Weeks 5 & 6 thread

[RaoulDuke79]

Jack loves him some Penix.

[Cactus Jack]

Jack loves him some Penix.

I do. The guy is the whole package.

[Mr B]

We have a couple Steelers fans here right? What do you guys think about the game Sunday night against the Cowboys? Should be a rainy night in Pittsburgh on Sunday.

Dallas defense is pretty bad and should be worse with no Micah and no DLaw. With the rain both teams should rely on their running games. With that in mind this might be a long night for the Cowboys.

[righterwriter]

Longterm it was the right move imo. If you want to criticize them for giving so much money to Cousins then that's fair.

Do you think Green Bay regrets picking Jordan Love? Of course not. It didn't make a ton of sense at the time. But they got their longterm guy.

That's mostly a bad strategy because by the time your QB starts getting playing time you lose his rookie contract advantage, really shortens your competitive advantage. That's assuming the guy you drafted even turns out to be good, which is far from given.

I have no issue sitting a guy his first year. It's proven to be beneficial.

The problem is they gave Cousins too much guaranteed money. So, he's basically the starter there for two years. The team would have to eat a ton of money to move on after this season.

They could've signed Sam Darnold this offseason & drafted Penix. But people shouldn't be criticizing the pick.

It's quite a different situation than the Jordan Love in GB situation, though.

1) Love was picked #26. Penix was picked #8. if Penix was picked late first or early second round, it wouldn't be quite as bad. But #8, without even a trade down, when you have just signed a $100M QB, is a wild swing.

2) Jordan Love was 21 when he was drafted. Penix was 24 (with a big injury history, to boot). The timeline for development and upside is not nearly the same. Sitting Love made sense. Sitting Penix during these years really does not make sense.

3) GB was locked into Rodgers when Love was drafted, but everyone knew that he would be gone in two seasons when his contract was totally off the books. There was a lot of contentiousness built up over the years and his time was just up. So drafting a QB in the late 1st rd while Rodgers finished up his career made some sense.

Atlanta had no QB and then brought in a top-quality vet on a three year commitment. It is the inverse of the Rodgers situation in terms of taking a QB who came in with a lot of goodwill and then **** on it by drafting his replacement rather than a player that could help him win now.

4) Atlanta chose the win-now route by signing Cousins. Putting so much equity into a developmental QB (again, a 24 year old with injury problems QB) runs counter to their big investment in Cousins. They had massive holes on defense that needed filling, but they decided that their QB situation in three years was more important than supporting the team now and the expensive veteran QB they signed now. That's a weird decision, and I do suspect that it is a move to cover the ass of the GM who perhaps didn't believe in Cousins, but had to sign him due to external pressure (see 82 year old Arthur Blank). Not a good sign of their front office having a plan and a goal. This is also supported in that they never even brought in Penix for a workout/personal meeting before the draft. Very strange, indeed.

There's a future here where Penix comes in and becomes a Pro Bowl QB instantly. Seems a bit unlikely, as he'll have been sitting on the bench for three years (two if they take a massive $35M dead cap hit to release Cousins early) and will need time to acclimate. Penix will be 26 or 27 years old by the time that happens and even if he turns out to be good his "rookie year" like Love, don't forget Love needed about half a season to get the game speed down. If Penix is just so-so as he acclimates, Atlanta will have to make a decison in the offseason if they want to extend him or let him go into the last year of his contract-- a then 27 year old still unproven QB.

But yes, he could just become Love right away and there is no issue whatsoever and this is all just a footnote. I'd probably say it was a high-risk decision that at least looks very bad for several years and can be pointed to as a reason why ATL cannot advance in the postseason despite a ton of offensive talent. So there's a lot to be critical of.

[Cactus Jack]

That's mostly a bad strategy because by the time your QB starts getting playing time you lose his rookie contract advantage, really shortens your competitive advantage. That's assuming the guy you drafted even turns out to be good, which is far from given.

I have no issue sitting a guy his first year. It's proven to be beneficial.

