RGM GOAT Debate Thread

[HighFlyer23]

Michael Jordan is a better basketball player than LeBron James

[RHODEY]

I don’t love Lebron, but none of that is facts aside from his finals record. Those are your opinions.

It's also a fact that he colluded with 2 other top ten players at the time to stack the deck in his favor. And even then he underachieved....But just those 2 facts are enough to disqualify him from being anywhere near the top end of the top ten for me.

Do you really think that Bosh was atleast as good as LeBron, Kobe, Durant, Howard, Melo, Dirk, Nash, Duncan, Howard and Garnett in 2010? Or better than Deron, Joe Johnson, Amare, Brandon Roy, Rondo, Gasol or Chris Paul? That's like what, 16 players who lead their team to playoffs and I think was better than Chris Bosh who lead the Raptors to lottery in 2010 and guess what, I didn't even include Wade so how did you come up with the conclusion that Chris Bosh was a top 10 player in 2010? I've seen you hoping for LeBron to sign with the Knicks in 2010 offseason, is that the root cause of this hate for LeBron? It's been 14 years Rhodey.. let it go. You are mocking LeBron's "weak Finals Record" but in order to reach 9 NBA Finals in 10 years, you need to win atleast 27 playoffs series and LeBron just did that while the Knicks won like 3 playoffs series in the last 24 years. I'm not mocking the Knicks, I'm excited for the squad they assemble this upcoming season and hope they go all the way as the Knicks fans deserve it but this unreasonable hate you have for LeBron is long overdue, let it go. He's also the only player in NBA history who won 3 NBA titles/Finals MVP for 3 different teams/coach/system so I'm not sure where you are getting this lack of leadership. Regarding Bron's "fear of the big shot", here's something for you.

Read on Twitter

I really think what I said, which is that Bosh was a top ten player(he averaged 24.0 points, 10.8 rebounds and 2.4 assists in 70 games in 2009-10 ) when Lebron decided he wanted to play with him - his punk azz also wanted to get Carmelo.

That's is like Jordan trying to go out and join up with Dominique Wilkins and Charles Barkley to ensure there was no competition. Just weak and lame AF, especially considering they still lost to the Mavs only got 2 rings out of it. Would have been 1 if it wasn't for Ray Allen. Lebron is the most overrated athlete of the century.

[Jabroni Lames]

International fans lost the most by LeBron / Team USA winning again.

Team USA has gone back to jut throwing talented players out there and hoping for the best, and they still managed to win gold despite no real game plan or familiarity and horrendous coaching.

It'll come back to bite them again eventually as it has in the past, but what this means is that if Team USA doubles down and takes these JV competitions seriously they're still a cut above all the Internatty Teams.

"still managed" is the key word here. Barely beat Serbia without a miracle Curry flurry. What happens when Lebron, Curry and KD retire?

[DB23]

Hand picked the Heat. The other were not really basketball decisions. Cavs was about bringing a championship to Cleveland and Lakers was about living in LA.

Neither place was the best set up to win.

The went 33-49 Cavs before he arrived, Lakers were 35-47. They had young players and each team needed to make a trade for a all NBA big to be competitive.

There were other much better options available.

Context. He knew love and ad were being acquired. It’s not as you are presenting it.

How did he know that? Did he ring the Pelicans? Did he speak to the Wolves? Maybe he thought they'd try.

Besides, I stated that they need an All-NBA big.

You really believe he never spoke to AD beforehand? If that’s the case I have a bridge to sell you…

[HighFlyer23]

I mean could you imagine Jordan being held to 8 points in an NBA Finals game by 5'10 JJ barera. Yeah I couldn't either.

While being part of a super team and scoring easy, high percentage field goals the entire season

[ropjhk]

Three hall of famers, and role players. Thats a super team. Name another version of that that isn’t a superteam

If 3 stars is a superteam, then outside of Jordan’s rookie year, he only lost to superteams in the playoffs.

1986: Bird, McHale, Parish
1987: Bird, McHale, Parish
1988: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1989: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1990: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1995: Shaq, Penny, Horace Grant

I said three HOFers sir

Well aside from the 1995 Magic all those teams do have 3 HOFers. Penny is up for consideration.

There should be consideration though for how good the HOFer was playing at the time. Were they an all star that year? Having an HOFer at the end of his career riding the bench for example shouldn't make a team any more super.

All star appearances or All NBA appearances in the year played should be the standard for superteam qualifications.

[Slimjimzv]

Here's my plea to RealGM . . . create a GOAT forum and move all the Lebron/Jordan stuff there so the rest of us don't have to see a new post on it every other day.

[LaLover11]

Michael Jordan is a better basketball player than LeBron James

LeBron is a better overall player than Jordan and he beat more talented and beat a better record Finals team than MJ ever did.

Doesn't matter if he was on the best 90's team, that just means MJ was a favorite in every single Finals.

