Miami Heat Offseason Thread Vol. 4: Fraudfather Snoozin 2.0

[HeatIn5]

It's either Ingram if we can make a fair trade,

Or do nothing, play the younings and go full youth movement. Could trade Jimmy for picks too, makes sense.

Mid is the worst.

Butler to Pels for Ingram and 2025 pick?

Alright for ****s and giggles, trade machine approved

To heat - Brandon Ingram, Bruce Brown, Herb Jones, Jordan Hawkins, 2025 MIL 1st (via NO), 2027 MIL 1st (via NO), 2028 2nd (via TOR)
Heat give up - Jimmy Butler, Tyler Herro, Orlando Robinson

To pelicans - Jimmy Butler, Davion Mitchell, Orlando Robinson, 2026 2nd (via Tor)
Pelicans give up - Brandon Ingram, Herb Jones, Jordan Hawkins, 2 1sts

To Raptors - Tyler Herro
Raptors give up - Bruce Brown, Davion Mitchell, 2 2nds

If the pelicans really want Jimmy, and are done with BI, this still a lot to give up. But they’d have a killer team.

We’d look a little different to say the least

Rozier/Brown
Duncan/Hawkins/JRich
Ingram/Jaime
Jovic/Herb
Bam/Love/Ware

No way this ever happens but was fun to play with

[Rapaz]

I am not a big fan of Ingram but the only big name trade I can see the Heat pulling off would be for Ingram.

A trade I would like to see for depth purposes is Orlando and Duncan Robinson for Malcolm Brogdon.

PG: Rozier- Brogdon - Richardson - Pullin - Smith - Stevens
SG: Butler - Herro
SF: Jaquez Jr. - Larsson
PF: Jovic - Johnson
Ce: Adebayo - Love - Ware - Bryant

I like Brogdon and would make that deal, but the FO is probably spooked by his injury history/availability concerns.

[Beenie]

The issue is they already have Jordan Poole making Herro type money.

Two separate transactions due to sign n trade rules but effectively one big trade:

Duncan and Niko for Jones

Rozier for Kuzma

I believe the math works but feel free to keep me honest.

Wizards have been angling for picks in return for Kuzma so no telling if they like Niko enough to amend their demands.

An offer worth exploring though

I think I’d rather keep Niko

After this season he is extension eligible

Team just drafted Ware presumably to move Bam to the 4 long term

[contract]

Bam isn't a 4, he's a 5.

[Beenie]

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[MettaWorldPanda]

I am not a big fan of Ingram but the only big name trade I can see the Heat pulling off would be for Ingram.

A trade I would like to see for depth purposes is Orlando and Duncan Robinson for Malcolm Brogdon.

PG: Rozier- Brogdon - Richardson - Pullin - Smith - Stevens
SG: Butler - Herro
SF: Jaquez Jr. - Larsson
PF: Jovic - Johnson
Ce: Adebayo - Love - Ware - Bryant

I like Brogdon and would make that deal, but the FO is probably spooked by his injury history/availability concerns.

For brokeback Duncan and Bum Shoulder J Rich you make that deal. All the Wiz care about right now is pick asset allocation

[MettaWorldPanda]

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Something brewing. They had until the 15th to decide. Opens money and roster spot. Probably just resigning Haywood

[greg4012]

Bam is a player that checks a lot of boxes for the skillset a team needs from its frontcourt rotation as a whole. He can move bodies with the best and biggest in the NBA. He can defend up and down the lineup and thrive defending on the perimeter or in the paint/around the rim. He's a high level rebounder. He can finish inside offensively and work as a high level roll man/dunker. He can handle the ball along the perimeter and in transition and create offense off the dribble for himself and others. He can score in the midrange.

He's not a 3 pt shooter--that's really the only box he doesn't check for a modern PF skillset.

The reality is that Bam is a really versatile and dynamic frontcourt player that has been tasked with handling almost all of Miami's frontcourt responsibilities for most of his career. He can fit with a number of different frontcourt partners, but the most important fit dynamic is that they can space the floor--because that's what the modern game requires.

