GT: Hornets vs Sixers Sun Nov 10 7pm

[KembaWalker]

Salaun should be getting on ball reps in the g league, Gibson should be dominating the weekend runs at LA Fitness or a practice body on Thibs coaching staff.

It would be nice if LaMelo was slightly more efficient in these games but at the same time but he ain’t Jokic yet for goodness sake. Dude can only do so much

Lee needs to reign him in. They're never going to be a real competitor with Melo at 36% usage and some of the boneheaded stuff he does.

I get he's a human heat check and they need to let him play his game for him to be successful, BUT he needs to be more intelligent during the game. Dial the gun-slinging back a little bit, get Miller and the boys some looks, and pick the shots better.

Miller had 22 and had every chance in the world to do anything and he totally **** the bed in the 4th and OT, trying to do stuff his handles aren't good enough for and dumping the ball into Diabetes with 2 seconds on the shot clock in OT. a chance to take a clutch shot like LaMelo did and completely bricked it.

"the boys" i'm not even sure who that is referring to cause I honestly felt like Grant Williams was shooting too much, Salaun/Gibson/Green/Diabate aren't going to give you anything. Mann got himself benched for Curry for whatever reason. who is out here needing more shots than they got last night? try hitting them

yeah it'd be nice if we were running the Spurs Beautiful Game system and the ball was moving around on a string but we don't have that personnel. We're the 2001 Sixers without the defense. half this roster is on cardio duty and the other half are too injured to do cardio or in Micic case, too bad to even do cardio

[Diop]

Melos loose handle annoyed me more than anything else, he got the ball picked off him a couple of times while he was doing nothing at the top of the 3 point line.

[MasterIchiro]

There's a fine line between a PG making everyone around him better vs. surrounding that PG with players who contribute zero on offense making him worse.

Instead of Mark Williams, Diabaté
Instead of Miles, Salaun
Green is the one constant as a zero on offense.

So 2 dudes (LaMelo & Miller) take on 5.

We are asking too much. The top of this roster is better than ever with LaMelo & Miller. But right now injuries and underperformers limit the full realization of that talent every night, no matter the competition.

[MasterIchiro]

So, Mark has missed over one year with back aches and sore foot. No structural damage that we know of. Some players that suffer ACL tear return to action sooner.

The bubble wrap is the elephant in the room.

We still don't know if he's a longterm piece because his situation is less about talent and all about availability. And the less we know about him the less we know about LaMelo & Miller having more space to navigate the perimeter while our big dives into the paint and drags defenders who otherwise smother the 3-pt line.

The promise of our collective talent is no more than theory. It gets old.

[Rich4114]

I'm fairly sure Mark's foot issue was a lisfranc that they wanted to rest and rehab rather than have surgery on to repair. No damn way is it taking 8 weeks for a foot strain.

[KembaWalker]

the starting lineup should be Ball/Miller/Martin/Grant/Diabate, these lethargic starts are costing us too much

shuffle mann/curry/green/salaun/gibson one or two at a time to spell guys. theres not enough talent there to call that a "line". try to stagger Miller and Ball a bit until the 4th.

[MasterIchiro]

I'm fairly sure Mark's foot issue was a lisfranc that they wanted to rest and rehab rather than have surgery on to repair. No damn way is it taking 8 weeks for a foot strain.

This sounds like more of the same - theory.

Mark is a theoretical piece at this point.

His absence is limiting to LaMelo & Miller. No paint points = live-and-die by 3. Might as well be a Hornets team with Plumlee directly under the basket launching a pass to the perimeter instead of going up strong for a dunk or fighting his way to the foul line.

Now Lee knows what it feels like to be JB. But he doesn't know what it's like to be Clifford 2 years down LaMelo. He's somewhere in between.

The overall report card remains incomplete.

Fans are going to feel fatigued with the guessing. Where is the full product?

I think we need to move on from Mark as starter and pay for a starter who stays on the court at his position.

[MasterIchiro]

Mark = mystery box. So fix it.

[JustBuzzin]

Anyone think we have found something with Diabate?

He's not a threat offensively, but man the energy he brings and the man is a rebound machine. I think we have our backup center of the future with that kid. Bring him off the bench he's bringing energy 100% of the time.

Center should be fine if we can get Mark back healthy. I would feel much more comfortable trading Nick if Mark can prove to stay healthy.

[Rich4114]

Anyone think we have found something with Diabate?

