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Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (Walker, last Ex-10 Player Waived)

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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#101 » by phincsfan » Tue Jul 16, 2024 3:37 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
Gant wrote:
darrendaye wrote:
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I agree, Keith.


When given a role, whether it's G league, summer league or the NBA, Queta reliably causes problems for the opposition.

Queta consistently was a positive in +/- last year when he was on the floor. Queta had very few fouls called on him when he was setting screens. Very productive and he will only get better. Not worried about him at all.


Also JT and JB loved playing with Rob and what he brought to the floor. I feel the same way about Queta. During the season I sensed that they wanted Queta on the floor more. IMO, they trusted him and hopefully the coaching staff can trust him more.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#102 » by BK_2020 » Tue Jul 16, 2024 3:40 pm

The Celtics outscored the opposition by 930 points last season. Even the worst on/off guys were consistently positive in +/- last year.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#103 » by Celts17Pride » Tue Jul 16, 2024 3:55 pm

BK_2020 wrote:The Celtics outscored the opposition by 930 points last season. Even the worst on/off guys were consistently positive in +/- last year.

Sounds like you are not worried at all also.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#104 » by BK_2020 » Tue Jul 16, 2024 3:57 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
BK_2020 wrote:The Celtics outscored the opposition by 930 points last season. Even the worst on/off guys were consistently positive in +/- last year.

Sounds like you are not worried at all also.

We'll be fine.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#105 » by Hal14 » Tue Jul 16, 2024 4:32 pm

Think we should give Watson that 15th roster spot.

1. tatum
2. brown
3 KP/White/Jrue

6 Al
7 Hauser/Pritchard

9 Tillman/Kornet

11 Springer/Queta

13 Scheierman/Watson

15 Walsh

Then for the last 2-way spot, we could give it to Ron Harper Jr. Or leave it open for now..then perhaps give it to Harper (or some other guy who's not yet signed with another team) at the end of SL.

Or let Harper compete for it in training camp..then give it to him (or some other guy who's not yet signed with another team) at the end of training camp..
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#106 » by Parliament10 » Wed Jul 17, 2024 4:01 pm

Hal14 wrote:Image

Using Hal's Chart.:

* I would cut Davison, from the Two-Way, before the end of Summer League.
* Can we put Watson on an Exhibit 10, until the end of Training Camp?
* Is it possible (while not probable) to Cut both Davison & Peterson, and put both on Exhibit-10's?

Thereby leaving all 3 x Two-Way spots Open, and allowing for more Camp competition.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#107 » by Hal14 » Wed Jul 17, 2024 4:23 pm

Parliament10 wrote:* Can we put Watson on an Exhibit 10, until the end of Training Camp?

I think that technically, it's possible. But that's not something that NBA teams actually do. If you use actual draft capital on a guy, like you literally *just* drafted them, you're going to sign them to a real contract (a standard roster spot or a 2-way), otherwise you wouldn't have drafted them.

These NBA teams spend a ton of time researching and evaluating potential draft picks. They wouldn't draft a guy and then just put them on a nothing contract like an exhibit 10.

Parliament10 wrote:* Can we put Watson on an Exhibit 10, until the end of Training Camp?
* Is it possible (while not probable) to Cut both Davison & Peterson, and put both on Exhibit-10's?

Idk, it might be possible. But again, it's just not something that NBA teams actually do.

That would really be jerking these guys around. Giving them a 2-way, then saying to them "nah, we're taking away the 2-way contract that we literally just signed you to (even though they've played pretty well so far in SL) and putting you on a worse contract to try and compete for a 2-way in training camp"

I don't think a team would do that.

Teams do sometimes waive a guy off their 2-way, since they're non-guaranteed contracts. But if they do waive them from their 2-way, then typically they are waiving them. Like, saying goodbye, good luck, sionara to them..so that player is no longer a part of the organization, like we did with Nathan Knight last season.

And typically, if a team does waive a guy off a 2-way, they don't do it until like December at the earliest (that's when we waived Knight last season). Because any earlier than that, and it's kind of silly, wouldn't make much sense..like the guy was good enough for you to sign him to a 2-way, for you to waive him off that 2-way, you gotta at least give him a chance..and if you are gonna waive him, then you would need a decent enough sample size of games of him playing bad to deserve to get waived..

Parliament10 wrote:Thereby leaving all 3 x Two-Way spots Open, and allowing for more Camp competition.

Typically, the only training camp competition we have is maybe 1 open standard roster spot and maybe 1 open 2-way spot. That's plenty of competition. Having more guys already signed heading into training camp probably means you have better players - since it's typically very fringe guys (who aren't very good) who are still looking for a contract when training camp begins..
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#108 » by ConstableGeneva » Wed Jul 17, 2024 10:41 pm

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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#109 » by Hal14 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 2:05 pm

We've got 2 open spots on the 21 man training camp roster. I figure that between House, Tillie and Ramsey, we pick 2 of those 3 guys to bring in to training camp.

