Official Scottie All Star Barnes Thread 8

[Scase]

Scottie reminds me of a lot of old veterans when I watch him drive.

He's slow as balls, no burst. But he does use screens well, and he is also pretty craft about getting guys on his hip and using his size to get to at least the elbow, sometimes to the low block. What he needs to work on is finishing options and ability once he gets there, including counters moving him into the lane. A turnaround J, an elbow pull-up. Moving into a backdown and maybe getting a spin or pivot, etc. Maybe a floater. Something. He's got some reasonable finishing in the short range already, but he needs to finish in close better and, ideally, to get in tight much more. Against Detroit, he actually did a great job getting close, he just couldn't close it out in the RA, which was frustrating. Maybe gassed after the first half or something, because he's usually pretty reasonable there and he shot a LOT against the Pistons.

A league-average 3 would go a long way to helping as well, as long as he moderates his volume.

So much is contingent on real development of his shot, though. He has some compelling tools as a foundation, so we'll see what happens. This should be a useful development season if he can stay healthy. Last season was going to be a bunch of that too before the hand injury, so I hope he can manage it this year. The goggles aren't a bad look, either, haha.

And then there's Jalen Green who can get any shot from the perimeter he wants due to his athleticism but doesn't have the height, strength to get easy looks inside the three point line. Basically the anti Barnes.

Oh, Jalen Green...

Jalen Green heard you talkin ****

[HumbleRen]

Scottie needs to learn to stop taking a half dozen pull up above the break 3’a early in the clock. He’s not a good shooter, and he’s pulling up as many 2’s as we would see from IQ or Dick. And a lot of them aren’t out necessity… they’re just downright bad shots

He’s trying to shoot himself into a rhythm. Might as well do it against a team like the Pelicans. Doubt he tries this against Miami.

[Indeed]

Scottie needs to learn to stop taking a half dozen pull up above the break 3’a early in the clock. He’s not a good shooter, and he’s pulling up as many 2’s as we would see from IQ or Dick. And a lot of them aren’t out necessity… they’re just downright bad shots

Teams give him that.
You can listen to the New Orleans commentators mentioning not to let him go down hill.

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&ContextMeasure=FGA&EndPeriod=0&EndRange=28800&GameID=0022400295&PlayerID=1630567&RangeType=0&Season=2024-25&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&StartPeriod=0&StartRange=0&TeamID=1610612761&flag=3&sct=plot&section=game

[Indeed]

Start the video at 2:06

#9 is Ausar Thompson, just ask yourself if old Barnes could pull that off (yes it was a miss, but that's a fault of the shot, not the handle)

Umm, it's a push off and a spin move against a defender overplaying, not super creative stuff here.

And I'm not expecting Barnes to be Kyrie, that's never going to happen. But he has no bag to rely upon for creating space. The burst, fluidity and balance aren't there. He could there with more focus on footwork, but I think he has to shoot a lot better/consistently to take that next step as a scorer.

That is what a lot of people (including me) saying, he will need to shoot a lot better, because he doesn't have the quickness. He isn't getting that much of an advantage on switch with a C being a PnR handler, and the NBA playtype stats reflected that.

Having a better shot will allow him to go down hill and draw foul, but his finishing is also a concern, or not as efficient as Barrett, so you got to wonder if you want him to initiate that much of possession to create.

[Boogie!]

Scottie needs to learn to stop taking a half dozen pull up above the break 3’a early in the clock. He’s not a good shooter, and he’s pulling up as many 2’s as we would see from IQ or Dick. And a lot of them aren’t out necessity… they’re just downright bad shots

barnes shooting 3's at an efficient clip is something he desperately needs to open up his game. he should continue to take them. the delusion that people seem to have is that he has a giannis like post game, where if he just keeps driving and attacking the paint he'll be such a great scorer and that him taking stupid 3s is holding him back. this is not the case. i'm still not sure how people watch him play and just keep pounding the same narrative that he just needs to be more aggressive and keep attacking.