He's not a threat offensively, but man the energy he brings and the man is a rebound machine. I think we have our backup center of the future with that kid. Bring him off the bench he's bringing energy 100% of the time.

Center should be fine if we can get Mark back healthy. I would feel much more comfortable trading Nick if Mark can prove to stay healthy.

He's got no bag offensively, but man I like what he brings rebounding-wise and shot blocking wise. Overall defense actually, because he can even keep guys in front of him on the perimeter that normally blow by everyone else. I would 100% start him until we get our C's back.

[MasterIchiro]

I don't think Diabaté is a C2 on a playoff team, neither is Nick.

I think we need to acquire a C1, shift Mark to C2, keep Diabeté at C3.

[HornetJail]

I don't think Diabaté is a C2 on a playoff team, neither is Nick.

I think we need to acquire a C1, shift Mark to C2, keep Diabeté at C3.

That "C1" should probably be a lower minute starter like Valanciunas or a hybrid PF/C that can play with Mark. I think Mark is still worth considering as our starting C, he's that good. we just have to have a backup plan for when he's not available.

Ask me again if he's still on IR in December with no timetable.

But your point about Moose is correct, I hope to never seen Nick play over him again

[JMAC3]

The problem is not Lee and his planning.

It's a personnel issue.

If Mark is not there to bring gravity to the rim, the pressure has to come from Mann, and the defense can just pack the paint and force midrange shots and threes early in the shot clock. Passing to the paint creates no opportunity. So of course a set defense can take advantage of an offense restricted to the perimeter. The defense can take away the rim unless Mann plays hero ball.

It isn't a personnel issue because there are plenty of teams around the league that lack in rim pressure, creators, passers, shooters etc and they are still running better offense than us. I think Brandon has ran off like 5 downscreens the whole year, even though that is something he does at a high level. We can preach Lee doesn't want midrange shots but we are struggling to score right now, it would make some sense to ya know get one of your better players going instead of....

Our whole offense is LaMelo with the ball, Miller comes and screens for him, then bolts to the side for a pick and pop three. Lamelo either drives or shoots, if he passes to Miller he then goes and rescreens for Miller this time and Miller tries to attack and score or pitch back out to Melo... over and over..

Clifford would actually run sets for Miller or Terry to get them open threes and I haven't seen that at all with Lee. Everything is all 5 defenders staring at him with the ball or him standing on the wing off a pitch out by Ball. Zero creativity.

[JMAC3]

It was the same thing with Miles, where we kept saying he was struggling. It is Lee job to put these guys in good positions to succeed and it seems like really only Mann and Melo are built to thrive in this iso ball offense.

[KembaWalker]

The problem is not Lee and his planning.

It's a personnel issue.

If Mark is not there to bring gravity to the rim, the pressure has to come from Mann, and the defense can just pack the paint and force midrange shots and threes early in the shot clock. Passing to the paint creates no opportunity. So of course a set defense can take advantage of an offense restricted to the perimeter. The defense can take away the rim unless Mann plays hero ball.

It isn't a personnel issue because there are plenty of teams around the league that lack in rim pressure, creators, passers, shooters etc and they are still running better offense than us. I think Brandon has ran off like 5 downscreens the whole year, even though that is something he does at a high level. We can preach Lee doesn't want midrange shots but we are struggling to score right now, it would make some sense to ya know get one of your better players going instead of....

Our whole offense is LaMelo with the ball, Miller comes and screens for him, then bolts to the side for a pick and pop three. Lamelo either drives or shoots, if he passes to Miller he then goes and rescreens for Miller this time and Miller tries to attack and score or pitch back out to Melo... over and over..

Clifford would actually run sets for Miller or Terry to get them open threes and I haven't seen that at all with Lee. Everything is all 5 defenders staring at him with the ball or him standing on the wing off a pitch out by Ball. Zero creativity.

if Clifford or Borrego had LaMelo with ankle braces they'd probably still be employed

that said, if we ever make the playoffs this will probably be worth the investment because this is how we would actually have to play to contend the more physical, slower paced postseason. you don't advance in the playoffs running floppy for Seth Currys or building a system to fit Vasa Micic. your best players have to put you on their backs. we'll see if we ever get there

[SWedd523]

Salaun should be getting on ball reps in the g league, Gibson should be dominating the weekend runs at LA Fitness or a practice body on Thibs coaching staff.

It would be nice if LaMelo was slightly more efficient in these games but at the same time but he ain’t Jokic yet for goodness sake. Dude can only do so much

Lee needs to reign him in. They're never going to be a real competitor with Melo at 36% usage and some of the boneheaded stuff he does.

