Sexton to Detroit

[babyjax13]

DET trades: Tim Hardaway Jr., Wendell Moore, 2025 TOR 2nd, 2027 BRK/DAL 2nd (less favorable), 2029 MIL 2nd
UTA trades: Collin Sexton

Why DET does it: put together a really nice three guard rotation that can keep the offense running for 48 minutes. Sexton is all energy, a very efficient scorer, and a much improved distributor (still not a pure PG, but solid enough as a primary ball handler for stretches). They get him for cheap, just expiring contracts and three decent future 2nds.

Why UTA does it: I love Sexton, but we have way too many combo guards and scoring combo guards unfortunately have very little trade value even when they are excellent. I think Sexton is going to win us several games, and given that we keep drafting guards I'm not sure he is in the long-term plans of this team (even though *I* think he is one of three clear keepers on this team in he, Lauri, and Walker). Given where things are going, I think you reset the cap sheet a bit and extract as many assets as you can. Moore and Hardaway can just be bought out and we can sign someone from the gleague that interests us (e.g., give Micah Potter a regular contract).

[Billl]

From detroit, I don't think we would do that swap even without the picks. That's too much money for a backup pg for the next 2 years.

[babyjax13]

From detroit, I don't think we would do that swap even without the picks. That's too much money for a backup pg for the next 2 years.

FWIW I imagine something like this:

PG: Cunningham 32/Sexton 16/Sasser
SG: Ivey 32/Sexton 14/Beasley 4

I think there are minutes there for Sexton, but I can also see preferring to keep picks. Sexton is well worth his money, though.

[wemby]

I don't know about the Pistons, but if this is what Jazz are looking for (a few SRPs + matching expirings) they should have no problem finding a taker. But I bet Danny feels different.

[babyjax13]

I don't know about the Pistons, but if this is what Jazz are looking for (a few SRPs + matching expirings) they should have no problem finding a taker. But I bet Danny feels different.

Yah, I think Danny wants two firsts just like he reportedly did with Kessler. I think Sexton is damn good and in a vacuum is probably worth two late firsts, but there are SO MANY good combo guards that I think it depresses value a ton.

[jbk1234]

From detroit, I don't think we would do that swap even without the picks. That's too much money for a backup pg for the next 2 years.

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

[Billl]

From detroit, I don't think we would do that swap even without the picks. That's too much money for a backup pg for the next 2 years.

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

[chrbal]

I actually don’t mind this trade, although I’m not looking to cough up Torontos second.

I will quote this article from si.com though

Mavs’ Hardaway Mentored Pistons’ Cunningham Before Season-Ending Surgery
Detroit Pistons young star Cade Cunningham had season-ending shin surgery in mid-December. Dallas Mavericks veteran Tim Hardaway Jr.’s advice made Cunningham feel more comfortable going through with his decision.
Dalton Trigg | Jan 17, 2023

We then trade for Tim, get a new coach, and (small sample size, but) Cades off to a pretty impressive start. I really wouldn’t want to mess with that.

[bkohler]

From detroit, I don't think we would do that swap even without the picks. That's too much money for a backup pg for the next 2 years.

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

I completely understand the sentiment, I just wanted to point out that sextons only at $18m.

[Billl]

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

I completely understand the sentiment, I just wanted to point out that sextons only at $18m.

You are 100% correct. Was looking at Collins number. It's still too much for a backup for us.

[oldncreaky]

From detroit, I don't think we would do that swap even without the picks. That's too much money for a backup pg for the next 2 years.

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

I disagree with this because it is not looking at the overall cap sheet, just Sexton in a vacuum.

Sexton expires next year, before any Ivey extension kicks in. For next summer, Detroit is already pretty much locked into operating over the cap, but nowhere near paying taxes ==> Sexton would be an expiring contract in 2025-26, with possibly some trade value. Adding Sexton's salary keeps Detroit in the "over the cap, far under the tax" range where we can use our exceptions and still have a bit of space to take on extra salaries in trade.

I do agree that Sexton is overpaid by a bit. Detroit is getting compensated for that with the SRPs. I think it is a fair debate whether Detroit should take extra SRPs, or hold out for something more valuable with its ability to absorb some money. But getting 3 SRPs with Sexton is fair value (or close to it).

[Billl]

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

I disagree with this because it is not looking at the overall cap sheet, just Sexton in a vacuum.

Sexton expires next year, before any Ivey extension kicks in. For next summer, Detroit is already pretty much locked into operating over the cap, but nowhere near paying taxes ==> Sexton would be an expiring contract in 2025-26, with possibly some trade value. Adding Sexton's salary keeps Detroit in the "over the cap, far under the tax" range where we can use our exceptions and still have a bit of space to take on extra salaries in trade.

