Denver HAS to trade MPJ, right? (Submit offers)

[clippertown]

Clippers covet MPJ to make right on a draft mistake (Clips drafted Jerome Robinson instead of MPJ with the #13th pick in one of the dumbest moves in draft history). MPJ can fit in as a small ball PF or when Kawhi is inevitably injured.

Clips can offer expirings (Mann / Bones / Tucker) or effective players on smaller deals (Norm). We can also offer our 2030 unprotected pick. It makes Denver's apron situation a bit better with smaller, easier to move expirings (plus Mann will stay).

[ejftw]

Clippers covet MPJ to make right on a draft mistake (Clips drafted Jerome Robinson instead of MPJ with the #13th pick in one of the dumbest moves in draft history). MPJ can fit in as a small ball PF or when Kawhi is inevitably injured.

Clips can offer expirings (Mann / Bones / Tucker) or effective players on smaller deals (Norm). We can also offer our 2030 unprotected pick. It makes Denver's apron situation a bit better with smaller, easier to move expirings (plus Mann will stay).

Clippers didn't pass up on George for financial flexibility to turn around and trade assets for Porter, especially Mann, who they refused to include for Harden and other speculated moves. And I'm definitely against giving up the last available first for an often injured shooter.

Plus, Denver also wouldn't do that, thankfully.

[Andre Roberstan]

Why not Ben Simmons for MPJ/Nnaji? Serious question.

They already have better Ben Simmons; he's named Aaron Gordon. You can't have two guys like that in the starting lineup.

[Andre Roberstan]

Clippers covet MPJ to make right on a draft mistake (Clips drafted Jerome Robinson instead of MPJ with the #13th pick in one of the dumbest moves in draft history). MPJ can fit in as a small ball PF or when Kawhi is inevitably injured.

Clips can offer expirings (Mann / Bones / Tucker) or effective players on smaller deals (Norm). We can also offer our 2030 unprotected pick. It makes Denver's apron situation a bit better with smaller, easier to move expirings (plus Mann will stay).

I can't come up with a way to make that work with 2nd apron restrictions. There might be a way, but it's real hard.

[Crymson]

Why not Ben Simmons for MPJ/Nnaji? Serious question.

Because Ben Simmons can't stay healthy, is a shadow of his former self when he plays, and would be a heinously bad fit with Jokic even at his best.

Denver would get immensely worse by making that trade.

[clippertown]

Well, we had a lot of trade proposals here to make Denver a significantly worst team. Thanks.
Can we have maybe one to make them better?

The Clippers tried to do better than absolutely nothing for Paul George but at the end of the day, the 2nd Apron forced the team to let him go for nothing or to trade him for unwanted assets from GSW. Ballmer chose the former option.

Denver is in a similar situation. Any improvement they make will likely come with a similar salary cost and wont get them out of Apron hell. To get out, they need expirings and picks. There is simply no easy way of trading a talented rookie contract for a max paid veteran. Unfortunately, Denver has to take far less than MPJ's real value this year or risk losing Murray or Gordon next year.

[clippertown]

Clippers covet MPJ to make right on a draft mistake (Clips drafted Jerome Robinson instead of MPJ with the #13th pick in one of the dumbest moves in draft history). MPJ can fit in as a small ball PF or when Kawhi is inevitably injured.

Clips can offer expirings (Mann / Bones / Tucker) or effective players on smaller deals (Norm). We can also offer our 2030 unprotected pick. It makes Denver's apron situation a bit better with smaller, easier to move expirings (plus Mann will stay).

Clippers didn't pass up on George for financial flexibility to turn around and trade assets for Porter, especially Mann, who they refused to include for Harden and other speculated moves. And I'm definitely against giving up the last available first for an often injured shooter.

Plus, Denver also wouldn't do that, thankfully.

Agreed with your reasoning, but under that logic, the Clippers will only have only one true PF on the roster next year (and even Batum is debatable as a PF). Obviously, MPJ is not a true PF either. Still, if the Clips refuse to give up Mann, they are looking at a bunch of below-average PF's that they can acquire with just Norm and Bones. Without a pick, it gets even worse (ie Tucker stays).

