Trades and Transactions thread cont - post Mikal trade

[Wildcat]

Well that’s not what wins titles in todays NBA

I don't think you need to mimic another team to win. Denver didn't win the Finals last year because they were lighting it up from 3. In fact, they were rather unimpressive in that regards, but they were dominant inside. Lakers and Bucks had different formulas as well.

One can even make the argument that it was their defense that won against Dallas. Then there's Dallas' perimeter D is pathetic, Boston's is not. Drive in and kick out is basically basketball 101. It's not Kidd's fault, either. Just a bunch of weak perimeter D players. The Knicks are stocked up on perimeter D.

I'm not crazy about Mitch starting again, but he's not a scrub either. Maybe that new head of medicine can help Mitch. He just needs to stay healthy. There's enough offensive versatility in the starting lineup that could reduce the impact of his offense liabilities.

Denver has the most offensively unique and offensively gifted center in NBA history, the Bucks have a floor spacing 5 and the Lakers won when AD was shooting 38% from three in the playoffs and played most of his minutes at the 5. You have to go back to 2016 to find a team with a strictly interior center that has won a title, it's very clear now that your center has to offer some kind of threat on offense whether it's passing, shooting or bucket getting. The Celtics won because they are talented but also because they're 5 out, they made light work of the Mavs interior bigs because that type of player is very easy to defend the further you get in the playoffs.

Whether we get another center or not Randle playing the 5 at times has to be a major part of the plan, because it turns us into a 5 out team, the whole point of having all these wings is that they have the size to switch onto rim runners and stop their rolls and can gang rebound to keep them off the boards. That is what the Celtics did to Lively and Gafford too, they penalized the Mavs for playing interior bigs on one end, then pulled them away from the rim on the other end.

This all translate to me that you have to have one of the best players in the league on your team to succeed. Seems to be it's best player plus some tangible gimmick/element. Jokic and interior presence, Brown/Tatum and perimeter D, (F LeBron), and Giannis and interior presence.

I think the Knicks have the player part covered. And if things translate the way we're hoping, their gimmick is going to be perimeter D.

Dallas is a poor example. Inexperienced big men plus below average defense wasn't going to cut it. They got hot at the right time and cold at the wrong time.

[Knicksrule2k4]

Read on Twitter

[TheGreenArrow]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

Get it Done without Deuce please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[3toheadmelo]

How is Kessler’s perimeter defense and pick and roll defense?

[sol537]

Kessler or Richards is fine by me.

Who wants the TPE, cash, WAS pick and DET pick?

[stuporman]

The Bridges trade may be getting tweaked and they are trying to work out the kinks to finalize the roster after that. Hopefully the plan is in the works and we will all breathe a little easier when the smoke clears. It's either that or they are gonna hard cap themselves at the first apron and only have the 5mil MLE to offer the backup center and we roll with 4 rookies on the bench. I would think they are working this out while we fumble over the keyboard panicking about things.

Brunson/Deuce/Kolek
Bridges/DDV
OG/Jeffries*/McCullar
Randle/Hart/Pacome
Mitch/Sims*/Hukporti

5mil exception
* Team option

IIRC that's what we have on the books now. With apron things making it hard to operate, this is taking some time.

I think we still have the 6.8M exception from Indiana for Obi.

Oh yeah. How do those work with these apron rules? Damn it!! I'm confused again!! How much money do we have to work with?!?!?!

This shyt is making me dizzy!

I'm confused about the aprons and there's not much googly info to clarify it for me.

Once the trade for Bridges is finalized if the Knicks send out more money than they take on there's a 'hard cap' at one of the two aprons. I just don't know if they are let's say 3 mil below the 1st they are capped at that one or if they can go above it to the 2nd to be capped.

It may be if that whatever apron they are below after the trade the cap is the immediate one above the salary so they would be inclined to go over the 1st to open up more space to work before capping out at the 2nd. It's not really that clear and most pundits are equally as clueless about it.

They do have exceptions, the TPMLE and vetmins to use but it all depends on how much space they have before being capped under whichever apron they are capped at. It could be why they are waiting to finalize the deal so they can do the most they can with it.

Most of the info available is about apron restrictions not nuances of navigating it with using the options to add players with the different options available to the teams. It's so new that most media heads are talking out of their asses about it. Jeremy Cohen has the best takes on it imo.