he needs a mid range shot, and to be able to knock down open 3s. in fact, a large reason he started off last year on fire was because he looked like an actual legitimate 3 point threat. it wasn't because he somehow became this all around versatile scorer. once his efficiency from 3 dropped, his offense went back to just being okay.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Here are videos of 2 guys who are his best potential comps, if we're discussing scottie as a future superstar. These are their highlights in their age 22 seasons. Now without looking at the stats, look at how they play. Look at the way they attack the basket, how quickly they explode and finish, even around defenders. Scottie doesn't have the same athleticism and explosiveness. He ends up forcing awkward shots in the paint and cant really get around guys but instead runs into them. His best shot to really become that superstar offensive player is to be able to shoot efficiently. Even with kawhi being able to attack the rim the way he did, he still developed an elite mid range and 3 point game, both from pull ups off the dribble and catch and shoot. If we want to discuss barnes as a future star, he's definitely not gonna go the giannis route in terms of just bullying people at the rim. He doesn't have the physical ability for it. So he has to keep working on his shots. Superstars take those kinds of shots and make them. I think people don't understand that if barnes had the ability to keep bullying people at the rim, he would. But there's a reason why he doesn't and why his drives and takes to the rim either look awkward or easily stifled.

[YogurtProducer]

Scottie needs to learn to stop taking a half dozen pull up above the break 3’a early in the clock. He’s not a good shooter, and he’s pulling up as many 2’s as we would see from IQ or Dick. And a lot of them aren’t out necessity… they’re just downright bad shots

barnes shooting 3's at an efficient clip is something he desperately needs to open up his game. he should continue to take them. the delusion that people seem to have is that he has a giannis like post game, where if he just keeps driving and attacking the paint he'll be such a great scorer and that him taking stupid 3s is holding him back. this is not the case. i'm still not sure how people watch him play and just keep pounding the same narrative that he just needs to be more aggressive and keep attacking.

he needs a mid range shot, and to be able to knock down open 3s. in fact, a large reason he started off last year on fire was because he looked like an actual legitimate 3 point threat. it wasn't because he somehow became this all around versatile scorer. once his efficiency from 3 dropped, his offense went back to just being okay.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Here are videos of 2 guys who are his best potential comps, if we're discussing scottie as a future superstar. These are their highlights in their age 22 seasons. Now without looking at the stats, look at how they play. Look at the way they attack the basket, how quickly they explode and finish, even around defenders. Scottie doesn't have the same athleticism and explosiveness. He ends up forcing awkward shots in the paint and cant really get around guys but instead runs into them. His best shot to really become that superstar offensive player is to be able to shoot efficiently. Even with kawhi being able to attack the rim the way he did, he still developed an elite mid range and 3 point game, both from pull ups off the dribble and catch and shoot. If we want to discuss barnes as a future star, he's definitely not gonna go the giannis route in terms of just bullying people at the rim. He doesn't have the physical ability for it. So he has to keep working on his shots. Superstars take those kinds of shots and make them. I think people don't understand that if barnes had the ability to keep bullying people at the rim, he would. But there's a reason why he doesn't and why his drives and takes to the rim either look awkward or easily stifled.

No delusion here from me. I don’t think he will ever be a great scorer from a self creation standpoint.

He has taken 31 3’s in the last 4 games and hit 6.

I just don’t like the development I’m seeing from him. He never projected to be an elite scorer, and it feels like we’re ignoring his strengths and trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

Hopefully once IQ is back that changes and he can get back to just doing what he’s good at.

[OakleyDokely]

We want him to be a better shooter, so he should be letting them fly imo, especially in a blowout game. He's not going to learn by just taking wide open 3s. The efficiency will suffer, but who cares, it's a developmental year.

[djsunyc]

since he's been back (4 games)

33 mins
20.8 pts
39.2 fg%
49 2fg% (10.7 2fga)
25.8 3fg% (7.8 3fga)
68.0 ft% (6.3 fta)
9 rebs
6.8 asts
2.3 tov
1.3 stl
0.8 blks
+5.0 (+/-)
113.7 ortg
105.1 drtg
+8.5 net

[MEDIC]

Scottie needs to learn to stop taking a half dozen pull up above the break 3’a early in the clock. He’s not a good shooter, and he’s pulling up as many 2’s as we would see from IQ or Dick. And a lot of them aren’t out necessity… they’re just downright bad shots

He’s trying to shoot himself into a rhythm. Might as well do it against a team like the Pelicans. Doubt he tries this against Miami.

I'd like to see him shoot himself into a rhythm from mid range. Those are simply bad shots for him.

