Official 2024-2025 Magic General Season Thread I

[thelead]

You'd feel better about our team if we looked like the best team in the league?

Yes

The point is, we have all of our picks and Denver's picks, 2 young prospects, and a ton of decent vets on short deals. We have plenty of assets to get our Kristaps and our Holiday/White.

I'm not suggesting that we do this ASAP but it should be the goal over the next 2 years.

Who is that player, buddy?

We sit back and wait for them to become available. Dejounte was one guy that was available this summer but he's certified crazy so I'm okay with us not making a move for him.

Have to find teams that are underperforming and are ready to go in a different direction.

[VFX]

Let me ask you folks a bold question:

Without Paolo, our roster and competitiveness is just horrible (among the league's worst in offensive rating plus 3pt shooting)

Should we explore trade or even tanking to improve our roster to get into Championship contention discussion? (I am not a fan of us tanking)

We have trade assets, including young pieces and draft picks. But I am not a fan of us wasting this season instead of player development and building a culture plus chemistry of winning.

But clearly, we are not good enough in terms of championship contention.

What should Magic do? Paolo's injury exposed this team?

No. We've identified our #1, #2, and #3 options. Our core is set. Now it's about developing AB and Jett into impact contributors, establishing a system and winning identity, and acquiring the right role players. Don't need lottery picks for that.

Indeed, in a world where we are a lottery team our core gets called into question and our championship window gets pushed back. Terrible scenario.

I do understand even with Jeff Weltman's philosophy of building it thru draft and organic development, hence very likely this team now and future is set with #1, #2, and #3.

But what about current situation now? With Paolo out, our team has lost 4 in a row by double digit, or blow out.

Is the depth good enough, is our second or third option good enough to carry the team? Or is our shooting and bench good enough?

Another thinking of mine is can we do better than the current construction of our roster not just short term but long term of possibly contending for Championships?

In that case, I am talking about a potential trade.

If, if and if our FO makes good judgement and have a good strategy in the now plus future, Orlando Magic could be a VERY VERY GOOD team, even a dynasty

Here is the issue.

Options #1,#2, and #3 are also in the crucial developing stage. None of these guys will be in their prime for another few years.

That makes it very difficult to both draft and develop the perfect complimentary players within the same timeframe without sacrificing THEIR development as well. Orlando this season WITH Paolo were not contenders.

For contrast, OKC just moved their youth for veteran depth as they are legitimately contending for a championship NOW.

Boston had to move their investments to attain:
Jrue Holiday (Robert Williams, Malcolm Brogdon, x2 frps)
Derek White (Langford, Richardson, top 4 pick :became Blake Wesley)
Porzingis (Marcus Smart)

So in reality the Magic's core is the only really important investment for development. The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster is extremely slim. They would need to see huge strides in development otherwise.

Watching this team so far this season, everyone looks to be on the table outside of Paolo, Suggs, or Franz. At least they absolutely should be. Nobody else has proven they are a good fit next to those guys moving forward.

[eyriq]

The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster as extremely slim.

I agree with this. Building a core 3 via the lottery is already a rare outcome. Core 4? Slim. Core 5? Unheard of.

That said, we are in the window to give it a go. Suggs' contract is friendly enough to fit in another core player down the road.

[BadMofoPimp]

This just shows that Franz is not a Max player. He shoulda gotten a deal closer to Suggs level.

[VFX]

The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster as extremely slim.

I agree with this. Building a core 3 via the lottery is already a rare outcome. Core 4? Slim. Core 5? Unheard of.

That said, we are in the window to give it a go. Suggs' contract is friendly enough to fit in another core player down the road.

In all likelihood its not going to be the guys already handed large extensions. Definitely not Paolo.

Some combination of Carter, Cole, 2024 DEN 1st, 2024 ORL 1st, Jett, AB, etc. JI and KCP down the road. Basically everyone that can bring better cohesion to the guys we absolutely know for a fact have clearly defined roles here.

