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ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference.

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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#161 » by Scase » Fri Aug 30, 2024 10:18 pm

Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#162 » by DreamTeam09 » Sat Aug 31, 2024 12:17 am

Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


I wouldn't trade our roster for theirs, KCP is a good addition definitely, their bench is deeper, but you really think

Suggs
KCP
Paulo
Frans
WCJ

Is substantially better ?

IQ
Dick
RJ
Barnes
Jakob

Personally I think next yr we're in their tier. Ino you dislike RJ
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#163 » by Indeed » Sat Aug 31, 2024 12:31 am

DreamTeam09 wrote:
Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


I wouldn't trade our roster for theirs, KCP is a good addition definitely, their bench is deeper, but you really think

Suggs
KCP
Paulo
Frans
WCJ

Is substantially better ?

IQ
Dick
RJ
Barnes
Jakob

Personally I think next yr we're in their tier. Ino you dislike RJ


Orlando starting lineup is clearly better. Our offense maybe same as theirs, but their defense is far better last year, which obviously not fancy, but they got to the playoffs
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#164 » by Johnston » Sat Aug 31, 2024 12:55 am

Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


Reread what I wrote. I bolded what you must have missed. I'm comparing them to 21,22 and 33 win teams.
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#165 » by pingpongrac » Sat Aug 31, 2024 1:07 am

Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


Orlando's depth a few years ago (before they drafted Paolo) wasn't very good. I don't think a team that won 22 games is a very high bar though lol.

That being said, I feel like people are underrating us a bit. We barely saw Scottie, IQ, RJ and Poeltl all playing together last season, but their 4-man lineup stats were good (+10.8 NetRTG in 234 minutes) and we went 7-7 in those games. Our starters are going to keep us in a lot of games and it's not like they have a history of being injury-plagued; Scottie missed 13 games through his first two seasons, RJ missed 29 games through his first four seasons and Quickley missed 13 games (with a few being DNPs in his rookie season) through his first three seasons while Poeltl missed ~10 games per season (with 1/3 of those games coming in his rookie season where he was in the G-League or DNP and a handful more coming at the end of the season when the Spurs were tanking) through his first seven seasons. Last season there was a lot of unfortunate tragedies (Barrett and Quickley both losing close family members and missing extended time) while Scottie suffered an extremely unlucky injury then we started giving guys extra nights off. It's unlikely that they only play ~25% of our games together barring an early-season Poeltl trade.

Our bench isn't good, but there is potential for internal growth (Gradey's sophomore year being more like the 2nd half of his rookie season and Agbaji getting back to being a ~35% three-point shooter would be big boosts for example) while the players we added through the draft or via trade could surprise us. Personally, I think Mitchell is going to be a good piece for us. He had very little opportunity on a guard-heavy team in Sacramento the past two seasons, but his defence can be a game changer off the bench and his improvement behind the arc could make him a pretty valuable backup guard.
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#166 » by Clutch0z24 » Sat Aug 31, 2024 1:17 am

DreamTeam09 wrote:
Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


I wouldn't trade our roster for theirs, KCP is a good addition definitely, their bench is deeper, but you really think

Suggs
KCP
Paulo
Frans
WCJ

Is substantially better ?

IQ
Dick
RJ
Barnes
Jakob

Personally I think next yr we're in their tier. Ino you dislike RJ


Its a team game and yeah maybe we have a bracket of a better big 3 with IQ/RJ/Barnes but its not worlds better than Banchero/Franz the difference is the overall team....

The Magic have a team full of legit Good to great NBA level role players...With Suggs/KCP/Mortiz/Black/Cole/Harris/Issac/Goga..They are all legit bench and good NBA level role players...Also Da Silva looks worlds ahead of our rookie in Kobe right now due to age and maturity...

Our bench is looking like Brown/33 year old Olynyk/Davion/Boucher and then a bunch of Rookies or guys we don't know will even be able to be in the NBA in a year or 2...

Its a major difference in overall talent that makes the Magic ahead of us by a bit here....I don't think we are close to them right now....In top end talent yes we are with the Magic...But overall team...Not close..

If you trade Magics roster to us But we keep Barnes/IQ/RJ And they keep Franz/Banchero and you flip the roleplayers/Other starters with us you have a playoff team...And they have lotto team...
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#167 » by Johnston » Sat Aug 31, 2024 1:33 am

pingpongrac wrote:
Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


Orlando's depth a few years ago (before they drafted Paolo) wasn't very good. I don't think a team that won 22 games is a very high bar though lol.

That being said, I feel like people are underrating us a bit. We barely saw Scottie, IQ, RJ and Poeltl all playing together last season, but their 4-man lineup stats were good (+10.8 NetRTG in 234 minutes) and we went 7-7 in those games. Our starters are going to keep us in a lot of games and it's not like they have a history of being injury-plagued; Scottie missed 13 games through his first two seasons, RJ missed 29 games through his first four seasons and Quickley missed 13 games (with a few being DNPs in his rookie season) through his first three seasons while Poeltl missed ~10 games per season (with 1/3 of those games coming in his rookie season where he was in the G-League or DNP and a handful more coming at the end of the season when the Spurs were tanking) through his first seven seasons. Last season there was a lot of unfortunate tragedies (Barrett and Quickley both losing close family members and missing extended time) while Scottie suffered an extremely unlucky injury then we started giving guys extra nights off. It's unlikely that they only play ~25% of our games together barring an early-season Poeltl trade.

