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Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center

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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1881 » by KnixinSix » Fri Jul 19, 2024 5:59 pm

sol537 wrote:
SelbyCobra wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
While I agree mostly I think that would also be a really big risk for the Knicks. You can just look at this like a one year window...we didn't make the Mikal trade to have 1 year to build this.

The concern is that if you go into the year with no extension done with Randle...you certainly open yourself up to the possibility of losing him for nothing...which the Knicks absolutely can't do since you can't replace him since we are a team operating over the cap.

So they need to have some contingency plan built in if no extension with Randle happens and then he likely opts out of his contract. At that point it could be a free for all. All it would take is one team giving him the max the Knicks don't want to do (say like the rockets) and then what do we do...he is an unrestricted FA at that point and would control where he wants to go.

We can't be put in a situation like Clippers were with PG13 where they didn't want to give him a max deal and tried to give him less and then he got fed up and left for another team and the Clippers were left with nothing. That can't happen.

I get your point...I'm sure ideally the knicks want to run this unit fully healthy...but they can't look at this year as a silo...Aller and company are way too smart to leave that big variable sitting over our heads all year.


Yeah, I can see not trading Randle this year to "make one run with everyone" as a logical pathway, but I feel like the other really logical - and more importantly long-view - option out there is moving Randle for younger, lesser pieces that have a chance to grow within the championship window it appears they've opened up this offseason. As you said, their whole approach has been longterm, sustained success.

If they really do not have information that Julius will sign a contract on their terms, the option of running it back with everyone at the risk of losing a valuable, but questionable, asset that could be mitigated by a preseason trade feels much more Cashman's Yankees than it does Leon's Knicks. This FO has been meticulous with their approach and roster building, so I can't see them opening themselves up to an enormous amount of asset risk for the sake of one season. But what do I know - I'm greatly enjoying sitting back and letting Leon/Wes/Brock cook.

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Houston could be that partner...

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Rokas, and the WAS 1st...


The rough parameters of this trade seem interesting to me but Randle is a 25/10/5 guy and 3 time All Star. I think his value should be a bit higher in a trade. Houston has more future cap flexibility and can pay him the bag too.

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Duane Washington, and a 2nd RP.

Do folks here like Jabari Smiths upside?
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1882 » by knicksstuff » Fri Jul 19, 2024 6:19 pm

Any Juluis randle trade that doesn't bring back another shot creator is pointless. We cant do that to Brunson and expect him to keep up that level of play. He's a much more efficient player when he has another player that draws the defense to them.

Also Ayton is one of the least KNicksy type players in the league can we please stop mentioning him. Can you imagine him telling Thibs he couldn't make it to a game because there's a sheet of Ice in his way
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1883 » by Guano » Fri Jul 19, 2024 6:34 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:Can we scoop up fultz for the low. last year he was pretty good. i dont know what happened this past season though


well well well look what we have here - melo advocating for another scrub
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1884 » by louisorr » Fri Jul 19, 2024 6:40 pm

who that 6'6 Dukie that was married to Candace Parker. He played center for us at one time and he's prolly under 40 yo still. maybe he's available?
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1885 » by Wildcat » Fri Jul 19, 2024 6:41 pm

KnixinSix wrote:
sol537 wrote:
SelbyCobra wrote:
Yeah, I can see not trading Randle this year to "make one run with everyone" as a logical pathway, but I feel like the other really logical - and more importantly long-view - option out there is moving Randle for younger, lesser pieces that have a chance to grow within the championship window it appears they've opened up this offseason. As you said, their whole approach has been longterm, sustained success.

If they really do not have information that Julius will sign a contract on their terms, the option of running it back with everyone at the risk of losing a valuable, but questionable, asset that could be mitigated by a preseason trade feels much more Cashman's Yankees than it does Leon's Knicks. This FO has been meticulous with their approach and roster building, so I can't see them opening themselves up to an enormous amount of asset risk for the sake of one season. But what do I know - I'm greatly enjoying sitting back and letting Leon/Wes/Brock cook.

Image


Houston could be that partner...

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Rokas, and the WAS 1st...


The rough parameters of this trade seem interesting to me but Randle is a 25/10/5 guy and 3 time All Star. I think his value should be a bit higher in a trade. Houston has more future cap flexibility and can pay him the bag too.

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Duane Washington, and a 2nd RP.

Do folks here like Jabari Smiths upside?


Smith is fine on a team that's rebuilding. Knicks are contenders today. This trade has them taking a step back.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1886 » by SelbyCobra » Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:20 pm

louisorr wrote:who that 6'6 Dukie that was married to Candace Parker. He played center for us at one time and he's prolly under 40 yo still. maybe he's available?


