Better player as a Raptor: Bosh vs DeRozan

[dkb964]

Leonard is his own thing and I think that Lowry is considered the GROAT by most Raptors fans. Who was the better player when playing for Toronto Bosh or DeRozan?

[NeoDragonKnight]

DeRozan by just a bit, its hard to gauge because Lowry was the true franchise player, and yet DeRozan constantly shrunk in the playoffs. But I give it to him because he and Lowry were able to make it pretty far into the playoffs with some good play in the early rounds.
Bosh, I rate less, because despite not having another star, he did have a solid supporting cast in 06-07 and were firing on all cylinders playing unselfish ball, and in the playoffs he played horrifically 2 years in a row getting completely shut down by Rashard Lewis and Mikki Moore. Your star simply cannot play that bad in the playoffs as a number 1. And as we find later, Bosh was better suited as a number 3.

[will]

Bosh had no one. Pretty funny and sad looking back now.

Edit: Sorry Mike James. Forgot about you.

[ontnut]

We've hashed this out many times during various GROAT threads.
Derozan had more playoff success in terms of winning rounds, but also had better talent around him. Derozan also shrunk more in the POs and had to be carried a lot of the time. Bosh in his second and final series for us went 24/9/3.5 on 47% vs the Dwight magic. That's impressive and better than any Derozan PO performance until maybe 2018 WAS.
Bosh had 5 all stars in 7 years, Derozan had 4 in 9.
Bosh was never a negative VORP, Derozan was for the 1st 3 seasons.
Derozan was a negative BPM for 5/9 seasons, Bosh 2/7.
Bosh has a better WS/48 (the most important stat to me) by roughly 20%.
Bosh was better, earlier than Derozan, and was a more consistent and polished product for longer.
Derozan developed a lot during his time here, as he finally got to 5apg in his final season, and never dipped below that after.

In pretty much all the counting and advanced stats, Bosh was the better player as a Raptor. Derozan's viewed better because we had more consistent playoff appearances during his tenure, and he didn't do as much weird stuff like the AS video/leave us to join Lebron.

[ontnut]

DeRozan by just a bit, its hard to gauge because Lowry was the true franchise player, and yet DeRozan constantly shrunk in the playoffs. But I give it to him because he and Lowry were able to make it pretty far into the playoffs with some good play in the early rounds.
Bosh, I rate less, because despite not having another star, he did have a solid supporting cast in 06-07 and were firing on all cylinders playing unselfish ball, and in the playoffs he played horrifically 2 years in a row getting completely shut down by Rashard Lewis and Mikki Moore. Your star simply cannot play that bad in the playoffs as a number 1. And as we find later, Bosh was better suited as a number 3.

Go look at their playoff stats. Derozan played far worse as the #1 option than Bosh did. Bosh went 24/9/3.5 on 47%FG in that ORL series...that's being shut down? Not sure how much more he could've done, his supporting cast was trash. It took until the 2016 ECF (4th overall series) for Derozan to have a series shooting over 40% fg. That's..not good. He shot UNDER 32% in that IND series in 2016...which went to 7 and then 39% in the MIA series. He avg'd 18/3.5/2.5 in that IND series, which was his 3rd playoff appearance. That's brutal. Derozan got swept 3 times in the playoffs. There were points in time where fans were willing to trade Derozan for a bag of chips because of how bad his playoff performances were.

[BetterCallSaul]

I think similar. Bosh better at his peak, but less longevity and success. He didn't have great chemistry with any players on the team and that does count for something. DeMar clicking with Kyle and vowing their loyalty to Toronto changed this franchise forever. Stats can't measure that.

[Tor_Raps]

Bosh was the better individual player but Demar is the better raptor based on his tenure/success.

Bosh's entire tenure here seems like it never happened thanks to his douche comments after he left. Still annoyed me that he was doing tv for the Raptors during their championship run.

[Vampirate]

DeRozan by just a bit, its hard to gauge because Lowry was the true franchise player, and yet DeRozan constantly shrunk in the playoffs. But I give it to him because he and Lowry were able to make it pretty far into the playoffs with some good play in the early rounds.
Bosh, I rate less, because despite not having another star, he did have a solid supporting cast in 06-07 and were firing on all cylinders playing unselfish ball, and in the playoffs he played horrifically 2 years in a row getting completely shut down by Rashard Lewis and Mikki Moore. Your star simply cannot play that bad in the playoffs as a number 1. And as we find later, Bosh was better suited as a number 3.

These 2 sentences contradict each other.

Regular Season wise, Demar's scoring can carry a team, playoff wise he becomes a liability. Great guy, but sadly the truth.

Demar is the weakest multiple time All Star Raptor.

[TheAlchemist23]

Bosh quite easily

[TorontoBarneys]

Gotta go with Bosh.

