2025 NBA Draft Thread, part 1 – Capture the Flagg

[playa-hater]

Igor Milicic is a poor man's Lauri Markkanen.

[Fierce1]

Igor Milicic is a poor man's Lauri Markkanen.

So his defense is also poorer than Lauri's defense.

[shackles10]

Too early to dig the grave, but IF Baylor is a bust then we shouldn't be worried about overlap with him. And actually, we drafted someone who's kind of an overlap with Hauser without issue so if there's a versatile shooter to be had who won't get killed on defense it might be one of the best positions to look for this late in the draft where everyone has some kind of flaw.

[djFan71]

Too early to dig the grave, but IF Baylor is a bust then we shouldn't be worried about overlap with him. And actually, we drafted someone who's kind of an overlap with Hauser without issue so if there's a versatile shooter to be had who won't get killed on defense it might be one of the best positions to look for this late in the draft where everyone has some kind of flaw.

Definitely agree that you don't worry about guys that aren't playing yet for drafting - bust or not. Let them fight it out.

I want shooting with a little more size, though. We seem good at true, non-shooting center. And one unicorn center. At versatile, shooting 4 we have Tatum and Al. And you don't want Tatum playing small ball 5 except in crucial playoff minutes. I just think we have a significant hole there as Al ages and eventually retires (after his next 2yr/$20M deal...). KP can play some double big with Queta or Luke, but he's not taking Giannis/LeBron/etc types on the perimeter. And you don't want that wear and tear on him anyways. Tillman is that for spot minutes, but doesn't seem like Joe will use him every night.

This draft seems to have enough intriguing guys at that size that I'm more interested in. I can always take another wing, so I wouldn't hate Karaban, he just wouldn't be my priority.

[phincsfan]

I'm on the Tyrese Proctor train. Big PG who can shoot and plays against the best teams. Get him in the 2nd if he stays in the draft.

[Hal14]

This article I just wrote was partly inspired by discussions in this very thread!

Read on Twitter

[redslastlaugh]

Too early to dig the grave, but IF Baylor is a bust then we shouldn't be worried about overlap with him. And actually, we drafted someone who's kind of an overlap with Hauser without issue so if there's a versatile shooter to be had who won't get killed on defense it might be one of the best positions to look for this late in the draft where everyone has some kind of flaw.

Definitely agree that you don't worry about guys that aren't playing yet for drafting - bust or not. Let them fight it out.

I want shooting with a little more size, though.

I agree that we can’t draft too much around guys we already have, especially at the end of the bench. But … if there was an archetype I’m pining for it’d be for athleticism at guard, wing, or big. Brown and Tatum are solidly in their prime but Browns in year nine and still bouncy but probably on the downtrend as a run/jump athlete.

Walsh is a plus athlete, Queta a plus athlete but those may not be foundational guys going forward. And then White, Holiday, PP, Hauser, Horford… this is not a plus athletic group. When you look at how scrappy OKC gonna be next couple of years, if we had a prime athlete Smart or prime athlete Robwill or prime speed Rondo … that’d be nice to draft an athletic boost with one of these picks, rather than a guy like Karaban who is not that…

When I think about exciting athleticism coming off the bench, recent examples would be 2006-2010 Tony Allen or young Avery Bradley when Pierce/KG were at the end of their Celtics career. Going way back, Reggie Lewis and Dee Brown were the young dogs when Bird, McHale, Chief got old. As the championship core gets older, it’d be nice to get a young guy coming up with young hops

[Hal14]

Too early to dig the grave, but IF Baylor is a bust then we shouldn't be worried about overlap with him. And actually, we drafted someone who's kind of an overlap with Hauser without issue so if there's a versatile shooter to be had who won't get killed on defense it might be one of the best positions to look for this late in the draft where everyone has some kind of flaw.

