What in the Hell Can the Nuggets Do?

[BelgradeNugget]

Like Rob Pelinka, Calvin Booth has fumbled back to back off seasons coming off a chip. Although the decision to let both Brucie and KCP walk is understandable given the financial position of the team, he completely contradicts that way of thinking by giving Nnaji that 4 year guarantee and then the more crippling 4 year fully guaranteed max to Jamal. Especially coming off a disatrous series against the Timberwolves and an all time worse performance in the Olympics for Canada.

There really isn't much the team can do. Nobody is touching Jamal and AG is nearly as important to the team as Jokic given his synergy with him and his role as the primary wing defender. MPJ is the logical candidate to shop with his career year so far, but the entire league knows that his value is inflated playing next to Jokic + he will always have long term injury concerns with his back. He's probably worth more to Denver than any team that trades for him. They do still have their 26, 28, 30 and 31 FRPs to trade but I don't see anything out there that would make a meaningful change.

I do find it strange that Booth isn't able to find any quality veteran depth pieces to fill out the bench. I mean, Jokic by all accounts should be the ideal superstar that you would want to play with.

* he signed Brown to a tax-MLE, he had non Bird rights on him, the Pacers offered him 20+. No chance to keep him
* you guys are not understanding what are the implications of resigning KCP to that contract. What it would do to the Nuggets flexibility going forward.... for a very marginal gain. It makes totally sense to bet on Braun and Strawther, and it's not like KCP has been setting the league on fire
* extending Murray is an ownership decision, and people would have complained no matter what. They are pot committed, there's no future for this team, as a contender, if Murray turns into a pumpkin. No matter what you do with his contract
* Nnaji actually showed some promise in the first few years, just he totally regressed since (and I suspect Malone has a role in that). It was a bet to have a cheap contributor long term, and potentially a matching salary. It didn't work but that's not the end of the world.

What people are missing is that the only thing that really matters is the regression of Murray. He goes back to last year level before the injury and the Nuggets are tier 1 contenders. He doesn't and they are cooked.

I personally blame Booth for giving player option on contracts to Nnaji, Jackson, Šarić...he gives PO on every contract and that decision turns so, so, contracts into terrible ones.

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

If Murray stays this version of himself they are screwd and no trade for player as good/bad will make them championship contender.

Also trading MPJ for 1/2 worst players than him doesn't make sense either.

[Richard Miller]

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

Don't think anyone could imagine Thomas and Saric would suck that much, on paper that looked like good signings. Bones is Tim Connelly player ("hooper") and has only himself to blame, besides, doesn't seem to play on the Clippers either. Jay Huff wouldn't be solving any of the Nuggets problems even if he stayed, a backup playing 5-10 min. behind Jokic is never going to be impactful.

[BelgradeNugget]

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

Don't think anyone could imagine Thomas and Saric would suck that much, on paper that looked like good signings. Bones is Tim Connelly player ("hooper") and has only himself to blame, besides, doesn't seem to play on the Clippers either. Jay Huff wouldn't be solving any of the Nuggets problems even if he stayed, a backup playing 5-10 min. behind Jokic is never going to be impactful.

Jay Huff's netrtg with Nuggets was -7.9 similar to what Jordan and Nnaji had. They were unplayable so Malone had to play Jokic/starters too much. They lost in the playoffs becuse they were exhausted - in game 7 they were up 20 pts in the 3Q. Malone even didn't trust Watson in the playoffs.

Jay Huff's netrtg with Memphis is +4.1 Is he so much better now or Jenkins knows how to use him? If he stayed and could play 16 minutes per game, he is playing now with positive impact, Jokic wouldn't have to be 2nd in the league in minutes per game and Nuggets wouldn't be - /a lot/ with Jokic on the bench. Maybe that would solve a lot of their problems because even with Murray playing this bad their starting lineup has a netrtg of +12.5

But Huff is not first in line of backup bigs who couldn't play for Malone, he is last in the line.

[Ssj16]

They should look into a trade with NNaji for Jonas Valenciunas. WAS tanking anyway and contacts match but NNaji is slightly cheaper and younger.

