Finals 2024 - G2 - Mavs @ Celtics (Sunday., 8:00PMEST)

[Bob8]

And turn it over at this rate...
100% agreed...

You are acting like Boston played a good game and Mavs are the only team who can improve.

This was the game to win. Unfortunately.

No you're absolutely right. Celtics missed a lot of shots but i do think the Mavs were better defensively. Mavs should have won this game if they hit their free throws and/or kyrie didn't play so poorly.

Mavs don't have the same margin of error as the celtics since they are far less talented. So they can't afford to leave free points on the line.

To have a chance in this series Mavs need to shoot a lot better for 3 and Kyrie needs to play a lot better. Shooting better FTs would help, but alone doesn't mean much.

[BliscoSantos]

Kyrie and others need to Play better,a lot better ...

In the offseason THJ,Maxi and Green have to go...they make too much and give too little

[tleikheen]

Its not the scorer like Hardy thats needed its the push the pace of Exum thats needed in this series . the 3rd guy that looks to get the others involved .
Luka is playing individually great basketball but he is the reason also why Dallas can't crack 100 pts scored with his frustrating slow pace ! 8 turnovers is because his slow pace allows the defense to set up every possession and the Mavs are getting closer to a sweep unless Mavs and Kidd figure out the slow pace is to Boston's advantage.

[tleikheen]

I can't believe that the Mavs team cannot find the pace of the beginning of the year of up and down and gunning 3's and that they have gone totally to the end of the spectrum to scoring UNDER 100 pts a game . PJ is an athletic upgrade over GWms and Gaff is an athletic upgrade over Powell yet Mavs have slowed down their pace that doesnt give them the advantage to win.
Luka is going to learn a hard lesson that one man basketball cannot beat the most elite teams in basketball.

[Bob8]

I can't believe that the Mavs team cannot find the pace of the beginning of the year of up and down and gunning 3's and that they have gone totally to the end of the spectrum to scoring UNDER 100 pts a game . PJ is an athletic upgrade over GWms and Gaff is an athletic upgrade over Powell yet Mavs have slowed down their pace that doesnt give them the advantage to win.
Luka is going to learn a hard lesson that one man basketball cannot beat the most elite teams in basketball.

You believe that Kyrie isn't capable to score more than 14 points on 18.5 shots? If Kyrie was scoring just his RS average, Mavs would have scored 110+.

Btw. Mavs are playing with the same pace the whole playoffs and you should understand that pace is going down considerably in playoffs. Even Indiana, who had with 102 the second fastest pace in regular season, played playoffs with exactly the same pace as Mavericks, 93.5. That's playoffs basketball.

In few occasions we pushed the pace action ended with block or TO. Exum looks especially non reliable with ball handling in the whole playoffs. That's the main reason he doesn't play much. Hardy and Kyrie are Iso scorers, that basically means Luka have to do more or less all ball handling.

[Bob8]

Kyrie and others need to Play better,a lot better ...

In the offseason THJ,Maxi and Green have to go...they make too much and give too little

Who will take them? They are all negative assets.

[tleikheen]

Bob8 » 8 minutes ago

tleikheen wrote:
I can't believe that the Mavs team cannot find the pace of the beginning of the year of up and down and gunning 3's and that they have gone totally to the end of the spectrum to scoring UNDER 100 pts a game . PJ is an athletic upgrade over GWms and Gaff is an athletic upgrade over Powell yet Mavs have slowed down their pace that doesnt give them the advantage to win.
Luka is going to learn a hard lesson that one man basketball cannot beat the most elite teams in basketball.


{You believe that Kyrie isn't capable to score more than 14 points on 18.5 shots? If Kyrie was scoring just his RS average, Mavs would have scored 110+.

Btw. Mavs are playing with the same pace the whole playoffs and you should understand that pace is going down considerably in playoffs. Even Indiana, who had with 102 the second fastest pace in regular season, played playoffs with exactly the same pace as Mavericks, 93.5. That's playoffs basketball.

In few occasions we pushed the pace action ended with block or TO. Exum looks especially non reliable with ball handling in the whole playoffs. That's the main reason he doesn't play much. Hardy and Kyrie are Iso scorers, that basically means Luka have to do more or less all ball handling.}

You can believe what you want but Boston has blocked/stolen the ball from the Mavs ,29 times to 17 for the Mavs ....A plus 12 for the Celtics., not good and they have 52 assists to the Mavs paltry 30 assists.

The lack of ball movement is the biggest cause of Mavs missing shots as most are contested or rushed ,thus the steals ,blocked shots and TO's by the Mavs. Playing into Boston's defense.

