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Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0

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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#361 » by Knightro » Sat Jun 22, 2024 12:52 am

SOUL wrote:
Knightro wrote:There's no reason to believe Black or Howard are ready to contribute next season at a high level after what happened in their respective rookie seasons.


Maybe Black.

I'm just generally frustrated with the low hanging fruit debate topics of "Black didn't get 30 mpg and free rein so the FO doesn't know what they're doing" sort of talk. It's panicky and not exactly real. You even said yourself that guys like Black and Jett are cost controlled and we have them for cheap for a few years so it's not as blasphemous of signing a guy with cap space who we thought would be a big addition who turns out to be a dud and plague to our cap.

Everything we do is going to be based off of Paolo/Franz/Suggs right now but people keep circling the center of the discussion over Black and Jett for some reason.

If fans cannot parse that with each passing year that our draft picks are not going to get carte blanche minutes and roles that our previous ones did (with more hype/expectations), then that's on them. I certainly hope that we have a plan for Black especially, but it would not surprise me if Jett gets moved at all.

The early Sixers process and even the recent Thunder strategy has been just to draft high ceiling guys they think might work on their team or hit, and then try again next year with more picks. Having 4 potential young keepers in Paolo, Franz, Suggs and Black is probably the edge of where you can even consider wanting to devote a lot of time and minutes to with young dudes.

Is OKC panicking about Cason Wallace maybe getting buried with Dort/SGA/Caruso/etc who showed a bit more than others last year? I don't really think so. It'll shake out fine. Same with every other young guy on a good team who got buried a bit until specific points of the season - Jarace, Hendricks (first half Jazz), Whitmore, Hawkins, etc.

A guy like Pritchard wanted out of Boston after three years of sub 20 mpg and suddenly got a bigger role and extended. That's like the worst case scenario of how I want the Black stuff to go but it just shows how things can change suddenly.

A guy like Dyson Daniels is in a similar spot with 17 mpg his first year and went up to 22 mpg, which usually jumps a lot in the 3rd year.. which is an extremely common trend with picks that somehow is being treated as an anomaly with Black.

Jett is an entirely different story, where I just think we did not want to develop that many young guys at once. I cannot gauge how that will go.


This has been discussed to death and it doesn't need to be rehashed any further.

The Magic tried to take two concurrent paths this past season and while this past season was fun and successful, it did not set the franchise up for maximum success this upcoming season, nor was it as successful as it could have been had they actually went for it.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#362 » by Cammo101 » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:03 am

eyriq wrote:
Cammo101 wrote:
eyriq wrote:What about the internal development of lottery picks?


What about them? Youth develops better in a winning culture next to vets than they do on a team where everyone is under 25. Being aggressive in adding talent doesn't preclude you from developing your young players, it enhances it because you aren't trying to develop 10 guys at a time.


They need reps to develop. Aggressive moves for players to take key roles will reduce reps for all the lottery picks.

Fair point about the winning culture. However, Mosley is proving that he can instill a winning culture with young players filing critical roles. Players in the top 3 in minutes are all 22 and under. Harris and Ingles were the veterans. Pretty much the bare minimum of veteran support, right? Yet we went 7 games in the first round and almost finished second in the East. Winning culture. Why change the recipe?


You can't develop everyone. This is why teams can be too young. You have to figure out who your true core pieces are and be willing to move the rest if needed. There is no world where you can continue to improve while also giving reps to all your youth. It's pretty clear to me that Paolo, Wagner, and Suggs are the core pieces. Everyone else should be made available if the right deal presents itself.

To be clear, we already have too much youth on this team. 2 lottery picks got no reps last year. We have already hit the tipping point here, and are a week away from adding another young player to a team with too many already.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#363 » by RookieStar » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:19 am

OT :

Its a shame not many posters here are as fanatical in stalking other players or rumours.

I enjoy visitng other teams board and see their rumours and news about this FA/trade/draft.

Seems that DLO is again being connected with us. Lol
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#364 » by Nyce_1 » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:22 am

RookieStar wrote:OT :

Its a shame not many posters here are as fanatical in stalking other players or rumours.

