not improve our record next year too much, since we will be in the lottery balls business again
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#3 » by tecumseh18 » Sun Jun 9, 2024 2:35 pm

freamon wrote:Just because Porzingis worked out for Boston doesn't mean it's the right strategy for us.

We are looking for pieces that complement our 22-to-24 year old core. The lens for any move involving Middleton, Harrison Barnes, etc, has to be: how does this help us build the core? Thus, any trade where we take on salary would have to:
  • Include young assets we want, like Keegan Murray, who they don't seem willing to part with
  • Maybe include draft picks, although we'd prefer players who fit the timeline and aren't 3 years away
  • Not improve our record next year too much, since we will be in the lottery balls business again


Yes, although I think 2025 draft picks that are unlikely to fall betwen 25 and 30 would still be valued. Darko said the other day that the 2025 and 2026 drafts are considered strong, but I doubt the Raps want to be in the lottery for another two years. Surely at least the play-in will be a target in 2026. So after missing out this year, 2025 HAS to count. We need at least a mid-lottery pick, and as many other chances to come away with an OG-level difference maker as possible.

So we're not looking for a Porzingis. Even Wiggins might be too much of risk, if he turns his game back around the way RJ did with us (although then we could trade him). We're looking for scrubs with bad contracts attached to draft picks. Huerter, maybe (although he may turn it around).
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#4 » by Merit » Sun Jun 9, 2024 2:37 pm

Wiggins
Lavine
Zion
I believe in Masai.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#5 » by TorontoRapsFan » Sun Jun 9, 2024 2:42 pm

torsport wrote:How Boston acquired KP and a pick because he was considered a 'toxic asset' made me wonder what the Raps could do similarly to acquire depth and future picks.

Are there players/teams out there that the Raps can target to use their financial flexibility.

I was thinking Lakers:
Gabe Vincent/Rui along with future 1st round pick.

Sacramento:
Huerter/Barnes along with future 1st or 2nd rounders.

Phoenix:
They're going to have to do something if they keep their core together. The only problem is that their core are the toxic assets.

Milwaukee:
Similar to Phoenix, Middleton is a core piece, but also a contract preventing them from adding depth around Dame/Giannis.


Outside of Huerter I wouldn't say any of those are toxic assets. Middleton is close cause his salary and contribution don't match anymore and the reasons you said.

Barnes started 82 games for them, is still a good player and vet, and has a very decent contract.
Vincent is on a 10 mil contract. That itself doesn't make it toxic. He'd be perfect for a sign and trade.
Rui is good enough but apparently Lakers don't like him, probably trade him, but not dump him.

There are very few toxic assets out there. I'd add Lavine and Wiggins to the list. But I wouldn't want Raps taking on either. To have a chance to be worth their contract they'd need to get high usage and I'd rather stick with the core now.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#6 » by ontnut » Sun Jun 9, 2024 2:47 pm

I've been trying to figure out how to get GTJ / Brown / Poeltl (In that order) to the Lakers, and to bring back at least 1 pick. Most iterations have Rui coming back, for salary, which I'm fine with.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#7 » by ConSarnit » Sun Jun 9, 2024 3:03 pm

torsport wrote:How Boston acquired KP and a pick because he was considered a 'toxic asset' made me wonder what the Raps could do similarly to acquire depth and future picks.

Are there players/teams out there that the Raps can target to use their financial flexibility.

I was thinking Lakers:
Gabe Vincent/Rui along with future 1st round pick.

Sacramento:
Huerter/Barnes along with future 1st or 2nd rounders.

Phoenix:
They're going to have to do something if they keep their core together. The only problem is that their core are the toxic assets.

Milwaukee:
Similar to Phoenix, Middleton is a core piece, but also a contract preventing them from adding depth around Dame/Giannis.


I don’t think some of these guys would return a 1st unless we are giving them an upgrade.

Barnes: perfectly solid starter making $18m. Definitely not the type of guy that gets dumped. A team like DET would take him for free.

Huerter: maybe slightly overpaid but probably not “pay a 1st” to get off him overpaid.

Rui: solid rotation player. Overpaid by a couple million. If he’s dumped would probably happen next off-season (when we lack space). Lakers also have few 1sts to trade so using one to get off a contract right now doesn’t make sense as they need those assets for trade.

