Breaking: KAT to the Knicks

[god shammgod]

What an awful trade. I don’t see a single thing KAT does better than Randle and we lost valuable depth and gave away a first round pick in the process. Very difficult to come back from a blunder like this financially. We went from a deep team with a lot of grit to an overpaid squad with lots of injury history. I don’t want to hyperbole too much but this team is one injury away from McDyess years.

I don't like the loss of depth, but the financial take here feels a bit silly.

Knicks were right at the 2nd apron as it was. Randle still needed to be extended and the team would have gotten more "expensive" as it was, not that it really mattered, the team was capped out anyway.

This isn't looking at the team financially like it was 5 years ago or even 4 or 3 or 2 etc. Knicks went all in with OG and Bridges and Brunson, could have added to that with Randle, but decided on KAT instead.

The depth we lost was Donte. That does matter and it sucks to lose him, but the depth issue is the same if KAT goes out or if Randle goes out, other than Donte, which again, I agree with you.

Cam Payne and Shamet might offset Donte some, but they aren't as good.

I've got concerns about KAT on defense, but Randle wasn't setting the world on fire there either.

most of the time kat will play the 4. i wouldn't be surprised if sims is still the starter on opening night.

[Montmorencie]

mfs, he dont need to be a winner. Brunson is our winner, OG is our winner, Michal is our winner.

He just needs to be our Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins or Michael Porter JR? These guys winners? I don't thinks to. But they hella important with their talent in the proper teams. Chill

[god shammgod]

mfs, he dont need to be a winner. Brunson is our winner, OG is our winner, Michal is our winner.

He just needs to be our Anthony Davis, Andrew Wiggins or Michael Porter JR? These guys winners? I don't thinks to. But they hella important with their talent in the proper teams. Chill

they were on the years their teams won

[thebuzzardman]

Wow. I'm honestly shocked, but not really since I was saying that Minnesota probably didn't want to pay that tax bill.

So I'm assuming the starters will be KAT/OG/Mikal/Hart/Brunson?

Probably. That's some serious wing/perimeter defense. Not sure about KAT in drop coverage.


KFS talked a lot about the trade. At some point, someone mentioned Precious might start.

With Mitch out, I'm not sure, as the Knicks would want Precious to back up KAT


Gut feeling, Hart comes off the bench. Thibs, I THINK, values the way that Hart provides maximum lineup flexibility when he subs in.

Hart can kind of sub in for 3, 2 or 4. Once he comes in and either Bridges or OG or Precious comes out (before January with Mitch), then there are ways to juggle the lineup/matchups between OG coming back in at 3 or 4, or Bridges coming back to the 3 or 2, and KAT having the option to be on the floor with OG at the 4 or Hart or Precious, which is 3 different looks.

Just feels Thibsian to have Hart and Deuce come in off the bench where perimeter defense is maintained as players get rest, while Deuce should maintain spacing.

Hopefully Harts 3 pointer is more like late season Hart than early season Hart.

[thebuzzardman]

Something that noone is mentioning... a few weeks ago we were wondering if Kolek made Deuce expendable. Turns out that he made Divi expendable. FO must really be high on him.

I think it's mostly Clyde and I who go on about this one aspect of how this FO operates and that is that they tend to stockpile at a position to build depth in front of a trade.

Knicks added Donte and it was pretty much writing on the wall for IQ.

Knicks stocked up at guard with Payne and Shamet and we all thought Deuce was on his way out, but turns out it was Donte.

Knicks even built up some not that great depth at PF, adding Bates-Diop and Morris, no doubt with an eye to moving Randle.

Kolek and Dadiet are more developmental guys at this point. Or future trade fodder.

[thebuzzardman]

What an awful trade. I don’t see a single thing KAT does better than Randle and we lost valuable depth and gave away a first round pick in the process. Very difficult to come back from a blunder like this financially. We went from a deep team with a lot of grit to an overpaid squad with lots of injury history. I don’t want to hyperbole too much but this team is one injury away from McDyess years.

I don't like the loss of depth, but the financial take here feels a bit silly.

Knicks were right at the 2nd apron as it was. Randle still needed to be extended and the team would have gotten more "expensive" as it was, not that it really mattered, the team was capped out anyway.