WAS would want a sweetner probably.

this is the move. Allows WAS to tank for Flagg and Den gets a backup C that wants to win

This is an interesting idea but the only problem is Washington is already so bad that they don't need to worry about tanking.

It would make more sense for them to hold to Val unless they get some real assets. I would agree more with this post if Washington was "winning" too many games.

That being said, maybe the Raps or BKN want to sell some pieces off.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

Don't think anyone could imagine Thomas and Saric would suck that much, on paper that looked like good signings. Bones is Tim Connelly player ("hooper") and has only himself to blame, besides, doesn't seem to play on the Clippers either. Jay Huff wouldn't be solving any of the Nuggets problems even if he stayed, a backup playing 5-10 min. behind Jokic is never going to be impactful.

Saric had a few games when he looked ok, actually, when Jokic was out.
He has limitations, he must be used properly imo

[Ssj16]

Like Rob Pelinka, Calvin Booth has fumbled back to back off seasons coming off a chip. Although the decision to let both Brucie and KCP walk is understandable given the financial position of the team, he completely contradicts that way of thinking by giving Nnaji that 4 year guarantee and then the more crippling 4 year fully guaranteed max to Jamal. Especially coming off a disatrous series against the Timberwolves and an all time worse performance in the Olympics for Canada.

There really isn't much the team can do. Nobody is touching Jamal and AG is nearly as important to the team as Jokic given his synergy with him and his role as the primary wing defender. MPJ is the logical candidate to shop with his career year so far, but the entire league knows that his value is inflated playing next to Jokic + he will always have long term injury concerns with his back. He's probably worth more to Denver than any team that trades for him. They do still have their 26, 28, 30 and 31 FRPs to trade but I don't see anything out there that would make a meaningful change.

I do find it strange that Booth isn't able to find any quality veteran depth pieces to fill out the bench. I mean, Jokic by all accounts should be the ideal superstar that you would want to play with.

* he signed Brown to a tax-MLE, he had non Bird rights on him, the Pacers offered him 20+. No chance to keep him
* you guys are not understanding what are the implications of resigning KCP to that contract. What it would do to the Nuggets flexibility going forward.... for a very marginal gain. It makes totally sense to bet on Braun and Strawther, and it's not like KCP has been setting the league on fire
* extending Murray is an ownership decision, and people would have complained no matter what. They are pot committed, there's no future for this team, as a contender, if Murray turns into a pumpkin. No matter what you do with his contract
* Nnaji actually showed some promise in the first few years, just he totally regressed since (and I suspect Malone has a role in that). It was a bet to have a cheap contributor long term, and potentially a matching salary. It didn't work but that's not the end of the world.

What people are missing is that the only thing that really matters is the regression of Murray. He goes back to last year level before the injury and the Nuggets are tier 1 contenders. He doesn't and they are cooked.

I personally blame Booth for giving player option on contracts to Nnaji, Jackson, Šarić...he gives PO on every contract and that decision turns so, so, contracts into terrible ones.

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

If Murray stays this version of himself they are screwd and no trade for player as good/bad will make them championship contender.

Also trading MPJ for 1/2 worst players than him doesn't make sense either.

I like Malone but more and more im starting to come to the same conclusion that maybe it is time for him to go if he doesn't mesh with the GM's vision. I think it's a coaches job to develop young players and I don't think Watson and Strawthers are that bad. Also, there is potential that the team can play better minutes without Jokic as well and I could see another coach getting more out of the team.

There's a high possibility that Jokic could be masking Malone's faults.

I by no means think he's a bad coach but just like in the Godfather, sometimes you need a wartime consigliere and maybe Malone ain't it right now.

