Detroit, Hawks, NO's, not involving #1

[Whole Truth]

OnC had a 25 pick projected teens for Ivey & cap space. I'd assume less value than that for (Stewart, cap space) or (pure cap space)

Can players be combined in a S&T ?

If so I'd try to rope Houston & Nets into the deal. Maybe Detroit can get something worth swapping Ivey for.

[Kalamazoo317]

I think there's some value to this fact that is being overlooked. If CJ was in the open market would he take 30 m to play for a 14 win team ?.

I don't think Detroit can give Claxton 25 per, without moving Duren or flipping Claxton to a team with no cap space.

So we should trade for a player who doesn't want to be here?

And, yeah, we can give Claxton 25 per and keep Duren just fine, and have 35 left to spend still. Not saying we should (I'm not keen on adding a non-spacing 5, personally), but it's highly doable.

Responding to an earlier post from you as well, I don't trust anyone at CJ's age to stay healthy.

[Whole Truth]

I think there's some value to this fact that is being overlooked. If CJ was in the open market would he take 30 m to play for a 14 win team ?.

I don't think Detroit can give Claxton 25 per, without moving Duren or flipping Claxton to a team with no cap space.

So we should trade for a player who doesn't want to be here?

And, yeah, we can give Claxton 25 per and keep Duren just fine, and have 35 left to spend still. Not saying we should (I'm not keen on adding a non-spacing 5, personally), but it's highly doable.

Responding to an earlier post from you as well, I don't trust anyone at CJ's age to stay healthy.

Big difference between preference of choice & honoring a contract. CJ could theoretically ask out, doubtful but there's a level of control.

Of course you could keep both doesn't mean it would be an ideal situation to bench your high draft pick for an overpriced rim runner. How many yrs Detroit plan to give Claxton ?

Langdon traded for & extended CJ to that max contract in NO's, if he trades for him, he knows exactly what he's getting. CJ has been healthy every year of his extension & his game is not predicated on athleticism. Lavine is coming off a considerable injury & his game is based in his athleticism but he is younger.

[Kalamazoo317]

My guess is that Langdon knowing exactly what he's getting with CJ is true and that he won't be trying to get CJ.

[Whole Truth]

My guess is that Langdon knowing exactly what he's getting with CJ is true and that he won't be trying to get CJ.

If that's the case, I know why he's in Detroit & not NO's.

[A_dub06]

News articles saying Detroit could be targeting Monk & Claxton at 25m per.

If Detroit don't plan to move Duren, I doubt they would give Claxton 25m per to bring Duren off the bench.

Detroit trade - (Stewart, cap space) for (CJ, #21)

Nets S&T - (Claxton 25m per) for (cap space, NO's FRP)

NO's trade - (CJ, #21, FRP) for (Claxton, Stewart)

Monk already re-signed in Sac. And no to the trade because we could get better value by trading Stewart in a seperate deal, and CJ is overpaid so would need compensation. This has Detroit giving away Stewart for free and the draft pick as compensation, not to mention Detroit themselves can simply throw a heavy contract at Claxton which I think is the wrong move but they are rumoured to be interested in

Just the other day I asked for targets, Monk was listed & I asked with a similar offer, what difference maker is singing with a 14 win team ? Needless to say I'm not shocked Monk resigned to a winning situation.

I think there's some value to this fact that is being overlooked. If CJ was in the open market would he take 30 m to play for a 14 win team ?.

I don't think Detroit can give Claxton 25 per, without moving Duren or flipping Claxton to a team with no cap space.

Ahhh the old “your team sucks and should take whatever they get” routine. It really plays old and ridiculous especially when you consider the rules of the new CBA. Cap flexibility is important and if NOR thinks teams are going to trade you cap flexibility for nothing for CJ you’re dreaming. CJ the player obviously has value but teams with cap space to absorb his context without sending back a different bloated salary player are going to be rebuilding teams which don’t really have a need for a player his age. You’re also completely disregarding the opportunity cost of the cap space Detroit has which Langdon said today will be used to acquire overpaid players to reduce compensation. If Detroit just absorbed CJ into cap space without assets coming back that space is gone and any asset we could’ve recover by trading for a different overpaid player is gone.

