Change My View: The Bubble championship is the most pure championship ever

[MrPainfulTruth]

Most the comments against the Bubble championship is less pressure from no crowds. I mean I get that argument if an 8th seed won but again the Lakers had the best record, they would’ve benefited from HCA and had that stripped away. And do we really think no crowds is a benefit to the best close-out player of all time? High pressure situations benefit Lebron, he’s been there plenty of times and always rose to the challenge whereas most his opponents have not.

Lebron has always struggled in high pressure situations since early in his career. You can watch any of the thousands of skip vs stephen episodes to see those discussions. When the 'Chosen one, became the frozen one'. HCA wouldnt mean anything as a few words or boos from opponent fans near the front row could have easily affected Lebron in close games.

This thread just keeps on giving. "Lebron has always struggled in high pressure situations", as proven by the "skip vs stephen episodes" LMAO. LeBron haters are really something else.

Why would you say that? If you want to be taken serious you cant label everyone remotely critical of LeBron as "hater", thats just weak.

We have seen 20 years of LeBron either passing up pressure shots - even if defended by a guy as small as Patrick Beverley. He either passed to a so called "role player" or chucked up a brick. To pretend LeBron is immune to arena pressure is just delusional. I'm sure that if your life depended on a guy making a last second shot and you could choose between MJ, Steph, KD, Dame or LeBron, nonone would really give LBJ the ball.

[elchengue20]

Lebron had to play without well deserverd HCA advantage in those Playoffa yet people want to argue his ring was easier because there was no fans.

Give me a fricking break Lebron haters.

[QingJames]

Do you know for a fact others didn’t though? That’s what I was questioning.

I’ll take an apology also for the rude comment

We have proof that the Lakers were practicing and no proof that other teams were. If you’re claiming other teams were practicing together as well, the burden of proof is on you.

I’ll give you an apology right after you apologize for inflicting your rabid political brainrot on me, bud. Magats really are the world’s biggest snowflakes.

Seriously? Ad hominems are weak, my dude. Don't be that guy.

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Nah, done entertaining ideologues who have to jam their politics into every topic. I’m talking about why I think L.A. had a competitive advantage over other teams in the bubble and some nut replies to me raving about how 50 million Californians deserve to burn in hell.

Going to kindly ask everyone taking part in this back and forth to cut it out. Any further replies aimed at continuing this part of the discussion are liable to result in strikes.
- ccs

[SkyBill40]

We have proof that the Lakers were practicing and no proof that other teams were. If you’re claiming other teams were practicing together as well, the burden of proof is on you.

I’ll give you an apology right after you apologize for inflicting your rabid political brainrot on me, bud. Magats really are the world’s biggest snowflakes.

Seriously? Ad hominems are weak, my dude. Don't be that guy.

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Nah, done entertaining ideologues who have to jam their politics into every topic. I’m talking about why I think L.A. had a competitive advantage over other teams in the bubble and some nut replies to me raving about how 50 million Californians deserve to burn in hell.

Fair enough. I must have missed that post. Even still, personal attacks are weaksauce. Don't fall prey to that trap.

[picc]

There are two equally logical arguments and both are wrong and right at the same time.

Argument one: it's the purest form of basketball with no interference in any way, so it's the purest form of winning

Counter argument: its not NBA basketball since that's what NBA basketball is, so even though its pure to basketball its not authentic to NBA basketball

[Bergmaniac]

Lebron has always struggled in high pressure situations since early in his career. You can watch any of the thousands of skip vs stephen episodes to see those discussions. When the 'Chosen one, became the frozen one'. HCA wouldnt mean anything as a few words or boos from opponent fans near the front row could have easily affected Lebron in close games.

This thread just keeps on giving. "Lebron has always struggled in high pressure situations", as proven by the "skip vs stephen episodes" LMAO. LeBron haters are really something else.

Why would you say that? If you want to be taken serious you cant label everyone remotely critical of LeBron as "hater", thats just weak.

We have seen 20 years of LeBron either passing up pressure shots - even if defended by a guy as small as Patrick Beverley. He either passed to a so called "role player" or chucked up a brick. To pretend LeBron is immune to arena pressure is just delusional. I'm sure that if your life depended on a guy making a last second shot and you could choose between MJ, Steph, KD, Dame or LeBron, nonone would really give LBJ the ball.

"Remotely critical", give me a break. He claimed that LeBron has always struggled in high pressure situation which isn't even close to true by any remotely objective measure. The guy has been under intense media spotlight since he was in high school yet has delivered the goods way more often than not. He has excelled in the biggest games time and time again. He averages 33/10/7 in elimination games. LeBron has taken and made more clutch shots in the biggest playoff moments than pretty much anyone else. And yes, he sometimes passes to other players who are in better positions in end of game situations. That's good basketball and it's absurd that it's seen as a weakness.

And sure, if it comes to the last shot and my choice is between LeBron and 4 of the greatest shooters in the history of the game, I probably wouldn't chooce LeBron, but there is way more to being clutch than last second shots (something LeBron is really good at, BTW, according to the stats). If it's in the playoffs, I'd probably pick him over Dame even for this, Dame's playoff clutchness is way overrated because of two series ending shots, he has shot 28% from 3 in playoff elimination games in his career.

[sashaturiaf]

Lebron has had his moments in the playoffs so he's definitely shed his choker label, he's a highly accomplished player.

However he's had plenty of moments of shrinking under the lights or stepping away from a challenge, and he has NEVER won a title where his team didn't have the overwhelming talent advantage. No revisionist history will ever change that for people who witnessed his whole career.

