PG: Knicks vs. Rockets where I want to strangle the refs

[thebuzzardman]

It's a shame the Knicks traded Randle since the same fans that trashed him have decided to turn on Brunson because "too many shots, he's selfish"

Do these people even watch the rest of the NBA? Are they aware that top options put up 20 shots a game regularly, to include the "point guard"

It isn't the 90's anymore. There aren't any Stockton/Mark Jackson point guards anymore.
Well, maybe Haliburton. He passes a lot. There. There's one. Chris Paul at the end of his career. There's the other.

Right. The problem isn't the shots, it's that he's missing shots he usually makes and is not adjusting when he's off.

Some more Kolek minutes would have had him better situated for a late game strike as well.

The problem there is nobody else to take the ball from him.

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Same problem as last year.

Mikal is "ok" on the ball but not enough. Not unlike Randle.

It's that KAT, OG and Hart can't really create, though KAT is an excellent finisher of plays he needs to be set up.

So, a defense just has to key on Brunson, play off Hart, and Knicks are done.

Any team with a shred of commitment to defense can beat them. Pretty easily.

[Spree2Houston]

We’re missing Divincenzo. We need a guard who can spam 15 threes and we don’t have anyone with a quick enough release to do that.

[RHODEY]

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[JayTWill]

Until we get farther out the BOS game is going to really impact those DEF numbers.

I was thinking this. That Boston game is going to gunk up the defensive metrics a lot.

Either way it's a good reminder that this is an ongoing process of improvement. There will be hiccups.

I know its tough to take 1 game out of a 7 game sample size but since BOS is just so good and couldn't miss anything from deep.

If you exclude the BOS game.

OFF rating - 118.8 (tied for 3rd in league)
DEF rating - 108.1 (ranked 4th in the league)
Net rating - 10.8 (ranked 4th in the league)

We have also played the 4th hardest SOS early in the season.

I don't think its time for doom and gloom we are figuring this stuff out. And the metrics would suggest we are likely going to be a top 5 team in the league when we figure it all out.

Just out of curiosity what happens if you remove the Detroit game which was basically a reversal of the Celtics game where instead the Knicks were the ones allowed to do whatever they wanted? What do the numbers look like? The Celtics couldn't miss in that game but it's not like the Knicks made things difficult for them either.

[knicksNOTslick]

hart is being guarding by centers that are trash. he literally was guarded by sengun and steven adams this entire game. that is insulting and we were barely able to exploit it until the end using him as a screen and roller.

hart is a problem for this offense. anyone acting like it's not a concern has their blinders on.

listening to the KFS pod and hearing macri ask "who is the worst offensive player in the starting lineup" and actually having to think about it and act as if hart isn't a complete liability is absurd. he questions if deuce is better offensively. OG is actually being defended by real players and still putting up numbers. hart brings the hustle/rebounding etc and transition offense - but in the half court (what the playoffs largely becomes) he is an absolute liability. this team's best lineups in the playoffs are going to include him sitting on the bench.

hart needs to be a bench energy guy that plays 15-25 minutes a night depending on matchups. him starting and playing 30+ minutes is a big problem.

i understand now there are injuries so there aren't great alternatives. but i already know even when precious/mitch/shamet come back thibs is still going to start and play this guy 30+ minutes. he was playing him over divo last year until injuries forced him to play divo more. he overly emphasizes the "rebounding/hustle" component. that doesn't matter if he ruins your offense.

Hart wasn't the reason we lost this game... Jalen's selfish play and missing bunnies, the overall team's lack of boxing out, poor interior defense by KAT and OG on Sengun, poor coaching adjustments to their switch defense, Sims and McBride giving you zero... Hart actually had some huge plays for us several times that got us within 1 (steals, finishes, unselfish passes to teammates, etc.).

i'm not blaming hart directly for the loss - but pointing out that he ruins the offense. it's part of the reason brunson goes 1 on 1 because the other 3 guys stay on their man and whoever is guarding hart completely ignores him. it's part of why he does "make some huge plays" - because the defense is acting like he doesn't exist so he's able to sneak in on cuts etc and grab boards.

the point is i already see a theme and thibs doesn't seem capable of exploiting how teams are defending us. they're essentially using a big wing/forward on Kat and putting the worst defender (often their center) on hart.

sure he gets the occasional backcut etc but overall it has completely stifled our offense. there has to be an answer to it outside of trying to just get mismatches or using hart as a screener - or worse just brunson going 1 on 1 with hart's guy acting as a help defender.