I think you should also realise that the time is ticking for NOP and if they don’t want to attach assets to shed that contract are they simply going to wait 2 years for his deal to end? I doubt without compensation other teams will be trading for CJ’s contract next season and only the following season will some playoff team trade for him but even then you’ll be getting back salary so it’s a wash and not helping. Bottom line, if NOP wants to delete CJ’s contract from their books they’ll be paying for it

[Kalamazoo317]

My guess is that Langdon knowing exactly what he's getting with CJ is true and that he won't be trying to get CJ.

If that's the case, I know why he's in Detroit & not NO's.

Me too. He likely wanted to escape an ill-fitting, aging, injury-prone, and increasingly expensive roster and try to make something of his own.

[Whole Truth]

Monk already re-signed in Sac. And no to the trade because we could get better value by trading Stewart in a seperate deal, and CJ is overpaid so would need compensation. This has Detroit giving away Stewart for free and the draft pick as compensation, not to mention Detroit themselves can simply throw a heavy contract at Claxton which I think is the wrong move but they are rumoured to be interested in

Just the other day I asked for targets, Monk was listed & I asked with a similar offer, what difference maker is singing with a 14 win team ? Needless to say I'm not shocked Monk resigned to a winning situation.

I think there's some value to this fact that is being overlooked. If CJ was in the open market would he take 30 m to play for a 14 win team ?.

I don't think Detroit can give Claxton 25 per, without moving Duren or flipping Claxton to a team with no cap space.

Ahhh the old “your team sucks and should take whatever they get” routine. It really plays old and ridiculous especially when you consider the rules of the new CBA. Cap flexibility is important and if NOR thinks teams are going to trade you cap flexibility for nothing for CJ you’re dreaming. CJ the player obviously has value but teams with cap space to absorb his context without sending back a different bloated salary player are going to be rebuilding teams which don’t really have a need for a player his age. You’re also completely disregarding the opportunity cost of the cap space Detroit has which Langdon said today will be used to acquire overpaid players to reduce compensation. If Detroit just absorbed CJ into cap space without assets coming back that space is gone and any asset we could’ve recover by trading for a different overpaid player is gone.

I think you should also realise that the time is ticking for NOP and if they don’t want to attach assets to shed that contract are they simply going to wait 2 years for his deal to end? I doubt without compensation other teams will be trading for CJ’s contract next season and only the following season will some playoff team trade for him but even then you’ll be getting back salary so it’s a wash and not helping. Bottom line, if NOP wants to delete CJ’s contract from their books they’ll be paying for it

I'm not saying to accept anything but reality of the situation. I don't know why you responding like I'm forcing CJ on Detroit, if Detroit doesn't want him, it's fine. Correct me if I'm wrong. Monk was available, Monk was a target, Detroit had all the cap space in the world & Monk chose to remain Sacramento. It's not a slight, it's a fact.

Every team I've chosen to support was from a point of rebuild Toronto, Memphis, NO's because I'm not a bandwagon type fan. I believe you have to know what it is to lose to appreciate winning. I know what it's like to be in a losing situation. Everyone of the teams I've chosen, is not a prime free agent draw like LA or Miami. I'm speaking from experience, not condemnation.

Finally, I'm not sure where I said anywhere that Detroit should accept CJ for pure cap space. I know that's not how deals work. Want & demand or decline. I value CJ for cap space so I'm willing to offer some additional value, never said otherwise. How much more I'm willing to add is the question. I think it should be less than a 25 pick in the teens with Ivey's value no longer involved. Never said anywhere that Detroit have to take CJ & like it.

Winning is a cure all.

Time waits for no one, patience is a virtue.

[Whole Truth]

My guess is that Langdon knowing exactly what he's getting with CJ is true and that he won't be trying to get CJ.

If that's the case, I know why he's in Detroit & not NO's.

Me too. He likely wanted to escape an ill-fitting, aging, injury-prone, and increasingly expensive roster and try to make something of his own.