[Bob8]

Bob8 » 8 minutes ago

tleikheen wrote:
I can't believe that the Mavs team cannot find the pace of the beginning of the year of up and down and gunning 3's and that they have gone totally to the end of the spectrum to scoring UNDER 100 pts a game . PJ is an athletic upgrade over GWms and Gaff is an athletic upgrade over Powell yet Mavs have slowed down their pace that doesnt give them the advantage to win.
Luka is going to learn a hard lesson that one man basketball cannot beat the most elite teams in basketball.


{You believe that Kyrie isn't capable to score more than 14 points on 18.5 shots? If Kyrie was scoring just his RS average, Mavs would have scored 110+.

Btw. Mavs are playing with the same pace the whole playoffs and you should understand that pace is going down considerably in playoffs. Even Indiana, who had with 102 the second fastest pace in regular season, played playoffs with exactly the same pace as Mavericks, 93.5. That's playoffs basketball.

In few occasions we pushed the pace action ended with block or TO. Exum looks especially non reliable with ball handling in the whole playoffs. That's the main reason he doesn't play much. Hardy and Kyrie are Iso scorers, that basically means Luka have to do more or less all ball handling.}

You can believe what you want but Boston has blocked/stolen the ball from the Mavs ,29 times to 17 for the Mavs ....A plus 12 for the Celtics., not good and they have 52 assists to the Mavs paltry 30 assists.

The lack of ball movement is the biggest cause of Mavs missing shots as most are contested or rushed ,thus the steals ,blocked shots and TO's by the Mavs. Playing into Boston's defense.

And you believe we would have less TOs playing with faster pace? Playoffs basketball is half court offense, because opponents are not giving easy points away. There's 0 teams that play with similar pace than in RS. Knicks had with 96 the slowest pace in RS. In playoffs only Lakers had 96 pace, all others played slower. Mavs are in the middle, 8th fastest. Very similar to Indiana, Denver, Cleveland.

[tleikheen]

Btw. Mavs are playing with the same pace the whole playoffs and you should understand that pace is going down considerably in playoffs. Even Indiana, who had with 102 the second fastest pace in regular season, played playoffs with exactly the same pace as Mavericks, 93.5. That's playoffs basketball.

This really gets me ...... because its the Mavs who have really slowed down avg 12 pts LESS than the 106 pts they had avg so far in the playoffs . Against the Celtics they're avg 94 ppg. The Celtics by comparison are avg 110 ppg /playoffs to 106 ppg against the Mavs more due to the Mavs slower pace than the defense played

[Bob8]

Btw. Mavs are playing with the same pace the whole playoffs and you should understand that pace is going down considerably in playoffs. Even Indiana, who had with 102 the second fastest pace in regular season, played playoffs with exactly the same pace as Mavericks, 93.5. That's playoffs basketball.

This really gets me ...... because its the Mavs who have really slowed down avg 12 pts LESS than the 106 pts they had avg so far in the playoffs . Against the Celtics they're avg 94 ppg. The Celtics by comparison are avg 110 ppg /playoffs to 106 ppg against the Mavs more due to the Mavs slower pace than the defense played

Mavs have played 92 against Clippers. Far the slowest.
94.75 against OKC.
94.2 against Wolves.
93.75 against the Celtics. Celtics playoffs pace is slower than that, 92.62.


I believe you will need to find different reason for Mavs scoring less. I suggest you to start with subpar shooting % on wide open shots by role players and subpar shooting % from Kyrie. Mavs outside Luka are shooting 15% wide open 3s, make it 35% and you have normal scoring and 1:1 series.

[41Dirk41]

Its not the scorer like Hardy thats needed its the push the pace of Exum thats needed in this series . the 3rd guy that looks to get the others involved .
Luka is playing individually great basketball but he is the reason also why Dallas can't crack 100 pts scored with his frustrating slow pace ! 8 turnovers is because his slow pace allows the defense to set up every possession and the Mavs are getting closer to a sweep unless Mavs and Kidd figure out the slow pace is to Boston's advantage.

Man, without Luka the Mavs will not score more than 70 points a game... Mostly with this subpar coach.

We not have great 3 points shooters, Boston cover well lob city ( and Kidd can't find a solution) and the first 3 guys(Kleber, Lively and Green) from the bench have 0 offensive skills...so we just hope that Luka&Kyrie have a great game.

We also played soft first 2 games. We are scared about Boston lineup (2 midgets, the 40yo center and 2 famous choker superstars) and the crystal KP. Wow.

[GermanFan120]

Its not the scorer like Hardy thats needed its the push the pace of Exum thats needed in this series . the 3rd guy that looks to get the others involved .
Luka is playing individually great basketball but he is the reason also why Dallas can't crack 100 pts scored with his frustrating slow pace ! 8 turnovers is because his slow pace allows the defense to set up every possession and the Mavs are getting closer to a sweep unless Mavs and Kidd figure out the slow pace is to Boston's advantage.

