Miami Heat Off-season Thread Vol. 5 - The One Where We Do Something

[lastb1ckman]

Jimmy hasn’t been challenged? He is balancing between running an upstart coffee company and leading g-leaguers to the finals. Andy is just mad he can’t do cool hair styles like Jimmy


Big face affogato from Van Leeuwen in NYC is my fav ice cream flavor

He hasn't been challenged regarding his work ethic before. He's usually seen as the crazy/hi intensity guy that'll tear people apart for not bring the same energy. But the heat have been noticing all the time he's been missing during the season, along with coasting when he does plays. They kept their mouth shut cause he would find a way to turn up when they needed it. He couldn't this time, so they're having a hard time tolerating it now. That's how I see it.

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

[Hallstar]

I said we didn't pay Wade so would we really pay Jimmy? And that was years ago. I don't know where the excitement is coming from. There's no trade that puts us in the top 3 in the East. So why extend the race for the play-in by several years with the highest paid player contribution being less and less...

[Beenie]

He hasn't been challenged regarding his work ethic before. He's usually seen as the crazy/hi intensity guy that'll tear people apart for not bring the same energy. But the heat have been noticing all the time he's been missing during the season, along with coasting when he does plays. They kept their mouth shut cause he would find a way to turn up when they needed it. He couldn't this time, so they're having a hard time tolerating it now. That's how I see it.

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

[dshearn]

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

I think a lot of Miami fan's are tired of waiting on Herro to carry the offensive load...we have wanted it for years, he was paid to do it....and it has not materialized yet.

[lastb1ckman]

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Of course role players on the team can't handle the lead role on offense, they're role players. Jimmy is the one being paid 50 million a year, not them. This even includes Herro, I don't expect him to have the same impact as Jimmy because he isn't being paid like Jimmy is. If Jimmy wants to be paid like a max player, I expect consistent max impact. It doesn't even have to be all on offense, it could be defense, or even both.

When it comes to Bam, even if he doesn't have a crazy offensive game he ALWAYS brings max impact on defense. He holds the entire defense together by his own damn self. He does this along with putting up like 20,9, and 4 a game last playoffs. I don't have any issues with Bam, he was one of the lone bright spots against the Celtics.

[lastb1ckman]

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

We don't see Bam or Herro go on 40 point explosions because Bam is holding the entire defense together and Herro isn't THAT guy. The Heat hoped he might turn into that, but he just hasn't. Tbh even though 27 million is A LOT of money, a lot of the guys making 20-30 million a year aren't THAT guy either. Most of those elite level of players are making or about to start making 40 to over 50 million a year.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Tons of strawman arguments in this post but I just came to say even if Jimmy pops off and we win the championship I would lean towards the FO not offering him the 4/$240M he wants. They’re just not going to do it.

I’m actually starting to get worried we’re going to botch this whole situation and lose him for nothing, or maybe 1 1st in a sign and trade, instead of maximizing his value this summer and getting several assets for him (like this FO has a bad habit of doing). We’re just delaying the inevitable at this point it seems

[Beenie]

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Of course role players on the team can't handle the lead role on offense, they're role players. Jimmy is the one being paid 50 million a year, not them. This even includes Herro, I don't expect him to have the same impact as Jimmy because he isn't being paid like Jimmy is. If Jimmy wants to be paid like a max player, I expect consistent max impact. It doesn't even have to be all on offense, it could be defense, or even both.

When it comes to Bam, even if he doesn't have a crazy offensive game he ALWAYS brings max impact on defense. He holds the entire defense together by his own damn self. He does this along with putting up like 20,9, and 4 a game last playoffs. I don't have any issues with Bam, he was one of the lone bright spots against the Celtics.

Yes, "they're role players" indeed. And they (Bam and Herro) are getting max or close to max contracts. Perhaps the ire of the fanbase ought to be directed either at them or at the front office.