You do realize that was the point of my post. Not quite in the way you put it but ok. lol

Who doesn't want to escape a young 49 win team that's not properly constructed & could be better with better management. I don't know about you but I rather a GM that likes a challenging situation than bolting to a situation that has nowhere to go but up. Detroit will get better simply because it's hard to be any worse. Ideal start to a new career.

[A_dub06]

Just the other day I asked for targets, Monk was listed & I asked with a similar offer, what difference maker is singing with a 14 win team ? Needless to say I'm not shocked Monk resigned to a winning situation.

I think there's some value to this fact that is being overlooked. If CJ was in the open market would he take 30 m to play for a 14 win team ?.

I don't think Detroit can give Claxton 25 per, without moving Duren or flipping Claxton to a team with no cap space.

Ahhh the old “your team sucks and should take whatever they get” routine. It really plays old and ridiculous especially when you consider the rules of the new CBA. Cap flexibility is important and if NOR thinks teams are going to trade you cap flexibility for nothing for CJ you’re dreaming. CJ the player obviously has value but teams with cap space to absorb his context without sending back a different bloated salary player are going to be rebuilding teams which don’t really have a need for a player his age. You’re also completely disregarding the opportunity cost of the cap space Detroit has which Langdon said today will be used to acquire overpaid players to reduce compensation. If Detroit just absorbed CJ into cap space without assets coming back that space is gone and any asset we could’ve recover by trading for a different overpaid player is gone.

I think you should also realise that the time is ticking for NOP and if they don’t want to attach assets to shed that contract are they simply going to wait 2 years for his deal to end? I doubt without compensation other teams will be trading for CJ’s contract next season and only the following season will some playoff team trade for him but even then you’ll be getting back salary so it’s a wash and not helping. Bottom line, if NOP wants to delete CJ’s contract from their books they’ll be paying for it

I'm not saying to accept anything but reality of the situation. I don't know why you responding like I'm forcing CJ on Detroit, if Detroit doesn't want him, it's fine. Correct me if I'm wrong. Monk was available, Monk was a target, Detroit had all the cap space in the world & Monk chose to remain Sacramento. It's not a slight, it's a fact.

Every team I've chosen to support was from a point of rebuild Toronto, Memphis, NO's because I'm not a bandwagon type fan. I believe you have to know what it is to lose to appreciate winning. I know what it's like to be in a losing situation. Everyone of the teams I've chosen, is not a prime free agent draw like LA or Miami. I'm speaking from experience, not condemnation.

Finally, I'm not sure where I said anywhere that Detroit should accept CJ for pure cap space. I know that's not how deals work. Want & demand or decline. I value CJ for cap space so I'm willing to offer some additional value, never said otherwise. How much more I'm willing to add is the question. I think it should be less than a 25 pick in the teens with Ivey's value no longer involved. Never said anywhere that Detroit have to take CJ & like it.

Winning is a cure all.

Time waits for no one, patience is a virtue.

lol man that’s such a piss take statement. And yeah, it will take at least a season before anyone takes Detroit seriously but by the sound of it Langdon is also aware of that and wants to prioritise development and asset accumulation so despite whatever you think about what fair value for CJ is, the new CBA punishes expensive teams severely and NOR will need to pay to unload that contract so really “I’m not not saying anything other than to accept the reality of the situation”.

Furthermore to the point of value, you’re looking at CJ’s value in terms of what he provides and almost trying to sell the idea of it when in reality, teams are smart enough to know NOR needs to unload that contract if they want to sign a better player so they will hold them over the barrel to extract compensation because of it. That’s just called good cap/asset management.

It’s not really a debate of whether CJ would improve the Pistons, he would, but the cost of that most likely marginal improvement is the issue which you really seem incapable of understanding which leaves this discussion at an impasse. Langdon has stated what he wants to do in pretty clear terms so trying to push a point that doesn’t fit that is no longer worth discussing.

