Rotation thread 2024/2025

[Nick K]

Would you rather have KAT or NAZ and NAW? I think the rotation is better with the latter...+ returns on KAT.

I'd rather have KAT.

I don't understand this KAT trade talk. It's just a bad idea unles we get overwhelming return and not just gamble draft picks.

I trade Rudy before KAT all day.

[cmoss84]

Would you rather have KAT or NAZ and NAW? I think the rotation is better with the latter...+ returns on KAT.

I'd rather have KAT.

I don't understand this KAT trade talk. It's just a bad idea unles we get overwhelming return and not just gamble draft picks.

I trade Rudy before KAT all day.

For me, it comes down to:
KAT <<<<< NAW, Naz, Lauri M (just an example), more salary cap flexibility, draft pick recoup

[Nick K]

Conley (26) / Dillingham (22)
Edwards (32) / Alexander-Walker (16)
McDaniels (30) / Alexander-Walker (10) / Ingles (8)
Towns (16) / Reid (26) / Ingles (6)
Gobert (32) / Towns (16)

Edwards 32
Towns 32
Gobert 32
McDaniels 30
Conley 26
Alexander-Walker 26
Reid 26
Dillingham 22
Ingles 14

You just keep shutting TSJ out. I can't see that happening. He's going to get at least some of those NAW Minutes.

TSJ will get minutes for sure but how many and where is the question. NAW won't give up him minutes easily. He still is a very good player even though his playoff performance was really bad offensively. That's all anybody remembers right now.

I can see TSJ playing some SF too. I can see him play some minutes with NAW. Throw Reid in there with Dilly and we have one helluva 2nd unit. It will be fun seeing how it all turns out.

[Nick K]

Conley (26) / Dillingham (22)
Edwards (32) / Alexander-Walker (16)
McDaniels (30) / Alexander-Walker (10) / Ingles (8)
Towns (16) / Reid (26) / Ingles (6)
Gobert (32) / Towns (16)

Edwards 32
Towns 32
Gobert 32
McDaniels 30
Conley 26
Alexander-Walker 26
Reid 26
Dillingham 22
Ingles 14

You just keep shutting TSJ out. I can't see that happening. He's going to get at least some of those NAW Minutes.

I wouldn't be surprised if he's not in the rotation to start the season. But I see him earning minutes and getting more and more time as the season goes on.

Yep. That makes the most sense. The kid is really talented but he'll have to earn it and I think he will.

[Nick K]

I'd rather have KAT.

I don't understand this KAT trade talk. It's just a bad idea unles we get overwhelming return and not just gamble draft picks.

I trade Rudy before KAT all day.

For me, it comes down to:
KAT <<<<< NAW, Naz, Lauri M (just an example), more salary cap flexibility, draft pick recoup

I can see why you'd say that but it's misguided. You are saying you'd trade Kat most for cap reasons but what you're missing is a year from now Lauri will be making Kat's money on his next contract. Nobody talks about that.

Naz isn't going anywhere. Plus, this organization will pay the money above the apron if they have a chance to win. We have a 3-5 year window. They are not going to move Kat and break up the team chemistry.

I can see them move Rudy in a year or two because his position is easier to replace. His DPOY didn't help us much against Dallas.

[cmoss84]

Rudy was amazing last year. His contract is up in a year or 2...unless we extend him, which would probably allow us to extend Naz and NAW...especially if we trade KAT. I would love to keep everyone. Just doesn't seem realistic. A lot of teams would love to have KAT. I'm sure we can get at least a modest return while saving a good chunk...with whoever that would be.

[Klomp]

Conley (26) / Dillingham (22)
Edwards (32) / Alexander-Walker (16)
McDaniels (30) / Alexander-Walker (10) / Ingles (8)
Towns (16) / Reid (26) / Ingles (6)
Gobert (32) / Towns (16)

Edwards 32
Towns 32
Gobert 32
McDaniels 30
Conley 26
Alexander-Walker 26
Reid 26
Dillingham 22
Ingles 14

I might be rethinking my approach, specific to the ninth spot. The luxury of a vet like Ingles isn't necessarily that he's solid as the last man in the rotation. Instead, the benefit is having an experienced vet like that as the 10th man in an 8.5-man rotation in case of injury or another sort of setback.

If roles were reversed, there might be hesitation to slide a rookie into the rotation in case of injury, opting instead to increase minutes for the vets. But I don't think Finch hesitates to give Ingles minutes if there is foul trouble or an injury.

