ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle

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ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#1 » by drosestruts » Wed Sep 11, 2024 11:46 pm

Three team trade with cost savings incentives for Chicago and Portland and a quick 2-year youthful re-tool for Atlanta. Trade as is keeps everyone under the tax this season


Atlanta in: Deandre Ayton, Coby White, Matisse Thybulle, and Dalano Banton
Atlanta out: Bogdan Bogdanovic, Clint Capela, Larry Nance Jr, and Dyson Daniels

Atlanta 24/25:

Young/Krejci/Banton
White/Bufkin/Matthews
Risacher/Thybulle/
Johnson/Hunter/Roddy
Ayton/Okongwu/Zeller

An entire starting 5 26 and under with additional key bench pieces all under 26 too. If you really wanted to emphasize defense in that starting unit you could swap Coby White and Thybulle as well. I think Young and Ayton are kind of perfect pairing as two overlooked, often criticized, but definitely talented players.


Chicago in: Bogdan Bogdanovic, Clint Capela, Larry Nance Jr, and Dyson Daniels
Chicago out: Nikola Vucevic, Lonzo Ball, and Chris Duarte

Chicago 24/25

Giddey/Dosunmu/Carter
Lavine/Bogdanovic/Daniels
Williams/Craig/Terry
Buzelis/Nance Jr/Phillips
Capela/Smith

Bulls shed some additional 25 cap space while adding some significant size to better balance their lineup. Clears the guard glut and opens up an easy pathway to starting minutes for both Williams and Buzelis - for better or worse.


Portland in: Nikola Vucevic, Lonzo Ball, and Chris Duarte
Portland out: Deandre Ayton, Matisse Thybulle, and Dalano Banton

PDX 24/25

Henderson/Ball/
Sharpe/Simons
Avdija/MurrayDuarte
Grant/Camara
Clingan/Vucevic/Williams/Reath

Portland will also save significant money in 2025. If by some miracle Lonzo Ball actually recovers having his bird right could be interesting as he is only 26 years old.


It's the dog days of summer - and this trade may reflect that.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#2 » by JRoy » Wed Sep 11, 2024 11:55 pm

I could get behind DA for Vooch +.

This is DA and MT for Vooch and a bunch of salary that might never play again.

Pass for POR.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#3 » by tester551 » Thu Sep 12, 2024 12:10 am

JRoy wrote:I could get behind DA for Vooch +.

This is DA and MT for Vooch and a bunch of salary that might never play again.

Pass for POR.

Yeah...

DA for Vooch + has some interest. The issue is that the Bulls are so close to the Tax, that creating a reasonable trade is difficult.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#4 » by Myth » Thu Sep 12, 2024 12:19 am

Not a fan of using all this pretty much just as a salary dump for Portland.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#5 » by DeBlazerRiddem » Thu Sep 12, 2024 12:27 am

Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#6 » by dms269 » Thu Sep 12, 2024 2:31 am

DeBlazerRiddem wrote:Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
If the cost for Ayton includes Daniels, then Atlanta definitely passes. He was the key "get" in the DJM deal as his size and defense fits well with Trae. I don't see how Ayton returns useful expirings and a young talent.

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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#7 » by Godaddycurse » Thu Sep 12, 2024 2:42 am

dms269 wrote:
DeBlazerRiddem wrote:Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
If the cost for Ayton includes Daniels, then Atlanta definitely passes. He was the key "get" in the DJM deal as his size and defense fits well with Trae. I don't see how Ayton returns useful expirings and a young talent.

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Vuc isnt useful nor is he an expiring. The main get for Atlanta is coby white, whom admittedly is not the greatest fit next to trae
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#8 » by dms269 » Thu Sep 12, 2024 2:46 am

Godaddycurse wrote:
dms269 wrote:
DeBlazerRiddem wrote:Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
If the cost for Ayton includes Daniels, then Atlanta definitely passes. He was the key "get" in the DJM deal as his size and defense fits well with Trae. I don't see how Ayton returns useful expirings and a young talent.

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Vuc isnt useful nor is he an expiring. The main get for Atlanta is coby white, whom admittedly is not the greatest fit next to trae
My statement was to the poster who suggested Chicago be cut out and Atlanta move Capela, Nance, and Daniels for Ayton.

