West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant

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Which duo would you take for your team?

West/Bird
20
49%
Curry/Durant
21
51%
 
Total votes: 41

The Explorer
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Re: West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant 

Post#61 » by The Explorer » Sun Oct 20, 2024 7:00 pm

Curry and Durant wouldn't be able to handle 60s and 80s basketball rules and coaching and culture. Curry would get benched after taking 1-2 long distance shots with no 3 pt line in the 60s and 70s. Durant would face far more physicality in the 80s than he has in the 2010s and 2020s. How would Durant handle racism in society on a daily basis back then, given how sensitive he is on social media? How would Curry's ankle's be in poor quality shoes? Rims and backboards were not what they are today either. Durant being coached by Fred Shaus? I don't see it ending well.
OhayoKD
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Re: West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant 

Post#62 » by OhayoKD » Sun Oct 20, 2024 7:29 pm

tsherkin wrote:
OhayoKD wrote:"Easily" seems a bit much for someone who can't jump, is slow-footed, handles the ball worse than multiple bigs in today's league, and offers very little threat at the rim.


There are a host of inherent assumptions in there about what it takes to be good in this league. And very common ones, which have routinely been proven inaccurate.


And what are you using as proof here? The only player I can think of with top 10 or so impact this era who isn't much stronger than Bird or much more explosive is Steph Curry who...is a much better ball-handler and a standard deviation above everyone in history as a shooter(on top of being significantly quicker).
I'm taking Luka, Jokic, Giannis, Embid, AD, SGA, Edwards, Booker, Lebron, and Steph without much thought. Guys like PG, Tatum, and Gobert seem at least debatable to me. I don't know what your bar for "superstar" is, but I think it gets tenuous after top 12 or so.


I don't really consider George debatable. Were he ever healthy, then it would be a more interesting conversation, but he's also now in his mid-30s, so at this point in time, he isn't even worth discussing in my mind.

That's fair.

I don't think Booker is ahead of him. I don't think Tatum or Gobert are, either. I think AD is another one who is interesting, but because of health and age, I have less and less confidence that he will continue to have 70+-game seasons going forward (last year being his first since 2018).

I don't really care if AD plays 70 rs games as long as he can play in the playoffs.
And I can't really fathom why you would take Ant over him at all.

I mean it would be the same reasons I'd take booker over really though I guess i may be overreacting to his series vs the Nuggets. He wasn't that good in the regular season or vs the Mavs.


Much better ball-handler, much better scorer, better passer(better arm) which combined with better ball-handling should make him a much better creator. This seems pretty straight forward to me.


Not actually a much better scorer. Higher-volume, sure, but not actually a better scorer. Definitely a better creator. You overvalue ball-handling, so that isn't surprising, but it is here at least relevant to Luka's shot creation, so that's fair.

I think they break out pretty similarly. I think Bird, honestly, is the superior scoring weapon, but that Luka is a dramatically superior shot creator, so that makes this a very compelling argument for me.

I mean, now I'm confused. How do they break out similarly if Luka is a dramatically superior shot-creator? Offense and offensive impact signals skew towards playmaking historicallly. If Luka is a much better shot creator and Bird is a somewhat better scoring weapon(doubtful on the latter but let's say he is), how does Bird win that comp?
its my last message in this thread, but I just admit, that all the people, casual and analytical minds, more or less have consencus who has the weight of a rubberized duck. And its not JaivLLLL
OhayoKD
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Re: West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant 

Post#63 » by OhayoKD » Sun Oct 20, 2024 7:30 pm

70sFan wrote:
OhayoKD wrote:"Easily" seems a bit much for someone who can't jump, is slow-footed, handles the ball worse than multiple bigs in today's league, and offers very little threat at the rim.

Isn't that just the description of Jokic?

I should have said "inside scoring". Jokic should be a much bigger threat within 18-feet because he is arguably the strongest player in the league. It also gives him an advantage as a passer and I guess I'll have to admit in light of my recent revelation regarding Hakeem's creation, he may be compensating for the ball-handling component with that post-gravity (though he didn't seem to be drawing the triples hakeem was during last 2 playoffs). Also Jokic was one of the "multiple bigs" I was thinking of. The best ball-handling big is probably Giannis.

I'd say Jokic is well ahead of Bird offensively though defense comes down to the series matchup(give me Jokic vs the Heat or the Clippers, maybe Bird vs the Timberwolves)
its my last message in this thread, but I just admit, that all the people, casual and analytical minds, more or less have consencus who has the weight of a rubberized duck. And its not JaivLLLL
DQuinn1575
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Re: West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant 

Post#64 » by DQuinn1575 » Mon Oct 21, 2024 1:24 am

One_and_Done wrote:
DQuinn1575 wrote:West/Bird are the 2 best defenders and the 2 best passers. They are also the better rebounding pair. They would fit most any team, and the majority of the time fill it out better than Curry/Durant.

Durant is the best defender here by far, as well as the most portable player ever. Bird was a good help defender, but a notoriously poor man defender.



West is definitely the best defender here.

I don't know why you call KD more portable than any of the other 3 - West really can fit in anywhere, being a point guard if you need one, or can play off ball, while being an excellent defender. West is probably as portable as any player ever.
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Re: West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant 

Post#65 » by One_and_Done » Mon Oct 21, 2024 1:29 am

DQuinn1575 wrote:
One_and_Done wrote:
DQuinn1575 wrote:West/Bird are the 2 best defenders and the 2 best passers. They are also the better rebounding pair. They would fit most any team, and the majority of the time fill it out better than Curry/Durant.

Durant is the best defender here by far, as well as the most portable player ever. Bird was a good help defender, but a notoriously poor man defender.



West is definitely the best defender here.

I don't know why you call KD more portable than any of the other 3 - West really can fit in anywhere, being a point guard if you need one, or can play off ball, while being an excellent defender. West is probably as portable as any player ever.

West would fit really nicely on the Nuggets bench this year.
Warspite wrote:Billups was a horrible scorer who could only score with an open corner 3 or a FT.
DQuinn1575
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Re: West/Bird vs. Curry/Durant 

Post#66 » by DQuinn1575 » Mon Oct 21, 2024 9:20 pm

One_and_Done wrote:
DQuinn1575 wrote:
One_and_Done wrote:Durant is the best defender here by far, as well as the most portable player ever. Bird was a good help defender, but a notoriously poor man defender.



West is definitely the best defender here.

I don't know why you call KD more portable than any of the other 3 - West really can fit in anywhere, being a point guard if you need one, or can play off ball, while being an excellent defender. West is probably as portable as any player ever.

West would fit really nicely on the Nuggets bench this year.


ah good one. You are funny.

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