It doesn't really matter if people want to label Bam a 5 or a 4. He is still doing 80% of all the frontcourt work for the Miami Heat. What matters is adding frontcourt rotation partners to play alongside Bam that can complement Bam by providing some spacing. The more additional boxes the frontcourt partners can check for team building the better.

The fact that Bam does so much allows Miami to deploy a variety of limited frontcourt partners alongside him as long as they can space the floor. But, if they can't defend on the perimeter then they better be a value-add rim protector.

Bam can play with Niko. If Ware's shot is real, Bam can play with Ware.

Personally, I heavily value the idea of Miami continuing to develop and invest in having as dynamic and deep of a frontcourt rotation as possible. That wins in the NBA more often than not.

I don't see the drafting of Ware coming at the expense of Niko's role on the Heat. I see it as an investment in developing one of the most dynamic frontcourt rotations in the NBA.

[MettaWorldPanda]

Duncan and J Rich is an exact dollar match for Brogdon. Wiz can’t aggregate Brogdon so the 2-1 works out perfectly.

[twix2500]

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I am glad they did it now. Let this kid find a home. It would of been very disrespectful to release him on the 15th, and then be locked out of free agency.

[MettaWorldPanda]

I’d be fine with trading for Brogdon or Schroder and signing one more vet wing defender. Be it Morris, Highsmith, or Crowder. Shoring up the bench with quality depth with our starting 5 should at least give us a regular season team that finishes good enough to pay out OKC’s pick.

[Shaq_Diesel]

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I am glad they did it now. Let this kid find a home. It would of been very disrespectful to release him on the 15th, and then be locked out of free agency.

Not surprising - but timing is interesting since they had until the 15th to do this. Maybe it signals HH is back this week. Maybe it's something more.

Theoretically you could've traded him this week and the other team could've also waived him on the 15th if someone was looking to get out of a small salary. But......the market for Lando is probably slim to none.

[DayofMourning]

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I am glad they did it now. Let this kid find a home. It would of been very disrespectful to release him on the 15th, and then be locked out of free agency.

Not surprising - but timing is interesting since they had until the 15th to do this. Maybe it signals HH is back this week. Maybe it's something more.

Theoretically you could've traded him this week and the other team could've also waived him on the 15th if someone was looking to get out of a small salary. But......the market for Lando is probably slim to none.

Im hoping we see Highsmith move on. I really feel like Keshad could likely fill his spot come playin time if given the minutes during the RS.

[Shaq_Diesel]

I am glad they did it now. Let this kid find a home. It would of been very disrespectful to release him on the 15th, and then be locked out of free agency.

Not surprising - but timing is interesting since they had until the 15th to do this. Maybe it signals HH is back this week. Maybe it's something more.

Theoretically you could've traded him this week and the other team could've also waived him on the 15th if someone was looking to get out of a small salary. But......the market for Lando is probably slim to none.

Im hoping we see Highsmith move on. I really feel like Keshad could likely fill his spot come playin time if given the minutes during the RS.

I agree but I'm also not going to overreact to just one summer league game. So far, so good though. Love his activity and frame.

[DayofMourning]

I agree but I'm also not going to overreact to just one summer league game. So far, so good though. Love his activity and frame.

Wasnt much to overreact to after the first game. Bunch of disjointed plays with zero flow. Typical of summer league.

He has nice athleticism, a strong body and moves well. He has good wing size if that becomes his role. Plenty of college seasoning. Hes the guy Id expect to look much better when surrounded with legit options. Let him play a role well.

[MettaWorldPanda]

I am glad they did it now. Let this kid find a home. It would of been very disrespectful to release him on the 15th, and then be locked out of free agency.

Not surprising - but timing is interesting since they had until the 15th to do this. Maybe it signals HH is back this week. Maybe it's something more.

Theoretically you could've traded him this week and the other team could've also waived him on the 15th if someone was looking to get out of a small salary. But......the market for Lando is probably slim to none.

Im hoping we see Highsmith move on. I really feel like Keshad could likely fill his spot come playin time if given the minutes during the RS.

