Eye of the Tiger: The Tidjane Salaun Thread

[MasterIchiro]

Certainly they are moving on from Richards and trying to find a backup big who can shoot, if they want to play a lot of 5 out

Mo Bamba on a cheap deal? Can run the floor and protect the rim as well as Nick.

[Diop]

Certainly they are moving on from Richards and trying to find a backup big who can shoot, if they want to play a lot of 5 out

Jalen Smith isn’t a bad bet. He’s not really a true 5 but I like his shot a lot.

He plays better as a 5, even though I suggested him as a backup 4 prior. It’s handy that he can play both

[MasterIchiro]

I remember when Jalen Smith bossed around whatever wimpy bigs we ran when Plumlee was here, the consummate wimp.

[MasterIchiro]

What do you think about this comp?

In his best case scenario, he's Gerald Wallace in his lone All Star campaign. That year Wallace hit 37% on his threes (shot 32% for his career through the tail end of the bully-ball era).

Wallace was 27 years old that season.

Put differently, 9 years from now for pick 6.

[MasterIchiro]

Everyone is welcome to salivate over that timeline.

What's a decade, give or take one or two?

[MasterIchiro]

To be fair, Wallace was a menace on defense and with his hustle and drive. Full throttle.

[bravor]

No matter how much he trains, Crash was a lockdown defender, something that Salaun will never become (and by never i mean never).
Wallace had good driving skills, he had a good ft rate in his career, again, i have trouble thinking it could be the same for Salaun.
The hustle and activity, sure, and i would add the competitiveness, that's something they share. But on the court, even with a great development, it's hard to find anything in common. If you could merge both, you would have a pretty nice tweener otoh (crash motor and agressivity to the rim and in defense, and Salaun's shooting and good positioning basically)

Anyway as of now, i see him as a spot on shooter, sort of a wing Teletovic (or as i once said, sort of a Ryan anderson guy with better defence)

[wilson115]

Crash's best years had his usage rate hovering in the low 20s, which would make him the third best player on most teams today.

Out of eight teams in this year's conference semis, the only ones to have more than two of their highest minute guys (at least 300) get better than 20% usage rates were the Pacers (5), Wolves (3), and Thunder (3). What they all had in common were bigs who let them play 4/5 out (Turner/Toppin, KAT/Naz Reid, and Holmgren).

A healthy Porzingis would've given the Celtics a third high-usage guy, but even the stud guards Holiday and White didn't get to 20% with Tatum and Brown dominating the ball. So, going by this year's playoffs at least, the best bet at a high-usage type able to share the floor with other high-usage types is a big who hits threes at a respectable volume.

Doesn't mean a team absolutely needs more than two high-usage guys to win seeing Boston and the Mavs (with PJ #3 in minutes and usage [16.8%] over the playoffs) both made it all the way to the finals relying on a mere two high-volume shot creators each.

[MasterIchiro]

Crash's best years had his usage rate hovering in the low 20s, which would make him the third best player on most teams today.

Out of eight teams in this year's conference semis, the only ones to have more than two of their highest minute guys (at least 300) get better than 20% usage rates were the Pacers (5), Wolves (3), and Thunder (3). What they all had in common were bigs who let them play 4/5 out (Turner/Toppin, KAT/Naz Reid, and Holmgren).

A healthy Porzingis would've given the Celtics a third high-usage guy, but even the stud guards Holiday and White didn't get to 20% with Tatum and Brown dominating the ball. So, going by this year's playoffs at least, the best bet at a high-usage type able to share the floor with other high-usage types is a big who hits threes at a respectable volume.

Doesn't mean a team absolutely needs more than two high-usage guys to win seeing Boston and the Mavs (with PJ #3 in minutes and usage [16.8%] over the playoffs) both made it all the way to the finals relying on a mere two high-volume shot creators each.

Oh, how comforting, Crash was drafted at age 19 and only needed 9 seasons to make an AS team. He shot 32% for his career on 3's. A decade can pass in the blink of an eye!

