Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center

[mpharris36]

Deuce >>> Kessler

Don't let Ainge rip us off

I wouldn't want to give up much more than Duece for him (or 3 team whatever dueces value in terms of re-routing draft picks to utah). But its just about minutes and NEED more right now.

Brunson is 34-36 mins
Mikal is 34-36 mins
OG is 34-36 mins
DD is 24 mins at least
Hart is 24 mins at least
Randle is 34-36 mins

Our center rotation of Mitch and whoever else is playing center is going to be another 48.

That leaves what 8-10 minutes for Duece a night just backing up Brunson. With DD coming off the bench that certainly complicated Dueces role. And we have insurance with Kolek and potentially the TPMLE to get a vet guard as well.

Mitch being injury prone could derail our season if we don't get a viable backup/spot starter big.

Agreed. I’m not trying to sound like the sky is falling, but I just cannot go into another season with Mitch’s health being such a massive factor in whether we contend.

With the massive talent boost this team has seen, our window has just begun to open and we really need to take advantage of that. Wrap it up — get the team built. Cash in some chips.

This is EXACTLY why the team-friendly contracts Leon has handed out are so great: when you find a better fit to move towards a championship, you can actually get value for that player.

I love Deuce, but I want to see a title in my lifetime.

I also feel we have a lot of depth at guard. We drafted Kolek who they really like and gave the richest 2nd round contract too. We can go the vet route to also find a backup PG for 10 or so minutes a game if we really need it and give Kolek a little more seasoning.

Right now the big market is very weak outside of trade options. Precious I want back but if its just Mitch/Precious/Sims....you are one mitch injury away from 48 mins of precious and sims...that isn't going to cut it.

[sol537]

Kessler for Deuce straight up makes sense.

Kessler for the WAS 1st, DET 1st, and a future 2nd also makes sense. Maybe throw in a swap as well.

I’d prefer the 2nd option so we can keep Deuce as a depth piece.

[DaGawd]

Does Rokas have any value?

I would trade his rights for Kessler

I'm shocked that the Jazz are dangling Kessler though. Do the Jazz have a better center on their squad?

they need to tank to keep their pick

[Deeeez Knicks]

I looked that up because that seemed a bit crazy . That was Embiid vs the Jazz. Kessler in the game that embiid dropped 59 was the backup and was a +13 in 12 minutes with 3 blocks (seemed like the only guy that defended him decently). Jazz like to play really small with there starters I think Vanderbilt was there starting 5 and got cooked.

I don't think anyone is "overrating him" he is what he is...good rebounding, good rim protection and can finish around the basket. I wouldn't call it a panic move unless we way overpaid which I think at this point Leon wouldn't do. If its too rich we look for other scenarios.

This is Ainge so we know the asking price will be high and it'll take an overpay.

In terms of Kessler, he protects the paint but is a pretty big liability in other areas. It does make him tough to play in certain matchups. Id just roll with the free players like Prescious or Paul Reed. Play some small ball too. Save our assets for something else.

In a vacuum again that may be fine but we are talking about mitch...we are an injury away from Precious or Sims playing huge roles for a contender.

If its too rich its too rich. But he's a niche player he is a good offensive rebounder, great rim protector. And your right vs stretch bigs he probably won't play as much but that is matchup driven. In an idea world I would want a Kessler and then Precious back with bird rights as our 5th big. Just like last year with Ihart/Mitch and then precious in case we need him.

I would look for a C with more offense and versatility if we are trading assets/picks. I mean, even Mitch at times is a liability. iHarts floater and passing were HUGE in the playoffs. Added a big element. If we are paying a steep price, I would look for a C that compliments Mitch rather then having 2 Cs with 0 offense..... especially looking at the East.

Or we need to learn to play more small ball.

We are running low on picks/assets so would be more careful and making sure it's for the right piece.

[Deeeez Knicks]

Read on Twitter

5 blocks in the game. Also had a big block vs Edey they overturned. Edey is huge.

That was a fun game.

The 5 blocks were nice but he also got bullied a bunch of times and had a bad turnover. He really should be dominating these games. He looked more underwhelming then anything tbh.

[mpharris36]

This is Ainge so we know the asking price will be high and it'll take an overpay.

In terms of Kessler, he protects the paint but is a pretty big liability in other areas. It does make him tough to play in certain matchups. Id just roll with the free players like Prescious or Paul Reed. Play some small ball too. Save our assets for something else.