If the Clippers run Kawhi at PF all year, he is going to get injured.

[BelgradeNugget]

Well, we had a lot of trade proposals here to make Denver a significantly worst team. Thanks.
Can we have maybe one to make them better?

The Clippers tried to do better than absolutely nothing for Paul George but at the end of the day, the 2nd Apron forced the team to let him go for nothing or to trade him for unwanted assets from GSW. Ballmer chose the former option.

Denver is in a similar situation. Any improvement they make will likely come with a similar salary cost and wont get them out of Apron hell. To get out, they need expirings and picks. There is simply no easy way of trading a talented rookie contract for a max paid veteran. Unfortunately, Denver has to take far less than MPJ's real value this year or risk losing Murray or Gordon next year.

Yes, I know we couldn't get better player/fit for Denver because there are not many such players (3rd options) in the league that fits what Denver wants better than MPJ. That is why I wouldn't trade him, although your offer was fair one.

People are forgetting here that Denver already did simmilar thing like the Clippers. We let KCP go to avoid 2nd apron. Now we are fine. We don't need to trade MPJ. The worst thing for teams in 2nd apron is after 3 years. Denver will be in the second apron in 25/26 and 26/27, then MPJs contract expires. After that, with new TV rights deal and everything they will make new strategy.

[NotACat]

Denver's issue is that the only first they can trade is their 2031 pick as a swap b/c of all the protections on the other picks they've dealt. In the end, they are probably going to have to use their young rotation players as incentive, and I don't really know where that gets them. They should probably start by seeing if they can get ORL to trade back their first round pick by pushing it to 2031 or trading them a young player. e.g.,

DEN trades: Peyton Watson, 2026 pick swap (ORL receives higher of ORL/DEN 1st, DEN receives lower)
ORL trades: 2025 DEN 1st (1-5 through 2027)
Orlando gets a backup 3/4 who maintains their defensive identity and helps build the rotation of a team that should be pushing for the playoffs, Denver gets some pick flexibility back.

DEN trades: 2031 DEN 1st (unprotected)
OKC trades: 2027 DEN 1st (1-5 protected through 2031)
OKC gets an unprotected pick further into the future, Denver gets back trade flexibility with the chance to trade its 2025, 2027, and 2029 1sts.

Then they can use those picks to create a cheaper rotation that still has a lot of the same strengths, e.g.,

DEN trades: Michael Porter Jr., Zeke Nnaji, 2027 DEN 1st, 2029 DEN 1st
BRK trades: Cam Johnson, Dorian Finney-Smith, Day'Ron Sharpe
Denver gets a shooter to fill MPJ's role (not quite as good of a player), a 3+D player to fill Watson's role (and he is expiring), and a backup center to backfill the rotation with Holmes injured. Brooklyn gets a chance to feature MPJ a bit and see if he does well in an expanded role (which might increase his trade value) while also getting picks for the amount of money they take.

Murray/Westbrook/Pickett
Braun/Murray/Strawther
Johnson/DFS
Gordon/DFS/Tyson
Jokic/Saric/Sharpe

+ they have their 2025 1st in a wing-heavy draft (and they'll need one, I think) or to aggregate in a trade
+ Holmes will return next season

I think this puts them in a better financial situation, makes them a little deeper, and while reducing some of the top-end talent may make up for it with depth and better positional balance.

Orlando is a no-go for MPJ - they have 2 forwards who are better and will be taking up a bunch of cap space. Jett Howard and TDS were very impressive in summer league and will likely take the backup F minutes after KCP.

[DanishLakerFan]

Its tough to find a deal that makes sense for both teams given MPJr's price tag.

Toronto for Olynyk and Bruce Brown?

[babyjax13]

Denver's issue is that the only first they can trade is their 2031 pick as a swap b/c of all the protections on the other picks they've dealt. In the end, they are probably going to have to use their young rotation players as incentive, and I don't really know where that gets them. They should probably start by seeing if they can get ORL to trade back their first round pick by pushing it to 2031 or trading them a young player. e.g.,

DEN trades: Peyton Watson, 2026 pick swap (ORL receives higher of ORL/DEN 1st, DEN receives lower)
ORL trades: 2025 DEN 1st (1-5 through 2027)
Orlando gets a backup 3/4 who maintains their defensive identity and helps build the rotation of a team that should be pushing for the playoffs, Denver gets some pick flexibility back.