[Beenie]

I think there's a reckoning coming to Jimmy's current value in the nba. It may be coming to a lot of players looking for big money with the new CBA. If Jimmy has to coast and rely on the rest of the team to get us to the post season, is he REALLY still worth the max? Is any star still worth the max when they have to do that? Isn't that a sign that they don't quite have it anymore?

What's the point of being called a max player, if you can't reliably bring max level impact anymore? And I don't buy "oh they haven't built a good enough roster around him", similar rosters in the past got to the finals multiple times and made deep playoff runs. It wasn't all Jimmy, we had some good contributors all over. And it wasn't just a fluke. You don't fluke into that stuff multiple times. By definition that's not a fluke.

Jimmy just might not have it in him the same way anymore, and the Heat kinda see it. Jimmy doesn't want to accept it yet like most aging stars.

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Tons of strawman arguments in this post but I just came to say even if Jimmy pops off and we win the championship I would lean towards the FO not offering him the 4/$240M he wants. They’re just not going to do it.

I’m actually starting to get worried we’re going to botch this whole situation and lose him for nothing, or maybe 1 1st in a sign and trade, instead of maximizing his value this summer and getting several assets for him (like this FO has a bad habit of doing). We’re just delaying the inevitable at this point it seems

If Mia wins the chip and Jimmy performs as he has in recent playoff runs, which suggests he'd win Finals MVP, the team will cave in and pay him, there's no doubt in my mind.

[DayofMourning]

Cap smoothing and 10% increases starting in 25-26.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/bryantoporek/2024/05/30/the-nbas-new-tv-deals-are-poised-to-send-the-salary-cap-skyrocketing/

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Read on Twitter

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Tons of strawman arguments in this post but I just came to say even if Jimmy pops off and we win the championship I would lean towards the FO not offering him the 4/$240M he wants. They’re just not going to do it.

I’m actually starting to get worried we’re going to botch this whole situation and lose him for nothing, or maybe 1 1st in a sign and trade, instead of maximizing his value this summer and getting several assets for him (like this FO has a bad habit of doing). We’re just delaying the inevitable at this point it seems

If Mia wins the chip and Jimmy performs as he has in recent playoff runs, which suggests he'd win Finals MVP, the team will cave in and pay him, there's no doubt in my mind.

I don’t see it tbh. What if we’re bounced in 6 in the 2nd round or ECF and he’s playing great? They’re giving a 36 year old Jimmy 4/$240M? This is Patrick James Riley we’re talking about

[twix2500]

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Of course role players on the team can't handle the lead role on offense, they're role players. Jimmy is the one being paid 50 million a year, not them. This even includes Herro, I don't expect him to have the same impact as Jimmy because he isn't being paid like Jimmy is. If Jimmy wants to be paid like a max player, I expect consistent max impact. It doesn't even have to be all on offense, it could be defense, or even both.

When it comes to Bam, even if he doesn't have a crazy offensive game he ALWAYS brings max impact on defense. He holds the entire defense together by his own damn self. He does this along with putting up like 20,9, and 4 a game last playoffs. I don't have any issues with Bam, he was one of the lone bright spots against the Celtics.

Yes, "they're role players" indeed. And they (Bam and Herro) are getting max or close to max contracts. Perhaps the ire of the fanbase ought to be directed either at them or at the front office.

Heat are not using Herro as a role player, they are using him as a go-too player, the lead go-too player.

[3ammy3uck3ts]

Of course role players on the team can't handle the lead role on offense, they're role players. Jimmy is the one being paid 50 million a year, not them. This even includes Herro, I don't expect him to have the same impact as Jimmy because he isn't being paid like Jimmy is. If Jimmy wants to be paid like a max player, I expect consistent max impact. It doesn't even have to be all on offense, it could be defense, or even both.