In a vacuum again that may be fine but we are talking about mitch...we are an injury away from Precious or Sims playing huge roles for a contender.

If its too rich its too rich. But he's a niche player he is a good offensive rebounder, great rim protector. And your right vs stretch bigs he probably won't play as much but that is matchup driven. In an idea world I would want a Kessler and then Precious back with bird rights as our 5th big. Just like last year with Ihart/Mitch and then precious in case we need him.

I would look for a C with more offense and versatility if we are trading assets/picks. I mean, even Mitch at times is a liability. iHarts floater and passing were HUGE in the playoffs. Added a big element. If we are paying a steep price, I would look for a C that compliments Mitch rather then having 2 Cs with 0 offense..... especially looking at the East.

Or we need to learn to play more small ball.

We are running low on picks/assets so would be more careful and making sure it's for the right piece.

We are talking about thibs tho...it was just reported the Knicks are a bit hesitant on precious because they view him more as a 4 not a 5. That is obviously coming from Thibs.

I am currently not trying to find a big that compliments mitch I am trying to find Mitch insurance. I am also not talking about "breaking the bank". And its also not like its a sunk cost. Duece does have a great contract but we would have control over Kessler too who can also be re-routed for another deal if you wanted.

But we need Mitch insurance and depth at center.

[Ghetto Gospel]

Does Rokas have any value?

I would trade his rights for Kessler

I'm shocked that the Jazz are dangling Kessler though. Do the Jazz have a better center on their squad?

they need to tank to keep their pick

i think you can tank with kessler, he's not that good lmao.

[nyk2017]

Kessler for Deuce straight up makes sense.

Kessler for the WAS 1st, DET 1st, and a future 2nd also makes sense. Maybe throw in a swap as well.

I’d prefer the 2nd option so we can keep Deuce as a depth piece.

If the Knicks trade Deuce straight up for Kessler, then Thibs will kill Leon.

[mpharris36]

Read on Twitter

5 blocks in the game. Also had a big block vs Edey they overturned. Edey is huge.

That was a fun game.

The 5 blocks were nice but he also got bullied a bunch of times and had a bad turnover. He really should be dominating these games. He looked more underwhelming then anything tbh.

he really didn't look underwhelming to me. Especially in that OT he was altering a lot of shots. Edey was a lottery pick and has legit NBA size, he freakin huge. He's not a bum. Yes there are areas he needs to improve...like a lot of 22 year olds.

We also would not be requiring him to a huge role right away. He continues to develop and learn under Mitch and Thibs. Mitch wont be here forever either.

And I love Duece...I just don't see a pathway to a huge role for him as the current roster is constituted (we just added Mikal without losing any perimeter players in the rotation). And I don't see thibs just going with Randle or OG at center for more than just small spurts...so we need more depth at center.

[WargamesX]

Does Rokas have any value?

I would trade his rights for Kessler

I'm shocked that the Jazz are dangling Kessler though. Do the Jazz have a better center on their squad?

they need to tank to keep their pick

And they want to play 5 out. They have Collins and just got Flipkowski.

Also there are rumors he wants out of there

[KnixinSix]

Begley says Utah is looking for “at least a first” for Kessler
and seemed skeptical the Knicks would meet that price.

Begley definitely gets good info from inside the organization.

Dadiet, Sims and the Detroit first. Get it done Leon.

[mpharris36]

Does Rokas have any value?

I would trade his rights for Kessler

I'm shocked that the Jazz are dangling Kessler though. Do the Jazz have a better center on their squad?

they need to tank to keep their pick

i think you can tank with kessler, he's not that good lmao.

yeah its more Lauri the guy they need to move. The only reason to potentially move kessler now is you might get less return in a year because he would only have 1 more year left on his deal and if they plan on playing other bigs his value will go down. It all depends on how the Jazz want to play. They seem to value floor spacing which is why Kessler rookie year to 2nd year kinda didn't really improve much and was stagnant.

[WargamesX]

Food for thought

Utah and Golden State are talking Marakkanen

Golden State can only trade 2 future 1’s unless they amended the pick they owe Washington (2030 top-20 protected). If they get that back, they can trade 4 future 1’s under the Stepin rule.

We own a WAS pick protected for the next 2 years turning into 2 2nds in 26 and 27. So most likely this is back to back picks in the mid 30’s

How can we enter this deal where we essentially return Washington’s pick, end up with Kessler and help Utah get more value from golden state in a Lauri deal.

hmmm that is interesting. Maybe us sending the Wasington pick back to washington allows washington to send the GS pick back to GS...to open up more 1st for GS to trade...to then somehow re-route Kessler to us.