[Scoundreldays]

I didn't like it but not because of the Bubble. 2020 was just such a depressing year especially coming from 2019 which was an amazing year for me. I'd like to forget 2020 ever happened between Kobe, covid and getting laid off.

[MrPainfulTruth]

Lebron has had his moments in the playoffs so he's definitely shed his choker label, he's a highly accomplished player.

However he's had plenty of moments of shrinking under the lights or stepping away from a challenge, and he has NEVER won a title where his team didn't have the overwhelming talent advantage. No revisionist history will ever change that for people who witnessed his whole career.

In a nutshell, his refusal to ever compete on his own in the dunk contest is like a magnifying glass on that weakness - as you said, shrinking under pressure. Of course his stans will find excuses even for that, although you will struggle to find a single all time great who thrived on athleticism and didnt once participate.

We all know those stats that are partly false, partly all career stats. If you play six more seasons than everyone else, you will tend to take and eventually make more shots than everyone else. To me, for his first ten or so years, he would pass up whenever he could (on offense and defense, who would forget how KD hit the game winner over him in 2017, so when the same situation came up in 2018, he eagerly switched away). For the last ten years he has improved his shot and also understood that it hurt his image to not take those shots, but when he takes them he often bricks them. Thers a reason he hasnt won without superstar talent on his team - a fact that clearly separates him from Joker for example, or Dirk or Kawhi.

[Optms]

Uh, the 72 Lakers say "Hi".

You needed to go back more than half a century to find me an example. I rest my case.

You left that door open for an example and one was provided. Don't be mad at him for rebutting your comment factually. Appreciate the fact that he took the time to think about it and supply an answer.

Had you wanted to narrow things down a bit, you should have avoided using "no" followed by "ever." You could have said something like "no team in the past 20 years" or similar.

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And I rebuttal his answer. The point stands, older players take time to get going. And one example from when households still had black and white televisions doesn't negate the statement.

[ryan in Maine]

there were more blunts and groupies than fans.

[Meeksology]

If Jordan had won a bubble championship you and the other Jordan fans would have proclaimed it the greatest sporting achievement of all time.

That's an absolute fact.

But Jordan didn't. And there's only one team that broke the rules.

- Make up something that didnt happen.
- call it a fact.

Lebron fans ladies and gentlemen lol

[SNPA]

I wonder how many more titles Russell, Bird, Duncan or others could have won if they got three months off before the playoffs started?

Hmm.

Yeah, seems legit’ish…kinda. If you ignore the main parts and have a bias or like Mickey Mouse.

[NBA4Lyfe]

I agree and I said that many times here.

No traveling (except Harden), no crowd pressure, no climate differences, just the purest basketball possible.

However, all that casts a shadow over that playoffs, as other teams had to overcome more difficult conditions to win a championship.

It's the purest title in terms of basketball, but a bit easier than others due to huge differences in additional non-court factors.

lebron and the lakers players were still illegally training in facilities while other nba players were forced to stay home and gaining weight.. 80% of players didnt even wanna finish the season.

fraud nba championship in my eyes

[Lala870]

I would argue Lakers DID have HCA due to the Kobe situation

[Harcore Fenton Mun]

The most...

Championship ever.

[Iwasawitness]

Most the comments against the Bubble championship is less pressure from no crowds. I mean I get that argument if an 8th seed won but again the Lakers had the best record, they would’ve benefited from HCA and had that stripped away. And do we really think no crowds is a benefit to the best close-out player of all time? High pressure situations benefit Lebron, he’s been there plenty of times and always rose to the challenge whereas most his opponents have not.

Lebron has always struggled in high pressure situations since early in his career. You can watch any of the thousands of skip vs stephen episodes to see those discussions. When the 'Chosen one, became the frozen one'. HCA wouldnt mean anything as a few words or boos from opponent fans near the front row could have easily affected Lebron in close games.

LeBron is arguably the greatest elimination game performer in the history of the NBA and has the most playoff buzzer beaters of all time. I always laugh at people who claim LeBron has struggled in high pressure situations when even the tiniest amount of evidence refutes this pretty easily.

Why would you say that? If you want to be taken serious you cant label everyone remotely critical of LeBron as "hater", thats just weak.

We have seen 20 years of LeBron either passing up pressure shots - even if defended by a guy as small as Patrick Beverley. He either passed to a so called "role player" or chucked up a brick. To pretend LeBron is immune to arena pressure is just delusional. I'm sure that if your life depended on a guy making a last second shot and you could choose between MJ, Steph, KD, Dame or LeBron, nonone would really give LBJ the ball.

And if you want to be taken seriously, you should probably start by not criticizing someone via spouting obvious nonsense. No one in their right mind at this point would still try to argue that LeBron is some kind of choke artist in the postseason.

[Iwasawitness]

Lebron has had his moments in the playoffs so he's definitely shed his choker label, he's a highly accomplished player.

However he's had plenty of moments of shrinking under the lights or stepping away from a challenge, and he has NEVER won a title where his team didn't have the overwhelming talent advantage. No revisionist history will ever change that for people who witnessed his whole career.

[zimpy27]

Certainly it was the most healthy playoffs you will ever see. Most talent available on all sides.

[tbhawksfan1]

The 2020 season and title will always have a deserved asterisk. The season was interrupted, not finished and then the bubble playoffs. The asterisk comes from the fact that it was not a normal season or playoffs

That's what astericks are for, to denote the one that is unlike the others