It's definitely too soon to know if Baylor is a bust. He's done nothing in boston yet but has lit it up in g league. So that's basically the same as Hauser did in his rookie year (and duncan robinson, and max strus, etc.) And Scheierman is basically same age as Hauser (and robinson and strus..) during his rookie year.

Plus, we also have Peterson emerging as possibly a contributor. And Walsh has emerged this season as a guy who has given us rotation mins at a young age (not a great shooter like these other guys but basically same position).

So I think it is a fair concern with a guy like Karaban - taking a guy where there's a bit of overlap on the roster - both from a skillset standpoint and a positional one. Especially if we're talking about using a 1st round pick on him.

I'd probably still take Karaban if he's there in the 28-30 range. I think he's that good and I like the potential fit with him here. And think it's possible he could emerge as the best option to possibly be a Hauser replacement (compared to Walsh, Scherman and Peterson). But I do think it's a fair question to ask, whether we take a guy like that so high in the draft - where there's a bit of overlap..

No matter who we take, there would be a bit of overlap though. We've got a team loaded with depth and talent. And core pieces locked up on long term deals. Which is why the best option is probably trade out of the 1st round (picking up some assets in the process) and take some guy in the 2nd round..

[phincsfan]

This article I just wrote was partly inspired by discussions in this very thread!

Read on Twitter

Good write up Hal.

IMO, and I’ve mentioned this before, the NIL will start attracting more international players to play in college which I think will be very good. You mentioned bringing the draft selections down. How about actually adding a 3rd round of draft and stash players for international players only? There will be no rush to bring those players over but the NBA teams will have their rights. Give college kids a better chance of making it.

[djFan71]

Putting names to it. F/C types I'm intrigued by:

Asa Newell
Noa Essengue
CMB
Kanon Catchings
Mackenzie Mgbako
Rasheer Fleming
JT Toppin

Bigger scoring and/or playmaking wings:
Will Riley, Nique Clifford, Thiero, Carter Bryant

Lead guards with some size: Proctor, Kam Jones, Sallis

New names I wanna look at still: Thomas Sorber, Jeremiah Fears

I'm not saying I take all those guys over Karaban or that I've done extensive analysis on them even, but the idea of them is more in line with what I want to add to this team and develop for a year or 2 after the draft.

[shackles10]

Too early to dig the grave, but IF Baylor is a bust then we shouldn't be worried about overlap with him. And actually, we drafted someone who's kind of an overlap with Hauser without issue so if there's a versatile shooter to be had who won't get killed on defense it might be one of the best positions to look for this late in the draft where everyone has some kind of flaw.

It's definitely too soon to know if Baylor is a bust. He's done nothing in boston yet but has lit it up in g league. So that's basically the same as Hauser did in his rookie year (and duncan robinson, and max strus, etc.) And Scheierman is basically same age as Hauser (and robinson and strus..) during his rookie year.

Plus, we also have Peterson emerging as possibly a contributor. And Walsh has emerged this season as a guy who has given us rotation mins at a young age (not a great shooter like these other guys but basically same position).

So I think it is a fair concern with a guy like Karaban - taking a guy where there's a bit of overlap on the roster - both from a skillset standpoint and a positional one. Especially if we're talking about using a 1st round pick on him.

I'd probably still take Karaban if he's there in the 28-30 range. I think he's that good and I like the potential fit with him here. And think it's possible he could emerge as the best option to possibly be a Hauser replacement (compared to Walsh, Scherman and Peterson). But I do think it's a fair question to ask, whether we take a guy like that so high in the draft - where there's a bit of overlap..

No matter who we take, there would be a bit of overlap though. We've got a team loaded with depth and talent. And core pieces locked up on long term deals. Which is why the best option is probably trade out of the 1st round (picking up some assets in the process) and take some guy in the 2nd round..