That was my thought.

Washington gets likely two high 2nds back in exchange for a pick that conveys anywhere between 20-50 in 2030.

By GS getting control of their 2030 1st back it frees them up to trade 29 and 31 to Utah.

They need to find a way to get us Kessler for the protected WAS pick. Something Utah won’t do outside of a larger trade

Need a windhorst photo here

That’s not a bad idea all things considered. And DC gets their freedom to be as good or as bad as they need to without giving up a first.

[sol537]

they need to tank to keep their pick

i think you can tank with kessler, he's not that good lmao.

yeah its more Lauri the guy they need to move. The only reason to potentially move kessler now is you might get less return in a year because he would only have 1 more year left on his deal and if they plan on playing other bigs his value will go down. It all depends on how the Jazz want to play. They seem to value floor spacing which is why Kessler rookie year to 2nd year kinda didn't really improve much and was stagnant.

Yup. Maybe there could be something to a NY, WAS, GSW, UTA 4-way trade whereby Kessler goes to NYK, Lauri to GSW, draft assets to UTA and WAS with other pieces involved. UTA and WAS are both in the Flag sweepstakes hah

[Fury]

Kessler for a top 24 protected 1st round pick

[Deeeez Knicks]

In a vacuum again that may be fine but we are talking about mitch...we are an injury away from Precious or Sims playing huge roles for a contender.

If its too rich its too rich. But he's a niche player he is a good offensive rebounder, great rim protector. And your right vs stretch bigs he probably won't play as much but that is matchup driven. In an idea world I would want a Kessler and then Precious back with bird rights as our 5th big. Just like last year with Ihart/Mitch and then precious in case we need him.

I would look for a C with more offense and versatility if we are trading assets/picks. I mean, even Mitch at times is a liability. iHarts floater and passing were HUGE in the playoffs. Added a big element. If we are paying a steep price, I would look for a C that compliments Mitch rather then having 2 Cs with 0 offense..... especially looking at the East.

Or we need to learn to play more small ball.

We are running low on picks/assets so would be more careful and making sure it's for the right piece.

We are talking about thibs tho...it was just reported the Knicks are a bit hesitant on precious because they view him more as a 4 not a 5. That is obviously coming from Thibs.

I am currently not trying to find a big that compliments mitch I am trying to find Mitch insurance. I am also not talking about "breaking the bank". And its also not like its a sunk cost. Duece does have a great contract but we would have control over Kessler too who can also be re-routed for another deal if you wanted.

But we need Mitch insurance and depth at center.

We should be looking for an iHart replacement over Mitch insurance. Just someone that can keep the defense honest outside of 5'. Kessler is also horrible at setting screens which is a big negative.

Thibs may not want to play small ball but that's more reason why we need a C with more offense. We just watched the Celtics render the Mavs Centers useless. The bucks and sixers do the same. We can't let Embiid, KP, Lopez, etc sit in the paint all game. It'll make things much harder for Brunson.

Mitch is still important. Just think we would be much better with a C with more offense to compliment him and mix things up, over 2 Cs that basically offer nothing on offense except rim running.... That's if we are paying Ainges price.

[mpharris36]

I would look for a C with more offense and versatility if we are trading assets/picks. I mean, even Mitch at times is a liability. iHarts floater and passing were HUGE in the playoffs. Added a big element. If we are paying a steep price, I would look for a C that compliments Mitch rather then having 2 Cs with 0 offense..... especially looking at the East.

Or we need to learn to play more small ball.

We are running low on picks/assets so would be more careful and making sure it's for the right piece.

We are talking about thibs tho...it was just reported the Knicks are a bit hesitant on precious because they view him more as a 4 not a 5. That is obviously coming from Thibs.

I am currently not trying to find a big that compliments mitch I am trying to find Mitch insurance. I am also not talking about "breaking the bank". And its also not like its a sunk cost. Duece does have a great contract but we would have control over Kessler too who can also be re-routed for another deal if you wanted.

But we need Mitch insurance and depth at center.

We should be looking for an iHart replacement over Mitch insurance. Just someone that can keep the defense honest outside of 5'. Kessler is also horrible at setting screens which is a big negative.

Thibs may not want to play small ball but that's more reason why we need a C with more offense. We just watched the Celtics render the Mavs Centers useless. The bucks and sixers do the same. We can't let Embiid, KP, Lopez, etc sit in the paint all game. It'll make things much harder for Brunson.

