Game 16 : MIN at BOS

[Guest84]

Not sure where I stand in terms of the choices you laid out Shrink but I think I’m leaning towards A similar to TimberKat.

The timing of the trade just seemed poor even though I can understand some the whys for it.

To start, the wolves don’t have a strong history of improving in the “short term” future. But we have seen them miss a potential championship run.

Back in 04, we might be one Sam injury away from a championship. Instead of trying again, we decided not to pay a star to keep the momentum going and it got us decades of pain.

Then the Jimmy era, instead of paying Jimmy and choosing Wigs it got us more pain and heartache.


Now this, while Towns may not have been the ideal number 2, he helped get us to a conference finals with an imbalanced roster. Keeping in mind KA was a big piece of the puzzle as well. But Towns was also coming off of injury and Ant wasn’t the same since the fall.

I feel like chemistry is so overlooked when it comes to the home team. I think we should’ve tried it at least one more year. Again, moves could’ve been made or not made during or after the season. Extensions not given, etc. but don’t break up something that got you somewhere you haven’t been in a long time if ever.

Next, yeah we added DDV but we keep adding guys that play the same position as our star. They’re also undersized, so if played together we’re at a disadvantage.

Naw, DDV, TSJ, then smaller guys like Mike and Rob. Our perimeter is just small. This also gets overlooked and is another reason why the trade may not have been ideal. It created a logjam and forced guys out of position and into different roles that made them successful.

Also, who’s to say that Connelly will be here long enough to see this through, considering what’s going on with ownership.

What about how the new TV contracts will affect the cap and what not? Was all this considered before the trade?

Idk I just think it killed the moral of the team, especially coming so late. Wasn’t it said that more guys were in town this summer more than prior years? Why kill the vibe and shared hunger? Julius didn’t experience that same pain with this team.

[Klomp]

Watch DEN and PHI this season. Two and half stars without strong supporting cast.

Can you win with one star and a bunch of role players?

Do you consider Jaylen Brown a star? BOS was easily the best team in the NBA last year.

How about the Nuggets the year before? Kawhi’s Raptors?

Ant needs to become a superstar, or the trade doesn’t matter one way or the other. I think he can.

It's interesting, because all of those teams had the flexibility to make a significant move that directly led to their titles. Boston traded for Holiday. Denver traded for Gordon. Toronto traded for Leonard.

[BlacJacMac]

I’ve said this before, but while I appreciate KAT more than most, I understand why Connelly might have made this deal. If you’re GM, you have a very narrow window here.

Many fans, including the owners, love KAT, while another large group have, for years, wanted MIN to get rid of him.

Many fans have wanted the Wolves to form a timeline based on Ant’s age, while another group want us to go for it right now.

Many fans are aware of the incredible restrictions that lux and apron rules put on teams, while another group ignores all that.

I think this trade improved our chances of being a strong franchise for years, but probably lowered our ceiling this year. And still, it was possible to see a scenario where we were just as good now and later. I think that NYK was probably the team that would offer us the most, or at least it sounded like they were the most interested. Personally, I don’t know if trading Towns was the right decision, but this deal could have been the last best chance to get off the merry-go-round where having a few hugely expensive players strangles your team’s future.

I don't see how the trade is making us a stronger franchise? Able to keep 3 role players instead of an all star level player?

Watch DEN and PHI this season. Two and half stars without strong supporting cast.

Denver is an anomaly. Jokic is having arguably the best season in the "modern age" of basketball.

Philly put all their eggs in two guys that can't stay healthy and a 3rd (small) guy that has hid his share of injury problem. In 16 games, Embiid has missed 12, George 8 and Maxey 6. Embiid and Maxey have played 15 minutes together. The Big 3 have played in 1 game together with Maxey and George both getting less than 20 minutes.

[Calinks]

I never wanted to trade KAT, I very much enjoy him as a player and person and hoped to see him succeed as a lifetime wolf. That said, as Shrink laid out, I fully understand why the front office made the move. I think I am probably higher on Towns than most, I would keep betting on that dude and think his strengths out shadow his shortcomings so I am not saying this as a hater of any sort. The situation we were in made this scenario a favorable one.

Because of that I wont feel its the end of the world if we do flop this season. I hope we don't but if we do, I still feel comfortable knowing we have some room to maneuver in the future.

[thinktank]

I never wanted to trade KAT, I very much enjoy him as a player and person and hoped to see him succeed as a lifetime wolf. That said, as Shrink laid out, I fully understand why the front office made the move. I think I am probably higher on Towns than most, I would keep betting on that dude and think his strengths out shadow his shortcomings so I am not saying this as a hater of any sort. The situation we were in made this scenario a favorable one.

Because of that I wont feel its the end of the world if we do flop this season. I hope we don't but if we do, I still feel comfortable knowing we have some room to maneuver in the future.

I can't help but disagree. Can you imagine the strong start to the season we could be having right now? We could've won a chip this year and now we're clearly not better. To me, that alone makes the deal not worth it. And this is coming from someone who always thought KAT was overpaid. So I can be wrong. But this trade looked bad at the start and it looks bad now. We'll see how it looks in the future.

To me, we were a very, very good team before the trade and now I'm not sure we'll ever get back to being that good again, even with a superstar in Ant, the pieces we have now, the pieces we may acquire in the future, etc.

[shrink]

Philly put all their eggs in two guys that can't stay healthy...

Are we sure KAT can stay healthy? We had a lot of eggs in that basket too.