[wilson115]

Crash's best years had his usage rate hovering in the low 20s, which would make him the third best player on most teams today.

Out of eight teams in this year's conference semis, the only ones to have more than two of their highest minute guys (at least 300) get better than 20% usage rates were the Pacers (5), Wolves (3), and Thunder (3). What they all had in common were bigs who let them play 4/5 out (Turner/Toppin, KAT/Naz Reid, and Holmgren).

A healthy Porzingis would've given the Celtics a third high-usage guy, but even the stud guards Holiday and White didn't get to 20% with Tatum and Brown dominating the ball. So, going by this year's playoffs at least, the best bet at a high-usage type able to share the floor with other high-usage types is a big who hits threes at a respectable volume.

Doesn't mean a team absolutely needs more than two high-usage guys to win seeing Boston and the Mavs (with PJ #3 in minutes and usage [16.8%] over the playoffs) both made it all the way to the finals relying on a mere two high-volume shot creators each.

Oh, how comforting, Crash was drafted at age 19 and only needed 9 seasons to make an AS team. He shot 32% for his career on 3's. A decade can pass in the blink of an eye!

Crash's best year he hit 37.1% of his 1.8 3P attempts per game. In college he hit a blistering 17.5% of the same number of tries per game. Different league back then, we can make the argument Tidjane's already a better shooter given his volume.

Toppin has gotten up to hitting 35.6% of his 3.3 3P heaves per his first playoffs with Indy after averaging less than 32% on threes his two years with the Knicks. I doubt it takes Tidjane nine years to hit that accuracy given the coach and roster around him.

[MasterIchiro]

Crash's best years had his usage rate hovering in the low 20s, which would make him the third best player on most teams today.

Out of eight teams in this year's conference semis, the only ones to have more than two of their highest minute guys (at least 300) get better than 20% usage rates were the Pacers (5), Wolves (3), and Thunder (3). What they all had in common were bigs who let them play 4/5 out (Turner/Toppin, KAT/Naz Reid, and Holmgren).

A healthy Porzingis would've given the Celtics a third high-usage guy, but even the stud guards Holiday and White didn't get to 20% with Tatum and Brown dominating the ball. So, going by this year's playoffs at least, the best bet at a high-usage type able to share the floor with other high-usage types is a big who hits threes at a respectable volume.

Doesn't mean a team absolutely needs more than two high-usage guys to win seeing Boston and the Mavs (with PJ #3 in minutes and usage [16.8%] over the playoffs) both made it all the way to the finals relying on a mere two high-volume shot creators each.

Oh, how comforting, Crash was drafted at age 19 and only needed 9 seasons to make an AS team. He shot 32% for his career on 3's. A decade can pass in the blink of an eye!

Crash's best year he hit 37.1% of his 1.8 3P attempts per game. In college he hit a blistering 17.5% of the same number of tries per game. Different league back then, we can make the argument Tidjane's already a better shooter given his volume.

Toppin has gotten up to hitting 35.6% of his 3.3 3P heaves per his first playoffs with Indy after averaging less than 32% on threes his two years with the Knicks. I doubt it takes Tidjane nine years to hit that accuracy given the coach and roster around him.

Great, so relative to the new era of pace and space, pick 6 has to clear an even higher bar for outside shooting than Crash, who seemed to get by without high volume accuracy, given am era when the league rewarded physicality to a greater extent.

Trying to stay hopeful here. Fingers crossed.

[MPM]

FWIW - everyone treating this pick like some massive reach might benefit from a hint of perspective. The NBA publishes a consensus mock. The last one looked like this:

MOST COMMON PICKS

No. 1 (Hawks): Zaccharie Risacher (8)

No. 2 (Wizards): Alexandre Sarr (9)

No. 3 (Rockets): Reed Sheppard (9)

No. 4 (Spurs): Stephon Castle (7)

No. 5 (Pistons): Matas Buzelis (5)

No. 6 (Hornets): Stephon Castle, Donovan Clingan (3)

No. 7 (Trail Blazers): Cody Williams (5)

No. 8 (Spurs): Tidjane Salaun (5)

It basically confirms that draftniks saw him as top 10 and that the Spurs were probably very likely to grab him at 8. Also interesting to see the low Clingan visibility. Synchs with my impression of him.