[BelgradeNugget]

* he signed Brown to a tax-MLE, he had non Bird rights on him, the Pacers offered him 20+. No chance to keep him
* you guys are not understanding what are the implications of resigning KCP to that contract. What it would do to the Nuggets flexibility going forward.... for a very marginal gain. It makes totally sense to bet on Braun and Strawther, and it's not like KCP has been setting the league on fire
* extending Murray is an ownership decision, and people would have complained no matter what. They are pot committed, there's no future for this team, as a contender, if Murray turns into a pumpkin. No matter what you do with his contract
* Nnaji actually showed some promise in the first few years, just he totally regressed since (and I suspect Malone has a role in that). It was a bet to have a cheap contributor long term, and potentially a matching salary. It didn't work but that's not the end of the world.

What people are missing is that the only thing that really matters is the regression of Murray. He goes back to last year level before the injury and the Nuggets are tier 1 contenders. He doesn't and they are cooked.

I personally blame Booth for giving player option on contracts to Nnaji, Jackson, Šarić...he gives PO on every contract and that decision turns so, so, contracts into terrible ones.

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

If Murray stays this version of himself they are screwd and no trade for player as good/bad will make them championship contender.

Also trading MPJ for 1/2 worst players than him doesn't make sense either.

I like Malone but more and more im starting to come to the same conclusion that maybe it is time for him to go if he doesn't mesh with the GM's vision. I think it's a coaches job to develop young players and I don't think Watson and Strawthers are that bad. Also, there is potential that the team can play better minutes without Jokic as well and I could see another coach getting more out of the team.

There's a high possibility that Jokic could be masking Malone's faults.

I by no means think he's a bad coach but just like in the Godfather, sometimes you need a wartime consigliere and maybe Malone ain't it right now.

Just think about this. Nuggets bench position among NBA benches and netrtg in Jokic era

24/25 - 29th - 6.2
23/24 - 22nd -1.5
22/23 - 29th - 3.7 championship year
21/22 - 23rd - 1.7
20/21 - 13th + 0.5
19/20 - 18th - 1.0
18/19 - 7th + 1.4
17/18 - 20th - 2.0
16/17 - 11th - 0.1 Jokic was backup in 14 games
15/16 - 20th -1.1 Jokic was backup in 25 games

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced?Season=2020-21&StarterBench=Bench&dir=A&sort=NET_RATING

In 2018/19 only year their bench was better than average, bench players were Monte Morris, Malik Beasley, Torrey Craig, Trey Lyles and Mason Plumlee. Jarred Vanderbilt was on the end of the bench unplayable. All of them were starters for at least one team they played on after they left Nuggets. Think about that.

[Calvin Klein]

Their core players( making over 20 million) outside of Joker need to step up. You don’t get paid so much to be mediocre.

Some get paid even more.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

I personally blame Booth for giving player option on contracts to Nnaji, Jackson, Šarić...he gives PO on every contract and that decision turns so, so, contracts into terrible ones.

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

If Murray stays this version of himself they are screwd and no trade for player as good/bad will make them championship contender.

Also trading MPJ for 1/2 worst players than him doesn't make sense either.

The real decision maker is Josh Kroenke, then you have a number of different voices in the room.
Booth is one of them, maybe the most important, but I am pretty sure Malone is not left out.
The issue i see here is that there's not alignment in the vision.
Booth's one, that he explained to KOC last year, is pretty clear to me:
- he wants the team to contend in all of the next 4-5 years, as long as Jokic is a MVP level player. he can't get stuck with an old and expensive team, like the Bucks
- he wants the team to have young players who will develop, bring the energy and then, eventually, phase out the expensive ones on roster now
But for this to makes sense you must be an organization who can find value on the margins and put the young players in position to succeed. For whatever reason, this is not happening with the Nuggets, at all.
Over the last for years, the team is totally falling apart when Jokic is not on the floor, no matter whoelse is playing.
Because of that, you're throwing these young guys into absolutely wretched situations. And you want them to sink or swim. not surprisingly, most of them end up under water throwing the whole project down the toilet.
We can blame Booth about the guys he brought in but, to be honest, I am not sure they are all that bad. Even a guy like Nnaji, he's been absolutely set for failure. And then his confidence is shot. Same for Pickett, or Tyson. Malone must be accountable for that, we've seen the likes of Deignault, Spoelstra o Jenkins finding contributors off the street. The Spurs did it for years. Why the Nuggets can't, on the opposite you see some of their guys flourish elsewhere?