I get he's a human heat check and they need to let him play his game for him to be successful, BUT he needs to be more intelligent during the game. Dial the gun-slinging back a little bit, get Miller and the boys some looks, and pick the shots better.

Miller had 22 and had every chance in the world to do anything and he totally **** the bed in the 4th and OT, trying to do stuff his handles aren't good enough for and dumping the ball into Diabetes with 2 seconds on the shot clock in OT. a chance to take a clutch shot like LaMelo did and completely bricked it.

"the boys" i'm not even sure who that is referring to cause I honestly felt like Grant Williams was shooting too much, Salaun/Gibson/Green/Diabate aren't going to give you anything. Mann got himself benched for Curry for whatever reason. who is out here needing more shots than they got last night? try hitting them

yeah it'd be nice if we were running the Spurs Beautiful Game system and the ball was moving around on a string but we don't have that personnel. We're the 2001 Sixers without the defense. half this roster is on cardio duty and the other half are too injured to do cardio or in Micic case, too bad to even do cardio

Yeah I don't exactly care what the personnel is, there's really no excuse for jacking 30 footers with 16 seconds left on the clock regardless of the situation.

I get it's his game. He needs to figure out that not every shot is a good shot because he's calling his and his team's potential when he plays like that

[KembaWalker]

Lee needs to reign him in. They're never going to be a real competitor with Melo at 36% usage and some of the boneheaded stuff he does.

I get he's a human heat check and they need to let him play his game for him to be successful, BUT he needs to be more intelligent during the game. Dial the gun-slinging back a little bit, get Miller and the boys some looks, and pick the shots better.

Miller had 22 and had every chance in the world to do anything and he totally **** the bed in the 4th and OT, trying to do stuff his handles aren't good enough for and dumping the ball into Diabetes with 2 seconds on the shot clock in OT. a chance to take a clutch shot like LaMelo did and completely bricked it.

"the boys" i'm not even sure who that is referring to cause I honestly felt like Grant Williams was shooting too much, Salaun/Gibson/Green/Diabate aren't going to give you anything. Mann got himself benched for Curry for whatever reason. who is out here needing more shots than they got last night? try hitting them

yeah it'd be nice if we were running the Spurs Beautiful Game system and the ball was moving around on a string but we don't have that personnel. We're the 2001 Sixers without the defense. half this roster is on cardio duty and the other half are too injured to do cardio or in Micic case, too bad to even do cardio

Yeah I don't exactly care what the personnel is, there's really no excuse for jacking 30 footers with 16 seconds left on the clock regardless of the situation.

I get it's his game. He needs to figure out that not every shot is a good shot because he's calling his and his team's potential when he plays like that

LaMelo is probably doing better purely on 28+' 3 pointers minus heaves than the offense is doing on its own without him on the floor lol

Salaun/Green/Martin/Mann/Curry combined for 2-18 from 3. LaMelo shot 6-18 from 3, on way harder shots than them including the game tying 3. Miller took 11 and Grant took 7, which is plenty volume for both of them, in fact more than they can handle most nights. I dunno what the answer it but it certainly isn't encouraging any of these guys to take more mid range shots, and we have no players that can execute paint offense. This is just the reality of our talent without Miles/Mark. Theres no exceptionally talented offensive players being held back here because LaMelo is taking shots.

The fact that there are 8 teams worse than us in ORTG with the dearth of offensive talent on our team compounded by injury is a testament to this dudes ability

[JMAC3]

Miller had 22 and had every chance in the world to do anything and he totally **** the bed in the 4th and OT, trying to do stuff his handles aren't good enough for and dumping the ball into Diabetes with 2 seconds on the shot clock in OT. a chance to take a clutch shot like LaMelo did and completely bricked it.

"the boys" i'm not even sure who that is referring to cause I honestly felt like Grant Williams was shooting too much, Salaun/Gibson/Green/Diabate aren't going to give you anything. Mann got himself benched for Curry for whatever reason. who is out here needing more shots than they got last night? try hitting them

yeah it'd be nice if we were running the Spurs Beautiful Game system and the ball was moving around on a string but we don't have that personnel. We're the 2001 Sixers without the defense. half this roster is on cardio duty and the other half are too injured to do cardio or in Micic case, too bad to even do cardio

Yeah I don't exactly care what the personnel is, there's really no excuse for jacking 30 footers with 16 seconds left on the clock regardless of the situation.