Just to add on... I don't think overlap for overlap's sake is a bad thing either. Part of what makes us so good is overlap. Everyone can shoot, almost everyone can bring the ball up, everyone can defend. It's the specialty guys like Hauser/PP with their shooting only early on, Springer with only defense, etc., that couldn't get any playing time. The Jays were criticized for being too much overlap, but that take proven to be wrong. Jrue and White are a bit of an overlap too, but it's incredibly valuable to have.

[Hal14]

Too early to dig the grave, but IF Baylor is a bust then we shouldn't be worried about overlap with him. And actually, we drafted someone who's kind of an overlap with Hauser without issue so if there's a versatile shooter to be had who won't get killed on defense it might be one of the best positions to look for this late in the draft where everyone has some kind of flaw.

It's definitely too soon to know if Baylor is a bust. He's done nothing in boston yet but has lit it up in g league. So that's basically the same as Hauser did in his rookie year (and duncan robinson, and max strus, etc.) And Scheierman is basically same age as Hauser (and robinson and strus..) during his rookie year.

Plus, we also have Peterson emerging as possibly a contributor. And Walsh has emerged this season as a guy who has given us rotation mins at a young age (not a great shooter like these other guys but basically same position).

So I think it is a fair concern with a guy like Karaban - taking a guy where there's a bit of overlap on the roster - both from a skillset standpoint and a positional one. Especially if we're talking about using a 1st round pick on him.

I'd probably still take Karaban if he's there in the 28-30 range. I think he's that good and I like the potential fit with him here. And think it's possible he could emerge as the best option to possibly be a Hauser replacement (compared to Walsh, Scherman and Peterson). But I do think it's a fair question to ask, whether we take a guy like that so high in the draft - where there's a bit of overlap..

No matter who we take, there would be a bit of overlap though. We've got a team loaded with depth and talent. And core pieces locked up on long term deals. Which is why the best option is probably trade out of the 1st round (picking up some assets in the process) and take some guy in the 2nd round..

Just to add on... I don't think overlap for overlap's sake is a bad thing either. Part of what makes us so good is overlap. Everyone can shoot, almost everyone can bring the ball up, everyone can defend. It's the specialty guys like Hauser/PP with their shooting only early on, Springer with only defense, etc., that couldn't get any playing time. The Jays were criticized for being too much overlap, but that take proven to be wrong. Jrue and White are a bit of an overlap too, but it's incredibly valuable to have.

Yeah that's fair, and is part of the reason why I am down with us snagging Karaban..

[165bows]

Putting names to it. F/C types I'm intrigued by:

Asa Newell
Noa Essengue
CMB
Kanon Catchings
Mackenzie Mgbako
Rasheer Fleming
JT Toppin

Bigger scoring and/or playmaking wings:
Will Riley, Nique Clifford, Thiero, Carter Bryant

Lead guards with some size: Proctor, Kam Jones, Sallis

New names I wanna look at still: Thomas Sorber, Jeremiah Fears

I'm not saying I take all those guys over Karaban or that I've done extensive analysis on them even, but the idea of them is more in line with what I want to add to this team and develop for a year or 2 after the draft.

He’s prob not as good on D but I’m wondering if anyone’s made the Bam comp for Sorber yet.

Need Hal or someone that hangs out in the draft board and draft twitter to fill me in on if that’s a fresh take or I’m just late to the party lol.

[165bows]

This is the other intriguing guy to me, lots of shades of Maxey and SGA:
https://tankathon.com/players/labaron-philon

But back to Sorber, he’s going to be a lotto pick unfortunately.

[brackdan70]

Putting names to it. F/C types I'm intrigued by:

Asa Newell
Noa Essengue
CMB
Kanon Catchings
Mackenzie Mgbako
Rasheer Fleming
JT Toppin

Bigger scoring and/or playmaking wings:
Will Riley, Nique Clifford, Thiero, Carter Bryant

Lead guards with some size: Proctor, Kam Jones, Sallis

New names I wanna look at still: Thomas Sorber, Jeremiah Fears

I'm not saying I take all those guys over Karaban or that I've done extensive analysis on them even, but the idea of them is more in line with what I want to add to this team and develop for a year or 2 after the draft.

