Karl-Anthony Towns Traded to New York (Official Discussion Thread)

[Neeva]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

[Guidus88]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

that's not fair, if he keep the same lvl of production in 1/2 year his contract will be a good one.

[Tukkerwolf]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

that's not fair, if he keep the same lvl of production in 1/2 year his contract will be a good one.

I disagree. He is a great offensive player, top 5-10 in the league. But his defensive deficiencies don't warrant him a 57M per year contract. Perhaps it's the price the Wolves had to pay to keep him, but he is not worth that kind of money. We've seen that enough the last 9 years.

[Guidus88]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

that's not fair, if he keep the same lvl of production in 1/2 year his contract will be a good one.

I disagree. He is a great offensive player, top 5-10 in the league. But his defensive deficiencies don't warrant him a 57M per year contract. Perhaps it's the price the Wolves had to pay to keep him, but he is not worth that kind of money. We've seen that enough the last 9 years.

in 1-2 years there will be much worse players that will earn more. That's how NBA salary is going.

[shrink]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

I think many people believe this, but to me, nearly all max contracts are positive ones.

First, a little background. Right now, there are roughly 50 players on max contracts. Several teams have three, and these are often your contenders. The reason max players are so valuable is that basketball if a total sum game, and if your team is putting better players on the floor in your 240 minutes of game time, whether by one point or twenty, you get a win, the other gets a loss. In other words, a player that averages 25 PPG is far more valuable than one who averages 20, because the extra 5 might be the difference between a win and a loss. These 50 exceptional players are also less common, and drives their value higher.

Second, super-max deals are probably the most guaranteed to have value. For any other deal, a GM can throw out an overpaid deal to anyone, regardless of their skill level. Super-max deals are the only ones that require a player to reach certain standards to even be offered one. The public makes a big deal about supermax deals because they are the most expensive, but remember, they are only 5% more of the salary cap (not even “payroll”) of a standard max. Personally I don’t draw a big distinction, but it looks like there is 14 supermax deals, and 50 total max deals.

Third, I think people have this perception because the CBA artificially limits what all these players make. We look at Jokic and fairly think that KAT shouldn’t be paid the same, he’s not as good. But the issue is that these players are all underpaid, it’s just that Jokic is underpaid more. More real world evidence shows that these older max deal players that fans say are “untradeable” continue to be traded in the real world, often for value.

If a team wants to win titles, it needs better players than their opponents. Nearly all titles have gone lately to teams with All NBA players, which is exactly why All-NBA restrictions are in the CBA for supermaxes. MIN doesn’t have a first teamer (yet!), and again, these players are even rarer and more valuable. They have been able to compete by having three max players, where some teams only have two. It’s just hard to get those players to MIN.

[Worm Guts]

Everyone is stuck on Julius, when Donte was the key to the trade. Julius is merely a means to an end.

I mean we didn’t trade Towns just for Donte Divecenzo, Randle matters, it’s both.

It's primarily for DDV. Randle was to match salaries.

I don’t agree with that. I don’t think they make the trade for a non-productive contract. Randle is going to be our starting PF.

[moss_is_1]

I mean we didn’t trade Towns just for Donte Divecenzo, Randle matters, it’s both.

It's primarily for DDV. Randle was to match salaries.

I don’t agree with that. I don’t think they make the trade for a non-productive contract. Randle is going to be our starting PF.

Agreed. Randle isn't some throw in. He's still a fringe allstar type player(3 of the last 4 years). I worry about his fit with the spacing for him and Rudy, but I think we'll see a lot of staggered lineups and Randle still shoots a lot of 3s and he's also a good passer.

Writing must be on the wall for NAW, wonder what his value is like on a small expiring contract.

[DaMplsKid]

IOutside of Reid, bigs didn't match up on d in certain series'

Reid was, by far, our worst big defender in the Playoffs.

We don't beat Denver without KAT defending Jokic and we don't sweep Phoenix without KAT checking Durant.

GOD is this is one of the most stale point about KAT that sooooooo many people keep regurgitating. Kat shows up for a couple good defensive in both series and no people want to give him credit for the series wins.

First of all why don't people say the samething about Kat in the Denver series the year before? Or the Memphis series in 2022? Or the play in game in 2022?