DEN trades: 2031 DEN 1st (unprotected)
OKC trades: 2027 DEN 1st (1-5 protected through 2031)
OKC gets an unprotected pick further into the future, Denver gets back trade flexibility with the chance to trade its 2025, 2027, and 2029 1sts.

Then they can use those picks to create a cheaper rotation that still has a lot of the same strengths, e.g.,

DEN trades: Michael Porter Jr., Zeke Nnaji, 2027 DEN 1st, 2029 DEN 1st
BRK trades: Cam Johnson, Dorian Finney-Smith, Day'Ron Sharpe
Denver gets a shooter to fill MPJ's role (not quite as good of a player), a 3+D player to fill Watson's role (and he is expiring), and a backup center to backfill the rotation with Holmes injured. Brooklyn gets a chance to feature MPJ a bit and see if he does well in an expanded role (which might increase his trade value) while also getting picks for the amount of money they take.

Murray/Westbrook/Pickett
Braun/Murray/Strawther
Johnson/DFS
Gordon/DFS/Tyson
Jokic/Saric/Sharpe

+ they have their 2025 1st in a wing-heavy draft (and they'll need one, I think) or to aggregate in a trade
+ Holmes will return next season

I think this puts them in a better financial situation, makes them a little deeper, and while reducing some of the top-end talent may make up for it with depth and better positional balance.

Orlando is a no-go for MPJ - they have 2 forwards who are better and will be taking up a bunch of cap space. Jett Howard and TDS were very impressive in summer league and will likely take the backup F minutes after KCP.

MPJ is going to Brooklyn here!

[nomansland]

Denver's issue is that the only first they can trade is their 2031 pick as a swap b/c of all the protections on the other picks they've dealt. In the end, they are probably going to have to use their young rotation players as incentive, and I don't really know where that gets them. They should probably start by seeing if they can get ORL to trade back their first round pick by pushing it to 2031 or trading them a young player. e.g.,

DEN trades: Peyton Watson, 2026 pick swap (ORL receives higher of ORL/DEN 1st, DEN receives lower)
ORL trades: 2025 DEN 1st (1-5 through 2027)
Orlando gets a backup 3/4 who maintains their defensive identity and helps build the rotation of a team that should be pushing for the playoffs, Denver gets some pick flexibility back.

DEN trades: 2031 DEN 1st (unprotected)
OKC trades: 2027 DEN 1st (1-5 protected through 2031)
OKC gets an unprotected pick further into the future, Denver gets back trade flexibility with the chance to trade its 2025, 2027, and 2029 1sts.

Then they can use those picks to create a cheaper rotation that still has a lot of the same strengths, e.g.,

DEN trades: Michael Porter Jr., Zeke Nnaji, 2027 DEN 1st, 2029 DEN 1st
BRK trades: Cam Johnson, Dorian Finney-Smith, Day'Ron Sharpe
Denver gets a shooter to fill MPJ's role (not quite as good of a player), a 3+D player to fill Watson's role (and he is expiring), and a backup center to backfill the rotation with Holmes injured. Brooklyn gets a chance to feature MPJ a bit and see if he does well in an expanded role (which might increase his trade value) while also getting picks for the amount of money they take.

Murray/Westbrook/Pickett
Braun/Murray/Strawther
Johnson/DFS
Gordon/DFS/Tyson
Jokic/Saric/Sharpe

+ they have their 2025 1st in a wing-heavy draft (and they'll need one, I think) or to aggregate in a trade
+ Holmes will return next season

I think this puts them in a better financial situation, makes them a little deeper, and while reducing some of the top-end talent may make up for it with depth and better positional balance.

While I admire your creativity, that's an awful lot of moving things around just to get what's essentially Cam Johnson and out of Nnaji's deal.

Denver's better off just keeping Porter and Watson.