I enjoy visitng other teams board and see their rumours and news about this FA/trade/draft.

Seems that DLO is again being connected with us. Lol
This time of the year is my Christmas. I hunt for every mention of Orlando on all podcasts and team forums.

I'm with you.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#365 » by RookieStar » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:24 am

Nyce_1 wrote:
RookieStar wrote:OT :

Its a shame not many posters here are as fanatical in stalking other players or rumours.

I enjoy visitng other teams board and see their rumours and news about this FA/trade/draft.

Seems that DLO is again being connected with us. Lol
This time of the year is my Christmas. I hunt for every mention of Orlando on all podcasts and team forums.

I'm with you.


Same... it was more intense the past years when we had such high draft picks.

Right now im more into trades and FA signings.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#366 » by Bensational » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:25 am

Knightro wrote:
Bensational wrote:
eyriq wrote:Here's a question. Do you think we have the main ingredients for a championship team already on the roster and we just need to slow cook it? Or do you think we're missing some critical ingredients?


Mostly missing time: to see how the young guys develop, and to see what pieces will be needed to become a champion when our guys are ready. Nobody knew the C’s needed JRue, White, Porzingis and Horford for Tatum and Brown to become champions after their 2nd season.


This is just a wildly inaccurate misrepresentation of what Boston actually did over the last 8+ years though man.

You know what the Celtics did a week after drafting Jaylen Brown? They signed Al Horford to a max contract.

You know what the Celtics did a week after drafting Jayson Tatum? They signed Gordon Hayward to a max contract.

You know what the Celtics did two months after drafting Jayson Tatum? They traded for Kyrie Irving who was on a max contract.

You know what the Celtics did after Kyrie Irving and Al Horford both walked in free agency in the summer of 2019? They signed Kemba Walker to a max contract.

You know what the Celtics did when Kemba flamed out? The immediately punted him to bring Horford back and traded two first rounders for Derrick White.

When the Smart/White/Brown/Tatum/Horford/Brogdon core wasn't good enough to win the title, they punted Smart and a 1st for Porzingis and Brogdon and two firsts for Jrue.

This idea that the Celtics let things grow naturally with Tatum and Brown and only once they realized what they had did they get aggressive in adding pieces around them is just flat out false.

Boston has been incredibly aggressive in both free agency and in trades for literally the last eight offseasons.

Not to mention the fact that due to one of the most lopsided trades in NBA history where the Celtics fleeced the Nets, they were adding top 3 picks to a roster that was already very good.

The 15-16 Celtics won 48 games and picked 3rd. The 16-17 Celtics won 53 games and made the conference finals and won the draft lottery for goodness sake.


Lol, what an overreaction to what I was saying whilst proving my point. Was IT the answer? Was Kyrie the answer? Was Kemba the answer? Was Smart the answer? Was Brogdon the answer?

What was the answer? Derrick White and JRue Holiday. What did they need to eventually acquire those guys? Gee, couldn’t have been the stable of young players they developed internally? Nesmith, R.Williams, G.Williams, Smart - those guys got them to the finals, and then got them the guys who got the ring. That took time, it’s not a path they could have anticipated having the value for back in 2017-18 when JRue and Porzingis were 20ppg all stars.

None of this is saying “don’t make a move”, but don’t trick yourself into believing that not signing Monk/Klay/Jones has derailed the future.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#367 » by Nyce_1 » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:27 am

RookieStar wrote:
Nyce_1 wrote:Would you trade for Brook Lopez


For who?
No idea. Saw us linked in a rumor and asked here. I remember last summer, many wanted to sign Brook.

Doc is looking to shake things up a little, so anything we send has to add value to their contending team. Obviously, we can absorb money, but who can send back?

Thinking through it, I don't believe we're good trading partners.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#368 » by Knightro » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:45 am

Bensational wrote:Lol, what an overreaction to what I was saying whilst proving my point. Was IT the answer? Was Kyrie the answer? Was Kemba the answer? Was Smart the answer? Was Brogdon the answer?