[SWedd523]

This is the most viscerally negative response I can remember to a hornets pick.

Which is funny because I bet this board did a collective hour or less of research into this kid.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

This is the most viscerally negative response I can remember to a hornets pick.

Which is funny because I bet this board did a collective hour or less of research into this kid.

But that is probably exactly why. It's easy to get wrapped up with the prospects you do research ahead of time and be mad when the team goes in another direction.

[wilson115]

Oh, how comforting, Crash was drafted at age 19 and only needed 9 seasons to make an AS team. He shot 32% for his career on 3's. A decade can pass in the blink of an eye!

Crash's best year he hit 37.1% of his 1.8 3P attempts per game. In college he hit a blistering 17.5% of the same number of tries per game. Different league back then, we can make the argument Tidjane's already a better shooter given his volume.

Toppin has gotten up to hitting 35.6% of his 3.3 3P heaves per his first playoffs with Indy after averaging less than 32% on threes his two years with the Knicks. I doubt it takes Tidjane nine years to hit that accuracy given the coach and roster around him.

Great, so relative to the new era of pace and space, pick 6 has to clear an even higher bar for outside shooting than Crash, who seemed to get by without high volume accuracy, given am era when the league rewarded physicality to a greater extent.

Trying to stay hopeful here. Fingers crossed.

Obi Toppin just got handed $60M/4 years for shooting that percentage in the playoffs. The Mavs sent out an FRP for PJ Washington and watched him play the third-most minutes in the playoffs while shooting just over 34% mostly on open looks from three. Pretty low bar for Tidjane as a shooter there ... or are you saying guys like PJ aren't that useful in this era?

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[Chapelchilla]

Acting like we know how a 18 year French kid is going to play in 8 years is crazy projection. Let’s see how he looks when he is at least 21 before we make up our minds.

[amcoolio]

I think a huge, better defending PJ is a good goal for Salaun, because that player can easily play the 5 for any team. He's got a ways to go though for on ball defense. He's already as good or better than PJ at switching/closeouts

[JMAC3]

I think him and Grant could play some minutes together in the front court in small ball lineups. That would give us some 5 out looks potentially.

[Diop]

No matter how much he trains, Crash was a lockdown defender, something that Salaun will never become (and by never i mean never).
Wallace had good driving skills, he had a good ft rate in his career, again, i have trouble thinking it could be the same for Salaun.
The hustle and activity, sure, and i would add the competitiveness, that's something they share. But on the court, even with a great development, it's hard to find anything in common. If you could merge both, you would have a pretty nice tweener otoh (crash motor and agressivity to the rim and in defense, and Salaun's shooting and good positioning basically)

Anyway as of now, i see him as a spot on shooter, sort of a wing Teletovic (or as i once said, sort of a Ryan anderson guy with better defence)

Ryan Anderson with better defense is pretty bloody valuable.

[GoBobs]

I think a huge, better defending PJ is a good goal for Salaun, because that player can easily play the 5 for any team. He's got a ways to go though for on ball defense. He's already as good or better than PJ at switching/closeouts

PJ Washington in college was 38/99 from 3 for 38%

Salaun last year was 46/140 from 3 for 33%

I don't think it is a given that he is going to come in with a shot on the same level as PJ. The bigger problem with him being a better defending PJ though, especially at the 5 if you ever envision him playing there, is the shotblocking.

PJ had 31 blk as a freshman followed by 43 blk as a SO, each time in about 1000 minutes played. Salaun had 8 blk in 748 minutes. Oubre in college had 13 blks in 756 minutes.

Salaun looks better on defense when he plays further away from the basket where he can get in the passing lanes. I think his position is more likely SG or SF