Cooper Flagg - Duke

[bigboi]

it's you who is flat out wrong. the offense literally runs through Tatum and has for years. Everyone plays off him which is why they shoot so many threes because he commands double teams and it leaves shooters wide open. That's literally his job. PnR to get a switch if necessary, break down his man to get his shot and if help comes over dish to wide open shooter. He's obviously not a point guard but he facilitates for others which is why his assists have hovered around 5 per game for the past several seasons.

Here's what I'm talking about. If this isn't facilitating I don't know what it means then

Watch on YouTube

;t=6s

Offense running through Tatum and Brown doesn’t mean that they’re the facilitator. Once again, you don’t know what you’re talking about lmao. Smart, Holiday, White have been the primary Celtics facilitators in the past. Please stop talking Celtics basketball because you’re embarrassing yourself.

bro, you're really clueless, even about your own team Quick, tell me who leads the Celtics in assists this season. Who finished 2nd in assists the past two seasons? I'll give you a hint, it's the facilitator that the offense goes through i.e. Tatum. The assists Jrue and White get for the most part are swinging the ball around to an open shooter off Tatum and Brown's action. Do you even watch the Celtics??!

My post clearly says the past. Tatum has stepped up as facilitator this season.

You’re not going to tell me about my own team: 22-23 Smart lead the team in assists. 23-24 White lead the team. Once you don’t know wtf you’re talking about at all lmao. It’s actually clownish how wrong you are. Flagg will never be on Tatum’s level offensively in his life nor will he ever be on Tatum’s level as a general player.

Once again, I’m not even sure Flagg hits prime Ben Simmons level

[EvanZ]

Cooper's BPM is 12.4. Tatum's BPM was 7.9.

According to Cerebro which has a more advanced all-in-one metric than BPM, Cooper's "C-RAM" is 10.0 vs Tatum's 9.6 as a Freshman. For reference that season, Lonzo had a 12.9 C-RAM leading all Freshmen (Fultz was at 12.0). So at least according to that metric neither was a world beater as Freshman. I agree with that so far.

I have the same top 3 Freshmen as Cerebro (in no particular order): Dylan, Queen and Sorber. Cooper is in that next tier with Demin, Jaku, etc.

[clyde21]

there is no size one fit all metric, looking back at it now there is no way you would've said Fultz was better than Coop in college tbh, Fultz didn't even hit 65% at the stripe in college which should've been a huge red flag for everyone, had a high T/O rate for supposedly a lead guard, only a +6 Net Rating overall and his team didn't even make the tourney.

[JMAC3]

Flagg is HORRIBLE as a scorer. Not mediocre, not below average, he’s legit having an all time bad scoring season for a hyped big man and may very well shoot under 40% on the season. He isn’t Tatum and will never be Tatum. Tatum is on a whole different stratosphere offensively compared to Flagg.

Flagg can’t dribble, can’t shoot, has a weak first step, athleticism isn’t as good as some people think here. Big men in college typically have much better efficiency stats than wings. There’s literally no excuse for Flagg except accepting reality. Flagg is a role player and that’s how he will succeed. A high motor player. Nothing about him screams top 2 option on a team because of his drafted team forces him into a scoring role then he will fail just like here

If you want to say Flagg is not generational which at this point is just a term people toss around for a good #1 pick then sure have at it. He probably isn't rookie LeBron, Wemby or maybe even Zion good from day 1. However, you are spiraling out of control for a guy that would be the #1 pick in most drafts, probably would have went #1 in last 4/5 drafts. If you want to say Harper is a really strong prospect and make a case that he should go #1 I think most people would be fine with that as a healthy discussion.

However, calling him horrible, a future role player, saying he can't dribble yada yada for a guy you probably will end up in your top 3 on your big board is going to look bad. You are now in this weird infatuation with comparing him to Tatum, who is a top 10 player in the league. If Cooper is a top 25 player in the league he will be an awesome #1 pick. He doesn't even have to reach a Tatum level for that team to be right, but if you compare them side by side then Cooper even with all the poor shooting is very comparable prospect.


Tatum
OBPM 4.6
DBPM 3.2
BPM 7.9
PER 22
PPG 16.8
RPG 7.3
APG 2.1
TO 2.6
BPG 1.1
SPG 1.3
FTR 38.1
Assist Rate 12.4

Flagg
OBPM 5.2
DBPM 7.3
BPM 12.5
PER 24
PPG 16.6
RPG 9.0
APG 3.6
TO 2.3
BPG 1.6
SPG 1.4
FTR 38.6
Assist Rate 23.4


IDK how anyone can look at this and seriously say Flagg is nowhere near Tatum levels of good in college with a straight face.
You are just basing this off the eye test from 8 years ago when you saw Tatum play, which is whatever but also just a lot of bias.
Also, why do you talk about Flagg as a "big man" you are painting him as some center when he plays much more like a wing, similar to what we saw Tatum do in college. Would also label him a college big?

but yes Tatum at age 26 is a much better player than 17 year old Flagg, I will concede that.
Which means absolutely nothing.

