Official Scottie All Star Barnes Thread 8

[Shwaguy]

Scottie becoming a nightly triple-double threat. Firmly in his Magic era in this current role. Just a shame he doesn't have better scoring teammates to take full advantage of what he creates.

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He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.

AND he plays excellent defence

sky is the limit. still underrated, even by raps fans

Fanbase doesn't realize what they have in him. They think "Ace Bailey" will save the franchise yet consistently underappreciate Scottie who Bailey will almost certainly never be better than.

What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

[Madhouse]

Scottie becoming a nightly triple-double threat. Firmly in his Magic era in this current role. Just a shame he doesn't have better scoring teammates to take full advantage of what he creates.

Read on Twitter

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.

Fanbase doesn't realize what they have in him. They think "Ace Bailey" will save the franchise yet consistently underappreciate Scottie who Bailey will almost certainly never be better than.

What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

how many players are there actually in the draft that could be confidently be the #1 guy over Barnes, only Harper?

[Shwaguy]

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.



What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

how many players are there actually in the draft that could be confidently be the #1 guy over Barnes, only Harper?

Confidently? None, unless you mean purely as a scorer, in which case I would say Harper. Possibly Johnson as well. And Flagg has the potential to be a better scorer but I wouldn't say that's a lock or likely.

Overall package though? It's possible I could see Flagg or Harper especially ending up better overall players but I also would not say it's likely either. The prospect of a Scottie Gradey Flagg/Harper trio to build around long term is super enticing though. Some really fun possibilities of playstyles with either of those trios.

[HangTime]

Scottie becoming a nightly triple-double threat. Firmly in his Magic era in this current role. Just a shame he doesn't have better scoring teammates to take full advantage of what he creates.

Read on Twitter

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.

Fanbase doesn't realize what they have in him. They think "Ace Bailey" will save the franchise yet consistently underappreciate Scottie who Bailey will almost certainly never be better than.

What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

This is kind of off topic, but do you think, in a loaded(ish) drafted. Bailey might be

84 - Sam Bowie
96 - Marcus Camby
03 - Darko Milicic
09 - Hasheem Thabeet, Jonny Flynn
11 - Derrick Williams, Bismack Biyombo
12 - Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Dion Waiters, Thomas Robinson

It'd be fun see if we can figure out who to avoid, and if a team is willing to trade up for him, because they think they're great, how much can you squeeze

[Shwaguy]

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.



What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

This is kind of off topic, but do you think, in a loaded(ish) drafted. Bailey might be

84 - Sam Bowie
96 - Marcus Camby
03 - Darko Milicic
09 - Hasheem Thabeet, Jonny Flynn
11 - Derrick Williams, Bismack Biyombo
12 - Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Dion Waiters, Thomas Robinson

It'd be fun see if we can figure out who to avoid, and if a team is willing to trade up for him, because they think they're great, how much can you squeeze

He might be. In the end I'm not an expert. Maybe he's the next TMac and I'm an idiot, but I personally don't expect that.

I think he's very likely to at least carve out a good career, even if he's not some superstar hall of famer.

[HiJiNX]

Barnes wanted no part of Lively on the perimeter and eventually just threw the ball away. An otherwise great performance but stuff like that really makes me question his ceiling imo.

lively is able to back off enough because scottie isn't a confident 3pt shooter. If scottie was say 3/4 at those points in the game lively would press up and scottie would have taken him off the dribble. His ceiling relies on how his shot making develops.

But we don’t want Scottie taking those jumpers remember?

[ItsDanger]

Last night is closer to the style Scottie should be playing, the Magic Johnson style.

The choice is clear on the path forward.

[Scase]

Scottie becoming a nightly triple-double threat. Firmly in his Magic era in this current role. Just a shame he doesn't have better scoring teammates to take full advantage of what he creates.

Read on Twitter

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.

Fanbase doesn't realize what they have in him. They think "Ace Bailey" will save the franchise yet consistently underappreciate Scottie who Bailey will almost certainly never be better than.

What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

I guess we'll just ignore the draft profile breakdowns from analysts, and his actual game to make that decision right? Damn near every analyst talks about him scoring at all 3 levels. As for not having more upside vs GD?

He's 6'10 and plays like a wing, and has good help defence, that alone gives him higher potential. I love GD, but in no way would he be the reason you don't pick up Bailey.

[Shwaguy]

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.



What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

I guess we'll just ignore the draft profile breakdowns from analysts, and his actual game to make that decision right? Damn near every analyst talks about him scoring at all 3 levels. As for not having more upside vs GD?

He's 6'10 and plays like a wing, and has good help defence, that alone gives him higher potential. I love GD, but in no way would he be the reason you don't pick up Bailey.

Bailey can't score at the rim, He doesn't really score from 3. He's not a 3 level scorer.

Skill matters, and GD has significantly more skill than Bailey. If you had to choose who's more likely to average an efficient 25 at the NBA level the answer is GD.

Can say GD's handle isn't good yet, and it's not. But it's still better than Baileys. Bailey plays like a shot creator who doesn't have shot creating skills.

[Shwaguy]

Barnes wanted no part of Lively on the perimeter and eventually just threw the ball away. An otherwise great performance but stuff like that really makes me question his ceiling imo.

lively is able to back off enough because scottie isn't a confident 3pt shooter. If scottie was say 3/4 at those points in the game lively would press up and scottie would have taken him off the dribble. His ceiling relies on how his shot making develops.

But we don’t want Scottie taking those jumpers remember?

Scottie shot 42% from 3 last game. His argument doesn't make sense lol.

[Vampirate]

Barnes pull up 3, while nowhere near being decent is at least now not last in the league in terms of percentages.

It's at 23% now (keep in mind it was at 7% earlier). I hope he can get it to 30% range by seasons end with the same amount of volume.