[KnixinSix]

The Knicks have also made inquiries on the trade market, showing interest in Jazz center Walker Kessler, league sources told HoopsHype, along with Hornets center Nick Richards, as previously reported by HoopsHype.

https://hoopshype.com/lists/nba-rumors-lauri-markkanen-trade-talks-demar-derozan-kyle-kuzma-lakers-knicks-76ers/

I’d be really happy with either of them.

Yup,
These are our 2 guys.

[KnixinSix]

Kessler or Richards is fine by me.

Who wants the TPE, cash, WAS pick and DET pick?

Might include McBride....we will soon see

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I don't think you need to mimic another team to win. Denver didn't win the Finals last year because they were lighting it up from 3. In fact, they were rather unimpressive in that regards, but they were dominant inside. Lakers and Bucks had different formulas as well.

One can even make the argument that it was their defense that won against Dallas. Then there's Dallas' perimeter D is pathetic, Boston's is not. Drive in and kick out is basically basketball 101. It's not Kidd's fault, either. Just a bunch of weak perimeter D players. The Knicks are stocked up on perimeter D.

I'm not crazy about Mitch starting again, but he's not a scrub either. Maybe that new head of medicine can help Mitch. He just needs to stay healthy. There's enough offensive versatility in the starting lineup that could reduce the impact of his offense liabilities.

Denver has the most offensively unique and offensively gifted center in NBA history, the Bucks have a floor spacing 5 and the Lakers won when AD was shooting 38% from three in the playoffs and played most of his minutes at the 5. You have to go back to 2016 to find a team with a strictly interior center that has won a title, it's very clear now that your center has to offer some kind of threat on offense whether it's passing, shooting or bucket getting. The Celtics won because they are talented but also because they're 5 out, they made light work of the Mavs interior bigs because that type of player is very easy to defend the further you get in the playoffs.

Whether we get another center or not Randle playing the 5 at times has to be a major part of the plan, because it turns us into a 5 out team, the whole point of having all these wings is that they have the size to switch onto rim runners and stop their rolls and can gang rebound to keep them off the boards. That is what the Celtics did to Lively and Gafford too, they penalized the Mavs for playing interior bigs on one end, then pulled them away from the rim on the other end.

This all translate to me that you have to have one of the best players in the league on your team to succeed. Seems to be it's best player plus some tangible gimmick/element. Jokic and interior presence, Brown/Tatum and perimeter D, (F LeBron), and Giannis and interior presence.

I think the Knicks have the player part covered. And if things translate the way we're hoping, their gimmick is going to be perimeter D.

Dallas is a poor example. Inexperienced big men plus below average defense wasn't going to cut it. They got hot at the right time and cold at the wrong time.

At full strength, the gimmick for us will be a team that can stay big or small and still be physical, there should be no rebounding drop off in theory if we go small. As in a team like the Pacers we should absolutely match down against and punish them, but it remains to be seen if the coach would do that.

[Orange Mamba]

It's good we're showing interest in Kessler and Richards. I can't see Utah accepting just McBride and 2rps for him though

[3toheadmelo]

Denver has the most offensively unique and offensively gifted center in NBA history, the Bucks have a floor spacing 5 and the Lakers won when AD was shooting 38% from three in the playoffs and played most of his minutes at the 5. You have to go back to 2016 to find a team with a strictly interior center that has won a title, it's very clear now that your center has to offer some kind of threat on offense whether it's passing, shooting or bucket getting. The Celtics won because they are talented but also because they're 5 out, they made light work of the Mavs interior bigs because that type of player is very easy to defend the further you get in the playoffs.

Whether we get another center or not Randle playing the 5 at times has to be a major part of the plan, because it turns us into a 5 out team, the whole point of having all these wings is that they have the size to switch onto rim runners and stop their rolls and can gang rebound to keep them off the boards. That is what the Celtics did to Lively and Gafford too, they penalized the Mavs for playing interior bigs on one end, then pulled them away from the rim on the other end.

This all translate to me that you have to have one of the best players in the league on your team to succeed. Seems to be it's best player plus some tangible gimmick/element. Jokic and interior presence, Brown/Tatum and perimeter D, (F LeBron), and Giannis and interior presence.

I think the Knicks have the player part covered. And if things translate the way we're hoping, their gimmick is going to be perimeter D.

Dallas is a poor example. Inexperienced big men plus below average defense wasn't going to cut it. They got hot at the right time and cold at the wrong time.