Sheldon Williams. Currently 40 years old.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1887 » by SelbyCobra » Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:27 pm

Wildcat wrote:
KnixinSix wrote:
sol537 wrote:
Houston could be that partner...

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Rokas, and the WAS 1st...


The rough parameters of this trade seem interesting to me but Randle is a 25/10/5 guy and 3 time All Star. I think his value should be a bit higher in a trade. Houston has more future cap flexibility and can pay him the bag too.

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Duane Washington, and a 2nd RP.

Do folks here like Jabari Smiths upside?


Smith is fine on a team that's rebuilding. Knicks are contenders today. This trade has them taking a step back.


Yes, but the point of a trade like that is big picture asset management, not maximizing every moment of the upcoming season.

If they know Randle's needs on his next contract exceed what they're willing to offer, then the best way to manage him as an asset is to get a return that can pay dividends well into the future, beyond this upcoming season. Instead of accepting one year of Julius Randle and then nothing more, you reset the asset's timeline and give yourself a chance at growing even more production for the future, with the risk being the loss of Randle this year and the potential of the trade return to not develop.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1888 » by dakomish23 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:33 pm

I'm not advocating for it, but if all the forwards leads to a crunch and they want to just move OG to PF full time, then I think MIA might listen on offers to Bam. 24-25 he's at $34,848,340 so it would be Randle & filler.

His extension kicks in 26-27 for the 50s. But this is about the now. IDK of the top of my head what's left from our own picks after the Mikal deal. But expect to pay just as much if not more.

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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1889 » by Clyde_Style » Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:36 pm

Leon is in stealth mode again while the world speculates which big man the Knicks will go after.

The fact that no one is mentioning Jorts gives me confidence the Knicks will indeed secure his services.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1890 » by DaGawd » Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:40 pm

:roll:
dakomish23 wrote:I'm not advocating for it, but if all the forwards leads to a crunch and they want to just move OG to PF full time, then I think MIA might listen on offers to Bam. 24-25 he's at $34,848,340 so it would be Randle & filler.

His extension kicks in 26-27 for the 50s. But this is about the now. IDK of the top of my head what's left from our own picks after the Mikal deal. But expect to pay just as much if not more.

Brunson Payne
DDV Deuce
Mikal Hart
OG
Bam Mitch

pat riley would never ever fkin dare :lol:
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1891 » by MrDollarBills » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:06 pm

Alan Hahn said that Brook Lopez is in play?
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1892 » by Kampuchea » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:22 pm

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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1893 » by spree8 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:23 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:Alan Hahn said that Brook Lopez is in play?



I wonder how. It’d have to be an Achiuwa s&t because we don’t have the salary for it.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1894 » by KnixinSix » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:24 pm

SelbyCobra wrote:
Wildcat wrote:
KnixinSix wrote:
The rough parameters of this trade seem interesting to me but Randle is a 25/10/5 guy and 3 time All Star. I think his value should be a bit higher in a trade. Houston has more future cap flexibility and can pay him the bag too.

Jabari Smith, Eason, Adams for Randle, rights to Duane Washington, and a 2nd RP.

Do folks here like Jabari Smiths upside?


Smith is fine on a team that's rebuilding. Knicks are contenders today. This trade has them taking a step back.


Yes, but the point of a trade like that is big picture asset management, not maximizing every moment of the upcoming season.

If they know Randle's needs on his next contract exceed what they're willing to offer, then the best way to manage him as an asset is to get a return that can pay dividends well into the future, beyond this upcoming season. Instead of accepting one year of Julius Randle and then nothing more, you reset the asset's timeline and give yourself a chance at growing even more production for the future, with the risk being the loss of Randle this year and the potential of the trade return to not develop.


Obviously would love Sengun but I think back to last year when we had OG and lost Randle in that Miami game. When the team was back near fully healthy they were pretty damn good still without Randle. Point being, add Bridges and Jabari Smith to that mix even without Randle that team could still compete for a championship . Also in the long term it would be in much better shape than losing Randle next offseason.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1895 » by Guano » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:25 pm

Kampuchea wrote:
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:lol:
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1896 » by moocow007 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:30 pm

MrDollarBills wrote:Alan Hahn said that Brook Lopez is in play?


Maybe he's thinking of Robin Lopez?

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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1897 » by Wildcat » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:34 pm

KnixinSix wrote:
SelbyCobra wrote:
Wildcat wrote:
Smith is fine on a team that's rebuilding. Knicks are contenders today. This trade has them taking a step back.


