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2025 ATL Thread - Burnes to have TJ surgery

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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1341 » by Kerb Hohl » Thu Oct 10, 2024 7:38 pm

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It always amazes me that there are people that pay attention to this sport and torture themselves in a league with no salary cap, highly based on local TV revenue/advertising, and convince themselves that the owner of a team with a 1.5 million metro area population will one day outspend or come close to teams in a city of 10+ million. And as it inevitably doesn't happen each year, they'll get mad again and again and again.

It sucks, but it is what it is and sometimes spending more money on washed vets actually **** you over (mid-market teams).

Always miserable people. Honestly one of the more delusional mindsets I can imagine to continue to care if this is how you view it. Enjoy, I guess.


I tend to agree. Its super frustrating BUT its been that way forever and there is zero I can do to change it. I remember always having to trade guys for prospects when I was a kid in Vaughn, Wickman, Sexson, Burnitz, etc. At least now we have a competent front office to identify young talent and find reasonable deals plus occassionally hang on to a guy like Braun, Yelich. It sucks that if miss on those big contracts that it really can hinder the team vs like LA who can shrug it off, but just the reality of it. Its not like the top payroll equals a championship either. It doesn’t hurt the chances but still need the players to work out and some luck along the way.


Yeah, my whole idea is that 90% of the owners are just as "cheap" as Attanasio, it's just proportional to market size.

Either there is fan-fiction that whatever higher power there is decides that Milwaukee is the graced with the one owner who decides to not turn a 20% profit for his company or ownership group and instead spends into his net worth and randomly outspends the Chicago teams every year...or *every* owner does this and the league is exactly the same, the only difference is Willy Adames costs $50 million/year instead of $25 million/year.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1342 » by ReasonablySober » Thu Oct 10, 2024 8:07 pm

Cheap owners don't need or deserve your defending. There isn't a player in the league that Mark couldn't afford, particularly when you factor in deferrals. Cheap owners have just trained you to believe that they can't.

Now, if you once you accept that Attanasio won't put the Brewers in play for high priced free agents (which, hey, mission accomplished Mark :thumbsup: ) then you can determine for yourself whether it's worth spending $15-$25 million each year on free agents, or if the Brewers should instead step back from free agency and instead allocate that money to extensions when the opportunities present themselves.

Personally, I think most free agency amounts to throwing good money after bad. That would include giving Adames or Burnes $20 million a year. Rewarding past their prime players is a bad idea.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1343 » by Kerb Hohl » Thu Oct 10, 2024 8:17 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:Cheap owners don't need or deserve your defending. There isn't a player in the league that Mark couldn't afford, particularly when you factor in deferrals. Cheap owners have just trained you to believe that they can't.

Now, if you once you accept that Attanasio won't put the Brewers in play for high priced free agents (which, hey, mission accomplished Mark :thumbsup: ) then you can determine for yourself whether it's worth spending $15-$25 million each year on free agents, or if the Brewers should instead step back from free agency and instead allocate that money to extensions when the opportunities present themselves.

Personally, I think most free agency amounts to throwing good money after bad. That would include giving Adames or Burnes $20 million a year. Rewarding past their prime players is a bad idea.


Again, this isn't a defense of an owner like Attanasio but I think some people are clouded by "rich guys = bad" (not totally wrong) they can't comprehend this idea.

Basically all of these guys are trying to churn the same profit. Everyone is proportionally cheap. The Dodgers went on a historic spending spree and if they wanted to, I bet they could have afforded to buy 2-3 more superstars because they have richer owners that were able to easily afford the Dodgers, who in-turn have better profitability with TV contract, rich fans, etc.

Again, there are 2 paths if people get their wish:
1. The Brewers are somehow the charmed franchise that has an owner that spends beyond his means while the other guys treating it as a business still decide not to, and somehow the spending chart is 1. NY, 2. LA, 3. Milwaukee, 4. NY, 5. Chicago 6. Boston, etc. (hey, this would be cool)

2. Everybody gets their wish and all of the cheap owners stop trying to turn such a profit. Suddenly the Yankees have a $500 million payroll, Attanasio has a $225 million payroll, the Pirates and Rockies wake up and spend, and nothing changes to the average fan but the player salaries for the major players are doubled or tripled.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1344 » by Matches Malone » Thu Oct 10, 2024 10:38 pm

Reese Olson kind of looks like the goalkeeper in The Big Green when he's about to windup.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1345 » by Kerb Hohl » Thu Oct 10, 2024 10:57 pm

Matches Malone wrote:Reese Olson kind of looks like the goalkeeper in The Big Green when he's about to windup.


