Trades and Transactions thread cont - post Mikal trade

[Capn'O]

Same crap as vs. the Cavs the year before.

Sixers were the better team with better players and a better coach and yet we comfortably beat them. How is that?

In before "Embiid was severely compromised" while putting up the statistically strongest playoff line of his career, including a 50 burger.

[DOT]

Rest of league : “this draft is very weak”
Knicks knation: “this 2nd rnd center looks like a rotation piece”

the best is not wanting to trade pacome dadiet...like more than half of us didn't even watch a highlight of this kid before we picked him. Not we can't move a 19 year old for a legit starting/backup center?

We are in the business of trying to win a championship and its likely that kid doesn't factor into our plans the next couple years...

I'm not saying just get rid of him to get rid of him but he certainly isn't "holding" up a deal that makes us better.

The only thing I've pushed back on is the dude trying to write a manifesto on how Dadiet is actually going to the Nets as part of the Mikal trade solely on the fact they worked him out once, cause that's a pretty dumb conspiracy theory

He could be traded of course, but it's exceedingly rare to see a guy get drafted in the 1st, not traded on draft night, and then traded before his rookie deal. I can't think of an instance off the top of my head besides Wiggins going to Minnesota, and even then it was nearly 2 months after the draft.

[mpharris36]

Rest of league : “this draft is very weak”
Knicks knation: “this 2nd rnd center looks like a rotation piece”

the best is not wanting to trade pacome dadiet...like more than half of us didn't even watch a highlight of this kid before we picked him. Not we can't move a 19 year old for a legit starting/backup center?

We are in the business of trying to win a championship and its likely that kid doesn't factor into our plans the next couple years...

I'm not saying just get rid of him to get rid of him but he certainly isn't "holding" up a deal that makes us better.

The only thing I've pushed back on is the dude trying to write a manifesto on how Dadiet is actually going to the Nets as part of the Mikal trade solely on the fact they worked him out once, cause that's a pretty dumb conspiracy theory

He could be traded of course, but it's exceedingly rare to see a guy get drafted in the 1st, not traded on draft night, and then traded before his rookie deal. I can't think of an instance off the top of my head besides Wiggins going to Minnesota, and even then it was nearly 2 months after the draft.

thats true...the nets deal has been laid out. The only reason it would expand is to help the knicks further if it was to be expanded and help us not get hard caped at the 1st apron. But we didn't just make the pick to send him to Brooklyn.

I'm just saying I don't think the Knicks would hesitate to add him to a deal that improves the team. It just a odd situation because his contract to aggregate salary so it would just be trading his rights so it would have to be in addition. But in theory we could use Obi's TPE to acquire and then move his rights to that same team for additional value.

[sol537]

I think there’s a good chance we simply complete the Mikal deal, and then re-sign Precious and Burks using Bird Rights so we have to additional salaries for potential future trades and both guys can step in with productive minutes when needed. 1-year or 2-year deals for each.

Mitch can go 24 mins, Precious 16, and then small ball Randle for 8 mins. We wouldn’t miss a beat IMO.

[DOT]

I'm just saying I don't think the Knicks would hesitate to add him to a deal that improves the team. It just a odd situation because his contract to aggregate salary so it would just be trading his rights so it would have to be in addition. But in theory we could use Obi's TPE to acquire and then move his rights to that same team for additional value.

It's kinda awkward because draft picks are like cars, their value depreciates the moment they're picked

The reason it's rare is cause teams want to pick guys themselves, if we picked Dadiet for another team then we'd already have the trade in place, but if we thought we would bring iHart back then why would we pin ourselves into the one player without flexibility?

Anything we do now was not agreed on pre-draft. We didn't pick Dadiet to trade him to a specific team, we picked Dadiet because that's who we wanted to pick. Of course, we're probably still fine with trading him, but all the "Dadiet worked out for this team, we must have picked him to trade him to them!" stuff is just not how this works.

[WargamesX]

I think there’s a good chance we simply complete the Mikal deal, and then re-sign Precious and Burks using Bird Rights so we have to additional salaries for potential future trades and both guys can step in with productive minutes when needed. 1-year or 2-year deals for each.

Mitch can go 24 mins, Precious 16, and then small ball Randle for 8 mins. We wouldn’t miss a beat IMO.