[MasterGMer]

No. We've identified our #1, #2, and #3 options. Our core is set. Now it's about developing AB and Jett into impact contributors, establishing a system and winning identity, and acquiring the right role players. Don't need lottery picks for that.

Indeed, in a world where we are a lottery team our core gets called into question and our championship window gets pushed back. Terrible scenario.

I do understand even with Jeff Weltman's philosophy of building it thru draft and organic development, hence very likely this team now and future is set with #1, #2, and #3.

But what about current situation now? With Paolo out, our team has lost 4 in a row by double digit, or blow out.

Is the depth good enough, is our second or third option good enough to carry the team? Or is our shooting and bench good enough?

Another thinking of mine is can we do better than the current construction of our roster not just short term but long term of possibly contending for Championships?

In that case, I am talking about a potential trade.

If, if and if our FO makes good judgement and have a good strategy in the now plus future, Orlando Magic could be a VERY VERY GOOD team, even a dynasty

Here is the issue.

Options #1,#2, and #3 are also in the crucial developing stage. None of these guys will be in their prime for another few years.

That makes it very difficult to both draft and develop the perfect complimentary players within the same timeframe without sacrificing THEIR development as well. Orlando this season WITH Paolo were not contenders.

For contrast, OKC just moved their youth for veteran depth as they are legitimately contending for a championship NOW.

Boston had to move their investments to attain:
Jrue Holiday (Robert Williams, Malcolm Brogdon, x2 frps)
Derek White (Langford, Richardson, top 4 pick :became Blake Wesley)
Porzingis (Marcus Smart)

So in reality the Magic's core is the only really important investment for development. The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster is extremely slim. They would need to see huge strides in development otherwise.

Watching this team so far this season, everyone looks to be on the table outside of Paolo, Suggs, or Franz. At least they absolutely should be. Nobody else has proven they are a good fit next to those guys moving forward.

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

[eyriq]

I do understand even with Jeff Weltman's philosophy of building it thru draft and organic development, hence very likely this team now and future is set with #1, #2, and #3.

But what about current situation now? With Paolo out, our team has lost 4 in a row by double digit, or blow out.

Is the depth good enough, is our second or third option good enough to carry the team? Or is our shooting and bench good enough?

Another thinking of mine is can we do better than the current construction of our roster not just short term but long term of possibly contending for Championships?

In that case, I am talking about a potential trade.

If, if and if our FO makes good judgement and have a good strategy in the now plus future, Orlando Magic could be a VERY VERY GOOD team, even a dynasty

Here is the issue.

Options #1,#2, and #3 are also in the crucial developing stage. None of these guys will be in their prime for another few years.

That makes it very difficult to both draft and develop the perfect complimentary players within the same timeframe without sacrificing THEIR development as well. Orlando this season WITH Paolo were not contenders.

For contrast, OKC just moved their youth for veteran depth as they are legitimately contending for a championship NOW.

Boston had to move their investments to attain:
Jrue Holiday (Robert Williams, Malcolm Brogdon, x2 frps)
Derek White (Langford, Richardson, top 4 pick :became Blake Wesley)
Porzingis (Marcus Smart)

So in reality the Magic's core is the only really important investment for development. The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster is extremely slim. They would need to see huge strides in development otherwise.

Watching this team so far this season, everyone looks to be on the table outside of Paolo, Suggs, or Franz. At least they absolutely should be. Nobody else has proven they are a good fit next to those guys moving forward.

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

AB is a home run prospect. Already an elite defender. We are seeing his playmaking unlocked. We've seen his spot up shooting and off-ball IQ. Super young. Great free throw rate in college and last year.

[thelead]

This just shows that Franz is not a Max player. He shoulda gotten a deal closer to Suggs level.

I would have been good with 5/175 even.

[Fortune Teller]

Here is the issue.

