An early summer 2024 thread

[KL2]

For those of you hoping for a PF …

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[Roscoe Sheed]

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Clippers are such a terrible run franchise. Always giving up draft picks because they dont know how to budget. We had to give up a second round pick to just get Westbrook off the books. We sign Westbrook only to give up on him to get Harden all because of PG. PG destroyed this franchise and this GM is a clown. We got sucked into taking PJs untradeable contract to get Harden. We need a change.

Name the last player we developed and sent out for draft picks. Terrance Mann is only player any team showed interest in.

Almost the right question, which is name anyone the Clippers drafted besides Mann who turned out to be worth a damn here, there, or anywhere.

True, the picks have been almost all 25 or higher since Blake but jeez, not a whiff of an actual NBA player.

SGA of course- but they sadly traded him

[esqtvd]

For those of you hoping for a PF …

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I don't see how you can trot out 3 non-scorers in Mann, Zubac and DJJ. KPJ needs to crack the starting 5, probably for Mann.

Word up: Kobe's shooting 22% from 3 in the SL, struggling just as he did in the GL [33%] and in 400 minutes with the big club [29%]. It looks like last year's SL when he shot the lights out was a fluke. As an average-to-below average rebounder and defender, it doesn't look like a fit.

[Roscoe Sheed]

For those of you hoping for a PF …

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with Theis and Plumlee gone, maybe they can convince Blake to come out of retirement for the vet minimum. I think he could still be an effective NBA player for 10-15 minutes a game

[esqtvd]

For those of you hoping for a PF …

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with Theis and Plumlee gone, maybe they can convince Blake to come out of retirement for the vet minimum. I think he could still be an effective NBA player for 10-15 minutes a game

And statistically was, even last year, although most of his minutes were at center. At least he was better than Kobe [and PJ of course], in about the same number of minutes.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/griffbl01.html

That's how bad things are. The FO has really screwed the pooch again on mismatching the roster, so far intending to run 6'5" PFs out there. If Kawhi misses a game, Coffey and 85-year-old Nico is all we've got above 6'6". No wonder they're touting Kobe, who's yet to prove he belongs out there at all.

[Wammy Giveaway]

Clippers are such a terrible run franchise. Always giving up draft picks because they dont know how to budget. We had to give up a second round pick to just get Westbrook off the books. We sign Westbrook only to give up on him to get Harden all because of PG. PG destroyed this franchise and this GM is a clown. We got sucked into taking PJs untradeable contract to get Harden. We need a change.

Name the last player we developed and sent out for draft picks. Terrance Mann is only player any team showed interest in.

Almost the right question, which is name anyone the Clippers drafted besides Mann who turned out to be worth a damn here, there, or anywhere.

True, the picks have been almost all 25 or higher since Blake but jeez, not a whiff of an actual NBA player.

Here is the complete list of draft picks the Clippers have given away since the Shai Gilgeous-Alexander trade:

2019-20: 2021 MIA 1st round pick (Tre Mann), 2022 OWN 1st round pick (Jalen Williams), 2023 MIA 1st round pick (Jaime Jaquez Jr.), 2024 OWN 1st round pick (Dillon Jones), 2025 OWN 1st round pick (TBC), 2025 OWN 1st round pick (TBC), 2026 OWN 1st round pick (TBC), 2020 OWN 1st round pick (Udoka Azubuike); 2021 OWN 1st round pick (TBC); 2021 DET 2nd round pick (Jeremiah Robinson-Earl)
(Nine 1sts, One 2nd, 10 total)

2020-21: 2023 DET 2nd round pick (James Nnaji), 2022 ATL 2nd round pick (TBC), 2023 POR 2nd round pick (Julian Philips), 2027 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC)
(Four 2nds, 4 total)

2021-22: 2024 DET 2nd round pick (Jonathan Mogbo), 2026 DET 2nd round pick (TBC), 2022 SAC 2nd round pick (TBC), 2025 DET 2nd round pick (TBC)
(Four 2nds, 4 total)