We could, but I also think if that was the plan you would already have seen reporters setting the table for it by dropping stories they heard the Knicks wanted to run it back with Precious. Similar to how they mentioned the FO didn’t think they could keep IHart.

They probably have something brewing or at least are trying to get something brewing.

[mpharris36]

I think there’s a good chance we simply complete the Mikal deal, and then re-sign Precious and Burks using Bird Rights so we have to additional salaries for potential future trades and both guys can step in with productive minutes when needed. 1-year or 2-year deals for each.

Mitch can go 24 mins, Precious 16, and then small ball Randle for 8 mins. We wouldn’t miss a beat IMO.

wouldn't work...we would be hard capped and wouldn't be able to use bird rights on Precious and Burks to sign them and keep going over the first apron.

If we just make the Mikal trade as reported...we basically would just have 5 MM left to spend. Not sure that is even enough for Precious at this point. We also would have no way to sign buyout candidates during the year because of that hard cap.

Read on Twitter

[stuporman]

If Philly has the 3 best players why did they lose in 6 to us ??

The hypothesis you present that time is merely a construction in the mind and not a linear unfolding of events in the universe is one that fascinates me...

Wow

[mpharris36]

I'm just saying I don't think the Knicks would hesitate to add him to a deal that improves the team. It just a odd situation because his contract to aggregate salary so it would just be trading his rights so it would have to be in addition. But in theory we could use Obi's TPE to acquire and then move his rights to that same team for additional value.

It's kinda awkward because draft picks are like cars, their value depreciates the moment they're picked

The reason it's rare is cause teams want to pick guys themselves, if we picked Dadiet for another team then we'd already have the trade in place, but if we thought we would bring iHart back then why would we pin ourselves into the one player without flexibility?

Anything we do now was not agreed on pre-draft. We didn't pick Dadiet to trade him to a specific team, we picked Dadiet because that's who we wanted to pick. Of course, we're probably still fine with trading him, but all the "Dadiet worked out for this team, we must have picked him to trade him to them!" stuff is just not how this works.

I did find it interesting Fred Katz was on KFS...he said the knicks loved Kolek and were considering picking him at 24 or 25...I wonder what made them wait and risk it. Did they have Dadiet rated higher or is it possible they knew other teams were interested in Dadiet and they were willing to take the risk trading back for Kolek so they could gain another tradable asset. Since a 19 year old wing with size is pretty valuable in todays NBA.

[WargamesX]

I think there’s a good chance we simply complete the Mikal deal, and then re-sign Precious and Burks using Bird Rights so we have to additional salaries for potential future trades and both guys can step in with productive minutes when needed. 1-year or 2-year deals for each.

Mitch can go 24 mins, Precious 16, and then small ball Randle for 8 mins. We wouldn’t miss a beat IMO.

wouldn't work...we would be hard capped and wouldn't be able to use bird rights on Precious and Burks to sign them and keep going over the first apron.

If we just make the Mikal trade as reported...we basically would just have 5 MM left to spend. Not sure that is even enough for Precious at this point. We also would have no way to sign buyout candidates during the year because of that hard cap.

Read on Twitter

We could sign buyouts if they made less than the non tax paying MLE. Basically you can always go over the hard cap by signing second rounders, sign vet min players, then only exception is if the vet min player got paid more than the MLE. This was done to ensure teams could still reach the minimum of 14 players.

[DOT]

I'm just saying I don't think the Knicks would hesitate to add him to a deal that improves the team. It just a odd situation because his contract to aggregate salary so it would just be trading his rights so it would have to be in addition. But in theory we could use Obi's TPE to acquire and then move his rights to that same team for additional value.

It's kinda awkward because draft picks are like cars, their value depreciates the moment they're picked

The reason it's rare is cause teams want to pick guys themselves, if we picked Dadiet for another team then we'd already have the trade in place, but if we thought we would bring iHart back then why would we pin ourselves into the one player without flexibility?

Anything we do now was not agreed on pre-draft. We didn't pick Dadiet to trade him to a specific team, we picked Dadiet because that's who we wanted to pick. Of course, we're probably still fine with trading him, but all the "Dadiet worked out for this team, we must have picked him to trade him to them!" stuff is just not how this works.