[Ryoga Hibiki]

I personally blame Booth for giving player option on contracts to Nnaji, Jackson, Šarić...he gives PO on every contract and that decision turns so, so, contracts into terrible ones.

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

If Murray stays this version of himself they are screwd and no trade for player as good/bad will make them championship contender.

Also trading MPJ for 1/2 worst players than him doesn't make sense either.

I like Malone but more and more im starting to come to the same conclusion that maybe it is time for him to go if he doesn't mesh with the GM's vision. I think it's a coaches job to develop young players and I don't think Watson and Strawthers are that bad. Also, there is potential that the team can play better minutes without Jokic as well and I could see another coach getting more out of the team.

There's a high possibility that Jokic could be masking Malone's faults.

I by no means think he's a bad coach but just like in the Godfather, sometimes you need a wartime consigliere and maybe Malone ain't it right now.

Just think about this. Nuggets bench position among NBA benches and netrtg in Jokic era

24/25 - 29th - 6.2
23/24 - 22nd -1.5
22/23 - 29th - 3.7 championship year
21/22 - 23rd - 1.7
20/21 - 13th + 0.5
19/20 - 18th - 1.0
18/19 - 7th + 1.4
17/18 - 20th - 2.0
16/17 - 11th - 0.1 Jokic was backup in 14 games
15/16 - 20th -1.1 Jokic was backup in 25 games

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/advanced?Season=2020-21&StarterBench=Bench&dir=A&sort=NET_RATING

In 2018/19 only year their bench was better than average, bench players were Monte Morris, Malik Beasley, Torrey Craig, Trey Lyles and Mason Plumlee. Jarred Vanderbilt was on the end of the bench unplayable. All of them were starters for at least one team they played on after they left Nuggets. Think about that.

the real issue is not the bench, it's the non Jokis minutes. other teams have a few starters raising the floor of the bench, the Nuggets totally forget how to play as Nikola sits.

[shrink]

I think their greatest need now, and in the future, is a great point of attack defender. With Murray and Westbrook’s defensive liabilities, a great defender seems necessary. They have really never been the same without Bruce Brown and KCP. Worse, they can’t afford to spend a lot.

I have wondered if they are committed enough to this season to make an offer for Nickiel Alexander-Walker. He’s been the biggest bright spot for the Wolves in a mediocre season, leading the team in net rating. He’s shooting an unsustainable 46% 3P, but it’s his defense that continues to amaze. He has been the most consistent perimeter defender, (sorry McDaniels) which has him leading the team in +/-. All of the Wolves best five-man line ups have him, including one that’s at the 100th percentile.

The only problem for MIN is that while he’s 6-5, he’s mostly a SG, and the Wolves obviously have Ant and traded for DiVincenzo on a three year cheap deal. NAW makes $4.3, but he’s expiring, and there is a good chance MIN can’t afford to bring him back if another team wants to pay him to be a starter.

For MIN, trading NAW would definitely be a step back, and the team still needs time to determine what their future is this season after the Towns trade. Even more worrisome would be giving Denver the key to unlocking their rival, perhaps for several years if the Nuggets utilize NAW’s Bird rights. Wolves fans hate the idea of trading away their bright spot, but the GM in me says that trading an expiring player at a crowded position is worth exploring. However, the goal is to win, and regardless of the price, maybe MIN shouldn’t be throwing rival Denver a lifeline. Jokic is too good, so it might be better to let them drown.

What would the Wolves want from Denver in exchange for NAW? The Nuggets themselves are in a tight spot when it comes to cap space so extending NAW would be a problem... I doubt you would want MPJ with his massive contract, Murray is sadly not eligable for a trade even if by some miracle you would want his albatros ass and Braun is the only player besides Jokic that should be untouchable. Watson is a defensive wing on a nice contract so trading him doesnt make sense for Fenver. Trading AG doesnt make sense for either team. So that leaves Strawther and picks with real value.

