Free Agency

[Canadafan]

So if the differences are marginal today, wouldn't it make sense to keep the guy who projects to be the better player within the next couple of years and is a lot cheaper and spend that money elsewhere? Ideally on someone that doesn't just have all of the same weaknesses Ivey has? Both are terrible defenders. Both are below average & very streaky spot-up shooters. Both prefer to play on the ball to maximize their talent. Why would we spend $25M/year on another one of those when we're already worried about the fit of the first one?

I'd argue that Monk projects to be the better player within the next couple of years.

But I agree that I'd rather spend that money elsewhere and agree witht the focus on defense. But I'd also trade Ivey, personally.

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

Do u guys consider Bridges a guard? I always thought of his as a forward hmmmm

[Kalamazoo317]

So if the differences are marginal today, wouldn't it make sense to keep the guy who projects to be the better player within the next couple of years and is a lot cheaper and spend that money elsewhere? Ideally on someone that doesn't just have all of the same weaknesses Ivey has? Both are terrible defenders. Both are below average & very streaky spot-up shooters. Both prefer to play on the ball to maximize their talent. Why would we spend $25M/year on another one of those when we're already worried about the fit of the first one?

I'd argue that Monk projects to be the better player within the next couple of years.

But I agree that I'd rather spend that money elsewhere and agree witht the focus on defense. But I'd also trade Ivey, personally.

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

To be clear, I'm not super into Monk or Ivey alongside Cade

[Kalamazoo317]

I'd argue that Monk projects to be the better player within the next couple of years.

But I agree that I'd rather spend that money elsewhere and agree witht the focus on defense. But I'd also trade Ivey, personally.

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

Do u guys consider Bridges a guard? I always thought of his as a forward hmmmm

He's a 2/3 wing, so should be able to play either shooting guard or small forward just fine

[vege]

I don't hate it, and the guy seems very smart, especially the way he talk about Monty and I imagine he is correct about that.

The only part I hate is, he is trading one pick too many to get Ingram, and that's not even legal, but we could do worse than add Ingram/Jonas/D.Robinson/Bullock/J.Smith

Watch on YouTube

[7r5ur]

I'd argue that Monk projects to be the better player within the next couple of years.

But I agree that I'd rather spend that money elsewhere and agree witht the focus on defense. But I'd also trade Ivey, personally.

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

Do u guys consider Bridges a guard? I always thought of his as a forward hmmmm

He can play the 2. He's like 6-6 210lb. Good size for the 2. It's really about who you can guard anyways. If you start Cade/Bridges/Ausar, you can just put Ausar and Bridges on the 2 best perimeter players and call it a day. Or you could put in Grimes instead of Ausar if he's shooting well and Bridges can go to the 3. The flexibility of that is probably the best part.

[Canadafan]

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

Do u guys consider Bridges a guard? I always thought of his as a forward hmmmm

He can play the 2. He's like 6-6 210lb. Good size for the 2. It's really about who you can guard anyways. If you start Cade/Bridges/Ausar, you can just put Ausar and Bridges on the 2 best perimeter players and call it a day. Or you could put in Grimes instead of Ausar if he's shooting well and Bridges can go to the 3. The flexibility of that is probably the best part.

Love the sounds of that. That trio on the perimeter looks golden to me. I'm a huge fan of defense

[Kalamazoo317]

Do u guys consider Bridges a guard? I always thought of his as a forward hmmmm

He can play the 2. He's like 6-6 210lb. Good size for the 2. It's really about who you can guard anyways. If you start Cade/Bridges/Ausar, you can just put Ausar and Bridges on the 2 best perimeter players and call it a day. Or you could put in Grimes instead of Ausar if he's shooting well and Bridges can go to the 3. The flexibility of that is probably the best part.

Love the sounds of that. That trio on the perimeter looks golden to me. I'm a huge fan of defense

And you'd still have Grime as an option to come off the bench for one of those guys or start in smaller lineups. Our wing defense would be so much better than last year.

My ideal offseason probably involves assembling a roster where the top 8 or so rotation players other than Cade are all better defenders than Cade and he's able to get away with being the worst defender of the bunch while he's being the motor of the offense.