This isn't looking at the team financially like it was 5 years ago or even 4 or 3 or 2 etc. Knicks went all in with OG and Bridges and Brunson, could have added to that with Randle, but decided on KAT instead.

The depth we lost was Donte. That does matter and it sucks to lose him, but the depth issue is the same if KAT goes out or if Randle goes out, other than Donte, which again, I agree with you.

Cam Payne and Shamet might offset Donte some, but they aren't as good.

I've got concerns about KAT on defense, but Randle wasn't setting the world on fire there either.

most of the time kat will play the 4. i wouldn't be surprised if sims is still the starter on opening night.

]

Until Mitch comes back, I think it'll be Precious.

With both Precious and Hart, I worry about the their defender sagging, but Donte was the price of getting KAT.

If Precious shows a reliable 15 foot jumper, would be a big deal, but that's probably not happening.
If Hart has a good 3 point shooting year, which he's had in the past, that would be nice, but kind of a crapshoot.

Deuce is available for the true 5 out sets, I guess.
Or MAYBE Morris/Towns, but that would be pretty situational.

[whocares1]

Wow. I'm honestly shocked, but not really since I was saying that Minnesota probably didn't want to pay that tax bill.

So I'm assuming the starters will be KAT/OG/Mikal/Hart/Brunson?

Probably. That's some serious wing/perimeter defense. Not sure about KAT in drop coverage.


KFS talked a lot about the trade. At some point, someone mentioned Precious might start.

With Mitch out, I'm not sure, as the Knicks would want Precious to back up KAT


Gut feeling, Hart comes off the bench. Thibs, I THINK, values the way that Hart provides maximum lineup flexibility when he subs in.

Hart can kind of sub in for 3, 2 or 4. Once he comes in and either Bridges or OG or Precious comes out (before January with Mitch), then there are ways to juggle the lineup/matchups between OG coming back in at 3 or 4, or Bridges coming back to the 3 or 2, and KAT having the option to be on the floor with OG at the 4 or Hart or Precious, which is 3 different looks.

Just feels Thibsian to have Hart and Deuce come in off the bench where perimeter defense is maintained as players get rest, while Deuce should maintain spacing.

Hopefully Harts 3 pointer is more like late season Hart than early season Hart.

I prefer Hart off the bench but realistically who would start? I don’t think Precious is starting at the 4. I think Thibs has a hot/cold relationship with the guy so I doubt that. It would not surprise me if Hart starts but also plays with the bench as well. Would surprise me if he wasn’t leading the team in minutes.

[god shammgod]

I don't like the loss of depth, but the financial take here feels a bit silly.

Knicks were right at the 2nd apron as it was. Randle still needed to be extended and the team would have gotten more "expensive" as it was, not that it really mattered, the team was capped out anyway.

This isn't looking at the team financially like it was 5 years ago or even 4 or 3 or 2 etc. Knicks went all in with OG and Bridges and Brunson, could have added to that with Randle, but decided on KAT instead.

The depth we lost was Donte. That does matter and it sucks to lose him, but the depth issue is the same if KAT goes out or if Randle goes out, other than Donte, which again, I agree with you.

Cam Payne and Shamet might offset Donte some, but they aren't as good.

I've got concerns about KAT on defense, but Randle wasn't setting the world on fire there either.

most of the time kat will play the 4. i wouldn't be surprised if sims is still the starter on opening night.

]

Until Mitch comes back, I think it'll be Precious.

With both Precious and Hart, I worry about the their defender sagging, but Donte was the price of getting KAT.

If Precious shows a reliable 15 foot jumper, would be a big deal, but that's probably not happening.
If Hart has a good 3 point shooting year, which he's had in the past, that would be nice, but kind of a crapshoot.

Deuce is available for the true 5 out sets, I guess.
Or MAYBE Morris/Towns, but that would be pretty situational.

it could be precious. thibs loves rim protection. not that sims really does that all that great either.

[thebuzzardman]

most of the time kat will play the 4. i wouldn't be surprised if sims is still the starter on opening night.

]

Until Mitch comes back, I think it'll be Precious.