[minimus]

A this point I would leave 15th spot open and would not seek FA signing like Gordon Hayward etc. It is a risk but in regular season I'd give minutes to Shannon, Nix and Clark

[Saltine]

We've got ~40 minutes a game available outside the top 7 players, I would hope most of those go to the young guys, if Jingles isn't needed. Certainly on back to backs, Mike and Rudy should get some rest, let the young guys work a bit. From what I've seen, TJ, Rob, Nix and Clark deserve a shot. Josh and Leonard need to play every game in Iowa, they need reps...

[Dan's with the Wolves]

Projected Total Minutes for 24/25 Season assuming similar health as 23/24

Edwards 2770 - 33.8/gm - same as 23/24
Gobert 2593 - 31.6/gm - same as 23/24 (could be shaved down to 2460 - 30.0/gm and allocated to Towns if he plays more games)
Conley 2193 - 26.7/gm - same as 23/24 (could be shaved down to 1968 - 24.0/gm and allocated to other guards)
Jaden 2105 - 25.7/gm - same as 23/24
Towns 2026 - 24.7/gm - same as 23/24
Reid 1964 - 24.0/gm - same as 23/24
NAW 1924 - 23.5/gm - same as 23/24
Dilly 1384 - 16.9/gm - Jmac(626), Shake(491), Monte(408) 23/24 minute less time when 2 of them were on the floor together (141)
Ingles 1169 - 14.3/gm - same as his Orlando minute from 23/24 replaces part of Kyle Anderson's 23/24 minute of 1782
TJ 1148 - 14.0/gm - remainder of Kyles 23/24 minute (613) + TBJ (410) and TJ Warren's (124) 23/24 minutes
Dozier 141 - 1.7/gm - Shake and Monte's 23/24 minute when either shared the floor with Jmac (141)
Garza 122 - 1.5/gm - same as 23/24
Minott 91 - 1.1/gm - same as 23/24
Clark 75 - 0.9/gm - Wendell Moore Jr.'s minute for 23/24
Miller 54 - 0.7/gm - same as 23/24
Nix 50 - 0.6/gm - same as 23/24
Total 19809 - 241.6/gm - same as 23/24

Given the top 7 are returning there aren't many minutes to reallocate.
Kyle's minute are the most critical to replace. Most of them to Ingles and I don't see Minott or Miller beating out Shannon for the remainder. Kyle did play 400 minutes without KAT or Naz on the floor some those minutes could be allocate to Miller/Minott.
They want Dilly to step up. He actually doesn't have that high of a bar to replace Jmac, Shake and Monte's minutes.


What do you think?

[Colbinii]

Projected Total Minutes for 24/25 Season assuming similar health as 23/24

Edwards 2770 - 33.8/gm - same as 23/24

Trimmed down to 33.0 in an ideal world.

Gobert 2593 - 31.6/gm - same as 23/24 (could be shaved down to 2460 - 30.0/gm and allocated to Towns if he plays more games)

Trimmed down to 30.0 given the busy off-season.

Conley 2193 - 26.7/gm - same as 23/24 (could be shaved down to 1968 - 24.0/gm and allocated to other guards)

Trimmed down to 25.0 with better back-up PG play and NAW growing.

Jaden 2105 - 25.7/gm - same as 23/24

Should be up with less foul trouble and a slightly larger offensive role. No reason he can't balloon to 29.0.

Towns 2026 - 24.7/gm - same as 23/24

No reason he can't be at 30.0.

Reid 1964 - 24.0/gm - same as 23/24

I think we see a bit of him at the 3 and more of him. 26.0.

NAW 1924 - 23.5/gm - same as 23/24

This is an interesting one, definitely. I think he can get up to 26.0, especially if we want to rest Conley more and if NAW makes some small strides [steps?] on-ball.

Dilly 1384 - 16.9/gm - Jmac(626), Shake(491), Monte(408) 23/24 minute less time when 2 of them were on the floor together (141)

I think NAW takes up a small amount of these. 1384 is quite high for a rookie guard. I think Anthony Black's minutes is his ceiling, which was around 1100. I expect more like 800-900, which equates to 10.0. Missed games takes this up to say 14.0.

Ingles 1169 - 14.3/gm - same as his Orlando minute from 23/24 replaces part of Kyle Anderson's 23/24 minute of 1782

Similar to DIlly, I'll go 14.0.

TJ 1148 - 14.0/gm - remainder of Kyles 23/24 minute (613) + TBJ (410) and TJ Warren's (124) 23/24 minutes

I like another 14.0.