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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#9 » by DeBlazerRiddem » Thu Sep 12, 2024 3:07 am

dms269 wrote:
DeBlazerRiddem wrote:Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
If the cost for Ayton includes Daniels, then Atlanta definitely passes. He was the key "get" in the DJM deal as his size and defense fits well with Trae. I don't see how Ayton returns useful expirings and a young talent.


That's fair, I was working off the OP and maybe underestimating the role White played in the deal.

Ayton for Capela/Nance was floated previously and I thought it could be a decent basis for a deal. Portland would probably be looking for a little something extra since while they could be useful somewhere neither player is useful here but maybe we find a 3rd team to trade a more useless expiring with some second rounders for them.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#10 » by wemby » Thu Sep 12, 2024 3:30 am

dms269 wrote:
DeBlazerRiddem wrote:Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
If the cost for Ayton includes Daniels, then Atlanta definitely passes. He was the key "get" in the DJM deal as his size and defense fits well with Trae. I don't see how Ayton returns useful expirings and a young talent.

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That's what you say until you see Dyson Daniels play, he's being severely overrated. The best player in the deal is easily Coby White, which opens the doors for the Hawks to move on from Trae: a Coby White / SG / Risacher / Jalen Johnson / Ayton (Okongwu) starting five sounds like a very promising young core to build around if they can get some premium assets for Trae.
Honestly I don´t know why Bulls do this.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#11 » by JRoy » Thu Sep 12, 2024 3:32 am

wemby wrote:
dms269 wrote:
DeBlazerRiddem wrote:Unless we can figure out a way to get our pick back from Chicago I think I would rather just deal with Atlanta here.

Something around Ayton to Atlanta for Daniels plus expiring contracts like Nance/Capela is a lot simpler and more likely to get our attention. I think we would have to include Banton+Walker as filler back to Atlanta but those are fine deep bench players with expiring contracts so I assume doesn't hurt too much. Or we could play with getting Thybulle there as well but that would complicate things.
If the cost for Ayton includes Daniels, then Atlanta definitely passes. He was the key "get" in the DJM deal as his size and defense fits well with Trae. I don't see how Ayton returns useful expirings and a young talent.

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That's what you say until you see Dyson Daniels play, he's being severely overrated. The best player in the deal is easily Coby White, which opens the doors for the Hawks to move on from Trae: a Coby White / SG / Risacher / Jalen Johnson / Ayton (Okongwu) starting five sounds like a very promising young core to build around if they can get some premium assets for Trae.
Honestly I don´t know why Bulls do this.


That’s a good point if they decide to move on from Trae. He’s a polarizing player.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#12 » by Astaluego » Thu Sep 12, 2024 1:42 pm

Capela+Nance for Ayton+Graham or some minimum wage (TPE)

simplify it...

The Hawks get a good fit for T.Young and the Blazers save money, get a good veteran/Mentor + another solid veteran in Nance (both expiring) who could return some asset at the deadline...


I think that in the Bulls, White along with Giddey/Buzelis and perhaps P.Williams/J.Smith should be the pillars of their reorganization, while they worry about developing them and keeping their selection next year...Vuc even has some value as tank captain/good veteran mentor
(The one they should try to change is Zach.)
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#13 » by JRoy » Thu Sep 12, 2024 2:25 pm

Astaluego wrote:Capela+Nance for Ayton+Graham or some minimum wage (TPE)

simplify it...

The Hawks get a good fit for T.Young and the Blazers save money, get a good veteran/Mentor + another solid veteran in Nance (both expiring) who could return some asset at the deadline...


I think that in the Bulls, White along with Giddey/Buzelis and perhaps P.Williams/J.Smith should be the pillars of their reorganization, while they worry about developing them and keeping their selection next year...Vuc even has some value as tank captain/good veteran mentor
(The one they should try to change is Zach.)


This is a salary dump. Pass for POR.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#14 » by BlazersBroncos » Thu Sep 12, 2024 2:34 pm

PDX isnt going to salary dump Ayton.

If this involved getting our pick back from CHI - I would pull the trigger.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#15 » by ChettheJet » Thu Sep 12, 2024 3:09 pm

The original, no how for the Bulls. You do realize you have left off Coby White from the Bulls out which makes this even worse to swap him for Bigdan

They cut off a year of Vuc's contract, get expiring Capela but they give up an expiring Ball for an additional year of Bogdan, and what does he do for them? They don't really clear their guard glut, they get Daniels, Ball is only a maybe to play short minutes, Duarte has nearly no time and they still have Lavine. Bogdan doesn't start over Williams at the 4 so he comes off the bench at the 2.