But the fact that we still haven't filled that 15th spot on the standard roster tells me that *perhaps* Brad is exploring more of a veteran (perhaps Brissett or someone else like Lonnie Walker, Osman, Covington or McDermott?) to fill that spot..that would push Watson to a 2-way contract and leave us with just 1 training camp roster spot left (so only 1 out of Tillie/Ramsey/House gets it)
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#110 » by phincsfan » Fri Jul 19, 2024 2:15 pm

I'd like to see Brad do the unthinkable and have Watson, Rico and Peterson get spots 13, 14 and 15. Trust and development this season. The main core got paid (except for Sam) so the audition part is out. Lots of load management on the way towards #19.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#111 » by darrendaye » Fri Jul 19, 2024 2:32 pm

Hal14 wrote:We've got 2 open spots on the 21 man training camp roster. I figure that between House, Tillie and Ramsey, we pick 2 of those 3 guys to bring in to training camp.

But the fact that we still haven't filled that 15th spot on the standard roster tells me that *perhaps* Brad is exploring more of a veteran (perhaps Brissett or someone else like Lonnie Walker, Osman, Covington or McDermott?) to fill that spot..that would push Watson to a 2-way contract and leave us with just 1 training camp roster spot left (so only 1 out of Tillie/Ramsey/House gets it)


I'd advocate for them to pull the deal on Harper Jr. and bring all three of those guys in. Unless they are fully committed to keeping Davison, in which case I'd say Brad would want bulkier guys to round out the Maine roster.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#112 » by darrendaye » Fri Jul 19, 2024 2:36 pm

phincsfan wrote:I'd like to see Brad do the unthinkable and have Watson, Rico and Peterson get spots 13, 14 and 15. Trust and development this season. The main core got paid (except for Sam) so the audition part is out. Lots of load management on the way towards #19.


Unless something changed, the CBA still allows 2-way players to be elevated for 50 or so regular season NBA games. My preferred play is talk Tillie into accepting a affiliate contract to start the year with a wink-wink to sign him to a 2-way later in the year, if he proves he can hit his 3's at a high rate and can finally remain healthy, once they sign Watson to reg contract.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#113 » by cloverleaf » Fri Jul 19, 2024 3:26 pm

BK_2020 wrote:The Celtics outscored the opposition by 930 points last season. Even the worst on/off guys were consistently positive in +/- last year.


That's not actually so. E.g., out of 19 players, JB had a team worst -7.7 on-off last year: https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2024.html

(Ha ha--Davison was team best, with a +19.6 on/off.)
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#114 » by threrf23 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 5:05 pm

cloverleaf wrote:
BK_2020 wrote:The Celtics outscored the opposition by 930 points last season. Even the worst on/off guys were consistently positive in +/- last year.


That's not actually so. E.g., out of 19 players, JB had a team worst -7.7 on-off last year: https://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/BOS/2024.html

(Ha ha--Davison was team best, with a +19.6 on/off.)


His on/off rating was -7.7, but his "on" rating was +8.2

We were 7.7 points better (per 100 poss) while he was on the bench, but we were still really good while he was on the court.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#115 » by cl2117 » Sat Jul 20, 2024 12:03 am

Put Watson on a two-way. As good as he's been, it's too small a sample size to commit to him (especially given the financial implications). Let him work through his 50 games as a two-way guy and make a call on him mid-way through the season.

We definitely need another ball-handler on a two-way as emergency depth for the regular season. If we are down two of our three primary ball handlers (Holiday/ White/ Pritchard), you're going to want to be able to call up another guard. You wouldn't necessarily need them to play given how many other guys outside that trio can initiate the offense and bring the ball up, but still you'd want the insurance.

I'd be fine with Davison taking that role, but I'm not excited about it. I just don't think his game has evolved enough since he's been drafted. He's still young though and his familiarity with our system is an added bonus. I'm also fine with them cutting bait and rolling the dice on a new guard (probably not House).

Peterson seems to have the inside track towards the third two-way, but similar to Davison, I'm only luke warm. Happy to cut bait for a random dice throw with similar upside. If he can take his shooting up a notch and consistently hit on above 40% he could be worth a full roster spot. Historically though he's been borderline and I don't think the rest of his game gives you enough without elite shooting. Still I'd take him before anyone else on the SL roster or Jay Scrubb.

Assuming Watson, Davison and Peterson all take two-ways, I think you just leave the 15th spot open and let them compete for it. If they churn through their 50 games and earn a roster spot then great, if not we can pick off the scrap heap of whatever veteran talent is out there for a ring chase.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#116 » by Hal14 » Sat Jul 20, 2024 3:31 am

cl2117 wrote:Put Watson on a two-way. As good as he's been, it's too small a sample size to commit to him (especially given the financial implications). Let him work through his 50 games as a two-way guy and make a call on him mid-way through the season.

We definitely need another ball-handler on a two-way as emergency depth for the regular season. If we are down two of our three primary ball handlers (Holiday/ White/ Pritchard), you're going to want to be able to call up another guard. You wouldn't necessarily need them to play given how many other guys outside that trio can initiate the offense and bring the ball up, but still you'd want the insurance.

