Did Kobe do anything better than Jordan?

[Hair Jordan]

Kobe’s 3-pt% and FT% are fractionally better than Jordan to the point where his advantage is basically negligible. Is there anything he was obviously better at than Jordan?

[Harry Palmer]

Deferring? Sounds ridiculous, I know, but all of MJ’s co-stars definitely got lower billing, especially when it comes to taking shots. Kobe played with Shaq. They both had massive egos, but Kobe put his through greater strain for the sake of winning, learned things like playing off the ball, etc. MJ never did that. Not saying he couldn’t have, especially if it happened to him as young as Kobe was, but we never saw him do it and there are personality indicators that make it a bit doubtful he could have.

Edit: only ~ peers he spoke about with anything like fear/reverence were Hakeem and Bird, so maybe with either of them as a teammate he finds a way if it happens young enough.

[1993Playoffs]

A better jump-shot

[capfan33]

Ball-handling and probably passing albeit the latter is not as clear. Variety of scoring moves as well, I think Kobe has a small but comfortable edge. Also, while the difference in percentage may be negligible, he took way more and higher difficulty threes, in absolute terms he was definitely better. If MJ focused on it who knows, but as is, I feel confident in Kobe.

[Hair Jordan]

A better jump-shot

People say that but FG% says otherwise. Tex Winter said Kobe’s jumper wasn’t better than Jordan's at his best.

[KingofTheClay]

No. Kobe was a budget Jordan.


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[Hair Jordan]

Ball-handling and probably passing albeit the latter is not as clear. Variety of scoring moves as well, I think Kobe has a small but comfortable edge. Also, while the difference in percentage may be negligible, he took way more and higher difficulty threes, in absolute terms he was definitely better. If MJ focused on it who knows, but as is, I feel confident in Kobe.

I don’t think Kobe had a better handle as Jordan averaged fewer turnovers. People confuse handles with ball handling. Stockton wasn’t going thru his legs or behind his back but that didn’t make him less of a ball handler. Jordan was a better tough shot maker than Kobe but didn’t take as many because he got to his spots with ease and always created distance to get good looks.

[LakerLegend]

Kobe’s 3-pt% and FT% are fractionally better than Jordan to the point where his advantage is basically negligible. Is there anything he was obviously better at than Jordan?

Jordan’s 3 point shooting is inflated by the disproportionate amount of 3s he took with the short 3 point line in 95 96 97. He’s a sub 30% three point shooter with the real line. His pre 96 stats are also inflated in a straight comparison because of the difference in league pace and defense.

[LakerLegend]

Ball-handling and probably passing albeit the latter is not as clear. Variety of scoring moves as well, I think Kobe has a small but comfortable edge. Also, while the difference in percentage may be negligible, he took way more and higher difficulty threes, in absolute terms he was definitely better. If MJ focused on it who knows, but as is, I feel confident in Kobe.

I don’t think Kobe had a better handle as Jordan averaged fewer turnovers. People confuse handles with ball handling. Stockton wasn’t going thru his legs or behind his back but that didn’t make him less of a ball handler. Jordan was a better tough shot maker than Kobe but didn’t take as many because he got to his spots with ease and always created distance to get good looks.

Kobe quite clearly has a tighter handle with more moves. Jordan’s massive hands made it easier to protect the ball. Jordan isn’t a better tough shot maker than Kobe. At least outside of 10 feet.
Inside 10 feet is debatable because of his massive hands.

[Hair Jordan]

Kobe’s 3-pt% and FT% are fractionally better than Jordan to the point where his advantage is basically negligible. Is there anything he was obviously better at than Jordan?

Jordan’s 3 point shooting is inflated by the disproportionate amount of 3s he took with the short 3 point line in 95 96 97. He’s a sub 30% three point shooter with the real line. His pre 96 stats are also inflated in a straight comparison because of the difference in league pace and defense.

Wrong. Jordan shot 38 and 35% from the original distance in ‘90 and ‘93 when he took at least three attempts per game. His career % is skewed negative because the 3’s he took his first four seasons were half court heaves, buzzer beaters with the shot clock running down or desperation 3’s late in games with his team trailing. People act like Jordan was the only player who benefited from a shorter 3 point line. He wasn’t even in the league the first year it was shortened and Kobe was in the league the last year it was in play.

