Official Ochai Agbaji Thread - Welcome to Toronto, Ochai!

[ash_k]

How does Masai find these diamonds in the rough?

Kids a stud!

Playing excellent basketball on both ends of the floor. Very impressed!

Knew he’d have a bounce back season, good for him!

I don't think he realizes how good he could be

[Tripod]

How does Masai find these diamonds in the rough?

Kids a stud!

Playing excellent basketball on both ends of the floor. Very impressed!

Knew he’d have a bounce back season, good for him!

He was MIA for the better part of a decade, but it's nice to see him round back into form. Hope we keep seeing some more guys showing some good progress.

I think your abacus is broken

[Scase]

How does Masai find these diamonds in the rough?

Kids a stud!

Playing excellent basketball on both ends of the floor. Very impressed!

Knew he’d have a bounce back season, good for him!

He was MIA for the better part of a decade, but it's nice to see him round back into form. Hope we keep seeing some more guys showing some good progress.

I think your abacus is broken

Feel free to point out any player he has traded for, drafted, or signed as a UDFA since Boucher that has been close to this level and stayed with the team. Then go google what "better part of a decade" means, and come back here.

[Tripod]

He was MIA for the better part of a decade, but it's nice to see him round back into form. Hope we keep seeing some more guys showing some good progress.

I think your abacus is broken

Feel free to point out any player he has traded for, drafted, or signed as a UDFA since Boucher that has been close to this level and stayed with the team. Then go google what "better part of a decade" means, and come back here.

Oh, so you want to move the goalposts now.

Yak.

That was easy

[Duffman100]

He was MIA for the better part of a decade, but it's nice to see him round back into form. Hope we keep seeing some more guys showing some good progress.

I think your abacus is broken

Feel free to point out any player he has traded for, drafted, or signed as a UDFA since Boucher that has been close to this level and stayed with the team. Then go google what "better part of a decade" means, and come back here.

Isn't better part of a decade > 5 years?

Edit:

The phrase “better part of a decade” refers to a significant portion of time, typically at least 8 or 9 years, during which something has been happening or existing

That would put us back to 2015.

So Powel, Wright, Poeltl, Siakam, OG, Ibaka, Poeltl (again), Barnes.

Unless you meant the better part of this specific decade (the 2020s).

[Thaddy]

Masai does great considering a lot of players don't want to live north of the border. He's built a culture here "for a better part of a decade".

Posters that think he's a bad GM should look at dysfunctional franchises across the league. We could be in a worse situation.

The only blackmark was Masai thinking Siakam, FVV, and OG could take the reins and lead us to a championship. He's back on track now to get us into a decent compete level for the second half of the 2020s.

[Duffman100]

Masai does great considering a lot of players don't want to live north of the border. He's built a culture here "for a better part of a decade".

Posters that think he's a bad GM should look at dysfunctional franchises across the league. We could be in a worse situation.

The only blackmark was Masai thinking Siakam, FVV, and OG could take the reins and lead us to a championship. He's back on track now to get us into a decent compete level for the second half of the 2020s.

Looking back on it, they should have seen the writing on the wall. They deal so much depth and 1sts to win the title, I'm not sure how they thought they'd build a bench for that FVV, OG, Siakam core.

Even if you believed in those 3, or at least those 3 getting you to 50 wins. Where was the new bench job coming from?

[no dice]

Wow what a season Ochai is having? He came in underperformed a bit and people started to disregard him and now he is killing it. He is a keeper imo

[nikster]

Masai does great considering a lot of players don't want to live north of the border. He's built a culture here "for a better part of a decade".

Posters that think he's a bad GM should look at dysfunctional franchises across the league. We could be in a worse situation.

The only blackmark was Masai thinking Siakam, FVV, and OG could take the reins and lead us to a championship. He's back on track now to get us into a decent compete level for the second half of the 2020s.

Looking back on it, they should have seen the writing on the wall. They deal so much depth and 1sts to win the title, I'm not sure how they thought they'd build a bench for that FVV, OG, Siakam core.

Even if you believed in those 3, or at least those 3 getting you to 50 wins. Where was the new bench job coming from?