2022-23: 2028 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC), 2024 OWN 2nd round pick (Bronny James(!)), 2025 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC)
(Three 2nds, 3 total)

2023-24: 2026 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC), 2027 MEM 2nd round pick (TBC), 2024 OWN 2nd round pick (Juan Nunez), 2028 OWN 1st round pick, 2029 OWN 1st round pick, 2029 OWN 2nd round pick, 2027 OWN 1st round pick (TBC)
(Three 1sts, Four 2nds, 7 total)

1st Picks Losts: Twelve (12)
2nd Picks Losts: Fifteen (15)
All TOGETHER: Twenty-seven (27)

Magical things always happen when you work with Clippers. Most of them will end up being Hall Of Famers, Role Players and Key Contributors. I think Bronny James will be the most shocking revelation of them all given the Clipper's losing history.

[madmaxmedia]

The pick swap doesn’t bother me. A few other trades to get done to dump a contact included 2 picks. I feel like we lucked out here. No idea how much cash was involved but not my concern either.

The one I’ve been worried about all along is Tucker.

The 2nd round pick swap was likely worth it to get RWB's contract off the books, though I don't know exactly where we are now with payroll after this move.

Do we even know when the swap is, or what is actually being swapped on Utah's side? They are rebuilding so I am guessing it's a swap with a pick they received from another team.

[esqtvd]

Clippers are such a terrible run franchise. Always giving up draft picks because they dont know how to budget. We had to give up a second round pick to just get Westbrook off the books. We sign Westbrook only to give up on him to get Harden all because of PG. PG destroyed this franchise and this GM is a clown. We got sucked into taking PJs untradeable contract to get Harden. We need a change.

Name the last player we developed and sent out for draft picks. Terrance Mann is only player any team showed interest in.

Almost the right question, which is name anyone the Clippers drafted besides Mann who turned out to be worth a damn here, there, or anywhere.

True, the picks have been almost all 25 or higher since Blake but jeez, not a whiff of an actual NBA player.

Here is the complete list of draft picks the Clippers have given away since the Shai Gilgeous-Alexander trade:

2019-20: 2021 MIA 1st round pick (Tre Mann), 2022 OWN 1st round pick (Jalen Williams), 2023 MIA 1st round pick (Jaime Jaquez Jr.), 2024 OWN 1st round pick (Dillon Jones), 2025 OWN 1st round pick (TBC), 2025 OWN 1st round pick (TBC), 2026 OWN 1st round pick (TBC), 2020 OWN 1st round pick (Udoka Azubuike); 2021 OWN 1st round pick (TBC); 2021 DET 2nd round pick (Jeremiah Robinson-Earl)
(Nine 1sts, One 2nd, 10 total)

2020-21: 2023 DET 2nd round pick (James Nnaji), 2022 ATL 2nd round pick (TBC), 2023 POR 2nd round pick (Julian Philips), 2027 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC)
(Four 2nds, 4 total)

2021-22: 2024 DET 2nd round pick (Jonathan Mogbo), 2026 DET 2nd round pick (TBC), 2022 SAC 2nd round pick (TBC), 2025 DET 2nd round pick (TBC)
(Four 2nds, 4 total)

2022-23: 2028 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC), 2024 OWN 2nd round pick (Bronny James(!)), 2025 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC)
(Three 2nds, 3 total)

2023-24: 2026 OWN 2nd round pick (TBC), 2027 MEM 2nd round pick (TBC), 2024 OWN 2nd round pick (Juan Nunez), 2028 OWN 1st round pick, 2029 OWN 1st round pick, 2029 OWN 2nd round pick, 2027 OWN 1st round pick (TBC)
(Three 1sts, Four 2nds, 7 total)

1st Picks Losts: Twelve (12)
2nd Picks Losts: Fifteen (15)
All TOGETHER: Twenty-seven (27)

Magical things always happen when you work with Clippers. Most of them will end up being Hall Of Famers, Role Players and Key Contributors. I think Bronny James will be the most shocking revelation of them all given the Clipper's losing history.