I agree. Hart passing up shots is so costly. It disrupts our offense because he will be wide open and almost always he passes back out and then the Knicks have to create something before the clock runs out. I would rather he take the shot no matter how bad the percentage is.

Hart should really be a bench player if he is unwilling to shoot.

[TheGreenArrow]

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Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mpharris36]

I was thinking this. That Boston game is going to gunk up the defensive metrics a lot.

Either way it's a good reminder that this is an ongoing process of improvement. There will be hiccups.

I know its tough to take 1 game out of a 7 game sample size but since BOS is just so good and couldn't miss anything from deep.

If you exclude the BOS game.

OFF rating - 118.8 (tied for 3rd in league)
DEF rating - 108.1 (ranked 4th in the league)
Net rating - 10.8 (ranked 4th in the league)

We have also played the 4th hardest SOS early in the season.

I don't think its time for doom and gloom we are figuring this stuff out. And the metrics would suggest we are likely going to be a top 5 team in the league when we figure it all out.

Just out of curiosity what happens if you remove the Detroit game which was basically a reversal of the Celtics game where instead the Knicks were the ones allowed to do whatever they wanted? What do the numbers look like? The Celtics couldn't miss in that game but it's not like the Knicks made things difficult for them either.

we can do that to the cows come home I just think there is no team in the NBA like the Celtics especially when they are on fire. We will play plenty teams like DET throughout the season.

[The Vo Show]

Knicks bench is too thin and small. Sims is also terrible. I knew rebounding was going to be a problem but I was hoping it was pre-season stuff. Now its pretty clear 6 games in we are going to need size.

[2010]

Not sure what people are on, but Brunson isn’t the problem here. We just got outworked, end of story. It happens.

The energy and the basketball gods can be sensitive. Cats better chill with the turning on Brunson crap, cuz one injury to him could change everything for this franchise to go right back to schit.

At times, dudes are gonna miss shots or go through a rough patch. But if he is really playing “selfish” ask yourselves if you would still feel that he’s been shooting excessively if the shots were going in?

Be honest with yourself…

[whocares1]

Right. The problem isn't the shots, it's that he's missing shots he usually makes and is not adjusting when he's off.

Some more Kolek minutes would have had him better situated for a late game strike as well.

The problem there is nobody else to take the ball from him.

Sent from my SM-S9080 using RealGM mobile app

Same problem as last year.

Mikal is "ok" on the ball but not enough. Not unlike Randle.

It's that KAT, OG and Hart can't really create, though KAT is an excellent finisher of plays he needs to be set up.

So, a defense just has to key on Brunson, play off Hart, and Knicks are done.

Any team with a shred of commitment to defense can beat them. Pretty easily.

You don’t need a starting five of creators. You need players that can’t be guarded strictly in single coverage. Both Brunson and Towns have that ability. Knicks have looked worse on switching teams bc Brunson hasn’t made these teams pay. When that inevitably changes it will force teams to help and our shooters don’t need much space. The way FVV was able to use an Adams screen and get what he wanted is exactly what we need Brunson to learn to do with Towns.

[JayTWill]

I know its tough to take 1 game out of a 7 game sample size but since BOS is just so good and couldn't miss anything from deep.

If you exclude the BOS game.

OFF rating - 118.8 (tied for 3rd in league)
DEF rating - 108.1 (ranked 4th in the league)
Net rating - 10.8 (ranked 4th in the league)

We have also played the 4th hardest SOS early in the season.

I don't think its time for doom and gloom we are figuring this stuff out. And the metrics would suggest we are likely going to be a top 5 team in the league when we figure it all out.