If Aaron Baynes worked out for example then you have the assets from Thad and Poeltl trades to potentially build some depth. Not likely but there's a timeline where we could get decent depth

[Scase]

I think your abacus is broken

Feel free to point out any player he has traded for, drafted, or signed as a UDFA since Boucher that has been close to this level and stayed with the team. Then go google what "better part of a decade" means, and come back here.

Oh, so you want to move the goalposts now.

Yak.

That was easy

So Jak was a diamond in the rough was he? Funny to trade a lotto pick for a diamond in the rough. Can you just read the comments that you are replying to?

No goalposts are being moved, you just aren't following the conversation in the slightest, Ochai is in no way the same situation as Jak.

I think your abacus is broken

Feel free to point out any player he has traded for, drafted, or signed as a UDFA since Boucher that has been close to this level and stayed with the team. Then go google what "better part of a decade" means, and come back here.

Isn't better part of a decade > 5 years?

Edit:

The phrase “better part of a decade” refers to a significant portion of time, typically at least 8 or 9 years, during which something has been happening or existing

That would put us back to 2015.

So Powel, Wright, Poeltl, Siakam, OG, Ibaka, Poeltl (again), Barnes.

Unless you meant the better part of this specific decade (the 2020s).

"Better part of" anything typically refers to the majority.

This is an archaic phrase derived from comparing parts of something which has been divided in two. People called the parts the "better part" and the "lesser part", meaning the larger and the smaller.

the best/better/greater part of idiom
: more than half of (something) : most of (something)
It took us the better part of a week to finish the job.
We've been waiting for the best part of an hour.
They live here for the greater part of the year.

What is considered a majority?
A majority is more than half of a total. It is a subset of a set consisting of more than half of the set's elements. For example, if a group consists of 31 individuals, a majority would be 16 or more individuals, while having 15 or fewer individuals would not constitute a majority.

Boucher joined the team 6 seasons ago in 2018-19, 6 is a majority out of 10.

[ash_k]

Masai does great considering a lot of players don't want to live north of the border. He's built a culture here "for a better part of a decade".

Posters that think he's a bad GM should look at dysfunctional franchises across the league. We could be in a worse situation.

The only blackmark was Masai thinking Siakam, FVV, and OG could take the reins and lead us to a championship. He's back on track now to get us into a decent compete level for the second half of the 2020s.

Looking back on it, they should have seen the writing on the wall. They deal so much depth and 1sts to win the title, I'm not sure how they thought they'd build a bench for that FVV, OG, Siakam core.

Even if you believed in those 3, or at least those 3 getting you to 50 wins. Where was the new bench job coming from?

Nah, they did the right thing:
Finding winning players that can handle the playoff pressure at the highest-level is way to difficult thus trying to squeeze everything out of them 'until the last minute'.
Masai&Bobby perfectly understood that they needed one player ala KD/Dame to mix with Pascal, OG (Scottie, and FVV) for another chance at LOB. They perfectly understood it thus not giving out MaxDeals to the Pascals..
Injuries to starters impacted our bench back then too.

[raptorforlife88]

Boucher joined the team 6 seasons ago in 2018-19, 6 is a majority out of 10.

I mean Gradey was last year unless you think he sucks or something. The 13th picks the last 25 years have produced equally as many complete busts as bench level and above players so I'd qualify that as he looks like he has the potential to be in the top tier of 13th picks. If he's as good as Richard Jefferson or Tyler Herro (both 13th picks) that would make him like the 5th best 13th pick the last 25 years.

Gradey was I believe I acquired just 5 years after Chris was acquired. So I would say technically you're wrong on the greater part of a decade claim.

[Scase]

Boucher joined the team 6 seasons ago in 2018-19, 6 is a majority out of 10.

I mean Gradey was last year unless you think he sucks or something. The 13th picks the last 25 years have produced equally as many complete busts as bench level and above players so I'd qualify that as he looks like he has the potential to be in the top tier of 13th picks.

Gradey was I believe I acquired just 5 years after Chris was acquired. So I would say technically you're wrong on the greater part of a decade claim.