Should Gradey be doing that? 100%. He is a 3 point specialist.

Scottie needs to work from the inside out. That is not the shot I would want him to be taking in clutch moments at the end of a game. He needs to study Kawhi's mid range arsenal. Kawhi could always get to his spot from mid range. Even Derozan would be a good study for him.

I just want Scottie to get to a point where he finds "his range" or "his shot". So far I haven't seen that from him other than within 5 feet of the basket. I would like him to build in a go-to move that helps hm get to a spot on the floor where you are thinking "that's his shot......he is going yo make it". It's not going to be from 3 point land.

[tsherkin]

And then there's Jalen Green who can get any shot from the perimeter he wants due to his athleticism but doesn't have the height, strength to get easy looks inside the three point line. Basically the anti Barnes.

Oh, Jalen Green...

Jalen Green heard you talkin ****

He has talent. A good game here or there happens.

[tsherkin]

Another very strong game all-around where scoring (especially on jumpers) remains an issue. Hopefully he shows some development there over the season.

[manjusaka]

This is the year for Scottie to forget efficiency and just keep shooting.

[PushDaRock]

This is the year for Scottie to forget efficiency and just keep shooting.

yeah last 2 games he's doing what I expected him to do when Siakam left

[AbC?]

I have it on good authority that Barnes is literally seeing two baskets right now with his damaged orbital bone. Every time he takes a shot, he has to make a 50/50 guess which basket to aim for.

He went 2/12 last night. Turn that into say, 8/12 and now he's giving you 35 points on 73% TS. Not so bad is it?

[XTC]

I have it on good authority that Barnes is literally seeing two baskets right now with his damaged orbital bone. Every time he takes a shot, he has to make a 50/50 guess which basket to aim for.

He went 2/12 last night. Turn that into say, 8/12 and now he's giving you 35 points on 73% TS. Not so bad is it?

Yeah just got to get Scottie to shoot 67% from the field, ans 73% TS every single night! You might be onto something there.

[Scase]

This is the year for Scottie to forget efficiency and just keep shooting.

Which isn't bad, but man, he really has to chill on the ATB 3's. He's not doing himself or anyone else any favours, he should be just taking as many shots as he can inside the arc, he needs to be pushing for everything near the basket.

[manjusaka]

This is the year for Scottie to forget efficiency and just keep shooting.

Which isn't bad, but man, he really has to chill on the ATB 3's. He's not doing himself or anyone else any favours, he should be just taking as many shots as he can inside the arc, he needs to be pushing for everything near the basket.

Forget about it, I got a feeling this is the style that SB himself wants to play. Our organization seems agreed and trying to develop him that way. Offensively he is going to be a PG/SG/point forward from now on. His style would probably closer to Doncic not LBJ or Giannis.

[sidsid]

This is the year for Scottie to forget efficiency and just keep shooting.

Which isn't bad, but man, he really has to chill on the ATB 3's. He's not doing himself or anyone else any favours, he should be just taking as many shots as he can inside the arc, he needs to be pushing for everything near the basket.

Nah, rebuilding is for working on your game, especially weaknesses to see what's actually there.

There was a question years ago about how do you tank properly by keeping both Siakam and OG while only trading Fred. The answer is getting Siakam to keep working on pull-up 3s-long 2s and send OG into traffic as much as possible.

Accelerate development when the games don't matter. We should have IQ play a lot more off-ball. Get RJ to try more difficult passes. Get them out of their comfort zones.

[Raps in 4]

Scottie needs to learn to stop taking a half dozen pull up above the break 3’a early in the clock. He’s not a good shooter, and he’s pulling up as many 2’s as we would see from IQ or Dick. And a lot of them aren’t out necessity… they’re just downright bad shots

barnes shooting 3's at an efficient clip is something he desperately needs to open up his game. he should continue to take them. the delusion that people seem to have is that he has a giannis like post game, where if he just keeps driving and attacking the paint he'll be such a great scorer and that him taking stupid 3s is holding him back. this is not the case. i'm still not sure how people watch him play and just keep pounding the same narrative that he just needs to be more aggressive and keep attacking.