You lumped in the picks in the PG trade--which also netted Kawhi Leonard, a Hall of Famer. Water under the bridge. 213 failed because of injuries, which even if somewhat predictable, not to this degree. Regardless, it was a gamble that lost, but that happens.

A more precise analysis is needed: What we got, and also if the receiving team traded those picks away themselves. Of the OKC/PG trade picks, Jalen Williams looks like the real thing, but Tre Mann's star is already fading and he was dumped in the Gordon Hayward trade, and the Jacquez pick was dealt by OKC to MIA in a massive draft-pick swap [no players] that makes the eyes glaze over. He looks like a nice player but probably not a star.


My specific point is that among the draft picks the Clippers DID keep [or trade for on draft night, like Kabengele and Keon Johnson, Jawun? Sindarius?] none except Mann developed into anything playable here OR elsewhere. [Except maybe Reggie Bullock, 5 years and 4 teams later lol. Hardly a tragedy.]

[og15]

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Clippers are such a terrible run franchise. Always giving up draft picks because they dont know how to budget. We had to give up a second round pick to just get Westbrook off the books. We sign Westbrook only to give up on him to get Harden all because of PG. PG destroyed this franchise and this GM is a clown. We got sucked into taking PJs untradeable contract to get Harden. We need a change.

Name the last player we developed and sent out for draft picks. Terrance Mann is only player any team showed interest in.

a second round pick swap, with a team like Utah, not sure the details but this seems like one which is unlikely to actually get swapped is not really the place to go on a rant about the team.

The Warriors weren't offering even half that much for PG. Not sure how the people who think he's still an asset with trade value can explain this without admitting they were wrong.

No one thought we were getting some huge haul, but come on- half of that would still be a significant package. The problem for us was going into the second apron in any trade, which significantly reduces the net value of such a trade for us.

A Kuminga package would have made the second apron worthwile. But according to the report, GSW does not want to part with Kuminga- even in a trade for Markannen.

Right. And the salary situations are completely different. The reason keeping PG would have put us (well) into the second apron was because he opted out and was a UFA. Even if he had exercised his player option, he was a $45 million plus player. Compare that to Markkanen, who is signed for $18 million this year. GSW doesn’t have to offer anything like the same amount of salaries and can keep their cap lower. They're forced to focus more on picks rather than players.

Yea, pretty different situations there, always have to take into account the contexts of these things and add some cap and salary considerations to analyze a lot of this stuff rightly.

[Bobbymcgee]

Any word on PJ Tucker? Are the Clippers going to give him another chance or are they still planning to get rid of him?

[Ballings7]

For those of you hoping for a PF …

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Looking like a glorified transition season.. but still have some faith.

Will have to see how things are in pre-season there, in the least. DJJ is a SF primarily, and a PF situationally.

Team really needs a decent player with some PF-esque overall size, to help out Kawhi up front. At this point in the respect of the former, wouldn't mind Batum or Kobe Brown being thrown in there.

[donemilio21]

I was surprised we signed Kris Dunn to a 3 year contract. I expected one maybe two years.

Apparently you can't do an S&T for less than 3 years according to CBA, so we tacked the 3rd year to the contract but made a TO.
Only have Kawhi, DJJ and Christie on guaranteed deals beyond 2026.

[madmaxmedia]

I was surprised we signed Kris Dunn to a 3 year contract. I expected one maybe two years.

Apparently you can't do an S&T for less than 3 years according to CBA, so we tacked the 3rd year to the contract but made a TO.
Only have Kawhi, DJJ and Christie on guaranteed deals beyond 2026.

The 3rd year is actually a team option, so basically 2 years if we only want that. I don't think there is any guaranteed money at all for the 3rd year.