I get it's his game. He needs to figure out that not every shot is a good shot because he's calling his and his team's potential when he plays like that

LaMelo is probably doing better purely on 28+' 3 pointers minus heaves than the offense is doing on its own without him on the floor lol

Salaun/Green/Martin/Mann/Curry combined for 2-18 from 3. LaMelo shot 6-18 from 3, on way harder shots than them including the game tying 3. Miller took 11 and Grant took 7, which is plenty volume for both of them, in fact more than they can handle most nights. I dunno what the answer it but it certainly isn't encouraging any of these guys to take more mid range shots, and we have no players that can execute paint offense. This is just the reality of our talent without Miles/Mark. Theres no exceptionally talented offensive players being held back here because LaMelo is taking shots.

The fact that there are 8 teams worse than us in ORTG with the dearth of offensive talent on our team compounded by injury is a testament to this dudes ability

There is a difference in saying the offense is bad and saying who is taking the shots is bad. I am more than fine with LaMelo, Brandon and Grant getting the majority of shots right now, but my point is the looks aren't good because we aren't forcing defense to rotate, we aren't getting paint touches, we aren't operating out of the single side enough. Everything is top of the floor and most are not wide open looks, I want more movement, more open looks, more passes.

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/ball-handler?dir=D&sort=PTS
We are #1 in scoring off PnR ball handler

Dead last in scoring off cuts and post ups.
Near the bottom on handoffs and spots ups as well.

We are 1 dimensional, I don't get how some can watch this and say that is good basketball.

We rank 25th in passes per game.
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/passing?dir=D&sort=PASSES_MADE

we rank 21st in paint touches.
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/touches?dir=D&sort=PAINT_TOUCHES

Shooting the 5th most pull up shots.
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/pullup?dir=D&sort=PULL_UP_FGA

[yosemiteben]

Last 2 minute report says Seth's steal should not have been called a foul, big play swing - https://official.nba.com/l2m/L2MReport.html?gameId=0022400205

[KembaWalker]

Yeah I don't exactly care what the personnel is, there's really no excuse for jacking 30 footers with 16 seconds left on the clock regardless of the situation.

I get it's his game. He needs to figure out that not every shot is a good shot because he's calling his and his team's potential when he plays like that

LaMelo is probably doing better purely on 28+' 3 pointers minus heaves than the offense is doing on its own without him on the floor lol

Salaun/Green/Martin/Mann/Curry combined for 2-18 from 3. LaMelo shot 6-18 from 3, on way harder shots than them including the game tying 3. Miller took 11 and Grant took 7, which is plenty volume for both of them, in fact more than they can handle most nights. I dunno what the answer it but it certainly isn't encouraging any of these guys to take more mid range shots, and we have no players that can execute paint offense. This is just the reality of our talent without Miles/Mark. Theres no exceptionally talented offensive players being held back here because LaMelo is taking shots.

The fact that there are 8 teams worse than us in ORTG with the dearth of offensive talent on our team compounded by injury is a testament to this dudes ability

There is a difference in saying the offense is bad and saying who is taking the shots is bad. I am more than fine with LaMelo, Brandon and Grant getting the majority of shots right now, but my point is the looks aren't good because we aren't forcing defense to rotate, we aren't getting paint touches, we aren't operating out of the single side enough. Everything is top of the floor and most are not wide open looks, I want more movement, more open looks, more passes.

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/ball-handler?dir=D&sort=PTS
We are #1 in scoring off PnR ball handler

Dead last in scoring off cuts and post ups.
Near the bottom on handoffs and spots ups as well.

We are 1 dimensional, I don't get how some can watch this and say that is good basketball.

We rank 25th in passes per game.
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/passing?dir=D&sort=PASSES_MADE

we rank 21st in paint touches.
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/touches?dir=D&sort=PAINT_TOUCHES

Shooting the 5th most pull up shots.
https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/pullup?dir=D&sort=PULL_UP_FGA

Lemme know whos supposed to be getting those paint touches. Im assuming the key to a more dynamic offense surely doesn't lie in feeding Taj and Diabate. I would also enjoy having someone in the paint that could score the ball. We don't have it. i mean aesthetically it would be nice to have a big Al in the paint doing his Hakeem impersonation at 48%, sad thing is that doesnt actually lead to any better offense than LaMelo and Miller yeeting 3s at 38%. Neither does giving cut attempts to Josh Green who has 0 layup package.

A lot of this would be better if Miles didnt appear to be washed untl that last game, we'll see