[Canadafan]

How is Obi Toppins defense? His stats look promising and on the upwards trajectory. He's young. Big enough and athletic enough for a position of need PF. I'd luv to poach him from the Pacers.
An ideal move would be getting Mikal for our #5 and Ivey which according to the trade board is realistic. Which I find hard to believe. Maybe toss in Sasser as well.
Then sign Tyus.
That would be an incredible offseason to me.
Duren and Stew battle for all the center minutes. Sign an old head as 3rd stringer to mentor them.
Obi Fontecchio Ausar getting minutes at PF.
Bridges Ausar Fontecchio at SF
Cade Bridges Grimes at SG
Tyus Cade and an old head mentor at PG.
Boom

This is a safe space, somewhat, for my mental thoughts. Be kind

[bstein14]

How is Obi Toppins defense? His stats look promising and on the upwards trajectory. He's young. Big enough and athletic enough for a position of need PF. I'd luv to poach him from the Pacers.
An ideal move would be getting Mikal for our #5 and Ivey which according to the trade board is realistic. Which I find hard to believe. Maybe toss in Sasser as well.
Then sign Tyus.
That would be an incredible offseason to me.
Duren and Stew battle for all the center minutes. Sign an old head as 3rd stringer to mentor them.
Obi Fontecchio Ausar getting minutes at PF.
Bridges Ausar Fontecchio at SF
Cade Bridges Grimes at SG
Tyus Cade and an old head mentor at PG.
Boom

This is a safe space, somewhat, for my mental thoughts. Be kind

Obi is below average on defense on a night to night basis but so was much of the Pacers team. They strategize on outscoring their opponents and putting up a ton of points. He's got the athletic ability and lateral quickness to stay in front of most guys.

He's a guy I don't see getting more than a MLE offer from anyone and someone I think we could lure in if a better option doesn't present itself as we could offer him a little over MLE.

[Snakebites]

I'd argue that Monk projects to be the better player within the next couple of years.

But I agree that I'd rather spend that money elsewhere and agree witht the focus on defense. But I'd also trade Ivey, personally.

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

Do u guys consider Bridges a guard? I always thought of his as a forward hmmmm

Mikal shoots threes and can defend guards, even point guards.

So it doesn’t matter.

[Skybox]

I'd argue that Monk projects to be the better player within the next couple of years.

But I agree that I'd rather spend that money elsewhere and agree witht the focus on defense. But I'd also trade Ivey, personally.

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

To be clear, I'm not super into Monk or Ivey alongside Cade

Agree. I'm a believer in Cade and I wasn't expecting to hear Monk talk here. Ivey's, arguably, already one too many "Monk-types". You guys wouldn't have drafted him but when SAC passed he was the clear BPA, regardless of fit...I figured Ivey would get moved on draft night and never get a DET uni.

Not too late, ORL would love Duren (when you draft Clingan) and Ivey. WCJ would be nice in front of, and, ultimately, next to Clingan. Then, I guess - a couple of picks?

[jars]

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

To be clear, I'm not super into Monk or Ivey alongside Cade

Agree. I'm a believer in Cade and I wasn't expecting to hear Monk talk here. Ivey's, arguably, already one too many "Monk-types". You guys wouldn't have drafted him but when SAC passed he was the clear BPA, regardless of fit...I figured Ivey would get moved on draft night and never get a DET uni.

Not too late, ORL would love Duren (when you draft Clingan) and Ivey. WCJ would be nice in front of, and, ultimately, next to Clingan. Then, I guess - a couple of picks?

I still think Ivey has some great aspects that could lead to him being a high level player, maybe even an all star. He and Cade just accentuate each others' weaknesses at times. Worst case, I feel like Ivey becomes a Monk type 6th man of the year contender of in the next few years.

WCJ doesn't excite me in the slightest, especially if we draft Clingan. The only Magic players I'm really interested in are Paolo, Franz and Suggs, and I assume you guys don't want to move any of them.

[vege]

I'd still way rather see Cade and Ivey with a coach other than Monty before I hand a very comparable player in Monk a hundred million dollar contract. Monty made zero attempt to make them work well together, and still Ivey's numbers are in the ballpark. Just seems like really terrible value and a high likelihood of looking very bad almost immediately.

If you can land a clear 2-way guy like Mikal Bridges, sure. It solves a lot of issues that both Monk and Ivey have.

To be clear, I'm not super into Monk or Ivey alongside Cade

Agree. I'm a believer in Cade and I wasn't expecting to hear Monk talk here. Ivey's, arguably, already one too many "Monk-types". You guys wouldn't have drafted him but when SAC passed he was the clear BPA, regardless of fit...I figured Ivey would get moved on draft night and never get a DET uni.

Not too late, ORL would love Duren (when you draft Clingan) and Ivey. WCJ would be nice in front of, and, ultimately, next to Clingan. Then, I guess - a couple of picks?

No. Duren for WCJ is an easy No and not fixable, you suggesting it 100 times won't make it any more likely.

[NYPiston]

Hoping Claxton signs with Nets and Monk stay with Sacramento.

So the Pistons should just stand pat then or go after some Tier 2 guys?

I get the skepticism about overpaying free agents and just about every one is an overpay but these are two guys right in their prime who would fill needs. I'm always more skeptical about overpaying guys in their late 20s, early 30s (like Grant for example). The Pistons would be getting the best years from these guys so I'd be on board with at least one of them. I don't think both is an option with Tech needing to be signed and Cade almost certainly getting the max and wouldn't want both anyway.