Man, without Luka the Mavs will not score more than 70 points a game... Mostly with this subpar coach.

We not have great 3 points shooters, Boston cover well lob city ( and Kidd can't find a solution) and the first 3 guy(Kleber, Lively and Green) from the bench have 0 offensive skills...so we just hope that Luka&Kyrie have a great game.

We also played soft first 2 games. We are scared about Boston lineup (2 midgets, the 40yo center and 2 famous choker superstars) and the crystal KP. Wow.

So you are suggesting Timmy?

[41Dirk41]

Its not the scorer like Hardy thats needed its the push the pace of Exum thats needed in this series . the 3rd guy that looks to get the others involved .
Luka is playing individually great basketball but he is the reason also why Dallas can't crack 100 pts scored with his frustrating slow pace ! 8 turnovers is because his slow pace allows the defense to set up every possession and the Mavs are getting closer to a sweep unless Mavs and Kidd figure out the slow pace is to Boston's advantage.

Man, without Luka the Mavs will not score more than 70 points a game... Mostly with this subpar coach.

We not have great 3 points shooters, Boston cover well lob city ( and Kidd can't find a solution) and the first 3 guy(Kleber, Lively and Green) from the bench have 0 offensive skills...so we just hope that Luka&Kyrie have a great game.

We also played soft first 2 games. We are scared about Boston lineup (2 midgets, the 40yo center and 2 famous choker superstars) and the crystal KP. Wow.

So you are suggesting Timmy?

I was thinking Hardy... But hey, Green and Maxi first 2games were horribles so...
Probably random 2 G-Leaguers should play better.

I don't know honestly, but i'm sick and tired of players who pass 3s or afraid to shoot. We are in the Finals.
Pussy are not allowed.

[joesha1698]

Kyrie and others need to Play better,a lot better ...

In the offseason THJ,Maxi and Green have to go...they make too much and give too little

How exactly does he need to play better? Aside from his shots or layups falling? This is not directed at you Bilsco - but just using this post to make a point. I've been reading all these posts and even some from sport writers and none of them are mentioning the obvious reason Kyrie is struggling so much. The way Dallas is using him. Kyrie is 6-7 years older since he been to his last finals. He's also 6-7 years older than Luka.

This style of play - 1on1 and using the heavy pick and roll is all designed for Luka's skill sets and even Luka is taking really tough shots and turning the ball over like crazy just to be effective. An older Kyrie with less height is facing the same type of defense and is expected to give you 30+ points easily.

Our whole offense is predicated on pick and roll and Luka and Kyrie going 1on1. Therefore, even our role players for the most part play off those guys. This is a result of having a very simplistic system of playing that does not encourage ball movement or player movement which is very much needed against elite teams (which you will always face) in the finals.

Instead of everyone saying they need more from Kyrie - can someone tell me how we're going to actually help Kyrie play to his strengths in the congested half court? If people could take Luka's almond joys out of their mouth for 1 second they would realize that helping Kyrie is going to make the Mavs more likely to win. Kidd should watch some tape of Curry versus the Celtics in the finals. It's simple.

How do you beat length/scheming and really tough one on one defense? You simply move without the ball - get to your spots and take quick shots. Kyrie is talented enough to trust his jumper in these series and get that shot before the defense can really lock in. Stop treating him like Luka. He's not 25 and he's not 6'7. Another thing Kidd has to do is let Kyrie bring the ball up and push the pace and see if he can get the others some quick looks or if he can get himself some opportunities to get to the cup b4 Boston defense reacts.

This should be Dallas thinking going forward:

1. Kyrie should push the ball every time up the court - any early opportunities for himself or teammates? No? Kick it back to Luka who should be trailing the play.

2. In the half court - Kyrie should be constantly moving looking for cuts to the hoop or empty spaces on the court where he can immediately rise up and knock down a jump shot. He should also be running off screens or double screens when its his time to score.

3.The Mavs should continue to switch everything on defense.

[GermanFan120]

Man, without Luka the Mavs will not score more than 70 points a game... Mostly with this subpar coach.

We not have great 3 points shooters, Boston cover well lob city ( and Kidd can't find a solution) and the first 3 guy(Kleber, Lively and Green) from the bench have 0 offensive skills...so we just hope that Luka&Kyrie have a great game.

We also played soft first 2 games. We are scared about Boston lineup (2 midgets, the 40yo center and 2 famous choker superstars) and the crystal KP. Wow.

So you are suggesting Timmy?

I was thinking Hardy... But hey, Green and Maxi first 2games were horribles so...
Probably random 2 G-Leaguers should play better.

I don't know honestly, but i'm sick and tired of players who pass 3s or afraid to shoot. We are in the Finals.
Pussy are not allowed.