I do agree that Sexton is overpaid by a bit. Detroit is getting compensated for that with the SRPs. I think it is a fair debate whether Detroit should take extra SRPs, or hold out for something more valuable with its ability to absorb some money. But getting 3 SRPs with Sexton is fair value (or close to it).

The trade is detroit giving up 3 second rounders to overpay sexton.

Also, our cap sheet is not going to look the same as it does today. All the young guys are being evaluated up to the trade deadline. It's highly unlikely langdon just decides to keep everyone

[Mavrelous]

Sexton is a positive value contract and easily worth a 1st, I'd give Mavs 25 1st for him w/o hesitation, but Mavs don't have the matching salary...
In Detroit next to big PG like Cade, he should be a great fit.

[oldncreaky]

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

I disagree with this because it is not looking at the overall cap sheet, just Sexton in a vacuum.

Sexton expires next year, before any Ivey extension kicks in. For next summer, Detroit is already pretty much locked into operating over the cap, but nowhere near paying taxes ==> Sexton would be an expiring contract in 2025-26, with possibly some trade value. Adding Sexton's salary keeps Detroit in the "over the cap, far under the tax" range where we can use our exceptions and still have a bit of space to take on extra salaries in trade.

I do agree that Sexton is overpaid by a bit. Detroit is getting compensated for that with the SRPs. I think it is a fair debate whether Detroit should take extra SRPs, or hold out for something more valuable with its ability to absorb some money. But getting 3 SRPs with Sexton is fair value (or close to it).

The trade is detroit giving up 3 second rounders to overpay sexton.

Also, our cap sheet is not going to look the same as it does today. All the young guys are being evaluated up to the trade deadline. It's highly unlikely langdon just decides to keep everyone

Oops, did I ever miss it! You are right, and I was wrong.

Yeah, there's absolutely no way I'd give up value for Sexton, or really anyone who would play the role of 3rd guard. We have much bigger issues/questions to answer, and Bickerstaff has kept the 2nd unit running well simply by staggering Ivey/Cade -- which in itself is a good sign. If I was going to add a 3rd guard to that mix, the first thing I'd want is D, and that is not Sexton's thing

Still wouldn't mind taking on $15-20M in salary that expires next year -- as long as it came with appropriate draft compensation

[babyjax13]

I don't think it's too much money for a really good sixth man which is what Sexton is. The are other issues: 1) Is Sexton willing to accept that he's a sixth man on a good team; 2) do the Pistons want to win this year, or is losing close/competitive games preferable; and 3) how would JBB feel about a reunion.

Maybe a contending team can justify $26 million for a 6th man. We're still a rebuilding team that is going to need to upgrade 2-3 starter spots before trying to make any real sort of run.

I disagree with this because it is not looking at the overall cap sheet, just Sexton in a vacuum.

Sexton expires next year, before any Ivey extension kicks in. For next summer, Detroit is already pretty much locked into operating over the cap, but nowhere near paying taxes ==> Sexton would be an expiring contract in 2025-26, with possibly some trade value. Adding Sexton's salary keeps Detroit in the "over the cap, far under the tax" range where we can use our exceptions and still have a bit of space to take on extra salaries in trade.

I do agree that Sexton is overpaid by a bit. Detroit is getting compensated for that with the SRPs. I think it is a fair debate whether Detroit should take extra SRPs, or hold out for something more valuable with its ability to absorb some money. But getting 3 SRPs with Sexton is fair value (or close to it).

You are giving 2nds in this deal. Sexton is worth his money, he is a 60%TS player who can average 18-22ppg depending on his minutes, and is a reasonable lead ball handler in many units. He is a bad defender, but at least not for lack of effort, just lack of size. His advance metrics over the last three years are eerily similar to Zach LaVine. But if Detroit isn't interested in another guard, that makes sense.

[mg]

Ainge isn't going to make that deal. He basically already gave away NAW and Agbaji but Sexton is a better player and still fairly young at 25. He's also going to work hard despite being on a bad team which is what Danny wants next to the kids. It's too bad because a team like Dallas could really use his scoring but I believe Collin is stuck for this season on the tanking Jazz along with Lauri.

I would guess if Ainge makes any deal by the deadline for picks it would likely involve Kessler who could potentially bring back a premium FRP.

[Canadafan]

Keep hardaway and deal Reed+Sasser or Sasser and Moore if that works with our $10million in cap space.

[Kalamazoo317]

I like this Detroit roster. I don't think we need any trades around the margins. If a superstar offer presents itself to allow us to pair Cade and them, it's worth considering, but I think letting this developmental year play out and using our next draft pick is our best direction.