GSW / DAL / LAC / DET [Paul George to GSW]

[hugepatsfan]

This is obviously predicated on Paul George opting in to facilitate a deal to the Warriors. It doesn't make sense otherwise. Deal also required GSW waiving CP3 prior to completion.

GSW gives: F Andrew Wiggins, F Jonathan Kuminga, G Moses Moodey, G Gary Payton Jr., C Kevon Looney, F Gui Santos, unprotected 2028 1st rounder [$47.7M]
GSW gets: F Paul George [$48.7M]

Why? Push chips in for another run with their core. Since they're not sending out more than they take back, I believe this won't hard cap them at the 1st apron. But it will hard cap them at the 2nd apron. By my calculations, they're about $43.3M below the 2nd apron after waiving CP3 and before this deal. So they should be able to re-sign Klay and fill out the roster with vet min deal after that. They're starting with a rotation of:

Steph / Payton
Podz / Klay
PG
Draymond
TJD

They'll have to fill out with the right vet min deals for the front court, but they get their co-star for Steph.

DAL gives: G/F Tim Hardaway Jr., F Maxi Kleber, unprotected 2025 1st rounder [$27.1M]
DAL gets: F Andrew Wiggins [$26.2M]

Why? Move spare parts for a 3rd perimeter scorer that can create. They would need to make a follow up move to swap out some other pieces to keep DJJ if they want to do so, but now they have an upgrade over him in the starting lineup. Their rotation would be:

Luka / Exum
Kyrie / Hardy
Wiggins / Green
Washington / Prosper
Lively / Gafford / Powell

That's a pretty deep roster, but I'm sure they'd like to try and consolidate down Green/Hardy/Exum/Prosper/Powell into a legit 3rd guard that also sheds a few million to keep DJJ. But getting a legit 2-way wing is so important to them and I don't see a better path than gambling on Wiggins keeping his head screwed on straight.

LAC gives: F Paul George [$48.7M]
LAC gets: F Jonathan Kuminga, G Moses Moody, F/C Maxi Kleber, unprotected 2028 GSW 1st rounder [$24.4M]

Why? Not going to try and sell this as positive. This is PG leaving and them facilitating. They get a good young player in Kuminga, a 1st rounder that has some upside with the age of the Warriors, a project in Moody, a playable forward/center in Kleber and some salary flexibility.

DET gives: cap space
DET gets: G/F Tim Hardaway Jr., C Kevon Looney, unprotected 2025 DAL 1st rounder [$24.1M]

Why? They get a 1st rounder for some expiring salary. THJ fills a need for wing shooting and Looney might be flippable into some team's MLE or if he stays he's a respectable vet for guys like Duren and Stewart to learn from.

[DonaldSanders]

Interesting idea. But why not involve CP3 with Wiggins/Kuminga instead of some of the salary filler? From what I understand Paul's contract can be guaranteed on a sliding scale, and it could be more attractive for LAC.

[Texas Chuck]

LAC should not cut Detroit into this degree and keep the Dallas pick.

I also think GSW would much prefer to use Payton/another pick and keep Kuminga. LAC wouldn't have the leverage to force otherwise either.

GSW fans have not asked for a 1st in the much discussed Wiggins deal so Dallas might be overpaying.

[babyjax13]

I think Golden State gtd. Looney and pushed back Paul's gtd. date to see if they could trade for George, Butler, or Ingram. Trading Wiggins might happen, but I think that's in a separate transaction.

[hugepatsfan]

Interesting idea. But why not involve CP3 with Wiggins/Kuminga instead of some of the salary filler? From what I understand Paul's contract can be guaranteed on a sliding scale, and it could be more attractive for LAC.

The partial guarantee is tough because the other team has to account for him at full value. LAC is a 2nd apron team when PG opts in, so them taking back $30M for CP3 makes the math tough as they can't take back more than they send out. Even if they end up waiving CP3 for savings later, they have to factor him in at the guarantee.

You could maybe guarantee CP3 and for like $10M and send him to DET instead of Looney's $8M. That alters the math so that GSW is sending out more than they're taking back here. I believe that would avoid the hard cap at the 1st apron so maybe they can make it work to keep Klay and still have Looney.

[hugepatsfan]

LAC should not cut Detroit into this degree and keep the Dallas pick.

I also think GSW would much prefer to use Payton/another pick and keep Kuminga. LAC wouldn't have the leverage to force otherwise either.

GSW fans have not asked for a 1st in the much discussed Wiggins deal so Dallas might be overpaying.

That makes sense about LAC keeping the pick. I guess it comes down to if LAC wants to stay so expensive. I have the DAL pick as reasonably expected to be late enough that the savings might be worth more.