There was a strong rumor that Tim Connelly was also interested in DaRon Holmes II at #27. So much so that the Nuggets traded up to grab him first, getting the #22 for #28, #56, and two future 2nds. Finch may still be interested, hoping Holmes overcomes the torn achilles and retains most of his value. As you know, he really likes who he likes .. he used MIN’s 15th roster spot on PJ Dozier.

For this season, the trade doesn’t take away anything from DEN on court this year (though it hurts MIN!). I think NAW is the type of player the Nuggets would want to extend on a reasonable contract, so I would imagine that trading for NAW might mean the Nuggets plan to get off of MPJ’s salary at the deadline or next summer for the money for Gordon, NAW, and a back up center.

Personally, I wouldn’t do this trade if I was the Wolves GM. Jokic and ..anybody .. is a major threat to the Wolves success, and it could be for multiple years. For an expiring player, getting this year’s #22 pick seems like good GMing, but it’s such a dangerous trade for the Wolves, I’d need more value after the achilles injury. However, to me, NAW is exactly the type of player DEN needs. He’s cheap ($4.3 mil), he is playing great, does the things DEN needs most, and because of MIN’s new roster construction, he might even be available.

And if NAW’s playoff defense broke Jamal Murray’s brain, maybe adding him as a teammate would end those nightmares and you’d get him back too!

[nomansland]

One thing I would like to ask people here - do you think Malone has a saying in Nuggets decision on players they are going to offer contracts in the first place. In 2022-23 champions year for the Nuggets, their bench was terrible and Booth brought Thomas and Jackson and gave up Bones in trade for 2 2nds. Why he did do that? Maybe Malone was asking for bench help. Neither of the two was used in the playoffs.

Did Malone OK'd Saric and Russ signing. His job is to make it work. He has a history of not being able to solve rotation problems. Jay Huffs sucess in Memphis puts new light on this problem. If Malone can't find solution he must go. Then it's Booths turn if new coach doesn't do better job. Booth is guilty for giving player options and then trading 2nd round picks to get rid of the same players next year. His job is for Nuggets to have assets and flexibility, they don't have it.

Don't think anyone could imagine Thomas and Saric would suck that much, on paper that looked like good signings. Bones is Tim Connelly player ("hooper") and has only himself to blame, besides, doesn't seem to play on the Clippers either. Jay Huff wouldn't be solving any of the Nuggets problems even if he stayed, a backup playing 5-10 min. behind Jokic is never going to be impactful.

Jay Huff's netrtg with Nuggets was -7.9 similar to what Jordan and Nnaji had. They were unplayable so Malone had to play Jokic/starters too much. They lost in the playoffs becuse they were exhausted - in game 7 they were up 20 pts in the 3Q. Malone even didn't trust Watson in the playoffs.

Jay Huff's netrtg with Memphis is +4.1 Is he so much better now or Jenkins knows how to use him? If he stayed and could play 16 minutes per game, he is playing now with positive impact, Jokic wouldn't have to be 2nd in the league in minutes per game and Nuggets wouldn't be - /a lot/ with Jokic on the bench. Maybe that would solve a lot of their problems because even with Murray playing this bad their starting lineup has a netrtg of +12.5

But Huff is not first in line of backup bigs who couldn't play for Malone, he is last in the line.

Memphis has the defenders who can play man defense in the paint so Huff can block shots from weakside. The Nuggets do not have that either at the backup 4 or 5. If they did, Zeke could do pretty much what Huff does. The overall fit is better for him in Memphis. I bet it would be for Zeke too.

[phanman]

Like Rob Pelinka, Calvin Booth has fumbled back to back off seasons coming off a chip.

How did Pelinka fumble the 20/21 season? It's always interesting when people just run with narratives instead of thinking for themselves.

That's funny, that you would assume that. You do realize that he reshuffled the supporting cast that played a pivotal role in that bubble chip too right?