If they do sign Claxton (who I think I'd prefer over Monk), Duren is likely out the door because I don't know how you can have two offensively challenged frontcourt players in todays' NBA to add to Ausar at SF who can't shoot from 3. A Claxton signing would almost assuredly mean big changes to the starting lineup unless the Pistons foolishly want to go with a non-shooting starting lineup in a shooting league.

[LaSheed]

Hoping Claxton signs with Nets and Monk stay with Sacramento.

So the Pistons should just stand pat then or go after some Tier 2 guys?

I get the skepticism about overpaying free agents and just about every one is an overpay but these are two guys right in their prime who would fill needs. I'm always more skeptical about overpaying guys in their late 20s, early 30s (like Grant for example). The Pistons would be getting the best years from these guys so I'd be on board with at least one of them. I don't think both is an option with Tech needing to be signed and Cade almost certainly getting the max and wouldn't want both anyway.

If they do sign Claxton (who I think I'd prefer over Monk), Duren is likely out the door because I don't know how you can have two offensively challenged frontcourt players in todays' NBA to add to Ausar at SF who can't shoot from 3. A Claxton signing would almost assuredly mean big changes to the starting lineup unless the Pistons foolishly want to go with a non-shooting starting lineup in a shooting league.

Just because they are "tier 2" guys doesn't mean there aren't better fits out there. In this free agent class I would really have to dive deep into it consider there to be any tiers in this class at all.

Investing in Claxton is yet another offensive challenged investment. Agree with you on Monk over Claxton but I think I said im another post it's fine if they sign these guys but can we please for once invest in our wings before we go dump another 100 million into a defensive big.

Edit: NVM I read your post wrong about Monk over Claxton lol

[vege]

Hoping Claxton signs with Nets and Monk stay with Sacramento.

So the Pistons should just stand pat then or go after some Tier 2 guys?

I get the skepticism about overpaying free agents and just about every one is an overpay but these are two guys right in their prime who would fill needs. I'm always more skeptical about overpaying guys in their late 20s, early 30s (like Grant for example). The Pistons would be getting the best years from these guys so I'd be on board with at least one of them. I don't think both is an option with Tech needing to be signed and Cade almost certainly getting the max and wouldn't want both anyway.

If they do sign Claxton (who I think I'd prefer over Monk), Duren is likely out the door because I don't know how you can have two offensively challenged frontcourt players in todays' NBA to add to Ausar at SF who can't shoot from 3. A Claxton signing would almost assuredly mean big changes to the starting lineup unless the Pistons foolishly want to go with a non-shooting starting lineup in a shooting league.

There are a ton of very impactiful free agents, and hopefully we alread have our stars in Cade and Ausar.

Naji Marshall, Derrick Jones Jr, Goga Bitadze (top tier defender and rim protector but very underrated), De'Anthony Melton, Gary Harris, KCP, Royce O'Neale, Obi Toppin, Isaiah Hartenstein, Isaac Okoro, Patrick Williams are players that would fit well next to our core

Cade and Ausar and nobody else should be our core - Fontecchio, Grimes, Stewart could be a top tier bench if put in the proper position to succeed.

Weaver is no longer our GM, we haven't seen or heard much from Langdon, but I will assume he is competent and he does have a brain.

We won 14 games, he shouldn't be an imbecile like Weaver thinking Stewart is a 4 and a player as dumb and clueless as Ivey should be starting and just because we're losing a player like Duren could stop giving a **** not care about defense and play me first ball and develop a ton of bad habits and bring those guys back and expect us to compete every game.

Anything less than 3 new starters and 5 different rotation players out of a 9-10 man rotation would be pathetic.

[Canadafan]

"Naji Marshall, Derrick Jones Jr, Goga Bitadze (top tier defender and rim protector but very underrated), De'Anthony Melton, Gary Harris, KCP, Royce O'Neale, Obi Toppin, Isaiah Hartenstein, Isaac Okoro, Patrick Williams"

Love alot of these names. Should be able to poach 3 of these guys to fit on our team with 'just above' MLE-type money for most of them.
I'm still somewhat blindly hopeful that Ivey and Duren can become what we hoped they'd become. Especially with a new direction and hopefully new coach.
And still believe if we make a trade that Ivey is the odd man out and combined with our #5 and Sasser or Grimes. We should be able to get a quality starter with that package.
Duren Ausar Cade Trade Grime Fontecchio Stewart plus 3 free agents. Boom, 10 deep

[Kalamazoo317]

I'm all about wing depth and am into most of those names as well. Pass on Pat Williams, though. He's a bust, imo.

