Tank World Order V (Rise of the Phoenix)

[PhilBlackson]

blazers had pretty much the exact same game and beat us out by five to the bottom of the standings. capture the flagg is off to a serious start

Team needs at least two drafts of being awful to get some more prospects on the roster. These young vets are going nowhere. They'd help other teams for sure, but collectively, they're a zero.

that's the entire point and exactly what they're doing. they're tanking this year and probably next for dybantsa. from 2014 to 2019, there was only one raptor left on that championship team and that was kyle lowry.





and even from that team there's only one guy left over and that's boucher who's probably gone after this season

Blazers have a huge advantage being in the west. Don't see anyone in the east out-tanking them.

Idk about that…the Wizards seem like easily the worst team in the league imo.

[Scase]

blazers had pretty much the exact same game and beat us out by five to the bottom of the standings. capture the flagg is off to a serious start


that's the entire point and exactly what they're doing. they're tanking this year and probably next for dybantsa. from 2014 to 2019, there was only one raptor left on that championship team and that was kyle lowry.





and even from that team there's only one guy left over and that's boucher who's probably gone after this season

You are much more confident in this FO to tank than I am. I fully expect them to push for pointless wins, the only thing that I am trusting in currently are the injuries and schedule forcing their hand. Masai has never tanked intentionally before.

Huh? This is just blatantly false. They can tank just fine like anyone else. When did they push for pointless wins last season when they fielded godawful lineups on purpose or in the Tampa year when they rested Lowry and others down the stretch. Whatever happened during the Wemby year wasn't pointless because they were giving that Siakam/Fred/OG/Scottie/Yak/Nurse core a chance to show something and they got upended by DeMar's daughter in the end. The context is entirely different now and everyone from management to coaching to the players themselves have been preaching rebuild since the opening press conference.

At this point, it's just annoying contrarianism to be saying the same old stuff when you know better. Literally game one and Jamison Battle already got 16 minutes of run.

Read on Twitter

come on now. The people that defended Masai/Fred and all that despite everything were annoying to be sure, but being totally on the total other side of that coin where you're being militantly opposed to everything the FO does despite the reality of what they're currently doing, which is obvious tanking, is also just as bad.

RJ and IQ after both missing 5-10 games straight, then proceeded to play 5 and 6 (respectively) of the last 8 remaining games, instead of just sitting it out. Prior to injuries no one at all was sitting out, they were playing full starter minutes, etc. There was literally nothing to indicate that was a tank, it was 2 players having season ending injuries. I've rehashed the Tampa thing multiple times, the starters played significant amounts of games and minutes in the last 20-25 games, there were tons of games with 4 starters playing regularly up until about 8 games left in the season.

Masai does not ever intentionally tank, he has tanks pushed upon him. You think Battle playing is some indication he's decided to go full tank mode? We're just going to ignore RJ, IQ, Olynyk, and Brown being injured? Battle played because we have a ton of injuries and a bad team with zero depth, in a blow out. Yeah he got 16 minutes of run, with 12 of those being the entire 4th quarter in a 30 point blow out, take a guess how many he had in the first half. No need, I'll let you know, zero.

As I already said, I do not have faith that this FO will do the right thing, and until I see some conclusive proof to prove otherwise, the skepticism is entirely warranted. They can preach whatever they want, actions speak louder than words, and they aren't getting a pass after one game.

[Brinbe]

You are much more confident in this FO to tank than I am. I fully expect them to push for pointless wins, the only thing that I am trusting in currently are the injuries and schedule forcing their hand. Masai has never tanked intentionally before.

Huh? This is just blatantly false. They can tank just fine like anyone else. When did they push for pointless wins last season when they fielded godawful lineups on purpose or in the Tampa year when they rested Lowry and others down the stretch. Whatever happened during the Wemby year wasn't pointless because they were giving that Siakam/Fred/OG/Scottie/Yak/Nurse core a chance to show something and they got upended by DeMar's daughter in the end. The context is entirely different now and everyone from management to coaching to the players themselves have been preaching rebuild since the opening press conference.