LeBron = Beat up his bigger stronger Brother *Warriors*
MJ= Beat up on his Little weaker brother " 6 times *

[Worm Guts]

Michael Jordan is a better basketball player than LeBron James

LeBron is a better overall player than Jordan and he beat more talented and beat a better record Finals team than MJ ever did.

Doesn't matter if he was on the best 90's team, that just means MJ was a favorite in every single Finals.

LeBron = Beat up his bigger stronger Brother *Warriors*
MJ= Beat up on his Little weaker brother " 6 times *

Lebron also lost to his little weaker brother.

[LaLover11]

Michael Jordan is a better basketball player than LeBron James

LeBron is a better overall player than Jordan and he beat more talented and beat a better record Finals team than MJ ever did.

Doesn't matter if he was on the best 90's team, that just means MJ was a favorite in every single Finals.

LeBron = Beat up his bigger stronger Brother *Warriors*
MJ= Beat up on his Little weaker brother " 6 times *

Lebron also lost to his little weaker brother.

I hope you're not talking about Dirk that destroyed the Back to Back Champion KB/Gasol/ Phil Jackson Lakers & Big 3 Thunder lmao

That team was the original Jokic " Dirk" Nuggets
Great team chemistry with superior coaching and extremely talented depth

[MavsDirk41]

Do you really think that Bosh was atleast as good as LeBron, Kobe, Durant, Howard, Melo, Dirk, Nash, Duncan, Howard and Garnett in 2010? Or better than Deron, Joe Johnson, Amare, Brandon Roy, Rondo, Gasol or Chris Paul? That's like what, 16 players who lead their team to playoffs and I think was better than Chris Bosh who lead the Raptors to lottery in 2010 and guess what, I didn't even include Wade so how did you come up with the conclusion that Chris Bosh was a top 10 player in 2010? I've seen you hoping for LeBron to sign with the Knicks in 2010 offseason, is that the root cause of this hate for LeBron? It's been 14 years Rhodey.. let it go. You are mocking LeBron's "weak Finals Record" but in order to reach 9 NBA Finals in 10 years, you need to win atleast 27 playoffs series and LeBron just did that while the Knicks won like 3 playoffs series in the last 24 years. I'm not mocking the Knicks, I'm excited for the squad they assemble this upcoming season and hope they go all the way as the Knicks fans deserve it but this unreasonable hate you have for LeBron is long overdue, let it go. He's also the only player in NBA history who won 3 NBA titles/Finals MVP for 3 different teams/coach/system so I'm not sure where you are getting this lack of leadership. Regarding Bron's "fear of the big shot", here's something for you.

Read on Twitter

You say 3 different titles with different teams like it is a good thing? When we know he hand picked specific rosters and situations. That’s not a plus in my book.

Hand picked the Heat. The other were not really basketball decisions. Cavs was about bringing a championship to Cleveland and Lakers was about living in LA.

Neither place was the best set up to win.

The went 33-49 Cavs before he arrived, Lakers were 35-47. They had young players and each team needed to make a trade for a all NBA big to be competitive.

There were other much better options available.

He contacted Love after signing with Cleveland. He was also part of recruiting Davis to LA. He was also part of getting Westbrook to LA as well. The Athletic reported that he held meetings at his house in LA with players for the purpose of getting them to come to the Lakers. Carmelo called James the GM. Just do a search on the internet and it will bring these articles up.

[DimesandKnicks]

Love Reggie but don’t see how he fits in here. Prime Shaq? Sure. On his last productive legs Shaq that Wade had to work with? Likely not. Wade was a self made champ and very deserving Finals MVP before Lebron ever joined him.

Not to mention Pippen was a rookie that joined the Bulls when Jordan was already a veteran. Jordan helped develop him into an all-star instead of pressuring the team to trade him for an established star… like Lebron did with Wiggins. Imagine how good Wiggins could’ve been if Lebron had taken him under his wing…

Wiggins was clearly overrated during his draft and the Cavs/LeBron made the right choice to get Klove instead.

Pippen being a Point Forward with Reggie being the main scorer would've been a good match together, let's not forget about the bulls also having Kukoc, Rodman, Kerr, Grant, BJ, Hodges, Lux

That team would've dominated the 90's 100%

Orlando Shaq with Pippen and semi fat Laker Shaq also would've destroyed the league together

Look… my point is simple. Wade won a chip as the main guy on his team. Nobody Jordan played with ever did that. Period.

I could care less about your hypotheticals, cherry picking random Jordan teammates from different eras, or hyping up scrubs like Kerr, Hodges and BJ… You can if, and, but all u want, but thems the fax. Jordan never got, or sought, the help Lebron did.

He didn’t need to *shrug*

[MavsDirk41]

Three hall of famers, and role players. Thats a super team. Name another version of that that isn’t a superteam

If 3 stars is a superteam, then outside of Jordan’s rookie year, he only lost to superteams in the playoffs.