I like the formula that don't fix the vase if it's not broken.

But now the vase is clearly broken, I was so surprised that Timmy got 0 min... I mean did he worsen the relationship with the coaching staff?

[joesha1698]

One last thing, the game plan for Kyrie by Kidd is not smart. Kyrie should be moving without the ball and knocking down quick jumpers in the mid range. Once those start going in - this will open up the floor for him. However, your throwing him the ball and telling him to go 1on1 in the congested half court of the Celtics (who have no faith in our role players consistently hitting shots + their taking away the lob) is just stupid.

[41Dirk41]

One last thing, the game plan for Kyrie by Kidd is not smart. Kyrie should be moving without the ball and knocking down quick jumpers in the mid range. Once those start going in - this will open up the floor for him. However, your throwing him the ball and telling him to go 1on1 in the congested half court of the Celtics (who have no faith in our role players consistently hitting shots + their taking away the lob) is just stupid.

Agree, Kyrie should run around the screen just like Steph or Klay.
Looks like we have no schemes for him and he is a great shooter.

We have a big coaching staff problem when Luka doesn't dominate games. We already knew it.

[Bob8]

Kyrie and others need to Play better,a lot better ...

In the offseason THJ,Maxi and Green have to go...they make too much and give too little

How exactly does he need to play better? Aside from his shots or layups falling? This is not directed at you Bilsco - but just using this post to make a point. I've been reading all these posts and even some from sport writers and none of them are mentioning the obvious reason Kyrie is struggling so much. The way Dallas is using him. Kyrie is 6-7 years older since he been to his last finals. He's also 6-7 years older than Luka.

This style of play - 1on1 and using the heavy pick and roll is all designed for Luka's skill sets and even Luka is taking really tough shots and turning the ball over like crazy just to be effective. An older Kyrie with less height is facing the same type of defense and is expected to give you 30+ points easily.

Our whole offense is predicated on pick and roll and Luka and Kyrie going 1on1. Therefore, even our role players for the most part play off those guys. This is a result of having a very simplistic system of playing that does not encourage ball movement or player movement which is very much needed against elite teams (which you will always face) in the finals.

Instead of everyone saying they need more from Kyrie - can someone tell me how we're going to actually help Kyrie play to his strengths in the congested half court? If people could take Luka's almond joys out of their mouth for 1 second they would realize that helping Kyrie is going to make the Mavs more likely to win. Kidd should watch some tape of Curry versus the Celtics in the finals. It's simple.

How do you beat length/scheming and really tough one on one defense? You simply move without the ball - get to your spots and take quick shots. Kyrie is talented enough to trust his jumper in these series and get that shot before the defense can really lock in. Stop treating him like Luka. He's not 25 and he's not 6'7. Another thing Kidd has to do is let Kyrie bring the ball up and push the pace and see if he can get the others some quick looks or if he can get himself some opportunities to get to the cup b4 Boston defense reacts.

This should be Dallas thinking going forward:

1. Kyrie should push the ball every time up the court - any early opportunities for himself or teammates? No? Kick it back to Luka who should be trailing the play.

2. In the half court - Kyrie should be constantly moving looking for cuts to the hoop or empty spaces on the court where he can immediately rise up and knock down a jump shot. He should also be running off screens or double screens when its his time to score.

3.The Mavs should continue to switch everything on defense.

Mavs are in the Finals playing the whole season exactly the same. Kyrie was hitting exactly the same and more difficult shots in Wolves series.

Celtics are not letting Mavs pushing pace, because they're very good in returning and defending in transition. Pace overall falls significantly in playoffs. Everyone is playing half court offense.

Kyrie is not shooter like Steph, he doesn't run around screens and shoot instantly, he likes ball in his hands and creates his shot alone with his superior handles.

Anyway, no team can totally change style of play in Finals, they are what they are. Especially not Mavs, who have only 2 players capable of creating something, Kyrie mostly for himself. And you can't start using plays that you never used before overnight.

Kyrie is getting solid looks he just missed everything and that's the good news, meaning he can easily start hitting those shots, game 3 more or less the last chance.

[41Dirk41]

Even they really want to change the script we can't because we should hire a coach.

G2 was the no return point, Boston will have 1 great 3points night for sure in Dallas... Golden state 2022 series feeling.

[tleikheen]

Every commentator you hear and the eye test shows Luka with the ball and slowing down the action which fits his style and he is the only one benefiting while his team mates are taking the dagger for missing their shots , but the ball isn't moving and they're not finding rythem. Mavs are avging 15 assists a game ,only.

I don't blame Luka's team mates like the rest of you . I don't see any open court action or transition basketball and this is what Kyrie thrives in . Kyrie is playing ISO ball on a setup defense waiting for him .