What I find interesting and confusing is how you openly state you’re not a “bandwagon fan” listing smaller market teams but you have changed the team you support. That’s not real fandom. Changing the team you follow based on the young players they’ve drafted is a form of bandwagoning. Kind’ve puts all the trash you’ve about Detroit into perspective now so I’ve had my laughter for the day. Thank you

[Whole Truth]

lol man that’s such a piss take statement. And yeah, it will take at least a season before anyone takes Detroit seriously but by the sound of it Langdon is also aware of that and wants to prioritise development and asset accumulation so despite whatever you think about what fair value for CJ is, the new CBA punishes expensive teams severely and NOR will need to pay to unload that contract so really “I’m not not saying anything other than to accept the reality of the situation”.

Furthermore to the point of value, you’re looking at CJ’s value in terms of what he provides and almost trying to sell the idea of it when in reality, teams are smart enough to know NOR needs to unload that contract if they want to sign a better player so they will hold them over the barrel to extract compensation because of it. That’s just called good cap/asset management.

It’s not really a debate of whether CJ would improve the Pistons, he would, but the cost of that most likely marginal improvement is the issue which you really seem incapable of understanding which leaves this discussion at an impasse. Langdon has stated what he wants to do in pretty clear terms so trying to push a point that doesn’t fit that is no longer worth discussing.

What I find interesting and confusing is how you openly state you’re not a “bandwagon fan” listing smaller market teams but you have changed the team you support. That’s not real fandom. Changing the team you follow based on the young players they’ve drafted is a form of bandwagoning. Kind’ve puts all the trash you’ve about Detroit into perspective now so I’ve had my laughter for the day. Thank you

Raptors were my original team because I briefly lived in Toronto. I stopped following the Raptors when they won their Championship, goal reached, 15yrs. I followed Jonas to Memphis into their rebuild because I didn't like the fact people made him into a scape goat as a 20 minute role player for not getting over the Cavs. Memphis became the 2 seed in the West before Ja's injury, 2yrs & I did the same when they traded him to a non PO NO's team, 3yrs because I like the business side of the sport. You'd be better off saying I'm a Jonas fan but now that Jonas is gone, I'm still following NO's so IDK. Since Raptors won the Championship I've found my interest in the sport waning. don't give 2 **** what you think of me.

Prioritize development for one more season. Did anyone think he would come in a transform Detroit in one year!.

You realize this trade I'm suggesting is not a cost saving trade right ?. The purpose & goal of my trade is to target a free agent C or by S&T using CJ's value for the cap space to do so. Though there's some financial benefit in deal. The majority of the money is going to another player, depending on if it's a pure cap deal etc. One iteration with Ivey, there would be minimal savings. The price paid is for value, not savings. What I'm valuing in trade is landing a starting C

What teams know is that NO's don't want to risk giving BI the max all things considered. Some could say poor cap management cost them Jonas to free agency, some would say Green prefers to switch defend over drop coverage & they intended to trade Jonas but instead let him walk because they want to upgrade defensively.

[A_dub06]

lol man that’s such a piss take statement. And yeah, it will take at least a season before anyone takes Detroit seriously but by the sound of it Langdon is also aware of that and wants to prioritise development and asset accumulation so despite whatever you think about what fair value for CJ is, the new CBA punishes expensive teams severely and NOR will need to pay to unload that contract so really “I’m not not saying anything other than to accept the reality of the situation”.

Furthermore to the point of value, you’re looking at CJ’s value in terms of what he provides and almost trying to sell the idea of it when in reality, teams are smart enough to know NOR needs to unload that contract if they want to sign a better player so they will hold them over the barrel to extract compensation because of it. That’s just called good cap/asset management.

It’s not really a debate of whether CJ would improve the Pistons, he would, but the cost of that most likely marginal improvement is the issue which you really seem incapable of understanding which leaves this discussion at an impasse. Langdon has stated what he wants to do in pretty clear terms so trying to push a point that doesn’t fit that is no longer worth discussing.