With both Precious and Hart, I worry about the their defender sagging, but Donte was the price of getting KAT.

If Precious shows a reliable 15 foot jumper, would be a big deal, but that's probably not happening.
If Hart has a good 3 point shooting year, which he's had in the past, that would be nice, but kind of a crapshoot.

Deuce is available for the true 5 out sets, I guess.
Or MAYBE Morris/Towns, but that would be pretty situational.

it could be precious. thibs loves rim protection. not that sims really does that all that great either.

I don't think KAT provides much true rim protection at the 5, but it's not like I study Timberwolves games, so who knows. Surely there is a reason that they got Gogurt.

Precious seems like he can hang defensively with most 4s, but the ones who are really "3" like might give him trouble.
I think Thibs will value his weakside shot blocking but the sub for Hart will be pretty quick, which also saves Precious for backup 5, until Mitch comes back.

Also, can't shake that Thibs loves having Hart off the bench as it starts the substitution slide between 2, 3 and 4.

[god shammgod]

]

Until Mitch comes back, I think it'll be Precious.

With both Precious and Hart, I worry about the their defender sagging, but Donte was the price of getting KAT.

If Precious shows a reliable 15 foot jumper, would be a big deal, but that's probably not happening.
If Hart has a good 3 point shooting year, which he's had in the past, that would be nice, but kind of a crapshoot.

Deuce is available for the true 5 out sets, I guess.
Or MAYBE Morris/Towns, but that would be pretty situational.

it could be precious. thibs loves rim protection. not that sims really does that all that great either.

I don't think KAT provides much true rim protection at the 5, but it's not like I study Timberwolves games, so who knows. Surely there is a reason that they got Gogurt.

Precious seems like he can hang defensively with most 4s, but the ones who are really "3" like might give him trouble.
I think Thibs will value his weakside shot blocking but the sub for Hart will be pretty quick, which also saves Precious for backup 5, until Mitch comes back.

Also, can't shake that Thibs loves having Hart off the bench as it starts the substitution slide between 2, 3 and 4.

he doesn't. you don't want him playing full time at center if you want a good defense.

[thebuzzardman]

Wow. I'm honestly shocked, but not really since I was saying that Minnesota probably didn't want to pay that tax bill.

So I'm assuming the starters will be KAT/OG/Mikal/Hart/Brunson?

Probably. That's some serious wing/perimeter defense. Not sure about KAT in drop coverage.


KFS talked a lot about the trade. At some point, someone mentioned Precious might start.

With Mitch out, I'm not sure, as the Knicks would want Precious to back up KAT


Gut feeling, Hart comes off the bench. Thibs, I THINK, values the way that Hart provides maximum lineup flexibility when he subs in.

Hart can kind of sub in for 3, 2 or 4. Once he comes in and either Bridges or OG or Precious comes out (before January with Mitch), then there are ways to juggle the lineup/matchups between OG coming back in at 3 or 4, or Bridges coming back to the 3 or 2, and KAT having the option to be on the floor with OG at the 4 or Hart or Precious, which is 3 different looks.

Just feels Thibsian to have Hart and Deuce come in off the bench where perimeter defense is maintained as players get rest, while Deuce should maintain spacing.

Hopefully Harts 3 pointer is more like late season Hart than early season Hart.

I prefer Hart off the bench but realistically who would start? I don’t think Precious is starting at the 4. I think Thibs has a hot/cold relationship with the guy so I doubt that. It would not surprise me if Hart starts but also plays with the bench as well. Would surprise me if he wasn’t leading the team in minutes.

True. I really don't know.

When Donte was still here and we all tried to figure out lineups, I think most people figured Thibs was going to find a way to play Hart near starter minutes and that while Donte's minutes were going to take a hit, maybe not THAT much.

Hart vs Precious at the starting 4 the most interesting part of the trade now. Pros and cons to both. Hart will surely play 30 mpg.

[Triple C]

This is for us that were here in 2015 and it didn't matter how many KP6 putback dunks we were gonna get, we still deep down felt we missed out on bringing KAT home

[thebuzzardman]

it could be precious. thibs loves rim protection. not that sims really does that all that great either.