But let look at last years playoff run.

You soon forget how much foul trouble Towns was in vs Phx. He had one good game that series and played limited mins in the other 3. Ant had the great quote of "stop F'in Fouling" The team or ANT avg 31 ppg won us this series.

Now onto the greatest KAT series of all time the DEN Nuggets. Towns a supermax players scored 10, 13. and 14 points in 3 of these games. And in game 7 that series he shot a 1-6 from 3 (greatest shooting big man of all time )

How come when everyone brings this up they never talk about the next series in the WCF vs Dallas? Where was our Supermax #1 pick best shooting big man of all time? Wait that was a team lose not Towns fault at all.

Last year in the playoff the team was a +12.7 points, +5.1 rebound, +7.5 Asst and +5.4 blks BETTER with Towns OFF the court!!!!!!!

Those FEW defensive stops that Towns made last year I sure we can figure something out and Randle will be just fine.

[DaMplsKid]

That's definitely more Ants fault than Towns.

Nope. Ant is slasher, slasher naturally are more comfortable passing to the corners, where Towns usually is not located. It is more about scheme.

.... Kobe was one of the best slashers in the league he still managed to get both Pau and Shaq significant assists.

If there wasn't a good scheme to utilize Towns then Ant should have spoken up especially considering he had the ball the majority of the time.

First of all you should never put Towns in the same conversation as two hall of fame players and one of the best C to ever play the game. Towns was a horrible PnR player. All he did was pop out every time and wasn't a good roll man or a lob threat ever. Sure when you can shoot like he can shoot to pop out but look at the Dallas PnR when you have a guy who can roll and help collapse a defense. Towns is a Brooke Lopez without the rim protection.

[shrink]

So the Knicks are paying the $4.1 million to Randle, but who's salary cap is that 4.1 million counting against?

If the Knicks pay the trade kicker, they could only send us a cash payment. Randle goes onto our books with the additional $4.1 mil, and we pay additional luxury tax on it at the end of the season.

[Biff Cooper]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

With the Wolves it is probably toxic to be paying him $49.2M, $53.1M, $57.1M, and $61.0M when Gobert plays Towns best position on the court. Towns contract wouldn't be toxic if we didn't have so much also committed to Ant, Gobert, McDaniels, etc. It sucks that KAT was named All-NBA third team in 2022 to make him eligible for a Supermax. We likely would not have needed to trade him if he was making $41M, $44.3M, $47.6M, and $50.8M on a max deal.

[DaMplsKid]

Yep Kat’s contract is toxic , he’s not close to a top ten player but is paid like one.

With the Wolves it is probably toxic to be paying him $49.2M, $53.1M, $57.1M, and $61.0M when Gobert plays Towns best position on the court. Towns contract wouldn't be toxic if we didn't have so much also committed to Ant, Gobert, McDaniels, etc. It sucks that KAT was named All-NBA third team in 2022 to make him eligible for a Supermax. We likely would not have needed to trade him if he was making $41M, $44.3M, $47.6M, and $50.8M on a max deal.

I think the point you and shrink are missing about his contract is you cant pay anyone that much money who isn't a winner. Pussy Kat isn't a winner and doesn't make winning plays regardless of the money he makes. Ever contract no matter how big or small you want guys who get better, love to win and show up when it counts.

The money might of played a roll in this trade but I think the fact PJ F'in Washington out played Karl "Pussy Kat" Towns in the Western Conference Finals. Stop giving this guy a pass cause he was nice and wanted to stay here. His playoff/big game numbers are were the men sperate themselves from the boys and Towns plays like a boy in those games making a mans salary.

[frankenwolf]

When I saw this yesterday morning, I was not a happy camper. My first thought was "All the SOB's who wanted a Randle for KAT trade finally got their wish." I will miss KAT and his smile, his shot and his team first attitude. Reflection on this trade still doesn't make me happy, as I'm pretty sure the Wolves as constructed could have won a championship this year.

I do understand why it happened, because they are afraid of that LT and the second apron restrictions. This is a business, in the end, and no matter who is running it, they would like to not spend any extra money if they can help it. KAT wound up being extra money. I just hope all you that despise KAT are wiling to eat crow when he comes back to the cities and puts up 70 against "a better defense, now that KAT is gone."