1986: Bird, McHale, Parish
1987: Bird, McHale, Parish
1988: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1989: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1990: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1995: Shaq, Penny, Horace Grant

I said three HOFers sir

I am going to assume that Westbrook, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo will eventually be inducted into the nba HOF. If that is the case were the 33-49 21/22 Lakers with James, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo a superteam? What about the 43-39 22/23 Lakers with James, Davis, and Westbrook?

[LaLover11]

If 3 stars is a superteam, then outside of Jordan’s rookie year, he only lost to superteams in the playoffs.

1986: Bird, McHale, Parish
1987: Bird, McHale, Parish
1988: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1989: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1990: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1995: Shaq, Penny, Horace Grant

I said three HOFers sir

I am going to assume that Westbrook, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo will eventually be inducted into the nba HOF. If that is the case were the 33-49 21/22 Lakers with James, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo a superteam? What about the 43-39 22/23 Lakers with James, Davis, and Westbrook?

[Worm Guts]

LeBron is a better overall player than Jordan and he beat more talented and beat a better record Finals team than MJ ever did.

Doesn't matter if he was on the best 90's team, that just means MJ was a favorite in every single Finals.

LeBron = Beat up his bigger stronger Brother *Warriors*
MJ= Beat up on his Little weaker brother " 6 times *

Lebron also lost to his little weaker brother.

I hope you're not talking about Dirk that destroyed the Back to Back Champion KB/Gasol/ Phil Jackson Lakers & Big 3 Thunder lmao

That team was the original Jokic " Dirk" Nuggets
Great team chemistry with superior coaching and extremely talented depth

The Mavs were the underdogs. Jordan didn’t lose to underdogs.

[MavsDirk41]

I said three HOFers sir

I am going to assume that Westbrook, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo will eventually be inducted into the nba HOF. If that is the case were the 33-49 21/22 Lakers with James, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo a superteam? What about the 43-39 22/23 Lakers with James, Davis, and Westbrook?

If 3 HOF players is a superteam why not? In fact, i dont think either of those teams were a superteam….i was making a point, context matters was the point….

[Homer38]

If 3 stars is a superteam, then outside of Jordan’s rookie year, he only lost to superteams in the playoffs.

1986: Bird, McHale, Parish
1987: Bird, McHale, Parish
1988: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1989: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1990: Thomas, Dumars, Rodman
1995: Shaq, Penny, Horace Grant

I said three HOFers sir

I am going to assume that Westbrook, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo will eventually be inducted into the nba HOF. If that is the case were the 33-49 21/22 Lakers with James, Davis, Howard, and Carmelo a superteam? What about the 43-39 22/23 Lakers with James, Davis, and Westbrook?

The Bulls had HOF George Gervin on the bench in the 1986 playoffs and Jordan could still not win a single game against Larry Bird.The only time Jordan beat Larry Bird in the playoffs it was when he was head coach of the pacers

[LaLover11]

Lebron also lost to his little weaker brother.

I hope you're not talking about Dirk that destroyed the Back to Back Champion KB/Gasol/ Phil Jackson Lakers & Big 3 Thunder lmao

That team was the original Jokic " Dirk" Nuggets
Great team chemistry with superior coaching and extremely talented depth

The Mavs were the underdogs. Jordan didn’t lose to underdogs.

The Mavs we're like a 2024 Serbia Team
Great coaching, Prime Star & Role players that helped their Star win.

Heat in 2011 had LeBron, Wade, Bosh with zero chemistry, rookie coach that came out the janitor closet and Joel Anthony, Eddie House, Juwan Howard

[Worm Guts]

I hope you're not talking about Dirk that destroyed the Back to Back Champion KB/Gasol/ Phil Jackson Lakers & Big 3 Thunder lmao

That team was the original Jokic " Dirk" Nuggets
Great team chemistry with superior coaching and extremely talented depth

The Mavs were the underdogs. Jordan didn’t lose to underdogs.

The Mavs we're like a 2024 Serbia Team
Great coaching, Prime Star & Role players that helped their Star win.

Heat in 2011 had LeBron, Wade, Bosh with zero chemistry, rookie coach that came out the janitor closet and Joel Anthony, Eddie House, Juwan Howard

You don’t get to hand pick your team, then complain that it’s not strong enough.

[Jabroni Lames]

You're an example of someone who keeps fishing lol
Having one allstar teammate is a superteam now

90's Teams never had a better overall team and talent and coaching compared to the 90's Bulls

It's just facts

Correct. Because no other team had Jordan.

Take Jordan off the Bulls and they become just another team. Still solid, but none of his teammates were leading the bulls to any titles without Jordan. You know… the way Wade led the Heat to a title without LeBron…

Jus fax

Yeah.... and the other Big 3 of Kyrie, Delly & Mozgov that carried Lebron to a chip.