[LakerLegend]

Kobe’s 3-pt% and FT% are fractionally better than Jordan to the point where his advantage is basically negligible. Is there anything he was obviously better at than Jordan?

Jordan’s 3 point shooting is inflated by the disproportionate amount of 3s he took with the short 3 point line in 95 96 97. He’s a sub 30% three point shooter with the real line. His pre 96 stats are also inflated in a straight comparison because of the difference in league pace and defense.

Wrong. Jordan shot 38 and 35% from the original distance in ‘90 and ‘93 when he took at least three attempts per game. His career % is skewed negative because the 3’s he took his first four seasons were half court heaves, buzzer beaters with the shot clock running down or desperation 3’s late in games with his team trailing. People act like Jordan was the only player who benefited from a shorter 3 point line. He wasn’t even in the league the first year it was shortened and Kobe was in the league the last year it was in play.

Wrong? No I’m factually correct. You can’t just cherry pick stats because your looking for any reason to say Jordan is better at everything like all your posts in this thread indicate.

[Ol Roy]

Kobe’s 3-pt% and FT% are fractionally better than Jordan to the point where his advantage is basically negligible. Is there anything he was obviously better at than Jordan?

Jordan’s 3 point shooting is inflated by the disproportionate amount of 3s he took with the short 3 point line in 95 96 97. He’s a sub 30% three point shooter with the real line. His pre 96 stats are also inflated in a straight comparison because of the difference in league pace and defense.

I think it's better to look at the seasons in which Jordan shot at a meaningful volume. Even if you take out the shortened-line years, '90 (38%) and '93 (35%) are probably a better indicator of Jordan's ability from range.

If put in Kobe's era with Kobe's volume, I see Jordan being a consistently above average three-point shooter.

[Hair Jordan]

Ball-handling and probably passing albeit the latter is not as clear. Variety of scoring moves as well, I think Kobe has a small but comfortable edge. Also, while the difference in percentage may be negligible, he took way more and higher difficulty threes, in absolute terms he was definitely better. If MJ focused on it who knows, but as is, I feel confident in Kobe.

I don’t think Kobe had a better handle as Jordan averaged fewer turnovers. People confuse handles with ball handling. Stockton wasn’t going thru his legs or behind his back but that didn’t make him less of a ball handler. Jordan was a better tough shot maker than Kobe but didn’t take as many because he got to his spots with ease and always created distance to get good looks.

Kobe quite clearly has a tighter handle with more moves. Jordan’s massive hands made it easier to protect the ball. Jordan isn’t a better tough shot maker than Kobe. At least outside of 10 feet.
Inside 10 feet is debatable because of his massive hands.

Jordan had better moves. That’s why he crushed Kobe as a scorer and did it way better efficiency. Jordan had more 30/40/50 point games than Kobe and only one less 60 point game and did it in far fewer games. Jordan has 8 career 50+ point games in the playoffs vs Kobe’s 1. If Kobe had more moves, was a better tough shot maker and had a better handle, why did he score way less and with worse efficiency?

[LakerLegend]

I don’t think Kobe had a better handle as Jordan averaged fewer turnovers. People confuse handles with ball handling. Stockton wasn’t going thru his legs or behind his back but that didn’t make him less of a ball handler. Jordan was a better tough shot maker than Kobe but didn’t take as many because he got to his spots with ease and always created distance to get good looks.

Kobe quite clearly has a tighter handle with more moves. Jordan’s massive hands made it easier to protect the ball. Jordan isn’t a better tough shot maker than Kobe. At least outside of 10 feet.
Inside 10 feet is debatable because of his massive hands.

Jordan had better moves. That’s why he crushed Kobe as a scorer and did it way better efficiency. Jordan had more 30/40/50 point games than Kobe and only one less 60 point game and did it in far fewer games. Jordan has 8 career 50+ point games in the playoffs vs Kobe’s 1. If Kobe had more moves, was a better tough shot maker and had a better handle, why did he score way less and with worse efficiency?

They played in different eras. The bad boys used to give up more ppg than the dirk/mash mavs who were considered a run and gun throw defense to the wind team. Your clearly not interested in a discussion here but instead looking for any reason to prop up Jordan so I’m not going to continue here.