The problem is they gave Cousins too much guaranteed money. So, he's basically the starter there for two years. The team would have to eat a ton of money to move on after this season.

They could've signed Sam Darnold this offseason & drafted Penix. But people shouldn't be criticizing the pick.

It's quite a different situation than the Jordan Love in GB situation, though.

1) Love was picked #26. Penix was picked #8. if Penix was picked late first or early second round, it wouldn't be quite as bad. But #8, without even a trade down, when you have just signed a $100M QB, is a wild swing.

2) Jordan Love was 21 when he was drafted. Penix was 24 (with a big injury history, to boot). The timeline for development and upside is not nearly the same. Sitting Love made sense. Sitting Penix during these years really does not make sense.

3) GB was locked into Rodgers when Love was drafted, but everyone knew that he would be gone in two seasons when his contract was totally off the books. There was a lot of contentiousness built up over the years and his time was just up. So drafting a QB in the late 1st rd while Rodgers finished up his career made some sense.

Atlanta had no QB and then brought in a top-quality vet on a three year commitment. It is the inverse of the Rodgers situation in terms of taking a QB who came in with a lot of goodwill and then **** on it by drafting his replacement rather than a player that could help him win now.

4) Atlanta chose the win-now route by signing Cousins. Putting so much equity into a developmental QB (again, a 24 year old with injury problems QB) runs counter to their big investment in Cousins. They had massive holes on defense that needed filling, but they decided that their QB situation in three years was more important than supporting the team now and the expensive veteran QB they signed now. That's a weird decision, and I do suspect that it is a move to cover the ass of the GM who perhaps didn't believe in Cousins, but had to sign him due to external pressure (see 82 year old Arthur Blank). Not a good sign of their front office having a plan and a goal. This is also supported in that they never even brought in Penix for a workout/personal meeting before the draft. Very strange, indeed.

There's a future here where Penix comes in and becomes a Pro Bowl QB instantly. Seems a bit unlikely, as he'll have been sitting on the bench for three years (two if they take a massive $35M dead cap hit to release Cousins early) and will need time to acclimate. Penix will be 26 or 27 years old by the time that happens and even if he turns out to be good his "rookie year" like Love, don't forget Love needed about half a season to get the game speed down. If Penix is just so-so as he acclimates, Atlanta will have to make a decison in the offseason if they want to extend him or let him go into the last year of his contract-- a then 27 year old still unproven QB.

But yes, he could just become Love right away and there is no issue whatsoever and this is all just a footnote. I'd probably say it was a high-risk decision that at least looks very bad for several years and can be pointed to as a reason why ATL cannot advance in the postseason despite a ton of offensive talent. So there's a lot to be critical of.

1. The Cousins contract is essentially a 2-year deal. He won't be there for a third year.

The mistake was signing Cousins in the first place. A guy at his age coming off a major injury.

2. Penix was not going to slide to the end of the 1st round. As he was coveted by many teams.

Read on Twitter

[bluejerseyjinx]

Did you bet on Tampa Bay?

No falcons

[azcatz11]

Did you bet on Tampa Bay?

No falcons

I lost it all betting on the Nuggets

[bluejerseyjinx]

No falcons

I lost it all betting on the Nuggets

I haven't bet basketball since 1983.

[azcatz11]

I lost it all betting on the Nuggets

I haven't bet basketball since 1983.

Wow really? Before I was born. Why is that

[bluejerseyjinx]

I lost it all betting on the Nuggets

I haven't bet basketball since 1983.

Wow really? Before I was born. Why is that

I was in college at the time. Lets just say this, after 2 straight wining football seasons, well you know how much we all know it all when we are 22 years old. Thought I could do basketball as well as football. Lost 70% of my previous football winnings thinking I was king sh.t.

[righterwriter]

1. The Cousins contract is essentially a 2-year deal. He won't be there for a third year.

That's possible. Although it still will cost Atlanta $35M in dead cap to cut him after year two (if my understanding of his contract is correct). And Penix will still be 26 years old by the time he'd finally have his "rookie season."

The mistake was signing Cousins in the first place. A guy at his age coming off a major injury.

