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2024 Draft Thread - Part II

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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1461 » by doclinkin » Mon Jun 10, 2024 3:09 pm

nate33 wrote:Knecht is a better on-ball shot creator than Kispert, but I value Kispert's off-ball actions and his finishing around the rim more. I also think Kispert is a better defender (which is damning with feint praise, I know).


Knecht had an eyepopping showing in the athletics and lane agility portion of the drills. With good length. If he was challenged by coaches to emphasize D could he give better effort there? I know he was relied upon to expend all his energy on offense this year, I just wonder whether it is disinclination, poor instincts, or lack of coaching that has him a negative factor on defense.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1462 » by payitforward » Mon Jun 10, 2024 3:52 pm

Quite a good point, doc. Kid took 21 FGAs & 7.5 FTAs per 40 minutes. Not to hard to imagine he did some coasting on D.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1463 » by Dat2U » Mon Jun 10, 2024 4:21 pm

doclinkin wrote:
From shooting .286 from NCAA three, to nearly 40% from NBA range. That shot has definitely begin to come around. That work ethic has his 3FG% steadily improving every year. Maybe not worth a #2 pick, but its' a good trend for a 23 year old player, especially if he can increase the volume and keep the % steady. If NBA peak is at age 26-27 he is showing signs of turning into a damned good player.

If Castle could get to .391% from 3 on work ethic and focus, I'd damn sure take that. A guy who can frustrate wings 1-4 is the rare part.


.391 sounds great.

Except volume is just as, if not more important in terms of spacing the floor. He went from making 0.9 a game on 3.2 attempts is rookie year to making 1.1 on 3.1 attempts a game last season. On a per game that's statistically negligible. He's still a hesitant shooter. He's still killing spacing. He was damn near unplayable in the playoffs.

If you want a guy to frustrate wings 1-4, then why is no one talking about Ryan Dunn? :wink:
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1464 » by TGW » Mon Jun 10, 2024 4:27 pm

Dat2U wrote:
If you want a guy to frustrate wings 1-4, then why is no one talking about Ryan Dunn? :wink:


I would take Dunn with the late FRP. Dude is a defensive beast.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1465 » by Dat2U » Mon Jun 10, 2024 4:33 pm

TGW wrote:
Dat2U wrote:
If you want a guy to frustrate wings 1-4, then why is no one talking about Ryan Dunn? :wink:


I would take Dunn with the late FRP. Dude is a defensive beast.


He is a monster defensively.

He's also the worst offensive non-C prospect I've ever scouted and not playable on that end.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1466 » by Rafael122 » Mon Jun 10, 2024 4:34 pm

Dat2U wrote:
TGW wrote:
Dat2U wrote:
If you want a guy to frustrate wings 1-4, then why is no one talking about Ryan Dunn? :wink:


I would take Dunn with the late FRP. Dude is a defensive beast.


He is a monster defensively.

He's also the worst offensive non-C prospect I've ever scouted and not playable on that end.


That's my thing, he can't shoot lol. Castle and Dunn as our FRPs would be disastrous IMO.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1467 » by doclinkin » Mon Jun 10, 2024 4:39 pm

Knecht probably had the best combine of anybody really. Fastest shuttle run. Second fastest lane agility. 31" standing vert, 39" max. Tied for 3rd in the motion shooting drills (72% in the star drill), 67% off the dribble, 2nd in the standstill shooting. Has more handle than Kispert, better length on D (6'9" wingspan on a 6'5.5" frame).

If Portland traded 7 + 14 to get Clingan at #2 (rumors say other teams may be looking to jump ahead to get the Center, Portland has worked him out and are interested) then I wouldn't hate on Knecht as a consolation prize. More versatile than Kispert potentially and turns Corey into a valuable trade piece. Upside of possible better D with coaching focus.

All depends on who else was taken by then. Currently tankathon has the Spurs taking him at 8 (with Castle still on the board. Doubt it highly). The consensus mock has him down at 11, albeit with pundits not all reacting yet to the Euro combine numbers and Topić's meniscus.