At this point, it's just annoying contrarianism to be saying the same old stuff when you know better. Literally game one and Jamison Battle already got 16 minutes of run.

Read on Twitter

come on now. The people that defended Masai/Fred and all that despite everything were annoying to be sure, but being totally on the total other side of that coin where you're being militantly opposed to everything the FO does despite the reality of what they're currently doing, which is obvious tanking, is also just as bad.

RJ and IQ after both missing 5-10 games straight, then proceeded to play 5 and 6 (respectively) of the last 8 remaining games, instead of just sitting it out. Prior to injuries no one at all was sitting out, they were playing full starter minutes, etc. There was literally nothing to indicate that was a tank, it was 2 players having season ending injuries. I've rehashed the Tampa thing multiple times, the starters played significant amounts of games and minutes in the last 20-25 games, there were tons of games with 4 starters playing regularly up until about 8 games left in the season.

Masai does not ever intentionally tank, he has tanks pushed upon him. You think Battle playing is some indication he's decided to go full tank mode? We're just going to ignore RJ, IQ, Olynyk, and Brown being injured? Battle played because we have a ton of injuries and a bad team with zero depth, in a blow out. Yeah he got 16 minutes of run, with 12 of those being the entire 4th quarter in a 30 point blow out, take a guess how many he had in the first half. No need, I'll let you know, zero.

As I already said, I do not have faith that this FO will do the right thing, and until I see some conclusive proof to prove otherwise, the skepticism is entirely warranted. They can preach whatever they want, actions speak louder than words, and they aren't getting a pass after one game.

what a load of nonsense. they won 25 games last year and clearly pivoted in that direction. that's all the evidence in your face. stop it. zero point in talking to people that don't argue in good faith at all and that's clearly where you're at.

yes, the team that's playing bruno fernando and jamison battle rotation minutes in game one is deathly serious about winning this year. wake up, man. how do you still not get that they absolutely utilise injuries as their selective tanking method. how are you this blind after all this time??? remember when lowry sat out a bunch of games late in that tampa year and then suddenly was good to go against the lakers and had an amazing game? and then they sat him again afterwards? they sit guys out all the time that could probably go if they cared enough to win but they don't.

the absolute need to be right, overriding the evidence in your face is not a good look at all for someone that thinks they know more than everyone else.

I'm not even someone that loves this front office, I've criticized them plenty. But you can't go around saying that they're not trying to tank and then saying that everything they do just sucks at the same time. trying to have your cake and eat it too is a terrible way to go about having arguments.

the very first word he used to describe this season was rebuilding. and while you can accuse masai of many things, he's usually forthright about the direction/expectations he sets for the team.

Watch on YouTube

what about everything they've done thus far has shown the tiniest inkling that they're not trying to tank?

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

Bruno Fernando sure looks like the guy we brought on to eat minutes when Scottie goes down with "injury".

Not by design of course. Wink, wink.

[Brinbe]

blazers had pretty much the exact same game and beat us out by five to the bottom of the standings. capture the flagg is off to a serious start


that's the entire point and exactly what they're doing. they're tanking this year and probably next for dybantsa. from 2014 to 2019, there was only one raptor left on that championship team and that was kyle lowry.





and even from that team there's only one guy left over and that's boucher who's probably gone after this season

Blazers have a huge advantage being in the west. Don't see anyone in the east out-tanking them.

Idk about that…the Wizards seem like easily the worst team in the league imo.

with the flat odds what real difference does it make if they win 20 and we win 28-30? bad is bad we're still gonna be bottom five and in the mix for a top pick regardless.

[mihaic]

Blazers have a huge advantage being in the west. Don't see anyone in the east out-tanking them.

Idk about that…the Wizards seem like easily the worst team in the league imo.

with the flat odds what real difference does it make if they win 20 and we win 28-30? bad is bad we're still gonna be bottom five and in the mix for a top pick regardless.

If you don't win the lottery then the standings are used. Let's say 3rd worst and compare to 5th worst record. If two teams jump above, it's the difference between 5th and 7th pick. Could be allstar or superstar vs good player.

