Randle's Future

[DaGawd]

we really need randle to tap back in to the defense he was playing in the covid season where he was regularly blocking shots and challenging shots at the rim

[Luv those Knicks]

imo we should only offer randle a slight bump over whatever OG is making.

OG's contract starts at 36.6m and increases at 8%.


so I wouldn't even offer randle 4/182

OG got 5 years, Randle can only get 4, so that's not exactly apples to oranges, 4-182 starts at 40 million per. OG starts at 36, but got 5-212.

Paying Randle 40 next year hits our space under the apron pretty hard. It almost guarantees we go over the first Apron with very little flexibility.

I like the idea that someone suggested of 31 for the first year if Randle opts in (I'm pretty sure Brunson opted in so this wouldn't be unprecedented), then starting at 42 with 8% increases for the next 3 years.

[KnicksGadfly]

If I was Randle, I wouldn't take that opt-in. You really don't know what will happen.

For example, people talk about Randle being a good team player in 2021 and signing a below-market extension. However, the year after that, Randle had a horrific season. His numbers look okay on the surface level, but it was marred by bad leadership, lack of effort, poor results, and losing. I'll admit that some things aren't under his control but he probably wouldn't have gotten a max extension in the 2022 offseason. That 2021 extension turned out to be the right choice for him.

Same situation here. Randle's stock is pretty high right now. He didn't get to prove himself in the postseason but he didn't eff up in the postseason, either. He basically ended on a high note. For someone with his struggles, he can really cement himself in NYC.

[3toheadmelo]

dont mind me just making sure this hits the next page

Some news from Fred Katz. the anti randle club won't handle this very well.

This is a team with championship ambitions. Because of that, there is no indication the Knicks want to trade their starting power forward. They saw what happened after the arrival of Anunoby in January when the group reeled off that 12-2 heater, which included annihilations of the healthy Philadelphia 76ers, Denver Nuggets and Minnesota Timberwolves.

They saw Randle play the best, pass-first basketball he’d churned out since coming to New York. They understand Brunson needs another source of shot creation next to him. The point guard can’t carry the attack all by himself, especially not when playoff defenses are keyed on him in May or June.

[BKlutch]

dont mind me just making sure this hits the next page

Some news from Fred Katz. the anti randle club won't handle this very well.

This is a team with championship ambitions. Because of that, there is no indication the Knicks want to trade their starting power forward. They saw what happened after the arrival of Anunoby in January when the group reeled off that 12-2 heater, which included annihilations of the healthy Philadelphia 76ers, Denver Nuggets and Minnesota Timberwolves.

They saw Randle play the best, pass-first basketball he’d churned out since coming to New York. They understand Brunson needs another source of shot creation next to him. The point guard can’t carry the attack all by himself, especially not when playoff defenses are keyed on him in May or June.

Go get Randle

[thebuzzardman]

1 day until the Towns trade!

[aggo]

1 day until the Towns trade!

tomorrow the narrative writers will have to find a new excuse for why Randle doesnt want to be here.

[Capn'O]

dont mind me just making sure this hits the next page

Some news from Fred Katz. the anti randle club won't handle this very well.

This is a team with championship ambitions. Because of that, there is no indication the Knicks want to trade their starting power forward. They saw what happened after the arrival of Anunoby in January when the group reeled off that 12-2 heater, which included annihilations of the healthy Philadelphia 76ers, Denver Nuggets and Minnesota Timberwolves.

They saw Randle play the best, pass-first basketball he’d churned out since coming to New York. They understand Brunson needs another source of shot creation next to him. The point guard can’t carry the attack all by himself, especially not when playoff defenses are keyed on him in May or June.

Good. Without a Giannis sort of get, why not run it back and see if that dominant team is sustainable.

[Clyde_Style]

Extending him now locks us into this team which I'm not sure they want to do. I do think there's smoke with the KAT stuff and that they probably want him but the Wolves making it to the WCF changed things.

I also think that OG and Hart playing so well at the 3 and 4 during the playoffs has them looking at things differently.

man, fck KAT.

that's just changing one problem for another problem. randle is unstable but he isn't soft like KAT. KAT is a straight up loser. I'm not opposed to moving Randle but it would have to be the right piece(s). Randle adds something this team desperately needs a 2nd creator. they would need to replace his ability to create while also hopefully bringing in another C if they move him.

which i honestly don't think they want to do. Dolan loves Randle.