If Castle, Shepp, Clingan, Sarr, Holland, Topic are all gone 1-6, and you are looking at Risacher, Knecht, Buzelis, Dillingham, what's the play? All have their pros and cons. I think the FO goes for Risacher or Buzelis based on potential, youth, positional size. Dillingham is the most dynamic. Knecht maybe has the better combination of both NBA ready skill, size/athletic upside if they think they can unlock his Defense.

Not sure what I would do, but I know a team like Miami would take him in a heartbeat then tune him up as a defender. He's one of those players that a 'don't overthink it' team would snatch and move on. Memphis at 9, for instance if the Spurs took Castle instead.

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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1468 » by Dat2U » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:05 pm

nate33 wrote:I'm starting to think drafting for fit should be a bit of a factor here. With Bilal looking so good in workouts, and with the Deni breakout, forward is really not a priority. And then factor that some of the best prospects in the 2025 draft are also forwards (Flagg, Bailey).

I'm not saying we should reach for fit over BPA, but if there's a tie between a forward, center or guard, we should lean toward the guard or center. It's one of the reasons why Sarr and Sheppard are a bit higher on my list.


Collier is growing on me and I already liked him. I wish we could trade down and get him but at this point it's hard to consider anyone of 8-9 prospects a reach at 2.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1469 » by closg00 » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:08 pm

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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1470 » by closg00 » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:11 pm

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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1471 » by DCZards » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:15 pm

Rafael122 wrote:
Dat2U wrote:
TGW wrote:
I would take Dunn with the late FRP. Dude is a defensive beast.


He is a monster defensively.

He's also the worst offensive non-C prospect I've ever scouted and not playable on that end.


That's my thing, he can't shoot lol. Castle and Dunn as our FRPs would be disastrous IMO.

Nobody is drafting Castle and Dunn in the first round.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1472 » by doclinkin » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:15 pm

Dat2U wrote:
TGW wrote:
Dat2U wrote:
If you want a guy to frustrate wings 1-4, then why is no one talking about Ryan Dunn? :wink:


I would take Dunn with the late FRP. Dude is a defensive beast.


He is a monster defensively.

He's also the worst offensive non-C prospect I've ever scouted and not playable on that end.


Because Ryan Dunn is mentally broken when it comes to shooting. Which does not seem to be Castle's issue.

When challenged to shoot and left wide open Castle took the shots and hit them under the brightest spotlights. When left open he took 6 3FGs against Alabama, and 4 against Purdue, and in general got more aggressive as the tournament required. Aside from the Illinois game where his primary job was to steal the soul of Terrance Shannon (2-12, and -15pts below his season average) his offensive role increased as the Tourney went on. Tying his career high in points in the Final Four.

We are talking upside here, not finished products. How you reach superstar status is by constant improvement. You take a player who has the best aptitude for growth, BBIQ, understanding of the game, combined with the physical abilities that won't cap his top end.

To my way of thinking: IF Castle can play as a lead guard as a 6'6" PG (a position he can defend, so yes on that end; but needs shooting so maybe not on the other) then he is probably the player with the largest lead on positional size and upside in the draft.

Better than Sarr who is a freak, but shows little sign of fire or understanding of his best role. And does not have a size advantage over the average player at his position. Light on his feet. Smallish of frame.

Maybe better than Sheppard who is a statistical outlier but average at best in size at PG. Maybe? I can see the argument for Sheppard as the most complete player at his postion in the draft. No flaws except volume and opportunity.

A better defender at PG than Dillingham is on offense at the spot? Could Castle stop Dills one on one? Check the tourney results against all guards Castle faced. And Kentucky flaming out.

A better physical mismatch at lead guard than Holland is at SF? Holland is insanely quick. But also has short arms for a forward, and did not show the team understanding that Castle played. I can see the argument that Holland may be a better defender. Had his lapses at this end, but showed fire and competitiveness. Still, will he be a better/more versatile defender at SF than Castle vs lead guards? Holland will be battling thicker stronger longer forwards. I give the mismatch edge to Castle on defense.