[louc1970]

I still like the idea of moving both Murray and MPJ.

Nuggets/Cavs/Pelicans

Nuggets send Murray/MPJ/Cancar (or other filler)
Nuggets receive Garland/Ingram
Discussion before the trade is that Ingram will be offered a contract but not the max. Worst case scenario, Ingram walks at the end of the year (saving Denver major money). Best case scenario, Holmes becomes the replacement for MPJ when healthy and Ingram S&Ts elsewhere. Garland is a young PG that needs away from Mitchell to reach his all-star level.

Cavs trade Garland
Cavs receive Murray
Murray and Mitchell can play off each other with more size. Risk with Murray wanting more money next year.

Pels send Ingram
Pels receive MPJ/Cancar
Pels have a safety net for injuries by having Murphy/Jones. MPJ gives size/shooting lost with Williamson.

[nomansland]

I still like the idea of moving both Murray and MPJ.

Nuggets/Cavs/Pelicans

Nuggets send Murray/MPJ/Cancar (or other filler)
Nuggets receive Garland/Ingram
Discussion before the trade is that Ingram will be offered a contract but not the max. Worst case scenario, Ingram walks at the end of the year (saving Denver major money). Best case scenario, Holmes becomes the replacement for MPJ when healthy and Ingram S&Ts elsewhere. Garland is a young PG that needs away from Mitchell to reach his all-star level.

Cavs trade Garland
Cavs receive Murray
Murray and Mitchell can play off each other with more size. Risk with Murray wanting more money next year.

Pels send Ingram
Pels receive MPJ/Cancar
Pels have a safety net for injuries by having Murphy/Jones. MPJ gives size/shooting lost with Williamson.

If Denver's going to risk letting someone walk to save money, it might as well be Murray. They'd be risking known fit and chemistry for arguably worse players in this deal. I don't get it.

[NotACat]

Denver's issue is that the only first they can trade is their 2031 pick as a swap b/c of all the protections on the other picks they've dealt. In the end, they are probably going to have to use their young rotation players as incentive, and I don't really know where that gets them. They should probably start by seeing if they can get ORL to trade back their first round pick by pushing it to 2031 or trading them a young player. e.g.,

DEN trades: Peyton Watson, 2026 pick swap (ORL receives higher of ORL/DEN 1st, DEN receives lower)
ORL trades: 2025 DEN 1st (1-5 through 2027)
Orlando gets a backup 3/4 who maintains their defensive identity and helps build the rotation of a team that should be pushing for the playoffs, Denver gets some pick flexibility back.

DEN trades: 2031 DEN 1st (unprotected)
OKC trades: 2027 DEN 1st (1-5 protected through 2031)
OKC gets an unprotected pick further into the future, Denver gets back trade flexibility with the chance to trade its 2025, 2027, and 2029 1sts.

Then they can use those picks to create a cheaper rotation that still has a lot of the same strengths, e.g.,

DEN trades: Michael Porter Jr., Zeke Nnaji, 2027 DEN 1st, 2029 DEN 1st
BRK trades: Cam Johnson, Dorian Finney-Smith, Day'Ron Sharpe
Denver gets a shooter to fill MPJ's role (not quite as good of a player), a 3+D player to fill Watson's role (and he is expiring), and a backup center to backfill the rotation with Holmes injured. Brooklyn gets a chance to feature MPJ a bit and see if he does well in an expanded role (which might increase his trade value) while also getting picks for the amount of money they take.

Murray/Westbrook/Pickett
Braun/Murray/Strawther
Johnson/DFS
Gordon/DFS/Tyson
Jokic/Saric/Sharpe

+ they have their 2025 1st in a wing-heavy draft (and they'll need one, I think) or to aggregate in a trade
+ Holmes will return next season

I think this puts them in a better financial situation, makes them a little deeper, and while reducing some of the top-end talent may make up for it with depth and better positional balance.

Orlando is a no-go for MPJ - they have 2 forwards who are better and will be taking up a bunch of cap space. Jett Howard and TDS were very impressive in summer league and will likely take the backup F minutes after KCP.

MPJ is going to Brooklyn here!

My mistake, please ignore my post lol