What was the answer? Derrick White and JRue Holiday. What did they need to eventually acquire those guys? Gee, couldn’t have been the stable of young players they developed internally? Nesmith, R.Williams, G.Williams, Smart - those guys got them to the finals, and then got them the guys who got the ring. That took time, it’s not a path they could have anticipated having the value for back in 2017-18 when JRue and Porzingis were 20ppg all stars.

None of this is saying “don’t make a move”, but don’t trick yourself into believing that not signing Monk/Klay/Jones has derailed the future.


The Celtics have been NBA title contenders since 16-17 man. They went to the conference finals three times during Tatum's rookie contract for goodness sake.

Just because they didn't actually cash in a ring until Tatum's 8th year doesn't mean they weren't one of few teams in each of those seasons with the capability to win the NBA title.

Winning a title is very difficult.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#369 » by RichCollab » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:46 am

Ok. Here is where I’m at now.

Suggs / Black / Fultz
Klay / Cole / Caleb
Franz / Jett / Beasley
Paolo / JI / Mo Wagner
Claxton / WCJ / Missi
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#370 » by Knightro » Sat Jun 22, 2024 1:57 am

RichCollab wrote:Ok. Here is where I’m at now.

Suggs / Black / Fultz
Klay / Cole / Caleb
Franz / Jett / Beasley
Paolo / JI / Mo Wagner
Claxton / WCJ / Missi


I think Claxton is going to resign with Brooklyn, but I'm not sure you could get him and Klay anyway. And certainly not also... Malik Beasley and resign Fultz?
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#371 » by RichCollab » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:01 am

Knightro wrote:
RichCollab wrote:Ok. Here is where I’m at now.

Suggs / Black / Fultz
Klay / Cole / Caleb
Franz / Jett / Beasley
Paolo / JI / Mo Wagner
Claxton / WCJ / Missi


I think Claxton is going to resign with Brooklyn, but I'm not sure you could get him and Klay anyway. And certainly not also... Malik Beasley and resign Fultz?


Vet minimum for Fultz and Beasley.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#372 » by eyriq » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:22 am

RichCollab wrote:Ok. Here is where I’m at now.

Suggs / Black / Fultz
Klay / Cole / Caleb
Franz / Jett / Beasley
Paolo / JI / Mo Wagner
Claxton / WCJ / Missi
Claxton and Klay would be amazing. The best three-point specialist and an All-NBA defensive center that's a lob threat? Home run.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#373 » by VFX » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:23 am

What are people even talking about? Now it’s not convenient to be wrong about the (in)decision the FO made to not commit to developing youth and instead going with Fultz last season? HOW CONVENIENT that discussion no longer matters.

Celtics and Magic are vastly different organizations. Orlando isn’t landing multi time allstars for other teams garbage. They have to develop talent and cut bait by trading early when things aren’t working out. Kinda like what OKC just did with Giddey and Caruso. Not hold onto players until their value reaches zero because everyone here is Vin Diesel in Fast and Furious 29.

If they aren’t trading for someone they are developing talent. You have to have assets to trade, instead of players that equal zero value. Orlando hasn’t signed anyone worth talking about in Free Agency since Rashard Lewis.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#374 » by Redick07 » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:28 am

I am now believing we will do nothing or tiny move this summer.

Something like
1. Signing a veteran SG like KCP with 1+1, 40-45m/2y, or Melton.
2. Drafting #18, sending him to G-league and trading #47 for cash.
3. Keep MoW, Ingles and Isaac
4. Losing Goga
5. Maybe resigning Fultz and get rid of G.Harris, Okeke and Houston.

Black/Cole
Suggs/Jett/KCP
Franz/Ingles/KCP
Paolo/Isaac
WCJ/MoW

Then, I will be disappointed….
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#375 » by eyriq » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:29 am

This guy is back

Read on Twitter
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#376 » by Cammo101 » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:39 am

RichCollab wrote:Ok. Here is where I’m at now.

Suggs / Black / Fultz
Klay / Cole / Caleb
Franz / Jett / Beasley
Paolo / JI / Mo Wagner
Claxton / WCJ / Missi


I'd take...