July 30, 2021: Traded by the Milwaukee Brewers to the Detroit Tigers for Daniel Norris.



One we may want to take back, unfortunately.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1346 » by MVP2110 » Fri Oct 11, 2024 1:47 am

It's always funny to me how some people think big market owners are just willing to spend more and small market owners are cheap.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1347 » by ReasonablySober » Fri Oct 11, 2024 1:56 am

MVP2110 wrote:It's always funny to me how some people think big market owners are just willing to spend more and small market owners are cheap.


It's always funny to me when the richest owners in the sport decide to be cheap because they've got the small market excuse.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1348 » by MVP2110 » Fri Oct 11, 2024 2:10 am

ReasonablySober wrote:
MVP2110 wrote:It's always funny to me how some people think big market owners are just willing to spend more and small market owners are cheap.


It's always funny to me when the richest owners in the sport decide to be cheap because they've got the small market excuse.


So you just think it's purely a coincidence that the owners in MLB who aren't "cheap" just happen to own the teams in large markets that bring in more revenue?
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1349 » by ReasonablySober » Fri Oct 11, 2024 2:14 am

MVP2110 wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
MVP2110 wrote:It's always funny to me how some people think big market owners are just willing to spend more and small market owners are cheap.


It's always funny to me when the richest owners in the sport decide to be cheap because they've got the small market excuse.


So you just think it's purely a coincidence that the owners in MLB who aren't "cheap" just happen to own the teams in large markets that bring in more revenue?


Do you have any idea how wealthy the owners of Cleveland, Minnesota, Detroit, Baltimore, and Oakland are? They wipe their asses with Mark A's wealth. They're richer than God. They're just cheap as ****.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1350 » by Thunder Muscle » Fri Oct 11, 2024 2:41 am

It kinda wild that Mark A bought the team for like 225-250M and per Forbes the franchise is worth 1.6B before the season.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1351 » by trwi7 » Fri Oct 11, 2024 2:42 am

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trwi7 wrote:
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It always amazes me that there are people that pay attention to this sport and torture themselves in a league with no salary cap, highly based on local TV revenue/advertising, and convince themselves that the owner of a team with a 1.5 million metro area population will one day outspend or come close to teams in a city of 10+ million. And as it inevitably doesn't happen each year, they'll get mad again and again and again.

It sucks, but it is what it is and sometimes spending more money on washed vets actually **** you over (mid-market teams).

Always miserable people. Honestly one of the more delusional mindsets I can imagine to continue to care if this is how you view it. Enjoy, I guess.


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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1352 » by Kerb Hohl » Fri Oct 11, 2024 1:01 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
MVP2110 wrote:
ReasonablySober wrote:
It's always funny to me when the richest owners in the sport decide to be cheap because they've got the small market excuse.


So you just think it's purely a coincidence that the owners in MLB who aren't "cheap" just happen to own the teams in large markets that bring in more revenue?


Do you have any idea how wealthy the owners of Cleveland, Minnesota, Detroit, Baltimore, and Oakland are? They wipe their asses with Mark A's wealth. They're richer than God. They're just cheap as ****.


So what you're telling me is that Mark is actually spending more than these guys, comparatively. Good for him? Jk, jk.

But again, this isn't a defense of him. The point is that they all are cheap, generally proportional to their market size, so the point is that "the Brewers suck because Attanasio is cheap" is correctly said about like 27 of the MLB teams...so actually if they listened to you, unless it was the Brewers and only the Brewers, everything would be the same to the fan except salaries would go up.