- Traded their starting SG/SF Danny Green for Dennis Schroeder
- Which in turn lead to him not resigning Rajon Rondo
- Swapped back up bigs in Dwight and Javale for Bell and Gasol

These all may have seem minor moves aimed at getting younger/better (in Schroeder's case), but those 4 guys were all hugely important to the chemistry of that team. Given the short off season and AD's mysterious decline, a repeat was likely not in the cards, but he didn't do the team any favors by getting rid of so many of the vets that made that team work.

* he signed Brown to a tax-MLE, he had non Bird rights on him, the Pacers offered him 20+. No chance to keep him
* you guys are not understanding what are the implications of resigning KCP to that contract. What it would do to the Nuggets flexibility going forward.... for a very marginal gain. It makes totally sense to bet on Braun and Strawther, and it's not like KCP has been setting the league on fire
* extending Murray is an ownership decision, and people would have complained no matter what. They are pot committed, there's no future for this team, as a contender, if Murray turns into a pumpkin. No matter what you do with his contract
* Nnaji actually showed some promise in the first few years, just he totally regressed since (and I suspect Malone has a role in that). It was a bet to have a cheap contributor long term, and potentially a matching salary. It didn't work but that's not the end of the world.

What people are missing is that the only thing that really matters is the regression of Murray. He goes back to last year level before the injury and the Nuggets are tier 1 contenders. He doesn't and they are cooked.

I don't think you guys read my post clearly, I did state that the decision to not resign Bruce and KCP were both understandable. I am fully aware that with Brucie they had no choice and KCP priced himself out of Denver but the reason I brought those examples up were to illustrate how the Booth contradicted his line of thinking but giving the unproven Nnaji that 4 year guranteed deal and then the more crippling 4 year max to Murray.

They were not pot committed with Jamal because lets face it, everybody in the league - front offices, fans, media were all shocked that they gave him that contract coming off the playoffs and summer that he did. He was still signed for this season and would have had to ball out in a contract year to earn that deal. They would have still had his bird rights in 2025 and it would have taken a whole lot for Jamal to actually entertain leaving Jokic man. Instead he got his money and from the games I have seen him play, has no real sense of urgency to give us playoff Murray production in the regular season.

[HMFFL]

change to MPJ...
MPJ+Nnaji+Future FRP for Lavine/Craig..

MPJ+Nnaji+Russ for Rozier/Robinson/Ware..?

MPJ for Stewart/Moore/THJ..?

I doubt Denver will want to move on from MPJ. He shoots 50% from the field for his career and 40% from three.

Sent from my SM-S928U1 using RealGM mobile app

[JDR720]

They struggle so much in non-Jokic minutes that I think there's a pretty good chance Malone just can't come up with a system that doesn't revolve around Jokic that works.

Huff rotted on the bench there, and now it looks like he'd be an ideal backup center. That potential miss and the worst small contracts in the league (Nnaji, Saric) would be one hell of a way to ruin the Nuggets season.

Jamal needs to figure it out too, he's been awful since the end of the playoffs. He's not even a top 10 PG anymore.

[manlisten]

Like Rob Pelinka, Calvin Booth has fumbled back to back off seasons coming off a chip.

How did Pelinka fumble the 20/21 season? It's always interesting when people just run with narratives instead of thinking for themselves.

That's funny, that you would assume that. You do realize that he reshuffled the supporting cast that played a pivotal role in that bubble chip too right?

- Traded their starting SG/SF Danny Green for Dennis Schroeder
- Which in turn lead to him not resigning Rajon Rondo
- Swapped back up bigs in Dwight and Javale for Bell and Gasol

These all may have seem minor moves aimed at getting younger/better (in Schroeder's case), but those 4 guys were all hugely important to the chemistry of that team. Given the short off season and AD's mysterious decline, a repeat was likely not in the cards, but he didn't do the team any favors by getting rid of so many of the vets that made that team work.

