Scase wrote:ATLTimekeeper wrote:CPT wrote:Without reading much of the thread, this was the comparison I was thinking of making. It's not perfect, but I think in terms of strengths, weaknesses, style, overall impact, etc, it's pretty close. I wonder what other people think of it.
From there, two things can be true, even if they contradict each other a bit.
1. I would be absolutely delighted if RJ becomes DeRozan. That's an amazing outcome for any player, let alone one we picked up as filler (arguably a cost) in a trade where we didn't have much leverage.
2. You do not want to lock yourself into a core building around DeMar DeRozan. When it's actually time to win, you know you will have to move off him.
Even if the on-court comparison isn't perfect, it's a pretty good representation of how I feel about RJ, and why I probably lean more negative at times in discussions about his future, role, upside, etc.
Re 2. Why not? That's exactly what we did before. Neither RJ, IQ or Barnes have shown they are on track to be championship core pieces in their current roles. But it seems good enough to be highly competent.
Our previous core started with DeMar-Lowry-Ross-JV. DeMar was upgraded for Kawhi. Ross was upgraded for Ibaka. JV was upgraded for Gasol. Kyle was nearly flipped for Mike Conley Jr. People wasted a lot of time arguing against those players, but they won a lot of games and raised their trade value as a result. They raised the standard of what it took to be a Raptor. I think that's more valuable then synergy or fit, or whatever gets complained about.
But this is exactly what everyone who is "complaining" is saying. People aren't complaining RJ just to complain, they are complaining about specific aspects of his game that indicate the same thing as those players traded, they don't have championship calibre skill sets.
Both IQ and Scottie do. RJ currently is DD with a considerably worse mid range game. I think most everyone who watched the DD years here can unequivocally say he does not possess any championship calibre skills outside his mid range game, and the value of that in the modern NBA is debatable.
The people "complaining" are simply saying the same thing that was said about the traded players, and they were right back then. Time will tell if that is the same case here, but it's not like there isn't precedent, people used to complain about DD's limitations all the time, and they were valid complaints cause they limited the ceiling of the team. So he was traded.
Okay, I'll bite. If Demar had a championship caliber midrange game, then RJ has a championship caliber slashing game. The dude can just get to the paint and get to the line, and has to be top 10 wing in the game at that skill now. That's RJ's elite skill. You don't get to 23, 6, 4 on 55 percent from the field being a jack of all trades, master of none. He is a master at bulldozing his way to the hoop.
If you look at RJ as a championship caliber 3rd option, which I think he can be, and his contract currently warrants then you realize, this teams success is more about Scottie and IQ becoming a 1 and a 2, or more than likely you have to make a trade to get Scottie the 1A, to his 1B. I see RJ as kind of a prime Caron Butler, Antawn Jamison, Richard Jefferson level player impact wise. Might make an all star or two, but probably just a slight teir below that, but still a bucket and a gamer who will show up when it matters. I see IQ as a prime Jason Terry level impact player maybe sans a little edge that JT played with, and JT was the second best scorer on a championship team that just had good players up and down the roster with great team chemistry and bball IQ on both ends, and obviously prime Dirk. So, this team has a long way to go, and we really need to improve depth and defensively.
sure it is.