Our bench isn't good, but there is potential for internal growth (Gradey's sophomore year being more like the 2nd half of his rookie season and Agbaji getting back to being a ~35% three-point shooter would be big boosts for example) while the players we added through the draft or via trade could surprise us. Personally, I think Mitchell is going to be a good piece for us. He had very little opportunity on a guard-heavy team in Sacramento the past two seasons, but his defence can be a game changer off the bench and his improvement behind the arc could make him a pretty valuable backup guard.


I agree, we likely aren't that bad. But I don't think we likely have much chemistry and we have a glut of meh guards. Which why I think we are likely a mid 30 win team if we don't lose key guys due to injury and our key players don't have exponential, unexpected growth.
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#168 » by DreamTeam09 » Sat Aug 31, 2024 3:27 am

Indeed wrote:
DreamTeam09 wrote:
Scase wrote:A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


I wouldn't trade our roster for theirs, KCP is a good addition definitely, their bench is deeper, but you really think

Suggs
KCP
Paulo
Frans
WCJ

Is substantially better ?

IQ
Dick
RJ
Barnes
Jakob

Personally I think next yr we're in their tier. Ino you dislike RJ


Orlando starting lineup is clearly better. Our offense maybe same as theirs, but their defense is far better last year, which obviously not fancy, but they got to the playoffs


They're better at the moment no doubt, but like are you scared of them, is that a formidable team or something
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#169 » by Scase » Sat Aug 31, 2024 4:39 am

Johnston wrote:
Scase wrote:
Johnston wrote:How far off are we from Orlando a cpl years ago before they drafted Banchero? Likely a little better, but I'd say our overall depth is likely worse.

If everything goes as planned we likely win 35ish games, if we are hit with an injury bug, or trade Poeltl we are likely in the 25ish win category.

We have a couple guys who COULD take huge (unexpected) leaps this year. That is something to be happy about.

A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


Reread what I wrote. I bolded what you must have missed. I'm comparing them to 21,22 and 33 win teams.

Ah yeah I missed the Banchero part. My point still kinda stands overall. Next year would be the equivalent of last year for ORL, people want to make the comparisons, but last year they had 2 3 year players and a 2 year player, and won 48 games. We'll have a 6 year, a 5 year, and a 4th year, and we'll still be worse, like a lot worse.

We are very far behind them. Otherwise sure, we're ahead of them when they just drafted Suggs/franz I guess? Not sure why that matters.
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Re: ESPN predicts Raptors finish 26-56. 11th place in Eastern Conference. 

Post#170 » by Indeed » Sat Aug 31, 2024 4:45 am

Clutch0z24 wrote:
DreamTeam09 wrote:
Scase wrote:A long way off. Our depth isn't "likely" worse, it is inarguably worse, and objectively one of the worst in the league lol. Their depth just got them the 3rd best defence in the NBA :lol:

I don't think the injury bug is needed to derail us, a collective 20 man games missed by anyone in BBQ is like to put us firmly into bottom 5 territory, we are thinner than saran wrap.


I wouldn't trade our roster for theirs, KCP is a good addition definitely, their bench is deeper, but you really think

Suggs
KCP
Paulo
Frans
WCJ

Is substantially better ?

IQ
Dick
RJ
Barnes
Jakob

Personally I think next yr we're in their tier. Ino you dislike RJ


Its a team game and yeah maybe we have a bracket of a better big 3 with IQ/RJ/Barnes but its not worlds better than Banchero/Franz the difference is the overall team....

The Magic have a team full of legit Good to great NBA level role players...With Suggs/KCP/Mortiz/Black/Cole/Harris/Issac/Goga..They are all legit bench and good NBA level role players...Also Da Silva looks worlds ahead of our rookie in Kobe right now due to age and maturity...

Our bench is looking like Brown/33 year old Olynyk/Davion/Boucher and then a bunch of Rookies or guys we don't know will even be able to be in the NBA in a year or 2...

Its a major difference in overall talent that makes the Magic ahead of us by a bit here....I don't think we are close to them right now....In top end talent yes we are with the Magic...But overall team...Not close..

If you trade Magics roster to us But we keep Barnes/IQ/RJ And they keep Franz/Banchero and you flip the roleplayers/Other starters with us you have a playoff team...And they have lotto team...


People have Suggs higher than role player in terms of potential. At least the top 24 under 24 has ranked Banchero-Wagner-Suggs all 3 in top 24. So I am unsure we will be better than them in terms of future. And no, their best 3 is the reason they get to the playoffs.

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