What I find interesting and confusing is how you openly state you’re not a “bandwagon fan” listing smaller market teams but you have changed the team you support. That’s not real fandom. Changing the team you follow based on the young players they’ve drafted is a form of bandwagoning. Kind’ve puts all the trash you’ve about Detroit into perspective now so I’ve had my laughter for the day. Thank you

Raptors were my original team because I briefly lived in Toronto. I stopped following the Raptors when they won their Championship, goal reached. I followed Jonas to Memphis into their rebuild because I didn't like the fact people made him into a scape goat as a 20 minute role player for not getting over the Cavs. Memphis became the 2 seed in the West before Ja's injury & I did the same when they traded him to a non PO NO's team because I like the business side of the sport. You'd be better off saying I'm a Jonas fan but now that Jonas is gone, I'm still following NO's so IDK.

Prioritize development for one more season. Did anyone think he would come in a transform Detroit in one year!.

You realize this trade I'm suggesting is not a cost saving trade right ?. The purpose & goal of my trade is to target a free agent C or by S&T using CJ's value for the cap space to do so. Though there's some financial benefit in deal. The majority of the money is going to another player, depending on if it's a pure cap deal etc. One iteration with Ivey, there would be minimal savings. The price paid is for value, not savings. What I'm valuing in trade is landing a starting C

What teams know is that NO's don't want to risk giving BI the max all things considered. Some could say poor cap management cost them Jonas to free agency, some would say Green prefers to switch defend over drop coverage & they intended to trade Jonas but instead let him walk because they want to upgrade defensively.

Can’t experience the highs with a team if you can’t experience the lows. It’s just not loyalty which isn’t fandom but interest, not that my opinion matters but I still find it weird.

Yes, and you still fail to see that teams know that NOR has cap issues as an increasingly expensive team which you can bet Murphy is going to be getting a bag as well. The BI situation makes things worse as he wants the max and teams reading for him will need to do so with the knowledge they will be paying him that or risk him leaving at the end of the season, that’s going to limit the value you get back for him since 1) nobody actually wants to pay him the max and 2) NOR can’t just let him leave for lesser value. This publicly wide information will be used against NOR which you can bet your top dollar Detroit will expect compensation for a salary dump in CJ, which while a decent player is overpaid and old not fitting the rosters timeline.

To reiterate, Detroit will not accept this deal unless compensation is coming back in the form of draft capital, and pick #21 in a bad draft is not enough value to dump that level of salary. Detroit will be asking for next years pick and any attempt to put heavy protections on it to stop it conveying will end the discussion. It’s simple. I’m not saying NOR should do it, but I’m saying that’s what the price will be which is supported by Landon’s comments.

I’m not interested in what other teams would do in a salary dump of sorts for CJ, and I’m not interested in what you believe BI would get back in a trade. I’m only concerned where Detroit’s involved and the pick with light protections like top 5 or something is what they’ll want. If you don’t like that idea, that’s cool but there’s nothing further to discuss. CJ is overpaid, Detroit wants to get back assets for taking on bloated contracts. You either give them what they want or don’t, it’s simple

[Whole Truth]

[

Can’t experience the highs with a team if you can’t experience the lows. It’s just not loyalty which isn’t fandom but interest, not that my opinion matters but I still find it weird.

Yes, and you still fail to see that teams know that NOR has cap issues as an increasingly expensive team which you can bet Murphy is going to be getting a bag as well. The BI situation makes things worse as he wants the max and teams reading for him will need to do so with the knowledge they will be paying him that or risk him leaving at the end of the season, that’s going to limit the value you get back for him since 1) nobody actually wants to pay him the max and 2) NOR can’t just let him leave for lesser value. This publicly wide information will be used against NOR which you can bet your top dollar Detroit will expect compensation for a salary dump in CJ, which while a decent player is overpaid and old not fitting the rosters timeline.

To reiterate, Detroit will not accept this deal unless compensation is coming back in the form of draft capital, and pick #21 in a bad draft is not enough value to dump that level of salary. Detroit will be asking for next years pick and any attempt to put heavy protections on it to stop it conveying will end the discussion. It’s simple. I’m not saying NOR should do it, but I’m saying that’s what the price will be which is supported by Landon’s comments.