It’s seems like a tough market to get paid in salary dumps right now. Teams can now use the MLE to absorb players so the competition for anyone making <$13m becomes tougher. Then the guys between $14-25m aren’t crazily overpaid. It’s tough to find many $20m deals that are just really bad (ie require a 1st to get off of). Matching salary rules for contracts below $29m also make it easier for more teams to get involved. If a team is trying to get off $18m they only have to take back $10.5m. That type of $7.5m savings is usually enough to help a team if they are trying to avoid tax issues. A number like $10.5m is also fairly easy for most teams to send out.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#8 » by Rapsfan07 » Sun Jun 9, 2024 3:20 pm

Hunter is probably available as well.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#9 » by anotherhomer » Sun Jun 9, 2024 3:31 pm

Andre hunter
Wiggins

Lavine doesn't fit though
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#10 » by Pointgod » Sun Jun 9, 2024 4:26 pm

torsport wrote:How Boston acquired KP and a pick because he was considered a 'toxic asset' made me wonder what the Raps could do similarly to acquire depth and future picks.

Are there players/teams out there that the Raps can target to use their financial flexibility.

I was thinking Lakers:
Gabe Vincent/Rui along with future 1st round pick.

Sacramento:
Huerter/Barnes along with future 1st or 2nd rounders.

Phoenix:
They're going to have to do something if they keep their core together. The only problem is that their core are the toxic assets.

Milwaukee:
Similar to Phoenix, Middleton is a core piece, but also a contract preventing them from adding depth around Dame/Giannis.


Remember KP wasn’t seen as a toxic contract. He was actually expiring if he didn’t opt into his contract and the Wizards chose to get assets back instead of losing him for nothing.

The two picks that Boston received with KP were from Memphis for Marcus Smart. This wasn’t a salary dump situation, Memphis was getting the defensive player of the year.

In the end:
Boston gets KP and two firsts and lose Smart and salary filler
Memphis gets Smart and loses Tyus Jones and two picks
Wizards lose KP and get Tyus Jones, salary filler and a pick.

Guys like Rui and Gabe Vincent aren’t toxic contracts, they only have two years left at reasonable money. Toxic contracts are like Wiggins, Hunter, Zach Lavine guys who are owed big money for 3+ seasons. These guys would be goood trade targets especially if teams will attach a pick to get off of them.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#11 » by 2019nbachamps » Sun Jun 9, 2024 4:37 pm

We aren’t 1 player away from changing our fortunes. Let’s build a competent 10-man roster first and then explore what big upgrades we need to make.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#12 » by ArthurVandelay » Sun Jun 9, 2024 4:40 pm

2019nbachamps wrote:We aren’t 1 player away from changing our fortunes. Let’s build a competent 10-man roster first and then explore what big upgrades we need to make.


might I add…

….10-man roster with a surplus of draft picks first and then…
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#13 » by Raps in 4 » Sun Jun 9, 2024 4:53 pm

There is no trade available right now that makes sense for this team.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#14 » by Snappycoocoo » Sun Jun 9, 2024 4:55 pm

Wiggins
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#15 » by Tor_Raps » Sun Jun 9, 2024 4:59 pm

Why do people think that going after a toxic asset means you need to be in championship contention? Very weird thinking considering we just got "toxic asset" RJ in a trade with IQ and a good pick lol.

These are the moves that require good foresight and can help push your team further. Porizingis is one example and Kyrie is another one.

In regards to our team, I've been pushing for us to go after Wiggins for the same reasons. Worst case, Wiggins expires the same time as RJ/Poeltl and we get something with him that hopefully helps the rebuild. Best case, our rebuild gets put on a flukey fast path like we did during the Demar/Lowry era that led to the best times in this franchise's history.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#16 » by PushDaRock » Sun Jun 9, 2024 5:00 pm

Pointgod wrote:
torsport wrote:How Boston acquired KP and a pick because he was considered a 'toxic asset' made me wonder what the Raps could do similarly to acquire depth and future picks.

Are there players/teams out there that the Raps can target to use their financial flexibility.

I was thinking Lakers:
Gabe Vincent/Rui along with future 1st round pick.

Sacramento:
Huerter/Barnes along with future 1st or 2nd rounders.

Phoenix:
They're going to have to do something if they keep their core together. The only problem is that their core are the toxic assets.