Yes I'm aware it wasn't the exact same roster. How did you come to the conclusion that it was the wrong thing to do? That team started the season with a record of 21-6. They had the best record in the league over a month into the season and were 2nd in the league 3 months into it. It was a 5 month season. Again, it was injuries that derailed the team. AD missed 36 games and LeBron missed 27. AD missed a chunk of games from February 16th to April 19th. Over that stretch the Lakers still managed to have the 2nd best defensive rating in the league. Does that sound like a team that "doesn't work"? LeBron was also out from March 21st to April 28th. The Lakers led the Suns 2-1 in the first round when AD injured his groin and that was all she wrote. It was a well built team that succumbed to injuries and still posted an elite defense without its 2 best players. People seem to confuse that season with the Westbrook season which was an unmitigated disaster. But if that was a fumbled season then so are the Cavs and Thunder this year because they all had similar win rates at this point of the year.

[phanman]

How did Pelinka fumble the 20/21 season? It's always interesting when people just run with narratives instead of thinking for themselves.

That's funny, that you would assume that. You do realize that he reshuffled the supporting cast that played a pivotal role in that bubble chip too right?

- Traded their starting SG/SF Danny Green for Dennis Schroeder
- Which in turn lead to him not resigning Rajon Rondo
- Swapped back up bigs in Dwight and Javale for Bell and Gasol

These all may have seem minor moves aimed at getting younger/better (in Schroeder's case), but those 4 guys were all hugely important to the chemistry of that team. Given the short off season and AD's mysterious decline, a repeat was likely not in the cards, but he didn't do the team any favors by getting rid of so many of the vets that made that team work.

Yes I'm aware it wasn't the exact same roster. How did you come to the conclusion that it was the wrong thing to do? That team started the season with a record of 21-6. Again, it was injuries that derailed the team. AD missed 36 games and LeBron missed 27. AD missed a chunk of games from February 16th to April 19th. Over that stretch the Lakers still managed to have the 2nd best defensive rating in the league. Does that sound like a team that "doesn't work"? LeBron was also out from March 21st to April 28th. The Lakers led the Suns 2-1 in the first round when AD injured his groin and that was all she wrote. It was a well built team that succumbed to injuries and still posted an elite defense without its 2 best players. People seem to confuse that season with the Westbrook season which was an unmitigated disaster. But if that was a fumbled season then so are the Cavs and Thunder this year because they all had similar win rates at this point of the year.

Given how those ancillary pieces played in that series against the Suns is how I came to that conclusion. Yes they still finished the regular season as a defensive juggernaut, but I guess I just place a much higher value on having guys like Green and Rondo in a playoff setting that who they ultimately settled on. Schroeder was a no-show against Phoenix and they just didnt have anybody capable of slowing down Book who Danny would have been a great option for. Yes AD injured his groin, but CP3 also hurt his shoulder in G1 and was limited the rest of the series.

I don't the reasoning for bringing up the Cavs and Thunder The playoffs is where we judge contending teams and from the what we've seen so far, they should be much better once that times comes around.

[manlisten]

That's funny, that you would assume that. You do realize that he reshuffled the supporting cast that played a pivotal role in that bubble chip too right?

- Traded their starting SG/SF Danny Green for Dennis Schroeder
- Which in turn lead to him not resigning Rajon Rondo
- Swapped back up bigs in Dwight and Javale for Bell and Gasol

These all may have seem minor moves aimed at getting younger/better (in Schroeder's case), but those 4 guys were all hugely important to the chemistry of that team. Given the short off season and AD's mysterious decline, a repeat was likely not in the cards, but he didn't do the team any favors by getting rid of so many of the vets that made that team work.

Yes I'm aware it wasn't the exact same roster. How did you come to the conclusion that it was the wrong thing to do? That team started the season with a record of 21-6. Again, it was injuries that derailed the team. AD missed 36 games and LeBron missed 27. AD missed a chunk of games from February 16th to April 19th. Over that stretch the Lakers still managed to have the 2nd best defensive rating in the league. Does that sound like a team that "doesn't work"? LeBron was also out from March 21st to April 28th. The Lakers led the Suns 2-1 in the first round when AD injured his groin and that was all she wrote. It was a well built team that succumbed to injuries and still posted an elite defense without its 2 best players. People seem to confuse that season with the Westbrook season which was an unmitigated disaster. But if that was a fumbled season then so are the Cavs and Thunder this year because they all had similar win rates at this point of the year.