Let's see what this team can do, but I don't think they made it better for the short term.

Spoiler:

And I will be ecstatic if I'm wrong and they win the championship this year

[Klomp]

For the record, it initially looked like they cut $8.8 mil in payroll, but that number will be less, because they aren’t including the Randle 15% Trade Kicker until it’s announced (roughly $4.5 mil) and the inclusion of Keita Bates Diop at $2.65. That would be a payroll savings of only about $1.83 mil.

For the record, to get under the lux, MIN would need to cut a little more than $33 mil more in payroll.

———

49.21. Towns

33.28. Randle 28.94 x 1.15
11.45. DiVincenzo
2.65. Diop
————-
47.38

$1.83 mil savings

First of all, paying 3 people less than you would have paid one person is significant. Also, it's more of a longterm savings than looking at this year.

2025-26
Towns: $53,142,264
DiVincenzo: $11,990,000

I don't think Randle's next contract, whether here or elsewhere, would come close to making up the $41 million difference.

[Klomp]

I didn’t believe it, but it’s apparently true! Here are the regular season games played in the last 5 seasons.

Towns 250 games
George 263 games
Porzingas 267 games
Embiid 275 games
Anunoby 277 games

For the record, Randle missed a lot of time last year, playing only 46 games. However, he still played 330 games over the last five. You never know if the most recent injury is the one a player never recovers from, but if he can get back to 100%, he has a better recent injury profile than KAT.

Between Randle's rookie season (1 game played) and 2023-24 (46 games played), the most time Randle has missed in the 8 years between came in 2021-22, when he played 72 of 82 games.

2014-15: 1 of 82
2015-16: 81 of 82
2016-17: 74 of 82
2017-18: 82 of 82
2018-19: 73 of 82
2019-20: 64 of 66
2020-21: 71 of 72
2021-22: 72 of 82
2022-23: 77 of 82
2023-24: 46 of 82

I also think your post shrink should be a cautionary tale for Knicks fans. Their starting PF and C now are extremely injury-prone in Anunoby and Towns. And this is a roster with basically zero depth, especially in the frontcourt.

[guest81]

I didn’t believe it, but it’s apparently true! Here are the regular season games played in the last 5 seasons.

Towns 250 games
George 263 games
Porzingas 267 games
Embiid 275 games
Anunoby 277 games

For the record, Randle missed a lot of time last year, playing only 46 games. However, he still played 330 games over the last five. You never know if the most recent injury is the one a player never recovers from, but if he can get back to 100%, he has a better recent injury profile than KAT.

Between Randle's rookie season (1 game played) and 2023-24 (46 games played), the most time Randle has missed in the 8 years between came in 2021-22, when he played 72 of 82 games.

2014-15: 1 of 82
2015-16: 81 of 82
2016-17: 74 of 82
2017-18: 82 of 82
2018-19: 73 of 82
2019-20: 64 of 66
2020-21: 71 of 72
2021-22: 72 of 82
2022-23: 77 of 82
2023-24: 46 of 82

I also think your post shrink should be a cautionary tale for Knicks fans. Their starting PF and C now are extremely injury-prone in Anunoby and Towns. And this is a roster with basically zero depth, especially in the frontcourt.

Mitchell Robinson is also already hurt

[Klomp]

Read on Twitter

[guest81]

From a Knicks perspective is just as interesting. The way thibs wanted to use kat in minnesota and who kat is now is way different. Karl is way to light to be the low post player that thibs wanted and i don't think kat wants to play that way anymore.

[thinktank]

Read on Twitter

Another one comparison with MEM Grit and Grind era. Randle = new ZBo? I love it!

Why emulate an outdated team that never won a championship? Why is that a good thing?

You emulate culture, not a team.

Edge is great. We need to see positive results in the form of a championship.

[shrink]

Sources describe Rosas as "Towns' foremost fan in the Knicks' organization" even ahead of Rose. Rosas had been pushing for the Knicks to attempt to trade for Towns even before the free agent departure of Isaiah Hartenstein and the worsening injury concerns for Mitchell Robinson.