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/player/_/id/20210/kris-dunn

[wakelaunch1]

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Clippers are such a terrible run franchise. Always giving up draft picks because they dont know how to budget. We had to give up a second round pick to just get Westbrook off the books. We sign Westbrook only to give up on him to get Harden all because of PG. PG destroyed this franchise and this GM is a clown. We got sucked into taking PJs untradeable contract to get Harden. We need a change.

Name the last player we developed and sent out for draft picks. Terrance Mann is only player any team showed interest in.

a second round pick swap, with a team like Utah, not sure the details but this seems like one which is unlikely to actually get swapped is not really the place to go on a rant about the team.

No one thought we were getting some huge haul, but come on- half of that would still be a significant package. The problem for us was going into the second apron in any trade, which significantly reduces the net value of such a trade for us.

A Kuminga package would have made the second apron worthwile. But according to the report, GSW does not want o part with Kuminga- even in a trade for Markannen.

Right. And the salary situations are completely different. The reason keeping PG would have put us (well) into the second apron was because he opted out and was a UFA. Even if he had exercised his player option, he was a $45 million plus player. Compare that to Markkanen, who is signed for $18 million this year. GSW doesn’t have to offer anything like the same amount of salaries and can keep their cap lower. They're forced to focus more on picks rather than players.

Yea, pretty different situations there, always have to take into account the contexts of these things and add some cap and salary considerations to analyze a lot of this stuff rightly.

they keep signing people that nobody wants and having to give up picks of their stupidity along with having players nobody wants unless they just want to dump contracts. Its a foolish front office. how many people outside of Kawhi, are teams clamboring from the Clippers? And Kawhi is one injury away from pretty much being worthless. We like the players because they are Clippers but do other teams want them?

Dunn is ok but man did we over pay for him. I barely knew he was in the NBA and he played on a losing team. and we doubled his salary with 3 years. Who here is excited to have Kris Dunn? 5 pts per game on the Utah Jazz. We are going to have to pay to get off his contract, i can almost guarantee you.

We still have PJ tucker too, who is washed.

[esqtvd]

I love Russ. Of all the Clippers in Clippers history he's the one I probably would most trust to get my back personally and professionally. The guy never quits, never whines, never alibis, never backstabs. And in his brief time with the Clippers--like so very few in our history--came to play every night.

PJ whined. Bones whined [but at least in private]. Russ got demoted to the point of humiliation and never a peep. I admire this guy totally.

But as a musician I have to admit that when somebody's the lead singer, lead guitarist, lead songwriter, and bandleader, there isn't a lot of room for the other guys to thrive. At least in the Beatles, John needed Paul and vice-versa, and George was at least the lead guitarist. [And Ringo was maybe the best drummer of his generation. True story.]

When you're averaging a triple-double, there's just not much space to grow or air left in the room. I don't think there are a ton of people lining up to play with Luka either. Neither one is selfish, but while they're being the best they can be, there's no area for you to be the best YOU can be. And when they're not being the best THEY can be, they're really not that great at making you the best YOU can be.

Anyway, this is kind of a Wammy Giveaway speech, but all I want to say is I love and respect Russ and wish him well. He leaves here even, and then some.

[KL2]

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The 2nd round pick swap was likely worth it to get RWB's contract off the books, though I don't know exactly where we are now with payroll after this move.

Do we even know when the swap is, or what is actually being swapped on Utah's side? They are rebuilding so I am guessing it's a swap with a pick they received from another team.

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[KL2]

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[nickhx2]

yay cap space so delicious yum yum

[KingCrimzzon]

I love Russ. Of all the Clippers in Clippers history he's the one I probably would most trust to get my back personally and professionally. The guy never quits, never whines, never alibis, never backstabs. And in his brief time with the Clippers--like so very few in our history--came to play every night.