When it comes to Bam, even if he doesn't have a crazy offensive game he ALWAYS brings max impact on defense. He holds the entire defense together by his own damn self. He does this along with putting up like 20,9, and 4 a game last playoffs. I don't have any issues with Bam, he was one of the lone bright spots against the Celtics.

Yes, "they're role players" indeed. And they (Bam and Herro) are getting max or close to max contracts. Perhaps the ire of the fanbase ought to be directed either at them or at the front office.

Heat are not using Herro as a role player, they are using him as a go-too player, the lead go-too player.

It’s one of this teams biggest flaws if not the biggest

[twix2500]

Tons of strawman arguments in this post but I just came to say even if Jimmy pops off and we win the championship I would lean towards the FO not offering him the 4/$240M he wants. They’re just not going to do it.

I’m actually starting to get worried we’re going to botch this whole situation and lose him for nothing, or maybe 1 1st in a sign and trade, instead of maximizing his value this summer and getting several assets for him (like this FO has a bad habit of doing). We’re just delaying the inevitable at this point it seems

If Mia wins the chip and Jimmy performs as he has in recent playoff runs, which suggests he'd win Finals MVP, the team will cave in and pay him, there's no doubt in my mind.

I don’t see it tbh. What if we’re bounced in 6 in the 2nd round or ECF and he’s playing great? They’re giving a 36 year old Jimmy 4/$240M? This is Patrick James Riley we’re talking about

Highly doubt the Heat are giving him 4 years regardless of his play.

[NightWatch]

Precious Achiuwa?

[wadenation305]

Jimmy hasn’t been challenged? He is balancing between running an upstart coffee company and leading g-leaguers to the finals. Andy is just mad he can’t do cool hair styles like Jimmy


Big face affogato from Van Leeuwen in NYC is my fav ice cream flavor

He hasn't been challenged regarding his work ethic before. He's usually seen as the crazy/hi intensity guy that'll tear people apart for not bring the same energy. But the heat have been noticing all the time he's been missing during the season, along with coasting when he does plays. They kept their mouth shut cause he would find a way to turn up when they needed it. He couldn't this time, so they're having a hard time tolerating it now. That's how I see it.

I wasn’t watching a ton of Chi games but isn’t it well known that Thib’s was running Jimmy and all of his guys in general into the ground?

And is it really a good strategy to demand that a mid thirties version of Jimmy be dialing up his intensity during the regular season instead of pacing himself for the playoffs?

Kinda speaks to the failures of the front office for not surrounding him with better players who are capable of generating more wins when giving the opportunity to be featured in the regular season and instead are forced to have to rely on Jimmy to bail out the roster.

That's the problem, when your top number one guy is going to be 36 years old, your second best , while a defensive beast, is not a true number 2 on offense. And your third guy us really a six man shooting guard that spo tries to pigeon hole into being a PG which he is not, while the rest of the guys are pretty much all undrafted guys. 30 year old Jimmy gets 4 years max money yesterday, 36 year old coasting big face Jimmy better start concentrating on his coffee brand.

[wadenation305]

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Of course role players on the team can't handle the lead role on offense, they're role players. Jimmy is the one being paid 50 million a year, not them. This even includes Herro, I don't expect him to have the same impact as Jimmy because he isn't being paid like Jimmy is. If Jimmy wants to be paid like a max player, I expect consistent max impact. It doesn't even have to be all on offense, it could be defense, or even both.

When it comes to Bam, even if he doesn't have a crazy offensive game he ALWAYS brings max impact on defense. He holds the entire defense together by his own damn self. He does this along with putting up like 20,9, and 4 a game last playoffs. I don't have any issues with Bam, he was one of the lone bright spots against the Celtics.

Yes, "they're role players" indeed. And they (Bam and Herro) are getting max or close to max contracts. Perhaps the ire of the fanbase ought to be directed either at them or at the front office.

Bam's defense and what he able to do on offense makes him a good third option, the problem is we don't have a second option and our first option is old

[lastb1ckman]

Jimmy's contract will be dictated by the results of this post season, in all likeliness.