It's a gamble. Based on this: can he play offense at the lead guard spot. He showed aptitude in Highschool, stifled it to win at UConn. Is that a sign that he can't do it? That his game falls apart as he changes levels? Or a sign that he can develop based on what his team needs. I think the latter. That's where I roll the dice and trust the development. Ask: which guy would do better under the Heat culture? Which guy would maximize their talents. I think Castle.

But otherwise yeah he's a shooting guard who can't shoot. A glue guy with no role. I'd bet on his aggression though, he takes it personally.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1473 » by payitforward » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:25 pm

At least one of the teams from e.g. 4-9 is very likely to be looking to move up & be sure to get their guy (Clingan? Sheppard?). Hard to imagine not.

What one of them would give for 2, in addition to their pick, is an open question. But, I'd say there's potential for a deal there. Or, at least, I hope there is.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1474 » by MDStar » Mon Jun 10, 2024 5:25 pm

Dat2U wrote:
nate33 wrote:I'm starting to think drafting for fit should be a bit of a factor here. With Bilal looking so good in workouts, and with the Deni breakout, forward is really not a priority. And then factor that some of the best prospects in the 2025 draft are also forwards (Flagg, Bailey).

I'm not saying we should reach for fit over BPA, but if there's a tie between a forward, center or guard, we should lean toward the guard or center. It's one of the reasons why Sarr and Sheppard are a bit higher on my list.


Collier is growing on me and I already liked him. I wish we could trade down and get him but at this point it's hard to consider anyone of 8-9 prospects a reach at 2.


This was the exact conversation we had a week or so ago. It's a complete waste of a resource, to draft a forward, when we have Deni and Bilal already on the roster, developing. Someone will not get enough minutes. If all things are equal, and it seems without a sure fire future star at the top, most of the top 10-12 prospects are relatively close and should all be lumped in a similar tier. Let Bilal and Deni man the forward spots (with Kuz :nonono:) and draft a Guard or Center to add to them.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1475 » by nate33 » Mon Jun 10, 2024 6:08 pm

Thoughts on Adem Bona?

He is currently mocked as the guy we take at #51. He's an athletic freak who is both huge and fast. Height is 6'-8.25 (no shoes) but with a 7'-3.35 wingspan and a 9-0 standing reach. He has an exceptional 35" standing vertical at a weight of 243 pounds. (His max vertical is 40"!). Lane agility and shuttle run are very good for a big man.

He plays with an extremely high motor, but the effect on the court is a mixed bag. 4.1 stocks per 36, but he doesn't rebound well, is way too turnover prone, and fouls a bit much.

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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1476 » by TGW » Mon Jun 10, 2024 7:10 pm

Dat2U wrote:
TGW wrote:
Dat2U wrote:
If you want a guy to frustrate wings 1-4, then why is no one talking about Ryan Dunn? :wink:


I would take Dunn with the late FRP. Dude is a defensive beast.


He is a monster defensively.

He's also the worst offensive non-C prospect I've ever scouted and not playable on that end.


Just curious...how did you come to this conclusion versus Kidd-Gilcrest, who was just as bad offensively as Dunn was in college?
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1477 » by Frichuela » Mon Jun 10, 2024 7:14 pm

Latest intel…ATL is allegedly deciding between the 2 Frenchmen…

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Or maybe is all a smokescreen and they are trading the pick, who knows… :crazy:
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1478 » by closg00 » Mon Jun 10, 2024 7:17 pm

I don’t believe for a second that ATL would pick Risacher #1.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1479 » by Frichuela » Mon Jun 10, 2024 7:43 pm

closg00 wrote:I don’t believe for a second that ATL would pick Risacher #1.


Agreed. He is quite an underwhelming prospect, meh to a t.
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Re: 2024 Draft Thread - Part II 

Post#1480 » by J-Ves » Mon Jun 10, 2024 7:57 pm

Hopefully ATL keeps their pick and we can be the ones who utilize Clingan’s trade value. I know Memphis wants him but I have no idea what they have except number 9 that we want

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