Just out of curiosity what happens if you remove the Detroit game which was basically a reversal of the Celtics game where instead the Knicks were the ones allowed to do whatever they wanted? What do the numbers look like? The Celtics couldn't miss in that game but it's not like the Knicks made things difficult for them either.

we can do that to the cows come home I just think there is no team in the NBA like the Celtics especially when they are on fire. We will play plenty teams like DET throughout the season.

I understand but I feel like we should be more concerned about how the team matches up against the Celtcis and not teams like the Pistons if they want to be more than a good/great regular season team. I was truly curious what the numbers would look like. How do you calculate the numbers?

[2010]

We’re missing Divincenzo. We need a guard who can spam 15 threes and we don’t have anyone with a quick enough release to do that.

This is practo-facto!

Although as a team we shoot a good percentage from three and score efficiently overall, we can’t get our 3pt volumes up, on par with the rest of the league because aside from Brunson, we lack 3pt shot creation.

All of our other 3pt shooters are catch & shoot guys. They can’t get to their 3pt shot off the bounce the way Donte did.

The only other one who can kinda do it (potentially) with any consistency is Deuce. But he was way off last night.

[TheGreenArrow]

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[2010]

Knicks bench is too thin and small. Sims is also terrible. I knew rebounding was going to be a problem but I was hoping it was pre-season stuff. Now its pretty clear 6 games in we are going to need size.

Sims needs to be out of the rotation. He’s not an NBA player. Not sure why we’ve kept him in tow for so long. Huk is better right now. Precious can’t get healthy soon enough.

But ultimately when Mitch comes back, our team will have gelled at that point and the chemistry should be intact. So Mitch will be like a trade deadline acquisition. What he brings we desperately need when placing big, active, physical teams like the Rockets and the Cavs.

[3toheadmelo]

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Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nobody is really scared of KAT being our anchor. Feels like there’s been multiple times where opponents have admitted the game plan was to attack him. And I don’t even need to say anything about sims

[mpharris36]

Just out of curiosity what happens if you remove the Detroit game which was basically a reversal of the Celtics game where instead the Knicks were the ones allowed to do whatever they wanted? What do the numbers look like? The Celtics couldn't miss in that game but it's not like the Knicks made things difficult for them either.

we can do that to the cows come home I just think there is no team in the NBA like the Celtics especially when they are on fire. We will play plenty teams like DET throughout the season.

I understand but I feel like we should be more concerned about how the team matches up against the Celtics and not teams like the Pistons if they want to be more than a good/great regular season team. I was truly curious what the numbers would look like. How do you calculate the numbers?

on NBA.com but you can't really exclude 1 game unless it was excluding a first game like the celtics. Its a little more complicated to filter a game in the middle...more at beginning or end.

And yes we should probably compare ourselves vs playoff teams but I am still throwing out the BOS game as an outlier. Ring ceremony night our team hasn't played together...lot of factors that probably shouldn't happen vs BOS next time.

We have played one of the toughest schedules so far this year.

[2010]

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Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nobody is really scared of KAT being our anchor. Feels like there’s been multiple times where opponents have admitted the game plan was to attack him. And I don’t even need to say anything about sims

Committing to him at the 5 is essentially committing to hoping you outshoot/outscore opponents.

I’ve consistently stated, I hope the T-Wolves model is what the plan is when Mitch is healthy. KAT at the 4, Mitch at the 5 (in the Gobert role) was successful for Minnesota so it would be for us.

The 5-out faction of our fanbase has been hype for KAT at the 5. But it’s not even really a 5-out offense when you got Hart in the starting 5.

For 5-out to have a chance to exploit these big physical teams, you’d have to bring Hart off the bench and start McBride in his place. But for whatever reason, Thibs has refused to do that.

But you can’t play non-shooters (Hart) with KAT at the 5 and have no rim protection but then expect to beat big physical teams when you’re undersized.

[KnixinSix]

Early pattern is Knicks are having some trouble with teams who switch everything
too much searching for mismatches and ISOs making it too easy on opposing defense.Thibs needs to be more creative drawing up plays vs these looks.

When teams play drop and zone tho Knicks are destroying it.

[TheGreenArrow]

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[mpharris36]

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