he needs a mid range shot, and to be able to knock down open 3s. in fact, a large reason he started off last year on fire was because he looked like an actual legitimate 3 point threat. it wasn't because he somehow became this all around versatile scorer. once his efficiency from 3 dropped, his offense went back to just being okay.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Here are videos of 2 guys who are his best potential comps, if we're discussing scottie as a future superstar. These are their highlights in their age 22 seasons. Now without looking at the stats, look at how they play. Look at the way they attack the basket, how quickly they explode and finish, even around defenders. Scottie doesn't have the same athleticism and explosiveness. He ends up forcing awkward shots in the paint and cant really get around guys but instead runs into them. His best shot to really become that superstar offensive player is to be able to shoot efficiently. Even with kawhi being able to attack the rim the way he did, he still developed an elite mid range and 3 point game, both from pull ups off the dribble and catch and shoot. If we want to discuss barnes as a future star, he's definitely not gonna go the giannis route in terms of just bullying people at the rim. He doesn't have the physical ability for it. So he has to keep working on his shots. Superstars take those kinds of shots and make them. I think people don't understand that if barnes had the ability to keep bullying people at the rim, he would. But there's a reason why he doesn't and why his drives and takes to the rim either look awkward or easily stifled.

No delusion here from me. I don’t think he will ever be a great scorer from a self creation standpoint.

He has taken 31 3’s in the last 4 games and hit 6.

I just don’t like the development I’m seeing from him. He never projected to be an elite scorer, and it feels like we’re ignoring his strengths and trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

Hopefully once IQ is back that changes and he can get back to just doing what he’s good at.

The whole point of a prospect is to develop their game. We aren't trying to win. Draymond Greens grow on trees. Masai hopes that Scottie can become more than that. I'd be pretty disappointed in this FO and coaching staff if they gave up on Scottie's development this early in his career.

[sidsid]

barnes shooting 3's at an efficient clip is something he desperately needs to open up his game. he should continue to take them. the delusion that people seem to have is that he has a giannis like post game, where if he just keeps driving and attacking the paint he'll be such a great scorer and that him taking stupid 3s is holding him back. this is not the case. i'm still not sure how people watch him play and just keep pounding the same narrative that he just needs to be more aggressive and keep attacking.

he needs a mid range shot, and to be able to knock down open 3s. in fact, a large reason he started off last year on fire was because he looked like an actual legitimate 3 point threat. it wasn't because he somehow became this all around versatile scorer. once his efficiency from 3 dropped, his offense went back to just being okay.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Here are videos of 2 guys who are his best potential comps, if we're discussing scottie as a future superstar. These are their highlights in their age 22 seasons. Now without looking at the stats, look at how they play. Look at the way they attack the basket, how quickly they explode and finish, even around defenders. Scottie doesn't have the same athleticism and explosiveness. He ends up forcing awkward shots in the paint and cant really get around guys but instead runs into them. His best shot to really become that superstar offensive player is to be able to shoot efficiently. Even with kawhi being able to attack the rim the way he did, he still developed an elite mid range and 3 point game, both from pull ups off the dribble and catch and shoot. If we want to discuss barnes as a future star, he's definitely not gonna go the giannis route in terms of just bullying people at the rim. He doesn't have the physical ability for it. So he has to keep working on his shots. Superstars take those kinds of shots and make them. I think people don't understand that if barnes had the ability to keep bullying people at the rim, he would. But there's a reason why he doesn't and why his drives and takes to the rim either look awkward or easily stifled.

No delusion here from me. I don’t think he will ever be a great scorer from a self creation standpoint.

He has taken 31 3’s in the last 4 games and hit 6.

I just don’t like the development I’m seeing from him. He never projected to be an elite scorer, and it feels like we’re ignoring his strengths and trying to force a square peg into a round hole.

Hopefully once IQ is back that changes and he can get back to just doing what he’s good at.

The whole point of a prospect is to develop their game. We aren't trying to win. Draymond Greens grow on trees. Masai hopes that Scottie can become more than that. I'd be pretty disappointed in this FO and coaching staff if they gave up on Scottie's development this early in his career.

The part of development that we want Scottie to work on inside the arc is hindered by the square peg that is Jak being jammed into the round hole that is Barnes' space on the floor.

Until that's fixed, it's a great time to work on his perimeter game. We know he showed good signs of being a competent C&S 3 guy beyond the arc. Keep the pull-ups coming for a while.