If Attanasio picked up on your virtues and also the Rockies, Orioles, etc. did - the spending would increase proportionally and we'd have the same inequality of spending.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1353 » by Thunder Muscle » Fri Oct 11, 2024 4:15 pm

I know our franchise history is a little rough overall, but to Mark A’s credit this is the best run we have arguably had.

I went back and looked at years we would have made the playoffs in its current format (basically took if were top 6 record) but did not at the time. They are in NL days: 2014, 2017. For AL: 1978, 1979, 1980, 1983, 1987, 1988, 1992.

So really it’s 2017-Current vs. 1978-1983 as best eras ever in history. I know we have no major hardware to show for it, but for as much **** as Mark A takes we’re arguably in our best run of our franchise. Maybe that speaks more to our struggles overall but none the less, haha.

Side note, which of those teams that did not make it would’ve been the best chance to do damage? I loved that 1992 squad and remember the excitement. 1978 & 1979 was before my time but that was a 93 and 95 win team respectively.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1354 » by Iheartfootball » Fri Oct 11, 2024 5:20 pm

There is a difference between the valuation of the franchise and operating revenue. Operating revenue pays for salaries. I'm sure Brewer's operating revenue is not as high as any team from NY, CA, etc.

No owner is putting their personal savings into paying for the team's operating costs. Because they aren't just fans, they are fans and investors and that would be bad business.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1355 » by ReasonablySober » Fri Oct 11, 2024 5:36 pm

Iheartfootball wrote:There is a difference between the valuation of the franchise and operating revenue. Operating revenue pays for salaries. I'm sure Brewer's operating revenue is not as high as any team from NY, CA, etc.

No owner is putting their personal savings into paying for the team's operating costs. Because they aren't just fans, they are fans and investors and that would be bad business.


Sure, but where the valuation is important is it allows an owner to get massive, friendly, loans from any institution in the world. It happens with pro sports teams all the time.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1356 » by Iheartfootball » Fri Oct 11, 2024 5:39 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
Iheartfootball wrote:There is a difference between the valuation of the franchise and operating revenue. Operating revenue pays for salaries. I'm sure Brewer's operating revenue is not as high as any team from NY, CA, etc.

No owner is putting their personal savings into paying for the team's operating costs. Because they aren't just fans, they are fans and investors and that would be bad business.


Sure, but where the valuation is important is it allows an owner to get massive, friendly, loans from any institution in the world. It happens with pro sports teams all the time.


Don't disagree, but again, that debt is financed from operating revenues, not valuation or owner savings.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1357 » by Kerb Hohl » Fri Oct 11, 2024 6:37 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
Iheartfootball wrote:There is a difference between the valuation of the franchise and operating revenue. Operating revenue pays for salaries. I'm sure Brewer's operating revenue is not as high as any team from NY, CA, etc.

No owner is putting their personal savings into paying for the team's operating costs. Because they aren't just fans, they are fans and investors and that would be bad business.


Sure, but where the valuation is important is it allows an owner to get massive, friendly, loans from any institution in the world. It happens with pro sports teams all the time.


Sure, the Brewers could, the Rockies could, the Pirates could...the Dodgers could.

I think we've actually decided that Attanasio puts a little bit more into player salaries vs. the Pirates, who are probably just sucking out profit - but all teams could put more in. They just choose to run this as a business. I'm not holding my breath that Attanasio and *only* Attanasio decides that he should be less cheap.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1358 » by Iheartfootball » Fri Oct 11, 2024 6:47 pm

Do I want Attansio spent more on payroll? Hell YES!

Do I believe he will or am I upset with him when he doesn't? Not really, because capitalism.
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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1359 » by WeekapaugGroove » Fri Oct 11, 2024 7:03 pm

It's funny when you get a guy like the new suns owners who yolo spends you get a decent amount of fans and media who are line 'WFT dude'.

NBA fans are the weirdest about this, I get being a cap league that salary matters but some fans act like they hand out a trophy every year for "most responsible contacts' :)

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Re: 2024 ATL Thread - Pete Rose RIP 

Post#1360 » by MickeyDavis » Fri Oct 11, 2024 11:18 pm

Cleveland/Detroit moved up to 12:08 tomorrow afternoon due to impending bad weather in Cleveland.
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