I did find it interesting Fred Katz was on KFS...he said the knicks loved Kolek and were considering picking him at 24 or 25...I wonder what made them wait and risk it. Did they have Dadiet rated higher or is it possible they knew other teams were interested in Dadiet and they were willing to take the risk trading back for Kolek so they could gain another tradable asset. Since a 19 year old wing with size is pretty valuable in todays NBA.

Think it's just a case of Kolek might've been there at 34 but they knew Dadiet wasn't gonna be, so they took the risk to get both.

[mpharris36]

I think there’s a good chance we simply complete the Mikal deal, and then re-sign Precious and Burks using Bird Rights so we have to additional salaries for potential future trades and both guys can step in with productive minutes when needed. 1-year or 2-year deals for each.

Mitch can go 24 mins, Precious 16, and then small ball Randle for 8 mins. We wouldn’t miss a beat IMO.

wouldn't work...we would be hard capped and wouldn't be able to use bird rights on Precious and Burks to sign them and keep going over the first apron.

If we just make the Mikal trade as reported...we basically would just have 5 MM left to spend. Not sure that is even enough for Precious at this point. We also would have no way to sign buyout candidates during the year because of that hard cap.

Read on Twitter

We could sign buyouts if they made less than the non tax paying MLE. Basically you can always go over the hard cap by signing second rounders, sign vet min players, then only exception is if the vet min player got paid more than the MLE. This was done to ensure teams could still reach the minimum of 14 players.

I don't believe that is accurate if they complete the Mikal trade as currently constructed. Once you make a trade were you take on more money then you send back you are then "hard caped" at that apron. Hard cap meaning you can't go over.

[stuporman]

How dare this forum sully the name of the french Jordan....that's Mr. Pac Dadi to you heathens...

[WargamesX]

wouldn't work...we would be hard capped and wouldn't be able to use bird rights on Precious and Burks to sign them and keep going over the first apron.

If we just make the Mikal trade as reported...we basically would just have 5 MM left to spend. Not sure that is even enough for Precious at this point. We also would have no way to sign buyout candidates during the year because of that hard cap.

Read on Twitter

We could sign buyouts if they made less than the non tax paying MLE. Basically you can always go over the hard cap by signing second rounders, sign vet min players, then only exception is if the vet min player got paid more than the MLE. This was done to ensure teams could still reach the minimum of 14 players.

I don't believe that is accurate if they complete the Mikal trade as currently constructed. Once you make a trade were you take on more money then you send back you are then "hard caped" at that apron. Hard cap meaning you can't go over.

Except by signing 2nd rounder and vet min players who were paid less than the MLE. Those exceptions is why 2nd rounders have more value. The league had to add this exception to their “hard cap” because eventually a team would have a top heavy team with less than 14 players at the hard cap. It would eventually lead to a fiasco.

It’s why Jeremy Cohen’s posts of the cap situation are unfortunately inacurate. It’s not illustrating the 2nd rounder exception. The Knicks can work through all their hard cap space and then sign their 2nd round players.

[Fury]

I don't agree. I think it's a toss up between the 2.

Wow. You don't think much of Brunson. No wonder you are down on the team, leader of the Golden Chariot Treadmill team.

I think Brunson is excellent. I also think Maxey is excellent.

I would be very happy with either of them.

I guess I'm not a Knicks fan if I don't consider Brunson the undisputed greatest player of all time.

No, just better than Tyrese Maxey.

[stuporman]

Obviously a team has to be able to fill out their roster if 'hard capped' at an apron but they lose use of any exceptions and are only allowed vetmins and rookie scale contracts to do it.

I'm not sure about bird rights though either if they extend qualifying offers or not. Like with Precious, the Knicks didn't give qualifying offer does that mean they can't resign him to go over if hard capped?

[mpharris36]

We could sign buyouts if they made less than the non tax paying MLE. Basically you can always go over the hard cap by signing second rounders, sign vet min players, then only exception is if the vet min player got paid more than the MLE. This was done to ensure teams could still reach the minimum of 14 players.

I don't believe that is accurate if they complete the Mikal trade as currently constructed. Once you make a trade were you take on more money then you send back you are then "hard caped" at that apron. Hard cap meaning you can't go over.