Options #1,#2, and #3 are also in the crucial developing stage. None of these guys will be in their prime for another few years.

That makes it very difficult to both draft and develop the perfect complimentary players within the same timeframe without sacrificing THEIR development as well. Orlando this season WITH Paolo were not contenders.

For contrast, OKC just moved their youth for veteran depth as they are legitimately contending for a championship NOW.

Boston had to move their investments to attain:
Jrue Holiday (Robert Williams, Malcolm Brogdon, x2 frps)
Derek White (Langford, Richardson, top 4 pick :became Blake Wesley)
Porzingis (Marcus Smart)

So in reality the Magic's core is the only really important investment for development. The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster is extremely slim. They would need to see huge strides in development otherwise.

Watching this team so far this season, everyone looks to be on the table outside of Paolo, Suggs, or Franz. At least they absolutely should be. Nobody else has proven they are a good fit next to those guys moving forward.

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

AB is a home run prospect. Already an elite defender. We are seeing his playmaking unlocked. We've seen his spot up shooting and off-ball IQ. Super young. Great free throw rate in college and last year.

Let's check in on how the home-run prospect is doing through 8 games in Year 2:

24.6 mpg
6.8 ppg
3.1 rpg
3.9 apg
0.6 spg
0.9 bpg
38.5% FG%
29.4% 3PT%
69.2 FT%

[thelead]

I'm hoping that our guy Creativetran was just hacked and that this isn't what they do:
viewtopic.php?f=42&t=2415346

[VFX]

I'm hoping that our guy Creativetran was just hacked and that this isn't what they do:
viewtopic.php?f=42&t=2415346

Wood chipper

[eyriq]

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

AB is a home run prospect. Already an elite defender. We are seeing his playmaking unlocked. We've seen his spot up shooting and off-ball IQ. Super young. Great free throw rate in college and last year.

Let's check in on how the home-run prospect is doing through 8 games in Year 2:

24.6 mpg
6.8 ppg
3.1 rpg
3.9 apg
0.6 spg
0.9 bpg
38.5% FG%
29.4% 3PT%
69.2 FT%

You left out the two mittens

[VFX]

Here is the issue.

Options #1,#2, and #3 are also in the crucial developing stage. None of these guys will be in their prime for another few years.

That makes it very difficult to both draft and develop the perfect complimentary players within the same timeframe without sacrificing THEIR development as well. Orlando this season WITH Paolo were not contenders.

For contrast, OKC just moved their youth for veteran depth as they are legitimately contending for a championship NOW.

Boston had to move their investments to attain:
Jrue Holiday (Robert Williams, Malcolm Brogdon, x2 frps)
Derek White (Langford, Richardson, top 4 pick :became Blake Wesley)
Porzingis (Marcus Smart)

So in reality the Magic's core is the only really important investment for development. The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster is extremely slim. They would need to see huge strides in development otherwise.

Watching this team so far this season, everyone looks to be on the table outside of Paolo, Suggs, or Franz. At least they absolutely should be. Nobody else has proven they are a good fit next to those guys moving forward.

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

AB is a home run prospect. Already an elite defender. We are seeing his playmaking unlocked. We've seen his spot up shooting and off-ball IQ. Super young. Great free throw rate in college and last year.

This depends entirely on whether he runs offense with Paolo at point guard. Anything other than that, and he’s a supplemental guy that can be moved. His value has to outweigh better fitting trade options.

[msmoore66]

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

AB is a home run prospect. Already an elite defender. We are seeing his playmaking unlocked. We've seen his spot up shooting and off-ball IQ. Super young. Great free throw rate in college and last year.

Let's check in on how the home-run prospect is doing through 8 games in Year 2:

24.6 mpg
6.8 ppg
3.1 rpg
3.9 apg
0.6 spg
0.9 bpg
38.5% FG%
29.4% 3PT%
69.2 FT%

As someone who makes a living dealing in the future prospects of your client(s), I would have thought you would understand how the term "prospect" is applied to a 20 year old in this scenario.