[NYPiston]

There are a ton of very impactiful free agents, and hopefully we alread have our stars in Cade and Ausar.

Naji Marshall, Derrick Jones Jr, Goga Bitadze (top tier defender and rim protector but very underrated), De'Anthony Melton, Gary Harris, KCP, Royce O'Neale, Obi Toppin, Isaiah Hartenstein, Isaac Okoro, Patrick Williams are players that would fit well next to our core

Cade and Ausar and nobody else should be our core - Fontecchio, Grimes, Stewart could be a top tier bench if put in the proper position to succeed.

Weaver is no longer our GM, we haven't seen or heard much from Langdon, but I will assume he is competent and he does have a brain.

We won 14 games, he shouldn't be an imbecile like Weaver thinking Stewart is a 4 and a player as dumb and clueless as Ivey should be starting and just because we're losing a player like Duren could stop giving a **** not care about defense and play me first ball and develop a ton of bad habits and bring those guys back and expect us to compete every game.

Anything less than 3 new starters and 5 different rotation players out of a 9-10 man rotation would be pathetic.

Agreed fully on all of that with the 2 man core and support players worth keeping, been saying that for a while. I'd add Sasser to the bench group, I just really like his mentality and microwave scoring ability and I'd be inclined to start Tech at least next year until the roster improves
My skeleton Pistons roster would look something like...

Cade
New SG
Ausar
Fontecchio
New C

Sasser
Grimes
New backup SF
New backup PF
Stewart

I think you can plug Monk or Claxton into one of those starting spots for now and then go from there.

Pat Williams is a player I thought of. I know, another reclamation project, but he shot 40%+ from 3 the last 2 years and is a hard worker from what I remember. He's an interesting case because the Bulls fans seem low on him so maybe it's a case of his good shooting numbers being deceiving?
In any event, a 22 year old with his athletic profile and good shooting would be an intriguing add.

[zeebneeb]

Hoping Claxton signs with Nets and Monk stay with Sacramento.

So the Pistons should just stand pat then or go after some Tier 2 guys?

I get the skepticism about overpaying free agents and just about every one is an overpay but these are two guys right in their prime who would fill needs. I'm always more skeptical about overpaying guys in their late 20s, early 30s (like Grant for example). The Pistons would be getting the best years from these guys so I'd be on board with at least one of them. I don't think both is an option with Tech needing to be signed and Cade almost certainly getting the max and wouldn't want both anyway.

If they do sign Claxton (who I think I'd prefer over Monk), Duren is likely out the door because I don't know how you can have two offensively challenged frontcourt players in todays' NBA to add to Ausar at SF who can't shoot from 3. A Claxton signing would almost assuredly mean big changes to the starting lineup unless the Pistons foolishly want to go with a non-shooting starting lineup in a shooting league.

There are a ton of very impactiful free agents, and hopefully we alread have our stars in Cade and Ausar.

Naji Marshall, Derrick Jones Jr, Goga Bitadze (top tier defender and rim protector but very underrated), De'Anthony Melton, Gary Harris, KCP, Royce O'Neale, Obi Toppin, Isaiah Hartenstein, Isaac Okoro, Patrick Williams are players that would fit well next to our core

Cade and Ausar and nobody else should be our core - Fontecchio, Grimes, Stewart could be a top tier bench if put in the proper position to succeed.

Weaver is no longer our GM, we haven't seen or heard much from Langdon, but I will assume he is competent and he does have a brain.

We won 14 games, he shouldn't be an imbecile like Weaver thinking Stewart is a 4 and a player as dumb and clueless as Ivey should be starting and just because we're losing a player like Duren could stop giving a **** not care about defense and play me first ball and develop a ton of bad habits and bring those guys back and expect us to compete every game.

Anything less than 3 new starters and 5 different rotation players out of a 9-10 man rotation would be pathetic.

Its interesting you bring up Goga, as he is someone thats been on my radar for a long damn time. I have always been a little befuddled as to why he was waved by the Pacers, and doesn't get a ron of playing time, when he seemingly does everything at a high level.

His per36 numbers are insane, and would firmly put him into the top tier center category, and all-star. If he can ever be consistent with his outside shot, damn.

Think about this for a second;

Cade
SG
Ausar
Goga
Claxton

That would give the Pistons two incredible shot-blockers at the rim(for those who don't know Gogas game, go check it out, especially his shot-blocking)and, as I stated earlier, if Goga can be consistent from 3, and incredible front-court of the future. Goga is 24, and Claxton is 25.

SG is always an issue for me, as I know the type of player I want there(scoring machine. Think Lavine with defense)but don't know of available players besides Monk, that the team wouldn't have to trade for. Isaiah Joe is super interesting, but can he handle the scoring load, that would be thrust upon him?