[tdotrep2]

lively is able to back off enough because scottie isn't a confident 3pt shooter. If scottie was say 3/4 at those points in the game lively would press up and scottie would have taken him off the dribble. His ceiling relies on how his shot making develops.

But we don’t want Scottie taking those jumpers remember?

Scottie shot 42% from 3 last game. His argument doesn't make sense lol.

1 of 5 and 2 of 6 aren't considered hot from 3. Go look at how lively guarded him, gave scottie plenty of space which doesn't happen if he's hot/respected which is my point.

[Scase]

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

I guess we'll just ignore the draft profile breakdowns from analysts, and his actual game to make that decision right? Damn near every analyst talks about him scoring at all 3 levels. As for not having more upside vs GD?

He's 6'10 and plays like a wing, and has good help defence, that alone gives him higher potential. I love GD, but in no way would he be the reason you don't pick up Bailey.

Bailey can't score at the rim, He doesn't really score from 3. He's not a 3 level scorer.

Skill matters, and GD has significantly more skill than Bailey. If you had to choose who's more likely to average an efficient 25 at the NBA level the answer is GD.

Can say GD's handle isn't good yet, and it's not. But it's still better than Baileys. Bailey plays like a shot creator who doesn't have shot creating skills.

He's shooting 36.7% on 4+ 3pa a game, I'm not saying he's some sniper from long range, but saying he doesn't score from 3's is kinda, you know, not true.

He can't score at the rim? So far 19.4% of all his shots are at the rim, and he's 13-21 there. Again, you're just making things up for some reason, I don't get it.

[mdenny]

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.



What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

This is kind of off topic, but do you think, in a loaded(ish) drafted. Bailey might be

84 - Sam Bowie
96 - Marcus Camby
03 - Darko Milicic
09 - Hasheem Thabeet, Jonny Flynn
11 - Derrick Williams, Bismack Biyombo
12 - Michael Kidd-Gilchrist, Dion Waiters, Thomas Robinson

It'd be fun see if we can figure out who to avoid, and if a team is willing to trade up for him, because they think they're great, how much can you squeeze

Marcus Camby? He had a decent career no?

[Basketball_Jones]

Lot of Ace talk here while I’m not crazy about him either I do dream of having a 6’10” shooter in the lineup with Scottie/RJ/Gradey. IQ may have to hit the bench in that scenario as we need someone to put pressure on the defense and penetrate so RJ is that guy for us until either Scottie somehow becomes it or we draft someone else.

[ArthurVandelay]

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.



What lol? Most people want Bailey to pair WITH Barnes, not replace him. Bailey is showing to be an efficient 3 level scoring threat, that would be an incredible player to play with Barnes. It's what the team is sorely missing, Lebron couldn't do it solo, what makes you think Scottie can?

Bailey is not a 3 level scorer. He is not efficient. He is not profiling to be a 3 level scorer in the NBA.

The level he can score in is the most uncommon level to be a scorer in. But he's not a 3 level scorer. Seen nothing to indicate he has more offensive upside than Gradey even. I think Ace will have a good future in the league but not as an offensive creator.

The Raptors are missing something, yes. I do not believe at all that Ace is what they are missing offensively.

My point is people think he can save this franchise while simultaneously thinking Barnes can't be the #1 player on the team. I can tell you right now if Barnes can't be the #1 guy on the team then neither can Bailey.

I guess we'll just ignore the draft profile breakdowns from analysts, and his actual game to make that decision right? Damn near every analyst talks about him scoring at all 3 levels. As for not having more upside vs GD?

He's 6'10 and plays like a wing, and has good help defence, that alone gives him higher potential. I love GD, but in no way would he be the reason you don't pick up Bailey.

The comparisons of Ace to Jabari Smith are also whack. Only thing they have in common is height and ability to hit 3…although NbA 3 hasn’t been overly kind to smith.

[dTox]

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[RoteSchroder]

He would easily be averaging a triple double if we had even just some more competent players on the roster.

I hate this illogical BS cause I’ve seen this statement by so many homers over the years. I remember Laker fans constantly whining about Smush Parker and how Kobe would be averaging so many more assists, like there weren’t any trash players in the rest of the league.

Whether it was Bosh, Bargani or Kobe, Lebron, pretty much none of the players showed increased assist numbers after getting more competent players on the roster. Probably because if they had better teammates, the ball wouldn’t be in their hands as much and their teammates would consist of good playmakers as well.

In fact, RJ went from a better team to a worse one and saw his assist numbers drastically increase.

[Tha Cynic]

We’re a high assist team because of the way we run our offense. 5th in the NBA in assist % and we were up there while Scottie was injured. RJ is averaging a career high in assists as well. It comes with the offense. That’s not to say Scottie isn’t great at it. But the offense definitely inflates his assist numbers, though they’d be high without it.

However, we are 2nd to last in isolation frequency, dead last in isolation PPP, 2nd to last in FT frequency off ISOs and dead last in score frequency. You cannot win in this league without isolation basketball. If we’ve all accepted that this season is about development, how about giving our franchise guy some reps here? I don’t expect Scottie to become a bonafide scoring machine, but I do expect that at some point he’s able to create some shots for himself. And not of the 3point pull up variety.

I agree with you that we need Scottie Barnes to be much more or an ISO scorer. I disagree with you that his assists are a function of the system. If you watch the way he runs this team, it's very much up there with LeBron James and Luka Doncic. He's not getting cheap assists like we saw Mitchell and Quickley get. Barnes is legitimately running this offense masterfully since returning. He has taken this to another level. Man, if he ever becomes more of a refined scorer...

[AbC?]

I've been impressed with his overall game this season. The efficiency is still awful but he's shown me enough to pencil him in as a legit 3rd option on a championship contender.