[msmoore66]

I'm hoping that our guy Creativetran was just hacked and that this isn't what they do:
viewtopic.php?f=42&t=2415346

Dead end link, assume it was deleted. Brief summary?

[thelead]

I'm hoping that our guy Creativetran was just hacked and that this isn't what they do:
viewtopic.php?f=42&t=2415346

Dead end link, assume it was deleted. Brief summary?

Let's just say it was links to (probably fake) CP content

[VFX]

I do understand even with Jeff Weltman's philosophy of building it thru draft and organic development, hence very likely this team now and future is set with #1, #2, and #3.

But what about current situation now? With Paolo out, our team has lost 4 in a row by double digit, or blow out.

Is the depth good enough, is our second or third option good enough to carry the team? Or is our shooting and bench good enough?

Another thinking of mine is can we do better than the current construction of our roster not just short term but long term of possibly contending for Championships?

In that case, I am talking about a potential trade.

If, if and if our FO makes good judgement and have a good strategy in the now plus future, Orlando Magic could be a VERY VERY GOOD team, even a dynasty

Here is the issue.

Options #1,#2, and #3 are also in the crucial developing stage. None of these guys will be in their prime for another few years.

That makes it very difficult to both draft and develop the perfect complimentary players within the same timeframe without sacrificing THEIR development as well. Orlando this season WITH Paolo were not contenders.

For contrast, OKC just moved their youth for veteran depth as they are legitimately contending for a championship NOW.

Boston had to move their investments to attain:
Jrue Holiday (Robert Williams, Malcolm Brogdon, x2 frps)
Derek White (Langford, Richardson, top 4 pick :became Blake Wesley)
Porzingis (Marcus Smart)

So in reality the Magic's core is the only really important investment for development. The others have a greater chance to be developed to be later moved. Why? Because the likelihood they ALL become integral parts of the contending timeframe of this particular roster is extremely slim. They would need to see huge strides in development otherwise.

Watching this team so far this season, everyone looks to be on the table outside of Paolo, Suggs, or Franz. At least they absolutely should be. Nobody else has proven they are a good fit next to those guys moving forward.

Don't you think AB can fit in pretty well being the #4 guy? I do. I think AB's development this season is going to benefit this team short term and long term.

Why? One thing is because of his offensive upside. Second is his defense. Botton line is dude is only 20 .

I know I know I do not want to turn it into another AB debate. But at least from a team constructing stand point, AB could be BIG

Could be. It depends on his role. Like I said, he has to provide huge value at a very important position competitive to trade targets in the rest of the league. He has time to figure that out, but if Orlando wants to get to the same levels as those teams I have mentioned (with their core guys) they are absolutely going to move a ton of players on this roster.

They cannot squander the competitive window of 2 max players AND Suggs at the expense of waiting for years for Anthony Black to prove he is better than point guards that are known quantities that work better with the current investment core.

And again, it is nearly impossible for a team to 100% draft their starting lineup and expect those guys to be the final iteration of this team. As of right this very moment... No I don't think Anthony Black fits with the three guys that are making the most money on this roster. I would love to be wrong about that, but I don't think I am. Why? This roster needs a guy that can move the basketball and create for others while still being good, if not great, on ball.

[msmoore66]

I'm hoping that our guy Creativetran was just hacked and that this isn't what they do:
viewtopic.php?f=42&t=2415346

Dead end link, assume it was deleted. Brief summary?

Let's just say it was links to (probably fake) CP content

Thanks, however going to be out of touch here and admit I don't know what CP is.

[RookieStar]

How is everyone here? All American posters voting/finished-voting???

[thelead]

Dead end link, assume it was deleted. Brief summary?

Let's just say it was links to (probably fake) CP content

Thanks, however going to be out of touch here and admit I don't know what CP is.

Don't want to spell it out but it has to do with kids and illegal content.