At full strength, the gimmick for us will be a team that can stay big or small and still be physical, there should be no rebounding drop off in theory if we go small. As in a team like the Pacers we should absolutely match down against and punish them, but it remains to be seen if the coach would do that.

Losing Ihart sux cause he has some sort of a threat offensively. Rest of our options are rim runners like Kessler

[stuporman]

Rose better have something slick up his sleeve or the Knicks are going to have a glaring weakness at the 5 because it's getting bleaker by the day.

It could be argued their title hopes for this year evaporated with iHart leaving but the longer the resolving the center situation drags out the more pitiful options available make it look like ECF hopes or even past the first round this season comes into question.

There is no way this FO was caught on their heels about this so they better dazzle us with something nobody could anticipate but had lined up all along.

A depth chart of Mitch/Sims/Huk is concerning and adding Precious to it doesn't encourage very many. With Mitch almost guaranteed to miss some time, Sims a simulated NBA player, Huk a rookie and Precious undersized even if gritty it's going to get ugly at some point, hopefully not the playoffs.

There really wasn't anyone to take in the draft that was guaranteed to be the solution so I'm not going to be too upset at them not drafting a center earlier.

Although, they could not have assumed iHart was going to pass up the bag for the Knicks even if everyone was surprised at how big it was offered at. If they didn't at least plan for him leaving and have solid plans to fill the void they screwed it up big time.

Goga gone, all the reclamation projects gone and now are they going to over pay in a trade out of desperation to get some middling center just to get someone?

Don't undue all the good work you've done so far Rose by not doing this one thing. Unless Thibs can miraculously turn Huk into iHart-lite by new year it's ruined this season.

This is an extreme take. GSW won with freakin’ Looney and McGee… multiple titles. We’ll be just fine. We’ll probably get Richards or Kessler. And the #58 pick has some upside as a back up.

No, they had Draymond and the death line up that was a match up nightmare and two of the greatest shooters in NBA history. The Knicks might have their Draymond in OG but wake me when they have comparable shooters.

It isn't an extreme take, maybe healthy Mitch, SIMSulated player and rookie Huk aren't going to cut it against the Celtics, Sixers(if healthy), Bucks(if healthy) or even the Pacers.

[knicksstuff]

We wouldnt even have to include mcbride in either trade since we are about 5.2 million from the first apron. Kessler makes about 2.6 and Richards 5 million. I would think we would be giving up some swaps and the det/washington picks

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I don't think you need to mimic another team to win. Denver didn't win the Finals last year because they were lighting it up from 3. In fact, they were rather unimpressive in that regards, but they were dominant inside. Lakers and Bucks had different formulas as well.

One can even make the argument that it was their defense that won against Dallas. Then there's Dallas' perimeter D is pathetic, Boston's is not. Drive in and kick out is basically basketball 101. It's not Kidd's fault, either. Just a bunch of weak perimeter D players. The Knicks are stocked up on perimeter D.

I'm not crazy about Mitch starting again, but he's not a scrub either. Maybe that new head of medicine can help Mitch. He just needs to stay healthy. There's enough offensive versatility in the starting lineup that could reduce the impact of his offense liabilities.

Denver has the most offensively unique and offensively gifted center in NBA history, the Bucks have a floor spacing 5 and the Lakers won when AD was shooting 38% from three in the playoffs and played most of his minutes at the 5. You have to go back to 2016 to find a team with a strictly interior center that has won a title, it's very clear now that your center has to offer some kind of threat on offense whether it's passing, shooting or bucket getting. The Celtics won because they are talented but also because they're 5 out, they made light work of the Mavs interior bigs because that type of player is very easy to defend the further you get in the playoffs.

Whether we get another center or not Randle playing the 5 at times has to be a major part of the plan, because it turns us into a 5 out team, the whole point of having all these wings is that they have the size to switch onto rim runners and stop their rolls and can gang rebound to keep them off the boards. That is what the Celtics did to Lively and Gafford too, they penalized the Mavs for playing interior bigs on one end, then pulled them away from the rim on the other end.

it makes perfect sense other than it going against what Thibs normally likes to do. Randle at the 5 would be amazing on offense. he would have so much space to work with and teams would probably be forced to put their centers on OG - to which he could also exploit. or if 5s are guarding randle (outside of someone like bam) - randle is going to cook.

defensively/rebounding etc - it's not as ideal. but i still think it can work against most teams these days. question is will Thibs be open to even trying it.