[Klomp]

I never wanted to trade KAT, I very much enjoy him as a player and person and hoped to see him succeed as a lifetime wolf. That said, as Shrink laid out, I fully understand why the front office made the move. I think I am probably higher on Towns than most, I would keep betting on that dude and think his strengths out shadow his shortcomings so I am not saying this as a hater of any sort. The situation we were in made this scenario a favorable one.

Because of that I wont feel its the end of the world if we do flop this season. I hope we don't but if we do, I still feel comfortable knowing we have some room to maneuver in the future.

I can't help but disagree. Can you imagine the strong start to the season we could be having right now? We could've won a chip this year and now we're clearly not better. To me, that alone makes the deal not worth it. And this is coming from someone who always thought KAT was overpaid. So I can be wrong. But this trade looked bad at the start and it looks bad now. We'll see how it looks in the future.

To me, we were a very, very good team before the trade and now I'm not sure we'll ever get back to being that good again, even with a superstar in Ant, the pieces we have now, the pieces we may acquire in the future, etc.

A great start to the season guarantees nothing. And a poor start to the season doesn't really mean much either.

[BlacJacMac]

Philly put all their eggs in two guys that can't stay healthy...

Are we sure KAT can stay healthy? We had a lot of eggs in that basket too.

Absolutely not.

He's missed more games than Embiid the past 5 years. And as cool as it was for the team that he went for the faster fix of his knee, I imagine it won't help his long-term career.

[Calinks]

I never wanted to trade KAT, I very much enjoy him as a player and person and hoped to see him succeed as a lifetime wolf. That said, as Shrink laid out, I fully understand why the front office made the move. I think I am probably higher on Towns than most, I would keep betting on that dude and think his strengths out shadow his shortcomings so I am not saying this as a hater of any sort. The situation we were in made this scenario a favorable one.

Because of that I wont feel its the end of the world if we do flop this season. I hope we don't but if we do, I still feel comfortable knowing we have some room to maneuver in the future.

I can't help but disagree. Can you imagine the strong start to the season we could be having right now? We could've won a chip this year and now we're clearly not better. To me, that alone makes the deal not worth it. And this is coming from someone who always thought KAT was overpaid. So I can be wrong. But this trade looked bad at the start and it looks bad now. We'll see how it looks in the future.

To me, we were a very, very good team before the trade and now I'm not sure we'll ever get back to being that good again, even with a superstar in Ant, the pieces we have now, the pieces we may acquire in the future, etc.

I hear you, that's what I wanted to do myself but the front office felt differently. They also know a lot more than I do about the ramifications of keeping KAT down the line. I tend to agree, that I would rather take a crack at a title now than hope for another one in the future but Connelly and company are banking on themselves being able to put this team in position to do it again.

[Loaf_of_bread]

None of us are in the locker rooms or the homes of these players. None of us know whether the poor culture is causing the poor play, or the poor play is causing the poor culture. DDV at 40% from distance and a solid on ball/off ball hybrid guard would have tremendous value for us. Unfortunately, that isn’t what we got. A Julius Randle willing to play defense and distribute the ball quickly and cleanly according to Finch’s vision would be very helpful to us, unfortunately that isn’t what we got. A TC that put the team before his personal needs (I.E a backup center over PJ Dozier,) would be very helpful to us. The bottom line is our situation is dire because the team isn’t willing to do the work. They don’t rotate properly on defense, they don’t space well on offense, they don’t gang rebound and hustle the way winning teams do. Karl might be the missing piece or not. Maybe he stays healthy, maybe not. At the end of the day, Ant is proving he cannot lead the locker room, and Finch is proving he cannot lead the locker room. We have too much talent to play this badly. Something is broken. Does it matter if TC, Taylor, Lore/Arod, Finch, Ant, or anyone else broke it? We need to fix it, or make changes so it becomes fixable.

Fantastic post. I am worried about Ant as well in terms of leadership capability. He isn't ascending this year at the level he should have.

[TimberKat]

Watch DEN and PHI this season. Two and half stars without strong supporting cast.

Can you win with one star and a bunch of role players?

Do you consider Jaylen Brown a star? BOS was easily the best team in the NBA last year.

How about the Nuggets the year before? Kawhi’s Raptors?

Ant needs to become a superstar, or the trade doesn’t matter one way or the other. I think he can.

The Celtics have 3 all star level player (Tatum, Brown, Holiday), two almost all star (Zinger, White), one great role player (Horford).
DEN has Jokic MVP 2 or 3 times. Ask Ant to be him is unfair. Murray (all star level 50mil max next year), great support in Porter and Gordon. Raptors also have multiple all starts (pass or future) but do agree it's as close to one star team as it gets. Lowry was all star that year. Siakam and VanVleet would make all star later

[minimus]

Can you win with one star and a bunch of role players?

Do you consider Jaylen Brown a star? BOS was easily the best team in the NBA last year.

How about the Nuggets the year before? Kawhi’s Raptors?

Ant needs to become a superstar, or the trade doesn’t matter one way or the other. I think he can.

The Celtics have 3 all star level player (Tatum, Brown, Holiday), two almost all star (Zinger, White), one great role player (Horford).
DEN has Jokic MVP 2 or 3 times. Ask Ant to be him is unfair. Murray (all star level 50mil max next year), great support in Porter and Gordon. Raptors also have multiple all starts (pass or future) but do agree it's as close to one star team as it gets. Lowry was all star that year. Siakam and VanVleet would make all star later

Grousbeck is selling BOS. The most expensive roster in NBA history of the legendary franchise with championship aspirations. MIN and BOS in terms of marketing are not even close.