[capfan33]

I don’t think Kobe had a better handle as Jordan averaged fewer turnovers. People confuse handles with ball handling. Stockton wasn’t going thru his legs or behind his back but that didn’t make him less of a ball handler. Jordan was a better tough shot maker than Kobe but didn’t take as many because he got to his spots with ease and always created distance to get good looks.

Kobe quite clearly has a tighter handle with more moves. Jordan’s massive hands made it easier to protect the ball. Jordan isn’t a better tough shot maker than Kobe. At least outside of 10 feet.
Inside 10 feet is debatable because of his massive hands.

Jordan had better moves. That’s why he crushed Kobe as a scorer and did it way better efficiency. Jordan had more 30/40/50 point games than Kobe and only one less 60 point game and did it in far fewer games. Jordan has 8 career 50+ point games in the playoffs vs Kobe’s 1. If Kobe had more moves, was a better tough shot maker and had a better handle, why did he score way less and with worse efficiency?

Era and athleticism mainly, and the problem with his better tough shot making was he also took them more than MJ, lowering his overall percentage.

[capfan33]

Ball-handling and probably passing albeit the latter is not as clear. Variety of scoring moves as well, I think Kobe has a small but comfortable edge. Also, while the difference in percentage may be negligible, he took way more and higher difficulty threes, in absolute terms he was definitely better. If MJ focused on it who knows, but as is, I feel confident in Kobe.

I don’t think Kobe had a better handle as Jordan averaged fewer turnovers. People confuse handles with ball handling. Stockton wasn’t going thru his legs or behind his back but that didn’t make him less of a ball handler. Jordan was a better tough shot maker than Kobe but didn’t take as many because he got to his spots with ease and always created distance to get good looks.

Jordan has less turnovers because he wasn't the primary ball-handler and played off-ball a lot of the time. And I'm not even sure Kobe's ball-handling was that much fancier than MJ's, he just had better control of the ball.

And I'm not sure if Jordan was a better tough shot maker, but the latter is true and part of the difference between them, Jordan was more athletic and could create easy looks more readily.

[lessthanjake]

I’m sure at a very micro-level there are things Kobe did better than Jordan (to take a fake example, I mean things like “better at pump faking after driving to his right”). There’s no way there’s not micro-level things like that that he was better at. But in terms of things that are broader and more easily discernible to us as fans, there’s not really anything. Three-point shooting is arguably one, I suppose, but it feels like it’s more just a product of era than anything.

[Hair Jordan]

Jordan’s 3 point shooting is inflated by the disproportionate amount of 3s he took with the short 3 point line in 95 96 97. He’s a sub 30% three point shooter with the real line. His pre 96 stats are also inflated in a straight comparison because of the difference in league pace and defense.

Wrong. Jordan shot 38 and 35% from the original distance in ‘90 and ‘93 when he took at least three attempts per game. His career % is skewed negative because the 3’s he took his first four seasons were half court heaves, buzzer beaters with the shot clock running down or desperation 3’s late in games with his team trailing. People act like Jordan was the only player who benefited from a shorter 3 point line. He wasn’t even in the league the first year it was shortened and Kobe was in the league the last year it was in play.

Wrong? No I’m factually correct. You can’t just cherry pick stats because your looking for any reason to say Jordan is better at everything like all your posts in this thread indicate.

I’m not cherry picking. Jordan rarely if ever took a 3 pointer during his first 4 seasons that wasn’t a buzzer beater or bailout shot. Do people really believe he was getting good looks and taking good 3’s and was still shooting 18 or 19%? The first year Jordan actually looked to take 3’s and took them in volume (3 or more attempts per game) he shot 38%. So Jordan benefited from a shortened line for two years whereas Kobe only benefited for one year but Jordan’s career % is dragged down by his first 4 years of heaves and buzzer beaters whereas Kobe’s career % is not dragged down yet they’re almost equal in terms of %.

[AdagioPace]

probably agility but I don't how much it matters if the rest is not on par.

[Cavsfansince84]

I don't think he did anything clearly better outside of maybe passing in the paint and shooting in the 18-24 ft range.