Keshad already showing way more athletic ability than Haywood has ever shown. Haywood has very minimal explosion to the basket.

[MettaWorldPanda]

If we can’t make a deal for a backup PG i really like the idea of Spencer Dinwiddie for the 5.2

[SA37]

Spoiler:

Absolutely, Herro isn't the #1 or #2 option right now, but he's also only 24 years old. Most players at that age simply aren't expected to be at their peak performance.

There’s still a chance he takes a significant leap for several reasons. First, player development isn't always linear. Many players continue to grow and refine their skills well into their mid-to-late 20s. Herro has shown flashes of high-level play, particularly with his shooting and scoring abilities, as seen in his great game vs. Chicago in the play-in and his one big performance against a high-quality Boston team.

Herro's work ethic and determination can't be overlooked. He's shown a willingness to put in the effort to improve his game, and with the right coaching and development within Miami's system, there's potential for him to elevate his performance. This is the first year where he really had to take on the #1 scoring/playmaking role because Jimmy was out so frequently. Notably, Bam and Herro had a good record without Jimmy as well. He faced a lot of defensive coverages and game plans designed to take him out of the game, which is a valuable learning experience.

As he gains more experience, especially in high-stakes situations, he could learn to better handle defensive pressure and find ways to be more effective even when targeted.

Depite Herro's work ethic, his improvements over the last 3 seasons have been marginal, at best. His numbers are stagnant across the board. There isn't a single, solitary sign that Herro is destined to change this over the next 3 years, especially when you consider his playoff performance in 22' (12-4-3 41-23-93 1.8 FTA) and this past series where Butler was out (17-3-5 38-35-90 1.8 FTA)

As a means of comparison at 24:

Herro: 21ppg 5rpg 4apg 44 fg% 40 3pt% 86 ft% 2.8 FTA

Booker: 25-4-4 48 fg% 34 3pt% 87 ft% 6 FTA

Lavine: 25-5-4 45-38-80 5.6 FTA

Jaylen Brown: 25-6-3 48-40-76 4 FTA

Mitchell: 26-4-5 44-38-85 6 FTA

Harden: 25-5-6 45-36-87 9 FTA

Irving: 25-3-6 47-40-90 4.6 FTA

Beal: 22-4-4 46-37-79 4.5 FTA

SGA: 31-5-5 51-34-90 11 FTA

McCollum: 21-3-4 45-42-83 2.8 FTA

The guys Herro compares to the best are McCollum, who has never been an all-star and is the comp I have always said was the most accurate, and Beal, who outside of 2 monster scoring seasons, is a borderline all-star who gets you ~22 per game.

Of course, we've seen late bloomers, like Chauncey Billups, Kyle Lowry, or now Jalen Brunson who all had breakout years after 25, but they are the exception, not the rule. In any case, Brunson is the only star. Lowry and Billups' careers are supremely overrated in my view.

It's unlikely that Herro will suddenly become an all-star level player (and I'm not saying that, despite the chance also not being entirely zero), but there’s still potential for growth. Player development isn't always predictable, and some players take a bit longer to really hit their best form. Even if he doesn’t reach the level of, say, Booker, Herro can still be a very valuable player for the Heat.

He already is a very versatile offensive player who can excel in many roles, whether on or off the ball, as a spot-up shooter, or as a secondary playmaker. If he continues to refine his skills and adapt to different roles within the team, he can contribute to their success. Moreover, he's not paid like a superstar, so the gap between his current performance and his contract value isn't large.

Agree 100% with the bolded and in general with the entire post.

In fairness to Herro, I think he suffers from playing in one of the most pathetic offenses in the entire league. I'm not suggesting Herro would be a radically different player on a different team, but I don't think he is helped by this team's offense which consistently ranks amongst the worst in the league.

A lot of the trade talk involving Herro stems from Miami 1) having his replacement on the roster 2) him needing to be included in any potential deal that would bring back a better player given Miami's dearth of assets and 3) a large supply of scoring guards in general

[SoFlaKingReal]

Orlando Robinson killed it in summer league last year....just goes to show ya.

[MettaWorldPanda]

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