Dozier 141 - 1.7/gm - Shake and Monte's 23/24 minute when either shared the floor with Jmac (141)
Garza 122 - 1.5/gm - same as 23/24
Minott 91 - 1.1/gm - same as 23/24
Clark 75 - 0.9/gm - Wendell Moore Jr.'s minute for 23/24
Miller 54 - 0.7/gm - same as 23/24
Nix 50 - 0.6/gm - same as 23/24

The two most intriguing guys here are Minott and Clark. Clark is an incredible On-Ball, POA defender. He is an absolute menace, and developing and seeing him on the court is important as we have a massive decision regarding NAW in June 2025.

[Dan's with the Wolves]

Colbinii - great comments.

Probably am too high with Dilly. I look at re-distributing some minutes
If Towns stays healthy, I'll need to find those minutes somewhere.
Hopefully Jaden doesn't have to sit as much with foul trouble.

[Colbinii]

Colbinii - great comments.

Probably am too high with Dilly. I look at re-distributing some minutes

Nothing wrong with being optimistic.

1) How many 20 year-old rookie, small guards have ever been conductive to winning in Year 1? Probably not many.

On the contrary...how many had the skill-set of Dilly AND joined a 50+ win, title contender? Probably none.

If Towns stays healthy, I'll need to find those minutes somewhere.

Let's hope he can.

Hopefully Jaden doesn't have to sit as much with foul trouble.

I'm hoping with a bit more NAW and TSJ he plays some 4 which should alleviate some foul trouble. I also think with SlowMo gone, Jaden needs to stay out of foul trouble since we don't have SlowMo to come in and replace/replicate his defense from the bench.

[minimus]

It might be much easier than it looks. Lets imagine first MIN game against LAL:

1) first player to sub is 36yo Conley, I dont think that Rob will be first player off the bench. Obvious choice here is NAW *
2) second player to sub is 32yo Gobert. Obvious choice here is Reid *
3) who is third player to sub usually depends on matchups: when opponent star plays on perimeter, then McDaniels will be subbed out when opponent star is sitting, here we also have Edwards, Towns to get some rest. Here the most interesting part starts:

- if Edwards rests, I'd put Rob immediately with second unit
- If both Towns rests and Gobert plays, I'd give Ingles some minutes as stretch four
- if Gobert sits, I'd try to push tempo and put TSJ with second unit

* - both Reid and NAW will be free agents next summer.

[Klomp]

It might be much easier than it looks. Lets imagine first MIN game against LAL:

1) first player to sub is 36yo Conley, I dont think that Rob will be first player off the bench. Obvious choice here is NAW *
2) second player to sub is 32yo Gobert. Obvious choice here is Reid *
3) who is third player to sub usually depends on matchups: when opponent star plays on perimeter, then McDaniels will be subbed out when opponent star is sitting, here we also have Edwards, Towns to get some rest. Here the most interesting part starts:

- if Edwards rests, I'd put Rob immediately with second unit
- If both Towns rests and Gobert plays, I'd give Ingles some minutes as stretch four
- if Gobert sits, I'd try to push tempo and put TSJ with second unit

* - both Reid and NAW will be free agents next summer.

A caveat for foul trouble is needed as well, but I agree that the breakdown is relatively straightforward.

-If Conley, McDaniels or Edwards sit first, the first sub will be Alexander-Walker.
-If Towns or Gobert sit first, the first sub will be Reid.

But I think something worth monitoring is the overall structure. If I remember correctly, the goal in the past was to sit both Conley and Gobert early to bring them in as stabilizers with the second unit in the second quarter. Perhaps this is the time to put in the rookies, because the tempo will be pushed more while the elder statesmen are on the bench.

But who will fit better with Conley and Gobert? Do we only run them with the starters, in an effort to not overextend them both? Keeping Ant with them might be better because they might need some extra half-court creation. If the rotation stretches to 10 during the regular season, this would likely be where we see Ingles.

Here's my brainstorm of a rotation for a first half, assuming full health and no foul trouble:
Starters (8 minutes): Conley / Edwards / McDaniels / Towns / Gobert
First rotation (4 minutes): Dillingham / Alexander-Walker / Shannon / Reid / Towns
Second rotation (4 minutes): Dillingham / Edwards / Alexander-Walker / Reid / Gobert
Third rotation (4 minutes): Edwards / Alexander-Walker / McDaniels / Ingles / Reid
Fourth rotation (4 minutes): Conley / Edwards / McDaniels / Towns / Gobert

Here's the minutes breakdown of what I have above:
Edwards 20
Gobert 16
Towns 16
McDaniels 16
Conley 12
Alexander-Walker 12
Reid 12
Dillingham 8
Shannon 4
Ingles 4

Not perfect, but I don't think it's far off where I'd project everyone's minutes loads to fall. Honestly, I debated in the "second rotation" replacing Edwards with Conley. This would bump Edwards down to a 32-minute game projection and Conley up to 28 minutes. We all know Finch likes to run two small guards together at times. That would still be below what Conley averaged last season, and Edwards would get a little bit of extra rest.