I dont think many people would consider a 19 year old (at the time) lotto pick a diamond in the rough. On average the 13th pick has a 20% chance to be a star player, 35% chance to be a starter, 15% chance to be a roleplayer, and 30% chance to be a deep bench player.

I would say Gradey is currently in the roleplayer bucket, which isn't exactly a diamond in the rough for the 13th pick. If he ends up being an all star, I will definitely change my mind and I actually have those expectations for him, but for now he's a solid pick.

To get this a little more on track, the example used was Ochai, a 22 year old (at the time), 4 year college guy who was looking to be a waste of a roster spot, and was acquired for relatively nothing, and now is a solid roleplayer. I wouldn't put Gradey who was drafted last year into that category.

[LoveMyRaps]

Watch on YouTube

[Brinbe]

Easily one of the best success stories of our season. I remember how bad he looked at summer league earlier this year and thought he was gonna be a total bust, so it's astonishing that he turned it around to this degree. I don't know what jumpstarted his road back to respectability, but mega kudos to Ochai for turning it around and saving his career.

And I don't know if he has even more upward developmental road left in his journey, but even if he keeps on this current track, that's a valuable role player that any team would be happy to have.

No lie, he should probably get some MIP votes and it'd be entirely deserved.

[Indeed]

Masai does great considering a lot of players don't want to live north of the border. He's built a culture here "for a better part of a decade".

Posters that think he's a bad GM should look at dysfunctional franchises across the league. We could be in a worse situation.

The only blackmark was Masai thinking Siakam, FVV, and OG could take the reins and lead us to a championship. He's back on track now to get us into a decent compete level for the second half of the 2020s.

Looking back on it, they should have seen the writing on the wall. They deal so much depth and 1sts to win the title, I'm not sure how they thought they'd build a bench for that FVV, OG, Siakam core.

Even if you believed in those 3, or at least those 3 getting you to 50 wins. Where was the new bench job coming from?

Nah, they did the right thing:
Finding winning players that can handle the playoff pressure at the highest-level is way to difficult thus trying to squeeze everything out of them 'until the last minute'.
Masai&Bobby perfectly understood that they needed one player ala KD/Dame to mix with Pascal, OG (Scottie, and FVV) for another chance at LOB. They perfectly understood it thus not giving out MaxDeals to the Pascals..
Injuries to starters impacted our bench back then too.

And Barnes was supposed to be that player instead of KD/Dame, but Barns was not proven even at this point

[Thaddy]

Masai does great considering a lot of players don't want to live north of the border. He's built a culture here "for a better part of a decade".

Posters that think he's a bad GM should look at dysfunctional franchises across the league. We could be in a worse situation.

The only blackmark was Masai thinking Siakam, FVV, and OG could take the reins and lead us to a championship. He's back on track now to get us into a decent compete level for the second half of the 2020s.

Looking back on it, they should have seen the writing on the wall. They deal so much depth and 1sts to win the title, I'm not sure how they thought they'd build a bench for that FVV, OG, Siakam core.

Even if you believed in those 3, or at least those 3 getting you to 50 wins. Where was the new bench job coming from?

Depth wasn't important when pace was slow. I am guessing Masai thought he could go forward with a top heavy rotation and then find undrafted players and 2nd rounders, which we pretty much did. The bigger problem was that neither Siakam or Fred are T5 in their positions and never project to be. The hardest part is finding a player who can compete to be the best player in the league in their prime. Time will tell if that player is Barnes, but right now I don't think so.

There's a lot of hate towards tanking but even though the odds are low in the top 8 of the draft it would drastically improve our chances of finding that number 1 option. This year I think that player will be Jakucionis. Sometimes we get carried away by measurements, athleticism and other factors that scream potential but skill is something that will always matter, especially shooting ability.

[raptorforlife88]

I dont think many people would consider a 19 year old (at the time) lotto pick a diamond in the rough. On average the 13th pick has a 20% chance to be a star player, 35% chance to be a starter, 15% chance to be a roleplayer, and 30% chance to be a deep bench player.

I would say Gradey is currently in the roleplayer bucket, which isn't exactly a diamond in the rough for the 13th pick. If he ends up being an all star, I will definitely change my mind and I actually have those expectations for him, but for now he's a solid pick.