Except by signing 2nd rounder and vet min players who were paid less than the MLE. Those exceptions is why 2nd rounders have more value. The league had to add this exception to their “hard cap” because eventually a team would have a top heavy team with less than 14 players at the hard cap. It would eventually lead to a fiasco.

It’s why Jeremy Cohen’s posts of the cap situation are unfortunately inacurate. It’s not illustrating the 2nd rounder exception. The Knicks can work through all their hard cap space and then sign their 2nd round players.

I don't think its inaccurate because the knicks are using the 2nd round pick holds to lower there cap. If it was just an open roster spot there would be a roster hold (for a vet minimum) which is larger than the 2nd round hold.

That is why it was crucial to make 3 2nd round picks...otherwise the roster cap hold would be higher than the 2nd round pick exception.

[stuporman]

I don't believe that is accurate if they complete the Mikal trade as currently constructed. Once you make a trade were you take on more money then you send back you are then "hard caped" at that apron. Hard cap meaning you can't go over.

Except by signing 2nd rounder and vet min players who were paid less than the MLE. Those exceptions is why 2nd rounders have more value. The league had to add this exception to their “hard cap” because eventually a team would have a top heavy team with less than 14 players at the hard cap. It would eventually lead to a fiasco.

It’s why Jeremy Cohen’s posts of the cap situation are unfortunately inacurate. It’s not illustrating the 2nd rounder exception. The Knicks can work through all their hard cap space and then sign their 2nd round players.

I don't think its inaccurate because the knicks are using the 2nd round pick holds to lower there cap. If it was just an open roster spot there would be a roster hold (for a vet minimum) which is larger than the 2nd round hold.

That is why it was crucial to make 3 2nd round picks...otherwise the roster cap hold would be higher than the 2nd round pick exception.

The use of the 2nd rounders was to keep them below the 2nd apron but the other part of that was sending out less money than taking in the Bridges trade so there would be no hard cap in the event that iHart took their offer.

Since iHart left the 2nd rounder savings wound up being moot but they still don't want to take more money then sending in the trade so the hard cap doesn't kick in for the 1st apron limiting them in filling out the roster and plug the center rotation hole.

[WargamesX]

I don't believe that is accurate if they complete the Mikal trade as currently constructed. Once you make a trade were you take on more money then you send back you are then "hard caped" at that apron. Hard cap meaning you can't go over.

Except by signing 2nd rounder and vet min players who were paid less than the MLE. Those exceptions is why 2nd rounders have more value. The league had to add this exception to their “hard cap” because eventually a team would have a top heavy team with less than 14 players at the hard cap. It would eventually lead to a fiasco.

It’s why Jeremy Cohen’s posts of the cap situation are unfortunately inacurate. It’s not illustrating the 2nd rounder exception. The Knicks can work through all their hard cap space and then sign their 2nd round players.

I don't think its inaccurate because the knicks are using the 2nd round pick holds to lower there cap. If it was just an open roster spot there would be a roster hold (for a vet minimum) which is larger than the 2nd round hold.

That is why it was crucial to make 3 2nd round picks...otherwise the roster cap hold would be higher than the 2nd round pick exception.

But they can still sign someone using that space regardless, reach the hard cap, and then officially sign the 2nd rounders. It’s all order of operations, however, it does mean they can use the full Obi TPE in a trade. Though I think they would probably wouldn’t.

They could in theory swap McBride for one of the picks going to the Nets, and then using the Obi TPE trade that pick for Kessler or Richards, and then go over the cap to bring back Precious and Burks using a combination of Bird rights and the TPMLE. And then sign the 2nd rounders going over the cap as needed. Though I think Ariel is a draft and stash and Mccular and Kolek are getting sent to the G league with Pacôme.

[thebuzzardman]

I don't agree. I think it's a toss up between the 2.

Wow. You don't think much of Brunson. No wonder you are down on the team, leader of the Golden Chariot Treadmill team.

I think Brunson is excellent. I also think Maxey is excellent.

I would be very happy with either of them.

I guess I'm not a Knicks fan if I don't consider Brunson the undisputed greatest player of all time.

You clearly don't think Brunson is better than souped up IQ. Sad.