I don't think KAT provides much true rim protection at the 5, but it's not like I study Timberwolves games, so who knows. Surely there is a reason that they got Gogurt.

Precious seems like he can hang defensively with most 4s, but the ones who are really "3" like might give him trouble.
I think Thibs will value his weakside shot blocking but the sub for Hart will be pretty quick, which also saves Precious for backup 5, until Mitch comes back.

Also, can't shake that Thibs loves having Hart off the bench as it starts the substitution slide between 2, 3 and 4.

he doesn't. you don't want him playing full time at center if you want a good defense.

We shall see. Until Mitch comes back, he's going to see a decent amount of minutes there.

[Knicks_Fan2]

Love this trade. I was deeply pessimistic about Randle’s fit and ball stopping nature with this roster and KAT is a knockdown shooter at a position of obvious need. Hes not perfect of course, with defensive flaws, but we were staring at a real problem at pf/c and turned what i think wouldve been a negative for this team (Randle) into a positive. KAT will make some maddening plays though so be prepared. Losing DDV sucks but KAT replaces his shooting and more minutes for Deuce. The pick will most likely be a second rounder.

Good work, Leon. Cant wait for the season to start.

[god shammgod]

I don't think KAT provides much true rim protection at the 5, but it's not like I study Timberwolves games, so who knows. Surely there is a reason that they got Gogurt.

Precious seems like he can hang defensively with most 4s, but the ones who are really "3" like might give him trouble.
I think Thibs will value his weakside shot blocking but the sub for Hart will be pretty quick, which also saves Precious for backup 5, until Mitch comes back.

Also, can't shake that Thibs loves having Hart off the bench as it starts the substitution slide between 2, 3 and 4.

he doesn't. you don't want him playing full time at center if you want a good defense.

We shall see. Until Mitch comes back, he's going to see a decent amount of minutes there.

he will but i still think they start sims or precious

[omerome]

I honestly don't know what to make of this trade right now. Sure, we get an actual 7' player on the team, but how much better is he for us when you also lose Donte? Who will be that microwave type player for us off the bench now?

Randle probably was not taking a discount to stick around, but I don't see how it was worth potentially ruining the chemistry to get KAT.

[KnixinSix]

Ha ha ha

This is insane

Always thought Rose was going to get KAT so I guess I'm one of the handful of idiots here who believed it would happen eventually

Anyway, this is going to make us impossible to defend. Randle is good, but KAT is better

Oh, and Kolek just got his playing time, because the kid can not only dime like a MF, but he can shoot the rock

The foundation for this whole thing has been building for a while:

1. KAT at numerous Rose/CAA functions and being CAA
2. CP Knicks TV basically getting intel it was going down from a couple months ago
3. Gersas Rosas hiring to front office
4. Aquiring so much gaurd talent including Rosas
5. Curiously not seemingly going hard after C talent after IHart left
6. All the guard depth we have picked up via draft and FA
7. McBride if he stays is the better Thibs player of DDV and him. DDV is no where near the player that McBride is on defense. And McBride has improved enough offensively to be a legit 6th man.
8. Knicks getting one of the best big man coaches in the business from Det. He wasnt coming here to just coach the oft injured Robinson


The whole offseason seemed like a building towards this moment

[thebuzzardman]

he doesn't. you don't want him playing full time at center if you want a good defense.

We shall see. Until Mitch comes back, he's going to see a decent amount of minutes there.

he will but i still think they start sims or precious

Very Thibsian if its Sims

[dreamer3kx]

Im not crazy about this trade, thats alot of points you just gave up, and production.

[thebuzzardman]

This is highlight watching, so not sure how accurate but:

Towns seems to make somewhat faster, more decisive decisions with the ball than Randle did. I think the Knicks valued that.

Towns seems to play, especially when he's a 5, but even with Gogurt on the floor, more like Randle played in New Orleans, where Towns attacks closeouts and the rim from the 3 point line on in, or shoots the 3.

Seems like a better fit on offense with Brunson and Bridges.
Not that Randle wouldn't have looked good, and Randle could create and was a willing passer.

Towns just seems to attack more decisively from a spread out offense.