There's smoke with the KAT stuff, if they could get him and Richards or Kessler as well, and play him at the 4, we'd probably be better simply because we'd be able to go small when the time comes with a floor spacing 5 and all 3 of the perimeter guys out there with him. Saying KAT is soft is soft is one thing, at the end of the day his worst playoff run is better than Randle's best so far.

Randle's creation has been terrible in the playoffs, and there's also the prospect that Mikal Bridges is going to get touches, as well as OG to a lesser extent. If they're bringing Mikal here to just play the Donte role it's a waste, if they're trying to find the guy he was for those 31 games in 2023 (Playoffs included) with the Nets that's going to require him having the ball or the ball moving more than it normally does.

Dolan can love Randle, the front office is making the decisions, and extending him now could be a massive mistake. I don't see the point in doing it now, if he has a flame out in the playoffs we're screwed if he's extended, if he plays well you just sign him, and if you want to bring him back after a flame out do it at a lowered rate, it's not like there's going to be some robust market for him. The rest of the league is not as high on him as people are here.

I agree entirely that this FO is evaluating Randle's place in the team's future. They may not have come to a conclusion yet, but I doubt they are all-in on him at this point. If they offer to extend him before the season I would be surprised.

As far as folks who say we need a second scorer, I'm like hello? We now have Bridges who can give you similar production, OG is a legit three point scorer who can give you 15 to 25 depending on the game, we gave guys coming off the bench who can score.

It's a false narrative that Randle's production as 2nd option is the conclusive factor. Does he give us a scorer in the middle? Yes. But Brunson is basically a midget who is top 5 in paint scoring already so he is already technically a bully baller supreme.

While having a big who scores mostly by rumbling into the paint has value, this team is going to score in bunches with solid on and off the ball movement. If everyone is sharing the rock we have points coming from everywhere on the floor other than the C position. And Randle is not a C.

Getting to the rack and scoring is not solely based on size. We'll get more paint scoring from two basic sources:

a league leading defense that produces fast break opportunities
and
having a starting unit that can't be double-teamed without leaving a legit shooter open which will equal more drop passes to cutters besides open jumpers

As this team is constructed, Randle may fit well, but not necessarily be essential to the offense. If he was at all motivated on defense then I'd be more supportive of him remaining a Knick, but frankly his attitude on defense is unprofessional garbage.

And you're correct about the market for Randle being sketchy. No one is beating down the doors to obtain his services, because of his bi-polar seasons and playoff history. The FO would be foolish to over commit at this point.

[spree2kawhi]

man, fck KAT.

that's just changing one problem for another problem. randle is unstable but he isn't soft like KAT. KAT is a straight up loser. I'm not opposed to moving Randle but it would have to be the right piece(s). Randle adds something this team desperately needs a 2nd creator. they would need to replace his ability to create while also hopefully bringing in another C if they move him.

which i honestly don't think they want to do. Dolan loves Randle.

There's smoke with the KAT stuff, if they could get him and Richards or Kessler as well, and play him at the 4, we'd probably be better simply because we'd be able to go small when the time comes with a floor spacing 5 and all 3 of the perimeter guys out there with him. Saying KAT is soft is soft is one thing, at the end of the day his worst playoff run is better than Randle's best so far.

Randle's creation has been terrible in the playoffs, and there's also the prospect that Mikal Bridges is going to get touches, as well as OG to a lesser extent. If they're bringing Mikal here to just play the Donte role it's a waste, if they're trying to find the guy he was for those 31 games in 2023 (Playoffs included) with the Nets that's going to require him having the ball or the ball moving more than it normally does.

Dolan can love Randle, the front office is making the decisions, and extending him now could be a massive mistake. I don't see the point in doing it now, if he has a flame out in the playoffs we're screwed if he's extended, if he plays well you just sign him, and if you want to bring him back after a flame out do it at a lowered rate, it's not like there's going to be some robust market for him. The rest of the league is not as high on him as people are here.

I agree entirely that this FO is evaluating Randle's place in the team's future. They may not have come to a conclusion yet, but I doubt they are all-in on him at this point. If they offer to extend him before the season I would be surprised.

As far as folks who say we need a second scorer, I'm like hello? We now have Bridges who can give you similar production, OG is a legit three point scorer who can give you 15 to 25 depending on the game, we gave guys coming off the bench who can score.