I’m not interested in what other teams would do in a salary dump of sorts for CJ, and I’m not interested in what you believe BI would get back in a trade. I’m only concerned where Detroit’s involved and the pick with light protections like top 5 or something is what they’ll want. If you don’t like that idea, that’s cool but there’s nothing further to discuss. CJ is overpaid, Detroit wants to get back assets for taking on bloated contracts. You either give them what they want or don’t, it’s simple

I followed the Raptors from rebuild to a Championship roughly 15yrs with plenty of highs & lows. From living in Toronto to moving back home. Not going to lie, them winning it all, the sport hasn't been the same for me since. I'm finding new interest in discussing the teams build. Memphis found success quickly in 2yrs. So here I am with NO's in a new build. If not for the business side of the sport I'm probably done.

I assume based on the other Detroit posters response thinking that I trashed Detroit by saying I know why Langdon is in Detroit & not NO's was about his involvement in trading for & extending CJ. NO's appear as though they want to keep CJ, so if Langdon doesn't want him in my hypothetical trade, it means he wasn't behind the original interest. So the response while bitter, correct. He might have wanted a different direction ..

I'm not failing to see anything. I was pushing to trade CJ/BI last year off the Suns PO rum & was targeting a soft reset with Brandon Miller in the 23 draft. I have a decent idea of NO's projected financial situation.

Last time. It's my idea not NO's that want to trade CJ to Detroit for cap space. The purpose of my trade is not a cost saving move but one for a starting C. I never said I wouldn't be willing to add necessary value. What I said was whatever that value is, it should be less than what I discussed with a Detroit poster that involved Ivey with the cap space.

Either way, I think the discussion has run it's course.

[A_dub06]

[

Can’t experience the highs with a team if you can’t experience the lows. It’s just not loyalty which isn’t fandom but interest, not that my opinion matters but I still find it weird.

Yes, and you still fail to see that teams know that NOR has cap issues as an increasingly expensive team which you can bet Murphy is going to be getting a bag as well. The BI situation makes things worse as he wants the max and teams reading for him will need to do so with the knowledge they will be paying him that or risk him leaving at the end of the season, that’s going to limit the value you get back for him since 1) nobody actually wants to pay him the max and 2) NOR can’t just let him leave for lesser value. This publicly wide information will be used against NOR which you can bet your top dollar Detroit will expect compensation for a salary dump in CJ, which while a decent player is overpaid and old not fitting the rosters timeline.

To reiterate, Detroit will not accept this deal unless compensation is coming back in the form of draft capital, and pick #21 in a bad draft is not enough value to dump that level of salary. Detroit will be asking for next years pick and any attempt to put heavy protections on it to stop it conveying will end the discussion. It’s simple. I’m not saying NOR should do it, but I’m saying that’s what the price will be which is supported by Landon’s comments.

I’m not interested in what other teams would do in a salary dump of sorts for CJ, and I’m not interested in what you believe BI would get back in a trade. I’m only concerned where Detroit’s involved and the pick with light protections like top 5 or something is what they’ll want. If you don’t like that idea, that’s cool but there’s nothing further to discuss. CJ is overpaid, Detroit wants to get back assets for taking on bloated contracts. You either give them what they want or don’t, it’s simple

I followed the Raptors from rebuild to a Championship roughly 15yrs with plenty of highs & lows. From living in Toronto to moving back home. Not going to lie, them winning it all, the sport hasn't been the same for me since. I'm finding new interest in discussing the teams build. Memphis found success quickly in 2yrs. So here I am with NO's in a new build. If not for the business side of the sport I'm probably done.

I assume based on the other Detroit posters response thinking that I trashed Detroit by saying I know why Langdon is in Detroit & not NO's was about his involvement in trading for & extending CJ. NO's appear as though they want to keep CJ, so if Langdon doesn't want him in my hypothetical trade, it means he wasn't behind the original interest. So the response while bitter, correct. He might have wanted a different direction ..

I'm not failing to see anything. I was pushing to trade CJ/BI last year off the Suns PO rum & was targeting a soft reset with Brandon Miller in the 23 draft. I have a decent idea of NO's projected financial situation.