The guy that makes sense in this is Nance in for Vuc out Smith becomes the starting 5, they find a backup and Nance plays a lot at the backup 4

At best ATL gets left out PORT can get the three Bulls,while I'm not even sure why they want Lonzo Ball, plus their own pick back for Ayton, and Thybulle if that's their plan. They cut down some money and years at the 5, Ball and Duarte expire and the pick. The Bulls get a bigger threat at the 5 a solid backup guard.

add to that the Bulls have recently signed Talen Hunter Tucker and EJ Liddell to take up spots at the end of the bench, they don't need to add more expensive players for limited minutes to sit in front of them

so all around not good
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#16 » by drosestruts » Thu Sep 12, 2024 4:24 pm

ChettheJet wrote:The original, no how for the Bulls. You do realize you have left off Coby White from the Bulls out which makes this even worse to swap him for Bigdan

They cut off a year of Vuc's contract, get expiring Capela but they give up an expiring Ball for an additional year of Bogdan, and what does he do for them? They don't really clear their guard glut, they get Daniels, Ball is only a maybe to play short minutes, Duarte has nearly no time and they still have Lavine. Bogdan doesn't start over Williams at the 4 so he comes off the bench at the 2.

The guy that makes sense in this is Nance in for Vuc out Smith becomes the starting 5, they find a backup and Nance plays a lot at the backup 4

At best ATL gets left out PORT can get the three Bulls,while I'm not even sure why they want Lonzo Ball, plus their own pick back for Ayton, and Thybulle if that's their plan. They cut down some money and years at the 5, Ball and Duarte expire and the pick. The Bulls get a bigger threat at the 5 a solid backup guard.

add to that the Bulls have recently signed Talen Hunter Tucker and EJ Liddell to take up spots at the end of the bench, they don't need to add more expensive players for limited minutes to sit in front of them

so all around not good


Please - THT and Liddell aren't camp invites who won't make the final roster and shouldn't be factored in to any fake trade as reasons why the Bulls do or don't pull the trigger.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#17 » by BlazersBroncos » Thu Sep 12, 2024 5:08 pm

Ayton for Vuc + PDX FRP returned would work for me.

I would probably bench Vuc after the trade DL if we cant flip him and give the minutes in a split to Clingan / RWIII - or at minimum reduce him to a 12-15mpg guy.
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#18 » by leo921 » Thu Sep 12, 2024 11:58 pm

I would love a Ayton for Vuc/Ball/Port pick

For Port Vuc is 2yr/40m so this year he can help Clingan get better and use to the NBA.
Clingan does have foul and conditioning issues so Vuc can soak up minutes and be effective in the
frontcourt. Next year he becomes a useful expiring.

Ball is a useful expiring if he cant play and if he can play then he can help Scoot out as the backup.

Port pick back gives Port trade flexibility now and in the future
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Re: ATL | CHI | PDX: Big man shuffle 

Post#19 » by Myth » Fri Sep 13, 2024 12:19 am

BlazersBroncos wrote:Ayton for Vuc + PDX FRP returned would work for me.

I would probably bench Vuc after the trade DL if we cant flip him and give the minutes in a split to Clingan / RWIII - or at minimum reduce him to a 12-15mpg guy.

leo921 wrote:I would love a Ayton for Vuc/Ball/Port pick

For Port Vuc is 2yr/40m so this year he can help Clingan get better and use to the NBA.
Clingan does have foul and conditioning issues so Vuc can soak up minutes and be effective in the
frontcourt. Next year he becomes a useful expiring.

Ball is a useful expiring if he cant play and if he can play then he can help Scoot out as the backup.

Port pick back gives Port trade flexibility now and in the future


Salary becomes the issue. I like the idea of Vuc+pick returned for Ayton, but Bulls take on too much money. Adding Ball makes it so Portland is taking on too much money. Adding Thybulle narrows that gap, but the Ball dead money for Thybulle addition of this trade requires additional compensation. Are Bulls willing to add a handful of 2nds?

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