To get this a little more on track, the example used was Ochai, a 22 year old (at the time), 4 year college guy who was looking to be a waste of a roster spot, and was acquired for relatively nothing, and now is a solid roleplayer. I wouldn't put Gradey who was drafted last year into that category.

I remember this from years ago and I don't know how much that number is really holding there. Actually I would say it's remarkably inaccurate over the past 25 years.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/every-nba-number-13-overall-pick-ever

This is the list of the last 25 picks. Of them Jefferson, Olynyk, Lavine, Booker, Mitchell, Herro are probably the best players in the last 25 years.

Lavine, Booker and Mitchell are the only three of them that would qualify as stars and honestly calling Lavine a star is borderline because Chicago can basically hope to unload his contract for a second round pick at this point. So that's 8% stars? 12% if you're being generous? Jefferson and Herro are starters and maybe Herro is a little more than that. Not sure how anyone is getting to 55% stars/starters from there. There's probably more guys out of the league within 5 seasons then starters.

I see Gradey getting to the Jefferson/Herro level like I said which makes him one of the better picks of the last 25 years at 13th. I genuinely want you to look at that list and the players on it over a long 25 year sample there and tell me that you don't think so, or that 55% of the players in there are Star/Starter level.

Seriously take the list, give me 55% of the names on the list and then bunch Gradey in the "role players" bucket like you described. I'm curious to see where you're planting him based on that measurement.

[Scase]

I dont think many people would consider a 19 year old (at the time) lotto pick a diamond in the rough. On average the 13th pick has a 20% chance to be a star player, 35% chance to be a starter, 15% chance to be a roleplayer, and 30% chance to be a deep bench player.

I would say Gradey is currently in the roleplayer bucket, which isn't exactly a diamond in the rough for the 13th pick. If he ends up being an all star, I will definitely change my mind and I actually have those expectations for him, but for now he's a solid pick.

To get this a little more on track, the example used was Ochai, a 22 year old (at the time), 4 year college guy who was looking to be a waste of a roster spot, and was acquired for relatively nothing, and now is a solid roleplayer. I wouldn't put Gradey who was drafted last year into that category.

I remember this from years ago and I don't know how much that number is really holding there. Actually I would say it's remarkably inaccurate over the past 25 years.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/every-nba-number-13-overall-pick-ever

This is the list of the last 25 picks. Of them Jefferson, Olynyk, Lavine, Booker, Mitchell, Herro are probably the best players in the last 25 years.

Lavine, Booker and Mitchell are the only three of them that would qualify as stars and honestly calling Lavine a star is borderline because Chicago can basically hope to unload his contract for a second round pick at this point. So that's 8% stars? 12% if you're being generous? Jefferson and Herro are starters and maybe Herro is a little more than that. Not sure how anyone is getting to 55% stars/starters from there. There's probably more guys out of the league within 5 seasons then starters.

I see Gradey getting to the Jefferson/Herro level like I said which makes him one of the better picks of the last 25 years at 13th. I genuinely want you to look at that list and the players on it over a long 25 year sample there and tell me that you don't think so, or that 55% of the players in there are Star/Starter level.

Seriously take the list, give me 55% of the names on the list and then bunch Gradey in the "role players" bucket like you described. I'm curious to see where you're planting him based on that measurement.

Im not basing his roleplayer status against only 13th picks, that makes no sense. I'm basing his roleplayer status on his current production and capabilities.

Personally I think he has the potential to exceed Herro's level, but I'm not giving Masai a gold star for drafting potential. Gradey has played 83 career NBA games, we don't know if he's gonna be a steal, a bust, or an average player. Hell, Ochai might completely crash and burn when put on a good team, who knows. For now based on what he was acquired for, his production, his previous production, and his draft position, I would qualify that as a diamond in the rough. He has already surpassed the value of what we traded to get him.

Gradey is still a WIP, I'm not going to plan a parade quite yet. So no, I won't consider that in my statement.

[Tripod]

Unless I miscounted, Ochai is 12th from his draft year in PPG this year which isn't bad for your like 4th-5th scoring option on the floor most nights.

Where do you think he would be in a re-draft. Top 20 looks like a lock as of now, but where would you put him?