[YogurtProducer]

DeRozan by just a bit, its hard to gauge because Lowry was the true franchise player, and yet DeRozan constantly shrunk in the playoffs. But I give it to him because he and Lowry were able to make it pretty far into the playoffs with some good play in the early rounds.
Bosh, I rate less, because despite not having another star, he did have a solid supporting cast in 06-07 and were firing on all cylinders playing unselfish ball, and in the playoffs he played horrifically 2 years in a row getting completely shut down by Rashard Lewis and Mikki Moore. Your star simply cannot play that bad in the playoffs as a number 1. And as we find later, Bosh was better suited as a number 3.

Then what is Demar better suited as?

Legitimately believe - Demar would only ever have had NBA playoff success as a bench guy. We just was not a good enough scorer to be a #1/2 guy on a team, and his other skills (defense, shooting, etc.) were not good enough to be a starting role player. 6th man IMO was his only route to real success.

[YogurtProducer]

Bosh was the better individual player but Demar is the better raptor based on his tenure/success.

Bosh's entire tenure here seems like it never happened thanks to Bosh's douche comments after he left. Still annoyed me that he was doing tv for the Raptors during their championship run.

IDK if we should even use "success" for Demar. He was the 2nd best player on those teams. Bosh was the best on his. Give Bosh a Lowry and I bet those teams are much better.

Thinking about a Lowry/Ross/OG/Bosh/Valanciunas team is actually kind of intriguing.

But regarding TV - I don't recall Bosh being on the broadcast ever. Any clips of that?

[Potential]

Give me regular season DeMar and playoff Bosh

[Tor_Raps]

Bosh was the better individual player but Demar is the better raptor based on his tenure/success.

Bosh's entire tenure here seems like it never happened thanks to Bosh's douche comments after he left. Still annoyed me that he was doing tv for the Raptors during their championship run.

IDK if we should even use "success" for Demar. He was the 2nd best player on those teams. Bosh was the best on his. Give Bosh a Lowry and I bet those teams are much better.

Thinking about a Lowry/Ross/OG/Bosh/Valanciunas team is actually kind of intriguing.

But regarding TV - I don't recall Bosh being on the broadcast ever. Any clips of that?

I said Bosh was the better player but Demar got to achieve the better success. I'm also not going to pretend like those Lowry/Demar teams were even that good. Most of their tenure was a major overachievement job.

I also just have grown to hate Bosh and am biased here. Although if Demar keeps dancing to Kendrick's Not Like Us on stage then he might join Bosh in a few years lol.

Type in "chris bosh raptors nba finals" on YouTube and you'll see a couple of his vids. He was there for the entire nba finals argghhh

[kalel123]

Unless a player is loads better individually, which Bosh wasn't, I always go with intangibles as a fan: Team success and loyalty. I understand we generally agree Lowry is GROAT but he wasn't some world beater that was great on his own. It's because Lowry and DeRozan were together that they were successful.

[TheGeneral99]

Bosh was the better individual player but Demar is the better raptor based on his tenure/success.

Bosh's entire tenure here seems like it never happened thanks to Bosh's douche comments after he left. Still annoyed me that he was doing tv for the Raptors during their championship run.

IDK if we should even use "success" for Demar. He was the 2nd best player on those teams. Bosh was the best on his. Give Bosh a Lowry and I bet those teams are much better.

Thinking about a Lowry/Ross/OG/Bosh/Valanciunas team is actually kind of intriguing.

But regarding TV - I don't recall Bosh being on the broadcast ever. Any clips of that?

I said Bosh was the better player but Demar got to achieve the better success. I'm also not going to pretend like those Lowry/Demar teams were even that good. Most of their tenure was a major overachievement job.

I also just have grown to hate Bosh and am biased here. Although if Demar keeps dancing to Kendrick's Not Like Us on stage then he might join Bosh in a few years lol.

Type in "chris bosh raptors nba finals" on YouTube and you'll see a couple of his vids. He was there for the entire nba finals argghhh

Not even that good?

They won 48, 49, 56, 51 and 58 games together over a 5 year span, including 3 semi-final appearances and a conference finals appearance. That's not by luck.

[TheGeneral99]

Unless a player is loads better individually, which Bosh wasn't, I always go with intangibles as a fan: Team success and loyalty. I understand we generally agree Lowry is GROAT but he wasn't some world beater that was great on his own. It's because Lowry and DeRozan were together that they were successful.

I'd put Lowry > Bosh > Derozan.

Lowry had top 10 player level impact while Bosh in his prime was probably a top 15 player at best.

Derozan was a really a top 25-35 player.

[MEDIC]

There were too many seasons where I thought Bosh played to pad his offensive stats here & didn't play to his potential defensively. He was desperate to make allstar games & get acknowledged in some way.

I'll take Derozan. He was a much better leader & his teams has more success.

At the end of the day, they were similar level players though.

Not on the same tier as Leonard, Carter or even Tmac. I'd also put Lowry a notch above them (in regards to being a winning/ productive player).

[Raps in 4]

Bosh was the better player, but DeRozan had the much better supporting cast (DeRozan wasn't even the best player on his teams).

[Clay Davis]

Chris Bosh. He was the only one who had the guts to face us.

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