It's a false narrative that Randle's production as 2nd option is the conclusive factor. Does he give us a scorer in the middle? Yes. But Brunson is basically a midget who is top 5 in paint scoring already so he is already technically a bully baller supreme.

While having a big who scores mostly by rumbling into the paint has value, this team is going to score in bunches with solid on and off the ball movement. If everyone is sharing the rock we have points coming from everywhere on the floor other than the C position. And Randle is not a C.

Getting to the rack and scoring is not solely based on size. We'll get more paint scoring from two basic sources:

a league leading defense that produces fast break opportunities
and
having a starting unit that can't be double-teamed without leaving a legit shooter open which will equal more drop passes to cutters besides open jumpers

As this team is constructed, Randle may fit well, but not necessarily be essential to the offense. If he was at all motivated on defense then I'd be more supportive of him remaining a Knick, but frankly his attitude on defense is unprofessional garbage.

And you're correct about the market for Randle being sketchy. No one is beating down the doors to obtain his services, because of his bi-polar seasons and playoff history. The FO would be foolish to over commit at this point.

I don’t think those are the main reasons really. Watching him play reveals that some of his enormous numbers are misleading, most notably the assists numbers. He is not a quick passer. He’ll pass it out of traffic, but that’s after dribbling into it. The NBA is about real ball movement, hand-offs, curls etc. Like Carmelo Anthony before him, Randle will pound (and chuck) the ball a lot. Both are exciting scorers and I’m always relieved when a Randle three pointer goes down, but he isn’t the shooter Melo was.

Randle is still easy to root for and I’d understand keeping such a talent around, but he doesn’t stand out because of his decision making prowess, basketball IQ or efficiency.

(Towns has different issues, but those are mostly unqualified narrative. He does all of the above better and in light of that, is easily the better fit. If Randle takes a deal starting at around 40/year he may be the better choice and value, but certainly not the better player.)

[Fat Kat]

Read on Twitter

[HarthorneWingo]

Randle’s going to come out beasting this season and none of you have been dumping on him all offseason will admit you were wrong. But Melo has been keeping files on all of you.

[thebuzzardman]

Read on Twitter

This reminds me of that time I watched the Knicks high on toad venom

[thebuzzardman]

Randle’s going to come out beasting this season and none of you have been dumping on him all offseason will admit you were wrong. But Melo has been keeping files on all of you.

Melo has more files on people than Stasi headquarters did

[3toheadmelo]

Randle’s going to come out beasting this season and none of you have been dumping on him all offseason will admit you were wrong. But Melo has been keeping files on all of you.

[NoStatsGuy]

yall remember when kat **** the bed in the playoffs just a couple months ago? yea trust me guys, you dont want him here.

im taking randle over his soft ass any day. plus thibs doesnt like the guy. this is never gonna happen. move on fellas

[Clyde_Style]

Randle’s going to come out beasting this season and none of you have been dumping on him all offseason will admit you were wrong. But Melo has been keeping files on all of you.

[Clyde_Style]

Randle’s going to come out beasting this season and none of you have been dumping on him all offseason will admit you were wrong. But Melo has been keeping files on all of you.

Melo has more files on people than Stasi headquarters did

[Chislic]

yall remember when kat **** the bed in the playoffs just a couple months ago? yea trust me guys, you dont want him here.

im taking randle over his soft ass any day. plus thibs doesnt like the guy. this is never gonna happen. move on fellas

"For his career, Randle has appeared in 15 postseason contests. In those games, he has averaged 17.1 points, 9.4 rebounds, 0.5 steals and 0.2 blocks while shooting a putrid 34.4% from the field and 28.3% from downtown. He also has more turnovers (58) than assists (56)." - Tommy Beer

I don't think either is the answer, but I'm more open to KAT now than previous years.

[spree8]

yall remember when kat **** the bed in the playoffs just a couple months ago? yea trust me guys, you dont want him here.

im taking randle over his soft ass any day. plus thibs doesnt like the guy. this is never gonna happen. move on fellas

"For his career, Randle has appeared in 15 postseason contests. In those games, he has averaged 17.1 points, 9.4 rebounds, 0.5 steals and 0.2 blocks while shooting a putrid 34.4% from the field and 28.3% from downtown. He also has more turnovers (58) than assists (56)." - Tommy Beer

I don't think either is the answer, but I'm more open to KAT now than previous years.

Context matters. How you gunna ignore him being injured and needing surgery in 2023 or him having zero help and being doubled every possession in 2021?