Good list. Rasheer Fleming is my current favorite. The defensive chops set him apart in my mind. I fear he will climb up the boards out of our reach though.

[brackdan70]

This is the other intriguing guy to me, lots of shades of Maxey and SGA:
https://tankathon.com/players/labaron-philon

But back to Sorber, he’s going to be a lotto pick unfortunately.

I wouldn’t fire Brad if we picked him.

This is feeling like a really good draft.

[Hal14]

Putting names to it. F/C types I'm intrigued by:

Asa Newell
Noa Essengue
CMB
Kanon Catchings
Mackenzie Mgbako
Rasheer Fleming
JT Toppin

Bigger scoring and/or playmaking wings:
Will Riley, Nique Clifford, Thiero, Carter Bryant

Lead guards with some size: Proctor, Kam Jones, Sallis

New names I wanna look at still: Thomas Sorber, Jeremiah Fears

I'm not saying I take all those guys over Karaban or that I've done extensive analysis on them even, but the idea of them is more in line with what I want to add to this team and develop for a year or 2 after the draft.

He’s prob not as good on D but I’m wondering if anyone’s made the Bam comp for Sorber yet.

Need Hal or someone that hangs out in the draft board and draft twitter to fill me in on if that’s a fresh take or I’m just late to the party lol.

I haven't watched a ton of Sorber. Haven't been blown away from what I have seen. But know he has some good stats and a few folks are very high on him so I'll certainly be watching him more closely moving forward.

But from what I have seen, he seems a lot more like Thomas Bryant than Bam..

[Hal14]

My updated rankings of the prospects:

Read on Twitter

[165bows]

Putting names to it. F/C types I'm intrigued by:

Asa Newell
Noa Essengue
CMB
Kanon Catchings
Mackenzie Mgbako
Rasheer Fleming
JT Toppin

Bigger scoring and/or playmaking wings:
Will Riley, Nique Clifford, Thiero, Carter Bryant

Lead guards with some size: Proctor, Kam Jones, Sallis

New names I wanna look at still: Thomas Sorber, Jeremiah Fears

I'm not saying I take all those guys over Karaban or that I've done extensive analysis on them even, but the idea of them is more in line with what I want to add to this team and develop for a year or 2 after the draft.

He’s prob not as good on D but I’m wondering if anyone’s made the Bam comp for Sorber yet.

Need Hal or someone that hangs out in the draft board and draft twitter to fill me in on if that’s a fresh take or I’m just late to the party lol.

I haven't watched a ton of Sorber. Haven't been blown away from what I have seen. But know he has some good stats and a few folks are very high on him so I'll certainly be watching him more closely moving forward.

But from what I have seen, he seems a lot more like Thomas Bryant than Bam..

Haven't watched a ton of him either but he does have a very workman-like look to him, not flashy really at all, except for maybe his passing. But that's a big element that separates from eg a Thomas Bryant, he looks like a very good passing big. 4 AST/40 mins, nearly a 20% assist rate, 2:1 A/TO ratio. Add that to elite block+steal rates, high volume and efficiency inside the arc scoring, there is a lot of intrigue there for me.

Has really outproduced Cooper Flagg (who I'm a big fan of) so far statistically, and albeit a quarter of the way into the season, more than Bam in college as well. But I think that's the upside of him, solid versatile defender as a big who can rebound, handle the ball and pass and score a lot of ways inside the arc, with the three point shooting being the thing that's more of a hope than anything else.

So agree he kind of looks boring but I'm wondering if there isn't a lot more there than it looks at first glance.

[playa-hater]

My updated rankings of the prospects:

Read on Twitter

I definitely have my own way of evaluating prospects. But always appreciate your work.. Good Job Hal!