[mihaic]

I was never this early into a tanking but unless we get a Kawhi type trade (highly unlikely) there is no other route I can see that can make us top 3 or 4 in the east.

I am 90% sure Scottie on his own will not take this team there.

Let's see how they play with RJ, we sorely needed his scoring this past game.

[Chandan]

how do you still not get that they absolutely utilise injuries as their selective tanking method. how are you this blind after all this time???

I remember we had a pivotal game where we needed to win against indiana last season which would have a lot of sway on the overall draft position. (Its one of those time we actually needed to win to help keep our pick)

They decided to sit IQ and totally forfeited the game from minute 1. They sure did "weaponized" the injuries alright. I wasnt even suprised because they never seem to do the smart things and prioitize the big picture stuff. They have always prefer to let the chip fall whereever instead of positioning thmselves at advantageous spot.

[Spida888]

During the Tampa year, we were trying to tank by sitting out multiple players during certain games. If not mistaken that was the year Lowry joked that he was really well "rested". I don't recall Masai tanking in other years though besides the Tampa year. The organization wasn't making money selling seats during the pandemic, so it was the perfect year to tank.

This year, I'll wait and see how committed they are to tanking for the draft when tanking generally means less revenue. It's encouraging that the FO regurgitated we are a rebuilding team multiple times, but there are still some question marks for me. If they're selling less tickets, will they play the starters more/rest players less to win more? If they are in 9th/10th place will they push for the play-in with win now moves, or trade Poeltl for future assets because that helps the tank?

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

Huh? This is just blatantly false. They can tank just fine like anyone else. When did they push for pointless wins last season when they fielded godawful lineups on purpose or in the Tampa year when they rested Lowry and others down the stretch. Whatever happened during the Wemby year wasn't pointless because they were giving that Siakam/Fred/OG/Scottie/Yak/Nurse core a chance to show something and they got upended by DeMar's daughter in the end. The context is entirely different now and everyone from management to coaching to the players themselves have been preaching rebuild since the opening press conference.

At this point, it's just annoying contrarianism to be saying the same old stuff when you know better. Literally game one and Jamison Battle already got 16 minutes of run.

Read on Twitter

come on now. The people that defended Masai/Fred and all that despite everything were annoying to be sure, but being totally on the total other side of that coin where you're being militantly opposed to everything the FO does despite the reality of what they're currently doing, which is obvious tanking, is also just as bad.

RJ and IQ after both missing 5-10 games straight, then proceeded to play 5 and 6 (respectively) of the last 8 remaining games, instead of just sitting it out. Prior to injuries no one at all was sitting out, they were playing full starter minutes, etc. There was literally nothing to indicate that was a tank, it was 2 players having season ending injuries. I've rehashed the Tampa thing multiple times, the starters played significant amounts of games and minutes in the last 20-25 games, there were tons of games with 4 starters playing regularly up until about 8 games left in the season.

Masai does not ever intentionally tank, he has tanks pushed upon him. You think Battle playing is some indication he's decided to go full tank mode? We're just going to ignore RJ, IQ, Olynyk, and Brown being injured? Battle played because we have a ton of injuries and a bad team with zero depth, in a blow out. Yeah he got 16 minutes of run, with 12 of those being the entire 4th quarter in a 30 point blow out, take a guess how many he had in the first half. No need, I'll let you know, zero.

As I already said, I do not have faith that this FO will do the right thing, and until I see some conclusive proof to prove otherwise, the skepticism is entirely warranted. They can preach whatever they want, actions speak louder than words, and they aren't getting a pass after one game.

what a load of nonsense. they won 25 games last year and clearly pivoted in that direction. that's all the evidence in your face. stop it. zero point in talking to people that don't argue in good faith at all and that's clearly where you're at.

yes, the team that's playing bruno fernando and jamison battle rotation minutes in game one is deathly serious about winning this year. wake up, man. how do you still not get that they absolutely utilise injuries as their selective tanking method. how are you this blind after all this time??? remember when lowry sat out a bunch of games late in that tampa year and then suddenly was good to go against the lakers and had an amazing game? and then they sat him again afterwards? they sit guys out all the time that could probably go if they cared enough to win but they don't.

the absolute need to be right, overriding the evidence in your face is not a good look at all for someone that thinks they know more than everyone else.