We'll see how it turns out. Right now they look like favorites to win the division, which would be worth it for a team that has been irrelevant since Shanahan left many years ago.

In any case, they went against their own commitment to a direction for the franchise by picking Penix after signing Cousins. That's my big criticism of it all. They certainly are going to need a guy to step in when Cousins is done there, but they could've easily signed or traded for a decent backup as a hedge to Cousins health. And then they could've picked a QB next year or even the year after to develop. That would've made sense. What they did this past offseason really didn't make sense.

2. Penix was not going to slide to the end of the 1st round. As he was coveted by many teams.

Oh yeah, I totally agree. My point was to dispel that it was similar to GB drafting Love, who was picked late in the 1st. That's a lot less draft capital to invest than at #8 for a developmental QB. And like I said, Love was a young pup when he was drafted Penix is already 24 years old.

FTR, I really liked Penix at UW and think he has a lot of talent. He is deserving of a top-15 pick, for sure. It just didn't make sense for Atlanta to do it after signing Cousins.

[GoRapstheoriginal]

I would have preferred Penix on the Raiders to what we have now...

[WentzerWuver]

I would have preferred Penix on the Raiders to what we have now...

What they really needed was to fill their biggest needs instead of another TE, who has great hands for pass catching but not a true pass blocker. Should have grab Fuaga who was taken immediately after the Raiders took Bowers, since their big need was at OT and CB. Protecting the QB is paramount to their success, which was why Minshew had been struggling. Or draft a potential shutdown corner.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/draft-tracker/

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/taliese-fuaga-crowned-as-the-nfls-best-rookie-through-two-weeks/ar-AA1qQNFs

https://www.rotoballer.com/player-news/brock-bowers-ineffective-in-raiders-week-4-win/1457503

[WentzerWuver]

Awesome game by both offenses.

It REALLY underlines how stupid it was for Atlanta's front office to pick a QB with their first pick after giving Kirk all that money. The Atlanta defense is atrocious and with glaring holes all over the field. Picking a guy like Cameron Latu or trading back to get one of the quality DBs and more picks should've been the obvious choice.

Of course Cousins could get hurt, but you don't assume that in the $100M QB you just signed. And there's no reason to think Penix would be any better this year than one of the many talented veteran QBs that were on the backup market.

Just such a shame that they made such a boneheaded move that undercut the team, just because the GM wanted to zag (and likely hedge the bet against Cousins, so he has more job security if Kirk got hurt or failed). Really poor management which is costing the team.

Longterm it was the right move imo. If you want to criticize them for giving so much money to Cousins then that's fair.

Do you think Green Bay regrets picking Jordan Love? Of course not. It didn't make a ton of sense at the time. But they got their longterm guy.

It was the right move cause they have plenty of high caliber playmakers but no QB capable to take advantage of them since Matty Ice, so they double down to cover Kirk from possible injuries that could derail their season. And Penix Jr. is not raw but should be able to step in like Bo Nix at the next level. Yes, they could have drafted defense but being able to outscore their opponents with their playmakers is another approach that is better served on this team than wasted prime talent for the past 3 seasons. All they need to do is win their weak division and then worry about the playoffs match-ups later.

[JujitsuFlip]

Bengals run defense has been so atrocious this season, allowing 145.5 ypg on average.

I went ahead and did a parlay of Henry for over 83.5 yards AND Lamar over 55.5 yards. I think both are pretty feasible, more confident in the Henry one but had to make it a parlay to make the bet worthwhile, odds wise.

Edit: Ravens have the #1 rushing offense in the NFL, 220.3 ypg on average.

[hermes]

alright, i'm on the early shift today in london town

go vikings!

[hermes]

its not a revenge game for darnold, yeah i'm sure

maybe its better this is in london and not new york so he doesn't get too fired up

[hermes]

mundt cakes!

[hermes]

jefferson with the black accents on the purple uniform is a nice look

[hermes]

so does the nfl fly over a ref crew, chain gang, production people or do they just find people in london to work these games?