Yes, but the point of a trade like that is big picture asset management, not maximizing every moment of the upcoming season.

If they know Randle's needs on his next contract exceed what they're willing to offer, then the best way to manage him as an asset is to get a return that can pay dividends well into the future, beyond this upcoming season. Instead of accepting one year of Julius Randle and then nothing more, you reset the asset's timeline and give yourself a chance at growing even more production for the future, with the risk being the loss of Randle this year and the potential of the trade return to not develop.


Obviously would love Sengun but I think back to last year when we had OG and lost Randle in that Miami game. When the team was back near fully healthy they were pretty damn good still without Randle. Point being, add Bridges and Jabari Smith to that mix even without Randle that team could still compete for a championship . Also in the long term it would be in much better shape than losing Randle next offseason.


I absolutely promise you if it comes down to it and both NYK and Randle decide to part ways, it's going to be via sign and trade. I absolutely do not agree that Smith keeps this team as a contender.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1898 » by Signature NYK » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:37 pm

Deuce and Precious in S&T for Vucevic.

Vooch can replicate a lot of what iHart did offensively and more as he can put the ball on the floor and drive himself and knock down open 3s. Has the push floater and a more refined post game. Can finish around the rim with both hands. He's always been a good rebounder. He can also pass pretty well although sometimes looks for his own shot too much. Maybe Thibs can unlock him as a secondary offensive hub in the high post.

He's definitely not the rim protector iHart was and has slow feet but in this scenario we'd still have Mitch for true Rim protection lineups.

Our offense would be immaculate but banking on our Wings in Mikal and OG to really handle business defensively and or for Randle to lock in on that side of the ball..

9 Man Rotation (Minutes Allocation)

Vooch (28) /Mitch (20
Randle (33)/OG (15)
OG (17)/Hart (26)/ Mikal (5)
Mikal (28)/Donte (20)
Brunson (33) /Payne (10) / Donte (5)

That lineup features 5 true threats to score and capable outside shooting from 1 - 5
Space for Randle and Brunson to operate


Chicago gets a young cost controlled asset that can pair with and ball dominate wing or lead guard
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1899 » by Juco24 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:45 pm

Signature NYK wrote:Deuce and Precious in S&T for Vucevic.

Vooch can replicate a lot of what iHart did offensively and more as he can put the ball on the floor and drive himself and knock down open 3s. Has the push floater and a more refined post game. Can finish around the rim with both hands. He's always been a good rebounder. He can also pass pretty well although sometimes looks for his own shot too much. Maybe Thibs can unlock him as a secondary offensive hub in the high post.

He's definitely not the rim protector iHart was and has slow feet but in this scenario we'd still have Mitch for true Rim protection lineups.

Our offense would be immaculate but banking on our Wings in Mikal and OG to really handle business defensively and or for Randle to lock in on that side of the ball..

9 Man Rotation (Minutes Allocation)
Vooch (28) /Mitch (20
Randle (33)/OG (15)
OG (17)/Hart (26)/ Mikal (5)
Mikal (28)/Donte (20)
Brunson (33) /Payne (10) / Donte (5)

That lineup features 5 true threats to score and capable outside shooting from 1 - 5
Space for Randle and Brunson to operate


Chicago gets a young cost controlled asset that can pair with and ball dominate wing or lead guard


Don't know if Chicago accepts THAT deal but I think Vooch is on the trade block. He's the guy I'd prefer tbh. Can't play a lick of defense but with our perimeter defenders, maybe they could make up for him.
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Re: Trades and Transactions thread cont - we still need a center 

Post#1900 » by moocow007 » Fri Jul 19, 2024 8:46 pm

A google of 'best center free agents in euroleague' netted this list (as of about a month ago):

Serge Ibaka - Age: 34, Last season: 28 games, 12.6 points (48% 3pts), 6.8 rebounds, 1.2 assists, 1.2 blocks



Johnathan Motley - Age: 29, Last season: 36 games, 11.2 points, 4.2 rebounds, 1.1 assists



Frank Kaminsky - Age: 31, Last season: 39 games, 8.9 points, 3.4 rebounds, 1.6 assists



Youssoupha (no not Tacko) Fall - Age: 29, Last season: 31 games, 8.8 points, 6.6 rebounds



Tibor Pleiss - Age: 34, Last season: 23 games, 7.8 points (44% 3pts), 3.6 rebounds



Daniel Oturu - Age: 24, Last season: 22 games, 7.4 points, 3.9 rebounds



Maik Kotsar - Age: 27, Last season: 39 games, 5.6 points, 3.3 rebounds, 1.2 assists

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