I'm not even someone that loves this front office, I've criticized them plenty. But you can't go around saying that they're not trying to tank and then saying that everything they do just sucks at the same time. trying to have your cake and eat it too is a terrible way to go about having arguments.

the very first word he used to describe this season was rebuilding. and while you can accuse masai of many things, he's usually forthright about the direction/expectations he sets for the team.

Watch on YouTube

what about everything they've done thus far has shown the tiniest inkling that they're not trying to tank?

idk man when I hear Masai use the term "rebuilding" to me it sounds like he's saying "play-in"

[deeps6x]

how do you still not get that they absolutely utilise injuries as their selective tanking method. how are you this blind after all this time???

I remember we had a pivotal game where we needed to win against indiana last season which would have a lot of sway on the overall draft position. (Its one of those time we actually needed to win to help keep our pick)

They decided to sit IQ and totally forfeited the game from minute 1. They sure did "weaponized" the injuries alright. I wasnt even suprised because they never seem to do the smart things and prioitize the big picture stuff. They have always prefer to let the chip fall whereever instead of positioning thmselves at advantageous spot.

We could have had Edey.

[Chandan]

We could have had Edey.

And we are in going for top 7th this year. that 1st rd pick to Spurs will convert to a 2nd round pick after next.

Its things like this that makes people wonder if masai will actually stick to the plan.

[Scase]

how do you still not get that they absolutely utilise injuries as their selective tanking method. how are you this blind after all this time???

I remember we had a pivotal game where we needed to win against indiana last season which would have a lot of sway on the overall draft position. (Its one of those time we actually needed to win to help keep our pick)

They decided to sit IQ and totally forfeited the game from minute 1. They sure did "weaponized" the injuries alright. I wasnt even suprised because they never seem to do the smart things and prioitize the big picture stuff. They have always prefer to let the chip fall whereever instead of positioning thmselves at advantageous spot.

Maybe I'm wrong, maybe they were tanking that whole time, and maybe they were just too incompetent to do it properly, I'm not sure which one is worse

Masai is the king of re-tools, and until I see otherwise, I'm not going to put blind faith in a guy who has for years talked out of both sides of his mouth to just gas up the public. Actions speak louder than words, and right now the only actions I've seen, have been players legitimately being injured forcing his hand.

[TheRaptor!]

Is flagg a bigger prospect than Wemby?

[bballsparkin]

If you don't win the lottery then the standings are used. Let's say 3rd worst and compare to 5th worst record. If two teams jump above, it's the difference between 5th and 7th pick. Could be allstar or superstar vs good player.

3rd worst seems unrealistic. Unnecessary stress. 5th could be attainable if the start to the season goes badly. Or perhaps for this thread a bad start is good.

[bballsparkin]

Is flagg a bigger prospect than Wemby?

I don't think so. He might not even go first in this draft. Wemby probably does in any draft going back to LeBron's draft. Or perhaps AD maybe. Flagg definitely seems like a high level prospect though.

[bluerap23]

We could have had Edey.

And we are in going for top 7th this year. that 1st rd pick to Spurs will convert to a 2nd round pick after next.

Its things like this that makes people wonder if masai will actually stick to the plan.

Pick to Spurs has already conveyed.

[anotherhomer]

We could have had Edey.

And we are in going for top 7th this year. that 1st rd pick to Spurs will convert to a 2nd round pick after next.

Its things like this that makes people wonder if masai will actually stick to the plan.

Pick to Spurs has already conveyed.

we conveyed a weak pick to Spurs

[REJECTEDBYCLARK]

the fanbase honestly deserves decades of treadmilling so they can get their quick dopamine fix ~41 games a year

would be proper punishment for hating against T.w.o.

[metafisical]

I wish we could play Boston (full strength and healthy) or OKC every game this season. Oh yeah, and sitting out Scotty, RJ, and Quickely. And Poeltl. That would be a dream season for me.