Suggs/Black/Queen
Simons (or Ingram)/Cole/Houston
Franz/Jett/Ingles
Paolo/Isaac/Okeke
Claxton/Edey/Mo
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#377 » by RookieStar » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:40 am

eyriq wrote:This guy is back

Read on Twitter
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Check the Raps board and their rumors thread eyriq, they got more juicy stuff there for the entire league.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#378 » by eyriq » Sat Jun 22, 2024 2:44 am

RookieStar wrote:
eyriq wrote:This guy is back

Read on Twitter
?t=Xs02RDCgV4znDW_C7GcWjQ&s=19


Check the Raps board and their rumors thread eyriq, they got more juicy stuff there for the entire league.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#379 » by Bensational » Sat Jun 22, 2024 3:50 am

Knightro wrote:The Celtics have been NBA title contenders since 16-17 man. They went to the conference finals three times during Tatum's rookie contract for goodness sake.

Just because they didn't actually cash in a ring until Tatum's 8th year doesn't mean they weren't one of few teams in each of those seasons with the capability to win the NBA title.

Winning a title is very difficult.


Yeah man, they took their path and we’re taking ours. They were in the conference finals before Tatum got there, we were in the lottery. Their team already knew how to win, ours is learning how to. We’ve got some undercooked prospects in Black, Jett and Houstan - they need time. Suggs, Franz and Paolo are still growing - they need time. There’s nothing controversial about that.

I’m actually onboard with most of your suggested targets! Monk, Klay, PG - we should totally pursue them and be happy to pay an inflated rate (especially PG). I think we should try to trade for Brogdon. Hartenstein would be a great addition. Fingers crossed Donovan Mitchell forces a trade here!

But I don’t expect wholesale changes from management, and I’m not going to be too disappointed if they choose not to make a move right now. I’m happy with the results to date. They’ve got my trust.
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Re: Official Summer 2024 Magic Free Agency and Trade Ideas Thread 6.0 

Post#380 » by Knightro » Sat Jun 22, 2024 4:44 am

Bensational wrote:
Knightro wrote:The Celtics have been NBA title contenders since 16-17 man. They went to the conference finals three times during Tatum's rookie contract for goodness sake.

Just because they didn't actually cash in a ring until Tatum's 8th year doesn't mean they weren't one of few teams in each of those seasons with the capability to win the NBA title.

Winning a title is very difficult.


Yeah man, they took their path and we’re taking ours. They were in the conference finals before Tatum got there, we were in the lottery. Their team already knew how to win, ours is learning how to. We’ve got some undercooked prospects in Black, Jett and Houstan - they need time. Suggs, Franz and Paolo are still growing - they need time. There’s nothing controversial about that.

I’m actually onboard with most of your suggested targets! Monk, Klay, PG - we should totally pursue them and be happy to pay an inflated rate (especially PG). I think we should try to trade for Brogdon. Hartenstein would be a great addition. Fingers crossed Donovan Mitchell forces a trade here!

But I don’t expect wholesale changes from management, and I’m not going to be too disappointed if they choose not to make a move right now. I’m happy with the results to date. They’ve got my trust.


The point that I’m making is that the Celtics trusted their evaluation of Brown and Tatum and spent big to maximize the team around them while those guys were still inexpensive.

Before Brown or Tatum’s rookie contracts were up, the Celtics signed two max players and traded for a third, then signed ANOTHER max player when two of the first three guys walked.

They didn’t just sit and wait for those high lotto picks to develop, and more importantly, get expensive to the point where they didn’t have the money to spend on upgrading the roster.

The time to upgrade the roster is right now because Suggs and Franz are gonna be making about 45M more combined than they make right now this time next offseason.

And Paolo’s only a year behind them.

The Magic are doing themselves an extreme disservice if they don’t appropriately utilize their cap flexibility to upgrade this roster.

And if they make a move and it doesn’t work, then you just fix it with a trade down the road. But these risk adverse dudes aren’t willing to stick their neck out there for any reason whatsoever.

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