The only question about it is whether or not the coach has the vision to do it, if Thibs stays big against a team like the Pacers when we'll lose in the end regardless of talent, because it means he's just too rigid to see what he has. They can go with ultra defensive small ball with Hart, Bridges, OG and Randle, or go with shooting with Donte in place of Hart, either way they have a lot of different options, but I'm sure we'll just see 24 mins of Mitch, 24 mins of his backup no matter who we play

[Jalen Bluntson]

I think we still have the 6.8M exception from Indiana for Obi.

Oh yeah. How do those work with these apron rules? Damn it!! I'm confused again!! How much money do we have to work with?!?!?!

This shyt is making me dizzy!

I'm confused about the aprons and there's not much googly info to clarify it for me.

Once the trade for Bridges is finalized if the Knicks send out more money than they take on there's a 'hard cap' at one of the two aprons. I just don't know if they are let's say 3 mil below the 1st they are capped at that one or if they can go above it to the 2nd to be capped.

It may be if that whatever apron they are below after the trade the cap is the immediate one above the salary so they would be inclined to go over the 1st to open up more space to work before capping out at the 2nd. It's not really that clear and most pundits are equally as clueless about it.

They do have exceptions, the TPMLE and vetmins to use but it all depends on how much space they have before being capped under whichever apron they are capped at. It could be why they are waiting to finalize the deal so they can do the most they can with it.

Most of the info available is about apron restrictions not nuances of navigating it with using the options to add players with the different options available to the teams. It's so new that most media heads are talking out of their asses about it. Jeremy Cohen has the best takes on it imo.

All of this! It is clear to me that the FO is navigating the waves caused by Shart leaving but, the apron stuff makes it difficult for a novice such as myself to figure out what they can and can't do. I do trust them though. Whatever they end up with will make sense. We already have a title contender on our hands IMO.

[Orange Mamba]

We wouldnt even have to include mcbride in either trade since we are about 5.2 million from the first apron. Kessler makes about 2.6 and Richards 5 million. I would think we would be giving up some swaps and the det/washington picks

We wouldn't have to, but I'm sure Utah would want Deuce and picks at a minimum

[NoDopeOnSundays]

This all translate to me that you have to have one of the best players in the league on your team to succeed. Seems to be it's best player plus some tangible gimmick/element. Jokic and interior presence, Brown/Tatum and perimeter D, (F LeBron), and Giannis and interior presence.

I think the Knicks have the player part covered. And if things translate the way we're hoping, their gimmick is going to be perimeter D.

Dallas is a poor example. Inexperienced big men plus below average defense wasn't going to cut it. They got hot at the right time and cold at the wrong time.

At full strength, the gimmick for us will be a team that can stay big or small and still be physical, there should be no rebounding drop off in theory if we go small. As in a team like the Pacers we should absolutely match down against and punish them, but it remains to be seen if the coach would do that.

Losing Ihart sux cause he has some sort of a threat offensively. Rest of our options are rim runners like Kessler

Kessler would be good insurance though, especially since he's a starting level C, his rim protection numbers were absolutely elite and better than Mitch and Ihart's while playing with no defenders. He was at 51% DFG last year, IHart was 53% and Mitch was 70%. Getting him would allow us to move Mitch in the offseason since he's still cost controlled.


Richards had better rim protection numbers than Mitch, worse than IHart, and I don't really know how good he is. I know Kessler is good though, but he's only making $3-4 million which is what you really want. We probably don't get either though

[KnixinSix]

Rit Holtzman
@BenRitholtzNBA
An essential note about 2 of the names that have have bandied about last couple of days, Mo Wagner and Day’Ron Sharpe:

Defensively, both conceded >63% at the rim last season,two of the worst marks among centers in the NBA (in front of only Jokic, Kelly O, JV, Nance).

Rit Holtzman
@BenRitholtzNBA
In contrast, 2 other available names, Tillman and Wiseman, graded out much better in this rim protection metric (54% and 56%, respectively).

Important to note with what Thibs expects from his 5-men.

[knicksstuff]

btw if Im the Knicks after seeing the Pacers sign another center in James Wiseman, I would be asking for Isiah Jackson and working something out there. His advanced stats jump out of the page

90th percentile in offensive reboudning
58th percentile in defensive rebounding
95th percentile in blocks
88th percentile in steals

[sol537]

I would do McBride, one 2nd and even one pick swap for Kessler.