Given how those ancillary pieces played in that series against the Suns is how I came to that conclusion. Yes they still finished the regular season as a defensive juggernaut, but I guess I just place a much higher value on having guys like Green and Rondo in a playoff setting that who they ultimately settled on. Schroeder was a no-show against Phoenix and they just didnt have anybody capable of slowing down Book who Danny would have been a great option for. Yes AD injured his groin, but CP3 also hurt his shoulder in G1 and was limited the rest of the series.

I don't the reasoning for bringing up the Cavs and Thunder The playoffs is where we judge contending teams and from the what we've seen so far, they should be much better once that times comes around.

They played well enough to take a 2-1 lead. Expecting them to reach the finals without AD is something, but not reasonable or realistic. In no way was it a "fumbled" season if they looked just as good or better than the year before when healthy. It's laughable to think Danny Green was the difference between winning and losing that series. Caruso is an all defensive guard and had nothing for Booker. Also pretty funny to call Schroeder a no show when he put up 19 and 3 with 2 steals on 56/40/80 in those first 3 games before AD went out.

[phanman]

Yes I'm aware it wasn't the exact same roster. How did you come to the conclusion that it was the wrong thing to do? That team started the season with a record of 21-6. Again, it was injuries that derailed the team. AD missed 36 games and LeBron missed 27. AD missed a chunk of games from February 16th to April 19th. Over that stretch the Lakers still managed to have the 2nd best defensive rating in the league. Does that sound like a team that "doesn't work"? LeBron was also out from March 21st to April 28th. The Lakers led the Suns 2-1 in the first round when AD injured his groin and that was all she wrote. It was a well built team that succumbed to injuries and still posted an elite defense without its 2 best players. People seem to confuse that season with the Westbrook season which was an unmitigated disaster. But if that was a fumbled season then so are the Cavs and Thunder this year because they all had similar win rates at this point of the year.

Given how those ancillary pieces played in that series against the Suns is how I came to that conclusion. Yes they still finished the regular season as a defensive juggernaut, but I guess I just place a much higher value on having guys like Green and Rondo in a playoff setting that who they ultimately settled on. Schroeder was a no-show against Phoenix and they just didnt have anybody capable of slowing down Book who Danny would have been a great option for. Yes AD injured his groin, but CP3 also hurt his shoulder in G1 and was limited the rest of the series.

I don't the reasoning for bringing up the Cavs and Thunder The playoffs is where we judge contending teams and from the what we've seen so far, they should be much better once that times comes around.

They played well enough to take a 2-1 lead. Expecting them to reach the finals without AD is something, but not reasonable or realistic. In no way was it a "fumbled" season if they looked just as good or better than the year before when healthy. It's laughable to think Danny Green was the difference between winning and losing that series. Caruso is an all defensive guard and had nothing for Booker.

I never said I expected them to make the Finals without AD and Caruso wasn't defensive caliber in 2021. It isn't laughable at all with Danny still on the team, maybe they don't actually start Drummond and benefit from his two-way play. Anyways i'd rather not derail this Nuggets thread any longer.

The main point is that Rob couldn't help himself to not tinker with a championship formula/team and the moves in 2021 were just the beginnings of him completely dismantling the core of what made the 2020 championship team great.

[nomansland]

When I think about potential trades, especially this year, I keep coming back to the idea that whatever they do, nothing is going to make a meaningful improvement unless Murray gets back to close to where he was in 2023. He doesn't have to be 2023 Murray, but almost.

Because unless Murray gets back to form, they're stuck with that deal for at least a couple of years and the finals are out of the question. And if Murray gets back to form, a big trade probably isn't necessary. Basically, it all comes down to Murray.

Now, a lot of message board experts are going to pile on and say he's toast and is never going to recover. That's certainly possible. But we've seen a lot of players bounce back from ACL injuries and he's only 27, so I wouldn't start digging his grave just yet.