Mitch is still important. Just think we would be much better with a C with more offense to compliment him and mix things up, over 2 Cs that basically offer nothing on offense except rim running.... That's if we are paying Ainges price.

Lets be honest though a big that can rim protect that also has a bit of an offensive game wouldn't be available for our asking price. Look at what ihart just got on the open market.

We are going to have to get someone with some kind of flaws. And I know I'm not going to convince you on Duece...he's your favorite player and I can't blame you. I really like Duece as well. But I also don't view Duece a full time PG because he lacks playmaking. He is an idea off ball 3/D defensive guard with some secondary ball handling. But isn't that what DD does?

Now if your telling me we can some navigate a backup big with a precious S&T and maybe a protected 1st or some 2nds...sure lets go that route if Kessler price is too high. I just don't see anyone available.

[TrueWarrior]

Last offseason if you said we could maybe get Kessler for Deuce you’d be called insane.

Anything can happen, but the likely outcome is Deuce will only play 10-15 mpg this year unless many injuries happen again. What will his value be then, especially if he still struggles playing point and guys like Kolek/Rokas or whoever take some of his minutes? Jalen, Donte, and Mikal already are taking most of Deuce’s role and time. He’s a 6’1”, albeit long, SG in the end.

Meanwhile Kessler will probably at least be as good as he was last season, which is still a 23 year old solid starter/great backup center with elite rim protection and rebounding.

If Kessler develops well we can trade Mitch down the line to get more of an offensive center behind him if that’s the concern some have. I just have no more faith that Mitch stays healthy or improves his glaring weaknesses. This is year 7 for him now and we are trying to win it all, not just make the playoffs.

I would bet that Deuce’s value goes down and Kessler’s goes up, mainly from opportunity. Deuce is a good player but easier to replace than Kessler, and the minutes just wont be there for him most likely. Ainge probably thinks the same thing which is why we wont trade. Sometimes you gotta strike when the opportunity arises though.

[Deeeez Knicks]

We are talking about thibs tho...it was just reported the Knicks are a bit hesitant on precious because they view him more as a 4 not a 5. That is obviously coming from Thibs.

I am currently not trying to find a big that compliments mitch I am trying to find Mitch insurance. I am also not talking about "breaking the bank". And its also not like its a sunk cost. Duece does have a great contract but we would have control over Kessler too who can also be re-routed for another deal if you wanted.

But we need Mitch insurance and depth at center.

We should be looking for an iHart replacement over Mitch insurance. Just someone that can keep the defense honest outside of 5'. Kessler is also horrible at setting screens which is a big negative.

Thibs may not want to play small ball but that's more reason why we need a C with more offense. We just watched the Celtics render the Mavs Centers useless. The bucks and sixers do the same. We can't let Embiid, KP, Lopez, etc sit in the paint all game. It'll make things much harder for Brunson.

Mitch is still important. Just think we would be much better with a C with more offense to compliment him and mix things up, over 2 Cs that basically offer nothing on offense except rim running.... That's if we are paying Ainges price.

Lets be honest though a big that can rim protect that also has a bit of an offensive game wouldn't be available for our asking price. Look at what ihart just got on the open market.

We are going to have to get someone with some kind of flaws. And I know I'm not going to convince you on Duece...he's your favorite player and I can't blame you. I really like Duece as well. But I also don't view Duece a full time PG because he lacks playmaking. He is an idea off ball 3/D defensive guard with some secondary ball handling. But isn't that what DD does?

Now if your telling me we can some navigate a backup big with a precious S&T and maybe a protected 1st or some 2nds...sure lets go that route if Kessler price is too high. I just don't see anyone available.

Well, per reports it does sound like the price for Kessler is too steep. That's the other issue. The price for what we are getting. We dont even have the picks Utah is looking for.

In terms of Deuce, there's not a ton of minutes right now. But things change. Injuries happen. He just played some huge minutes when nobody expected that. For the right deal I would trade him though

Trading Deuce plus what few picks we have left.....I mean we do have to be careful about that. We will need to go thru the Celtics.

Do you really see Kessler being effective against the Celtics in the playoffs against KP?

[HarthorneWingo]

I'm okay with Mitch/Hukporti/Sims to start the season with the option to play smaller too. This team has a good size window, at this point it might be best to see what we got then adjust again from there.

Hukporti the backup center?

No.