PJ whined. Bones whined [but at least in private]. Russ got demoted to the point of humiliation and never a peep. I admire this guy totally.

But as a musician I have to admit that when somebody's the lead singer, lead guitarist, lead songwriter, and bandleader, there isn't a lot of room for the other guys to thrive. At least in the Beatles, John needed Paul and vice-versa, and George was at least the lead guitarist. [And Ringo was maybe the best drummer of his generation. True story.]

When you're averaging a triple-double, there's just not much space to grow or air left in the room. I don't think there are a ton of people lining up to play with Luka either. Neither one is selfish, but while they're being the best they can be, there's no area for you to be the best YOU can be. And when they're not being the best THEY can be, they're really not that great at making you the best YOU can be.

Anyway, this is kind of a Wammy Giveaway speech, but all I want to say is I love and respect Russ and wish him well. He leaves here even, and then some.

I completely agree with the points here. Russ is a good guy and gave his heart and soul every time, for better or worse. I kind of feel like they are shipping him because of his tustle with one of the Mavs during the playoffs. Ala Pat Bev style. Personally, I thought he was a brightspot on the team and provided much needed energy and leadership off the bench. It will be hard to reproduce this with the current squad, but hope I'm wrong. As far as the making others better bit goes, I think Kawhi is also one of those players that is amazing and doesn't lead. Just plays awesome by example that almost nobody can match.

[og15]

Clippers are such a terrible run franchise. Always giving up draft picks because they dont know how to budget. We had to give up a second round pick to just get Westbrook off the books. We sign Westbrook only to give up on him to get Harden all because of PG. PG destroyed this franchise and this GM is a clown. We got sucked into taking PJs untradeable contract to get Harden. We need a change.

Name the last player we developed and sent out for draft picks. Terrance Mann is only player any team showed interest in.

a second round pick swap, with a team like Utah, not sure the details but this seems like one which is unlikely to actually get swapped is not really the place to go on a rant about the team.

Right. And the salary situations are completely different. The reason keeping PG would have put us (well) into the second apron was because he opted out and was a UFA. Even if he had exercised his player option, he was a $45 million plus player. Compare that to Markkanen, who is signed for $18 million this year. GSW doesn’t have to offer anything like the same amount of salaries and can keep their cap lower. They're forced to focus more on picks rather than players.

Yea, pretty different situations there, always have to take into account the contexts of these things and add some cap and salary considerations to analyze a lot of this stuff rightly.

they keep signing people that nobody wants and having to give up picks of their stupidity along with having players nobody wants unless they just want to dump contracts. Its a foolish front office. how many people outside of Kawhi, are teams clamboring from the Clippers? And Kawhi is one injury away from pretty much being worthless. We like the players because they are Clippers but do other teams want them?

Dunn is ok but man did we over pay for him. I barely knew he was in the NBA and he played on a losing team. and we doubled his salary with 3 years. Who here is excited to have Kris Dunn? 5 pts per game on the Utah Jazz. We are going to have to pay to get off his contract, i can almost guarantee you.

We still have PJ tucker too, who is washed.

Without knowing your understanding of the cap and CBA or who you were expecting, it's hard to comment back.

Dunn got $5.7 million a year with a non guaranteed 3rd year. His minimum this year with it being his 9th season would have been $3 million since minimum salaries increase by years of experience. So he's making barely more than his minimum.

Clippers don't really have the resources to just get whatever "somebody" you might be thinking of. That's why Adam Silver recently said he's happy about the results of the CBA. Restricting how much teams can ultimately spend and their flexibility to do so was the point.

The 2030 swap could give the Clippers a lower 2nd round pick in 2030 or it might not. The benefit of a swap is that you still get a pick regardless, you don't lose the pick, and a second round swap is not nearly as critical. Of course a 2nd round swap could be really painful if you go from 31st to 60th, or any huge change like that, but that's based on you being a bottom 10 team and the swap team being a top 10 team.