Milwaukee:
Similar to Phoenix, Middleton is a core piece, but also a contract preventing them from adding depth around Dame/Giannis.


Remember KP wasn’t seen as a toxic contract. He was actually expiring if he didn’t opt into his contract and the Wizards chose to get assets back instead of losing him for nothing.

The two picks that Boston received with KP were from Memphis for Marcus Smart. This wasn’t a salary dump situation, Memphis was getting the defensive player of the year.

In the end:
Boston gets KP and two firsts and lose Smart and salary filler
Memphis gets Smart and loses Tyus Jones and two picks
Wizards lose KP and get Tyus Jones, salary filler and a pick.

Guys like Rui and Gabe Vincent aren’t toxic contracts, they only have two years left at reasonable money. Toxic contracts are like Wiggins, Hunter, Zach Lavine guys who are owed big money for 3+ seasons. These guys would be goood trade targets especially if teams will attach a pick to get off of them.


Seems a bit unfair to consider Hunter a toxic contract as well. He just had a career year while putting up almost 16 a game on 60 TS%.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#17 » by ItsDanger » Sun Jun 9, 2024 5:08 pm

Acquiring a toxic contract isn't a tactic this front office favors based on history.
But if they don't utilize their cap space, it needs to be an option that is explored. Should be able to obtain additional draft capital or young players. If they don't believe they'll be competitive until 25/26 or later, I don't see why they should sit on their hands, take advantage of opportunities.
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#18 » by Tor_Raps » Sun Jun 9, 2024 5:32 pm

PushDaRock wrote:
Pointgod wrote:
torsport wrote:How Boston acquired KP and a pick because he was considered a 'toxic asset' made me wonder what the Raps could do similarly to acquire depth and future picks.

Are there players/teams out there that the Raps can target to use their financial flexibility.

I was thinking Lakers:
Gabe Vincent/Rui along with future 1st round pick.

Sacramento:
Huerter/Barnes along with future 1st or 2nd rounders.

Phoenix:
They're going to have to do something if they keep their core together. The only problem is that their core are the toxic assets.

Milwaukee:
Similar to Phoenix, Middleton is a core piece, but also a contract preventing them from adding depth around Dame/Giannis.


Remember KP wasn’t seen as a toxic contract. He was actually expiring if he didn’t opt into his contract and the Wizards chose to get assets back instead of losing him for nothing.

The two picks that Boston received with KP were from Memphis for Marcus Smart. This wasn’t a salary dump situation, Memphis was getting the defensive player of the year.

In the end:
Boston gets KP and two firsts and lose Smart and salary filler
Memphis gets Smart and loses Tyus Jones and two picks
Wizards lose KP and get Tyus Jones, salary filler and a pick.

Guys like Rui and Gabe Vincent aren’t toxic contracts, they only have two years left at reasonable money. Toxic contracts are like Wiggins, Hunter, Zach Lavine guys who are owed big money for 3+ seasons. These guys would be goood trade targets especially if teams will attach a pick to get off of them.


Seems a bit unfair to consider Hunter a toxic contract as well. He just had a career year while putting up almost 16 a game on 60 TS%.


To be fair, Hunter always being injured is what causes him to be a toxic asset. A team trying to win would definitely consider him toxic but a team like us could be willing to take the risk and hope he can stay on the court.

He would be a great addition to this team. Probably could have had him + stuff for Siakam but could still maybe get him depending on what the Hawks want to do going forward (win now vs rebuild).
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#19 » by Mr.Raptorsingh » Sun Jun 9, 2024 5:33 pm

De'Andre Hunter
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Re: 'Toxic Assets' for Raps to target? 

Post#20 » by Ackshun » Sun Jun 9, 2024 5:52 pm

anotherhomer wrote:Andre hunter
Wiggins

Lavine doesn't fit though


I like Lavine here but that price tag scares me off. I like Hunter a little more because we can keep RJ in the backcourt, where he has found his groove and get Scottie over to the point forward position.

Scottie shot 34% from 3, so this lineup would give 4 guys that shoot long distance with Poetl in the middle. It’s not bad and likely better than anything else we’ll be able to put together through the draft or free agency.

I’ve felt strongly about NO to Wiggins but after some time to reflect, I’m warming up to it. But I still don’t see where the $$ comes to build a bench, and that starting five isn’t something I think deserves the tax penalties.

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