For instance, if Mia gets into the playoffs and if he performs similarly to how he has in the past ie dropping 50 and 40 point games on the so called best perimeter defender in basketball in Holiday, or having multiple high scoring triple doubles in the finals, Mia would have no other recourse than to pay him whatever he wants.

This would be regardless of how his performs in the regular season even if he only averages around 21ppg on good efficiency and is a a stat stuffer across the board but simultaneously is pacing himself.

Regarding the rest of the roster, I wonder how the team would perform if Bam or Herro were featured in the main role in the playoffs. Well, we dont have to wonder because it just happened and it was a disaster. This past year aside, 2 post seasons ago when Mia got to the Finals, how well do you think the team would have done had Bam or Herro been casted the main guy with the most usage? Do you think either player is capable of being the focus of the opposing team's defense in a 7 game series, being able to withstand double teams, and being assigned by the other teams' best primary defenders? I have doubts whether they could hold their season averages for the entirely of the playoffs much less go nuclear and significantly increase them the way Jimmy has.

I cant be for certain who exactly you are referring to when you bought up 'role players' but I'm isolating just Bam and Herro here only because the other guys are completely replaceable. For the sake of argument though, the same scenario applies to all of them. If Vincent, Strus, Martin, Duncan, etc switched roles with Jimmy and were relied upon with his playoff usage rate, how well do you think the team would have performed in those playoff runs?

Lastly, if the role players are as capable as you suggest, the regular season ought to be the a testing lab for at least a first step provability of being more than just roles players. Why arent we really seeing Bam or Herro go nuclear in regular season games? Where are their 40 and 50 explosions that carry the team to difficult victories? Or their high scoring triple doubles? They certainly cant be relied upon to perform that way during the playoffs but how come they aren't really doing those things in the regular season when opposing teams arent really game planning against them and when Mia is trying to feature them ahead of Jimmy?

Of course role players on the team can't handle the lead role on offense, they're role players. Jimmy is the one being paid 50 million a year, not them. This even includes Herro, I don't expect him to have the same impact as Jimmy because he isn't being paid like Jimmy is. If Jimmy wants to be paid like a max player, I expect consistent max impact. It doesn't even have to be all on offense, it could be defense, or even both.

When it comes to Bam, even if he doesn't have a crazy offensive game he ALWAYS brings max impact on defense. He holds the entire defense together by his own damn self. He does this along with putting up like 20,9, and 4 a game last playoffs. I don't have any issues with Bam, he was one of the lone bright spots against the Celtics.

Yes, "they're role players" indeed. And they (Bam and Herro) are getting max or close to max contracts. Perhaps the ire of the fanbase ought to be directed either at them or at the front office.

There's levels to "max" contracts. For Jimmy and Herro, the difference is nearly 20 million a year. The difference between being paid like Cam Johnson and being paid Kevin Durant. And like I said, Bam at least brings it all the time on defense. I can't say that for Jimmy on offense or defense.

[AirP.]

If Mia wins the chip and Jimmy performs as he has in recent playoff runs, which suggests he'd win Finals MVP, the team will cave in and pay him, there's no doubt in my mind.

Cave in to pay a guy who plays like an MVP? That's nuts!

What I think has happened is that Riley has put a trainwreck in motion. He's asking a player who has prioritized winning over individual stats to... prioritize individual stats and that could have a ripple effect throughout the roster causing a lot of issues.

I think there's a chance Butler has a great season if he decides to coast less (there's a chance he gets hurt too) while the team doesn't have a good playoff run (less defense on the roster to compliment Butler's scoring) and for Miami making him prove it, he's going to make Miami prove it and not only asks for the max, asks for a NTC too.

It's quite possible, Butler for the next 3 years (deep into his 30s) may play at a level that Bam doesn't get to play with the rest of his time in Miami once Butler is gone. I think there's some sobering years coming for Miami.