[minimus]

It might be much easier than it looks. Lets imagine first MIN game against LAL:

1) first player to sub is 36yo Conley, I dont think that Rob will be first player off the bench. Obvious choice here is NAW *
2) second player to sub is 32yo Gobert. Obvious choice here is Reid *
3) who is third player to sub usually depends on matchups: when opponent star plays on perimeter, then McDaniels will be subbed out when opponent star is sitting, here we also have Edwards, Towns to get some rest. Here the most interesting part starts:

- if Edwards rests, I'd put Rob immediately with second unit
- If both Towns rests and Gobert plays, I'd give Ingles some minutes as stretch four
- if Gobert sits, I'd try to push tempo and put TSJ with second unit

* - both Reid and NAW will be free agents next summer.

A caveat for foul trouble is needed as well, but I agree that the breakdown is relatively straightforward.

-If Conley, McDaniels or Edwards sit first, the first sub will be Alexander-Walker.
-If Towns or Gobert sit first, the first sub will be Reid.

But I think something worth monitoring is the overall structure. If I remember correctly, the goal in the past was to sit both Conley and Gobert early to bring them in as stabilizers with the second unit in the second quarter. Perhaps this is the time to put in the rookies, because the tempo will be pushed more while the elder statesmen are on the bench.

Recently I watched a few NOP highlights from Davis-Cousins era:

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

I was surprised how it corresponds a quote about that offense

“Both Gentry and Finch loved to play at a breakneck pace and operated under the premise that shots in the first eight seconds of the shot clock tend to be the most efficient. They didn’t hesitate to push off made baskets and always had defenses on tilt, frequently forcing cross matches due to the speed of play. They had many clever actions designed to get either a good look at the rim or an open three early in the clock and gave all players the freedom to take advantage of this."

Cousins as offensive star had same problems: offensive fouls, turnovers, technical fouls. However, I can see a lot of similarities between Davis-Cousins and Gobert-Towns-Reid. Can at least second unit with Towns-Reid push pace with early crossmatches, postups, high-low passing, DHO, elbow touches etc?

P.S. I wonder if Towns-Reid duo might have better supporting cast as Davis-Cousins: outside of Holiday next players in rotation were Solomon Hill, Lance Stephenson, Dante Cunningham, E'Twaun Moore, Terrence Jones, Omri Casspi, Nikola Mirotić, Rajon Rondo, Darius Miller etc. Meanwhile MIN will be able to put some combinations of Towns-Reid-NAW, plus TSJ, Dillingham, Ingles/McDaniels as part of second unit

[minimus]

Unless we sign someone like Lonnie Walker for vetmin, I think the only possible move will be waiving Jesse Edwards and giving third two-way contract to another prospect. But I think it will be decided after training camp / preseason games

[minimus]

Unless we sign someone like Lonnie Walker for vetmin, I think the only possible move will be waiving Jesse Edwards and giving third two-way contract to another prospect. But I think it will be decided after training camp / preseason games

Read on Twitter

[FrenchMinnyFan]

Unless we sign someone like Lonnie Walker for vetmin, I think the only possible move will be waiving Jesse Edwards and giving third two-way contract to another prospect. But I think it will be decided after training camp / preseason games

Read on Twitter

Lakers cutting this guy and giving big money to Bronny... They make me laughing almost each time they make something!

[Klomp]

It sounds like the staff will be patient with Rob in the early going (Finch wants to "manage the runway"). Also, it seems like Finch really likes Joe, but I bet the staff will be cautious with him because Finch has stated there will surely be nights where he can't go. I bet he gets nights off on back-to-backs at minimum.

Makes me wonder if Mike might get the same treatment. Would bake in opportunities to give the young guys a look.

And with the Top 7 being cemented in place, I wonder if giving them extra minutes will be the first option on some nights rather than spreading the minutes thin. (ie. If Joe can't go but it's a more important game, keeping the rotation tighter as opposed to putting in the rookie).

tl;dr. There might be a lot of inconsistency in rotations early on from game to game, simply due to the experience level of guys on opposite ends of the spectrum.