I'd be fine with Davison taking that role, but I'm not excited about it. I just don't think his game has evolved enough since he's been drafted. He's still young though and his familiarity with our system is an added bonus. I'm also fine with them cutting bait and rolling the dice on a new guard (probably not House).

Peterson seems to have the inside track towards the third two-way, but similar to Davison, I'm only luke warm. Happy to cut bait for a random dice throw with similar upside. If he can take his shooting up a notch and consistently hit on above 40% he could be worth a full roster spot. Historically though he's been borderline and I don't think the rest of his game gives you enough without elite shooting. Still I'd take him before anyone else on the SL roster or Jay Scrubb.

Assuming Watson, Davison and Peterson all take two-ways, I think you just leave the 15th spot open and let them compete for it. If they churn through their 50 games and earn a roster spot then great, if not we can pick off the scrap heap of whatever veteran talent is out there for a ring chase.

Yup. Seems like the most likely scenario. Especially since Brian Robb has hinted in 2 different articles in the past few days that Watson is gonna sign a 2-way.

I'm fine with it. Watson/JD/Peterson for 2-ways. Leave 15th roster spot open to start the season..fill it later if needed, either by converting Watson or signing (or trading for) a vet.

Try getting our other SL guys (House, Enaruna, Harper, Tillie, Ramsey) to be on our G league team..
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#117 » by Parliament10 » Sat Jul 20, 2024 4:44 am

Exhibit 10 players
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/06/salary-cap-tax-line-set-for-2024-25-nba-season.html
The maximum Exhibit 10 bonus is, as its name suggests, the highest possible bonus available to a player who signs an Exhibit 10 contract with an NBA team, gets cut, then spends at least 60 days with that club’s G League affiliate.

This amount ($77,500) is also the maximum two-way protection amount, which means a player who signs a two-way contract before the season can get up to $77.5K guaranteed upon signing.


Two-Way players
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/07/2024-25-nba-two-way-contract-tracker.html
Two-way players are eligible to be active for up to 50 of their team’s 82 regular season games. If a team isn’t carrying a full 15-man standard roster, its two-way players can only be active for a combined 90 games.
Players on two-way contracts will earn $578,577 in 2024/25, half of the rookie minimum.
Two-way contracts can’t be signed after March 4.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#118 » by brackdan70 » Mon Jul 22, 2024 12:46 pm

Parliament10 wrote:Exhibit 10 players
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/06/salary-cap-tax-line-set-for-2024-25-nba-season.html
The maximum Exhibit 10 bonus is, as its name suggests, the highest possible bonus available to a player who signs an Exhibit 10 contract with an NBA team, gets cut, then spends at least 60 days with that club’s G League affiliate.

This amount ($77,500) is also the maximum two-way protection amount, which means a player who signs a two-way contract before the season can get up to $77.5K guaranteed upon signing.


Two-Way players
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/07/2024-25-nba-two-way-contract-tracker.html
Two-way players are eligible to be active for up to 50 of their team’s 82 regular season games. If a team isn’t carrying a full 15-man standard roster, its two-way players can only be active for a combined 90 games.
Players on two-way contracts will earn $578,577 in 2024/25, half of the rookie minimum.
Two-way contracts can’t be signed after March 4.

Thanks. I didn’t know about that “combined total 90 games” clause for having an open roster spot. I don’t think it’s much of a bother this year…but I wonder if it did come into play last year with Queta?
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#119 » by ConstableGeneva » Mon Jul 22, 2024 12:49 pm

brackdan70 wrote:
Parliament10 wrote:Exhibit 10 players
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/06/salary-cap-tax-line-set-for-2024-25-nba-season.html
The maximum Exhibit 10 bonus is, as its name suggests, the highest possible bonus available to a player who signs an Exhibit 10 contract with an NBA team, gets cut, then spends at least 60 days with that club’s G League affiliate.

This amount ($77,500) is also the maximum two-way protection amount, which means a player who signs a two-way contract before the season can get up to $77.5K guaranteed upon signing.


Two-Way players
https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/07/2024-25-nba-two-way-contract-tracker.html
Two-way players are eligible to be active for up to 50 of their team’s 82 regular season games. If a team isn’t carrying a full 15-man standard roster, its two-way players can only be active for a combined 90 games.
Players on two-way contracts will earn $578,577 in 2024/25, half of the rookie minimum.
Two-way contracts can’t be signed after March 4.

Thanks. I didn’t know about that “combined total 90 games” clause for having an open roster spot. I don’t think it’s much of a bother this year…but I wonder if it did come into play last year with Queta?

Not even close. Less than 40 games total between Queta, JD, and Drew.
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Re: Off-season Roster Update, 2024-25 – (21-Man Limit) 

Post#120 » by brackdan70 » Mon Jul 22, 2024 1:06 pm

ConstableGeneva wrote:
brackdan70 wrote:

Thanks. I didn’t know about that “combined total 90 games” clause for having an open roster spot. I don’t think it’s much of a bother this year…but I wonder if it did come into play last year with Queta?

Not even close. Less than 40 games total between Queta, JD, and Drew.

I was thinking Queta was active for many of the games he didn’t play? But yeah on further review it looks like even then not close.
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