Last time. It's my idea not NO's that want to trade CJ to Detroit for cap space. The purpose of my trade is not a cost saving move but one for a starting C. I never said I wouldn't be willing to add necessary value. What I said was whatever that value is, it should be less than what I discussed with a Detroit poster that involved Ivey with the cap space.

Either way, I think the discussion has run its course.

Obviously you don’t speak for the team lol. Frame it however you want but it’s a salary dump, and at over $30m per season that is a large dump. I don’t know how long the list is of teams with enough cap space to absorb that level of salary but it wouldn’t be long at all, and of that list most are likely going to be bottom teams which don’t have the need for a player at CJ’s age which means compensation is required. Do you think Detroit largely values the 21st pick in this draft? I don’t. But they would value a 1st in next years draft so that would be the logical and likely asking price given what the POBO has said on record regarding taking on big salary from another team. I’m simply stating what was blatantly said at Langdon’s press conference so there’s no point in arguing what is no longer theoretical but fact. Many teams don’t even value half the lottery from this draft so pick 21 from this draft is like a second round pick from a normal draft.

And to be clear, there are Detroit posters that don’t care that a move like the one you’re talking about won’t actually help the team make the playoffs, and there’s others that believe Cade will be a top 1 player in the league. There a multitude of beliefs/opinions but most are just sick of the status quo and would want almost any change just for the sake of change. I like to look at things from a perspective of reality, logic and wanting to build the right way to eventually compete for a championship not just a couple extra wins in a meaningless season. So basing your trade off of one or two posters opinion probably isn’t productive discussion. Especially when you’re failing to consider what the opposing team you are theoretically trading to needs, and has publicly stated on record what they plan to do.

[Whole Truth]

Obviously you don’t speak for the team lol. Frame it however you want but it’s a salary dump, and at over $30m per season that is a large dump. I don’t know how long the list is of teams with enough cap space to absorb that level of salary but it wouldn’t be long at all, and of that list most are likely going to be bottom teams which don’t have the need for a player at CJ’s age which means compensation is required. Do you think Detroit largely values the 21st pick in this draft? I don’t. But they would value a 1st in next years draft so that would be the logical and likely asking price given what the POBO has said on record regarding taking on big salary from another team. I’m simply stating what was blatantly said at Langdon’s press conference so there’s no point in arguing what is no longer theoretical but fact. Many teams don’t even value half the lottery from this draft so pick 21 from this draft is like a second round pick from a normal draft.

And to be clear, there are Detroit posters that don’t care that a move like the one you’re talking about won’t actually help the team make the playoffs, and there’s others that believe Cade will be a top 1 player in the league. There a multitude of beliefs/opinions but most are just sick of the status quo and would want almost any change just for the sake of change. I like to look at things from a perspective of reality, logic and wanting to build the right way to eventually compete for a championship not just a couple extra wins in a meaningless season. So basing your trade off of one or two posters opinion probably isn’t productive discussion. Especially when you’re failing to consider what the opposing team you are theoretically trading to needs, and has publicly stated on record what they plan to do.

I know the trade itself is a salary dump, I'm not disputing that but you mention NO's need to dump salary as tax leverage in trade. What I'm saying, is the salary dump is not a cost saving trade. NO's have alternative options to avoid the tax apron if Detroit don't want to use their cap space on CJ. This trade was my preference which as you know doesn't matter because all signs point to NO's wanting to keep CJ for his spacing ability, where I think he's a poor defensive fit with Zion.

I know very well people don't value things the same way & there's many varying reasons value will differ. It's why I say value is relative & encompassing, not set.

My trade is predicated on Detroit somewhat valuing CJ's addition.

So I ask, do you think Claxton is worth CJ & a 25 pick in the teens ? & it doesn't stop there, Nets would probably have to get value/FRP to facilitate the S&T. I don't give Detroit wrong if they don't want CJ or like the value. At some point it stops making sense for NO's too. So the trade is dependent on Detroit having some value/interest in wanting CJ for the cap space.

Detroit doesn't value CJ for mainly cap space, my trade intention no longer makes sense for either team.

[Whole Truth]

To the Detroit fans reading this, if you feel I was intently trashing your team it was not my intention & I apologize if it came off that way.