I get what you mean about the leverage on Kuminga. My thought is that the Clippers are strengthening two chief rivals here. If you swap Kuminga out for Payton and a pick then essentially LAC is getting nothing on the court this year. Tough pill to swallow. But these opt in and trade deals can force a team to accept bad returns. Does PG have any other options? There's talk of NY, for example, and maybe LAC would rather facilitate him going there since they have on court value to send back. That could force GSW to give up Kuminga if LAC insists and PG is ok going to NY. Lots of dynamics at play there.

My thinking with DAL having to give up the pick is that it's paying for the addition of Wiggins on the court and the dumping of THJ on DET. But could maybe be worked out with a bunch of 2nds instead, definitely valid.

[eminence]

Based off the Harden to LAC trade last season this seems like slightly too much for an opt in guy.

[hugepatsfan]

Based off the Harden to LAC trade last season this seems like slightly too much for an opt in guy.

Maybe. It's just hard for me to get over the optics of LAC facilitating PG to the Warriors without getting a lot back. LAC is taking a huge step back here and giving a prime competitor a huge step forward. The structure here is even strengthening Dallas in the West as well. And with Kawhi just extended, LAC is always probably going to be win now.

What would the Harden deal have looked like if he was pushing to go to MIL, for example? Do the dynamics on PHI's end change at all if they feel they're making a competitor better? IDK. Added onto the normal "oddness" of opt in to trade and there are some unique dynamics at play.

[theBigLip]

LAC should not cut Detroit into this degree and keep the Dallas pick.

I also think GSW would much prefer to use Payton/another pick and keep Kuminga. LAC wouldn't have the leverage to force otherwise either.

GSW fans have not asked for a 1st in the much discussed Wiggins deal so Dallas might be overpaying.

That makes sense about LAC keeping the pick. I guess it comes down to if LAC wants to stay so expensive. I have the DAL pick as reasonably expected to be late enough that the savings might be worth more.

I get what you mean about the leverage on Kuminga. My thought is that the Clippers are strengthening two chief rivals here. If you swap Kuminga out for Payton and a pick then essentially LAC is getting nothing on the court this year. Tough pill to swallow. But these opt in and trade deals can force a team to accept bad returns. Does PG have any other options? There's talk of NY, for example, and maybe LAC would rather facilitate him going there since they have on court value to send back. That could force GSW to give up Kuminga if LAC insists and PG is ok going to NY. Lots of dynamics at play there.

My thinking with DAL having to give up the pick is that it's paying for the addition of Wiggins on the court and the dumping of THJ on DET. But could maybe be worked out with a bunch of 2nds instead, definitely valid.

F--k SRPs. Detroit has the cap space and especially this year, it shouldn't come cheap. Taking on Looney and THJ? That's going to cost at least one FRP. Dallas's FRP is likely to be in the high 20s, so it isn't even that good, unless Luka tears an ACL. But this isn't happening for SRPs.

[BeiBeau]

This was kinda my though process for a Wiggins to Dallas move the other day.

Dallas fans will complain about the 1st but it’s fine.

[Texas Chuck]

LAC should not cut Detroit into this degree and keep the Dallas pick.

I also think GSW would much prefer to use Payton/another pick and keep Kuminga. LAC wouldn't have the leverage to force otherwise either.

GSW fans have not asked for a 1st in the much discussed Wiggins deal so Dallas might be overpaying.

That makes sense about LAC keeping the pick. I guess it comes down to if LAC wants to stay so expensive. I have the DAL pick as reasonably expected to be late enough that the savings might be worth more.

I get what you mean about the leverage on Kuminga. My thought is that the Clippers are strengthening two chief rivals here. If you swap Kuminga out for Payton and a pick then essentially LAC is getting nothing on the court this year. Tough pill to swallow. But these opt in and trade deals can force a team to accept bad returns. Does PG have any other options? There's talk of NY, for example, and maybe LAC would rather facilitate him going there since they have on court value to send back. That could force GSW to give up Kuminga if LAC insists and PG is ok going to NY. Lots of dynamics at play there.

My thinking with DAL having to give up the pick is that it's paying for the addition of Wiggins on the court and the dumping of THJ on DET. But could maybe be worked out with a bunch of 2nds instead, definitely valid.

F--k SRPs. Detroit has the cap space and especially this year, it shouldn't come cheap. Taking on Looney and THJ? That's going to cost at least one FRP. Dallas's FRP is likely to be in the high 20s, so it isn't even that good, unless Luka tears an ACL. But this isn't happening for SRPs.

He may have pivoted to LAC taking on more of the money as I talked about and Detroit(or another team if its still too much) taking back less than $10M? You might still prefer not to sell the space, but at under 8 figures "a bunch of 2nds" is plenty of value.

I would be surprised if he thought Detroit would take THJ plus Looney or Payton for just 2nds. He might just not have been clear?

Plus Dallas already sweetened the deal with Lindsay

[Kalamazoo317]

Yeah, Detroit does the OP, but will keep the cap space for other uses if there's no FRP involved