[SeattleJazzFan]

fact: cooper flagg is really good at basketball.

fact: it's really hard to become a star wing in today's nba if you can't shoot.

fact: none of us have any clue whether or not he will eventually be a good shooter at the nba level.

we can argue about flagg until we're blue in the face - and whether you like flagg as a prospect (fact #1) or you are concerned about him as a prospect (fact #2), none of those arguments will change those facts.

iow, it's okay to like flagg a lot and have him as a lock at #1(or 2) because he's a damn good basketball player - especially for his age - and you might think he'll become a good shooter in the league.

it's also okay to be cool or just lukewarm on him as a prospect (and have him somewhere below #2 overall) because stardom in the nba is hard to come by if you're a wing who can't shoot and you might think he won't ever become a good shooter in the league.

[FarBeyondDriven]

Offense running through Tatum and Brown doesn’t mean that they’re the facilitator. Once again, you don’t know what you’re talking about lmao. Smart, Holiday, White have been the primary Celtics facilitators in the past. Please stop talking Celtics basketball because you’re embarrassing yourself.

bro, you're really clueless, even about your own team Quick, tell me who leads the Celtics in assists this season. Who finished 2nd in assists the past two seasons? I'll give you a hint, it's the facilitator that the offense goes through i.e. Tatum. The assists Jrue and White get for the most part are swinging the ball around to an open shooter off Tatum and Brown's action. Do you even watch the Celtics??!

My post clearly says the past. Tatum has stepped up as facilitator this season.

You’re not going to tell me about my own team: 22-23 Smart lead the team in assists. 23-24 White lead the team. Once you don’t know wtf you’re talking about at all lmao. It’s actually clownish how wrong you are. Flagg will never be on Tatum’s level offensively in his life nor will he ever be on Tatum’s level as a general player.

Once again, I’m not even sure Flagg hits prime Ben Simmons level

lol this guy ^ doesn't even know his own team apparently.

Tatum has been a point forward for the past several seasons. The offense mostly runs through him. I provided the video proof from the past Finals. He's hovered around 5 apg and has been 2nd in assist on the Celtics the previous three seasons and now leads them this season.

2022 Tatum was 2nd to PG Smart and had nearly 4.5 apg
2023 Tatum was 2nd to PG Smart and had 4.6 apg
2024 Tatum was a close 2nd to White and had 4.9 apg
2025 Tatum is leading the Celtics in assists with 5.5 apg

This is what point forwards do. The offense runs through them and they either score or facilitate. This is similar to Banchero and imo will be the case with Flagg.

[HadAnEffectHere]

At the point where Flagg needs to actually make shots soon or I'm going to be very concerned.

A PF with a 50.5% TS% is bad.

[Jstock12]

fact: cooper flagg is really good at basketball.

fact: it's really hard to become a star wing in today's nba if you can't shoot.

fact: none of us have any clue whether or not he will eventually be a good shooter at the nba level.

we can argue about flagg until we're blue in the face - and whether you like flagg as a prospect (fact #1) or you are concerned about him as a prospect (fact #2), none of those arguments will change those facts.

iow, it's okay to like flagg a lot and have him as a lock at #1(or 2) because he's a damn good basketball player - especially for his age - and you might think he'll become a good shooter in the league.

it's also okay to be cool or just lukewarm on him as a prospect (and have him somewhere below #2 overall) because stardom in the nba is hard to come by if you're a wing who can't shoot and you might think he won't ever become a good shooter in the league.

Very well put.

I'd speculate he will learn how to shoot at least at an average level though. While there are exceptions to this line of logic, a big man having 75% from the FT line is usually indicative of someone who at least has potential to improve his jumpshot, especially given the fact that he's still only 17.

[bigboi]

Flagg is HORRIBLE as a scorer. Not mediocre, not below average, he’s legit having an all time bad scoring season for a hyped big man and may very well shoot under 40% on the season. He isn’t Tatum and will never be Tatum. Tatum is on a whole different stratosphere offensively compared to Flagg.

Flagg can’t dribble, can’t shoot, has a weak first step, athleticism isn’t as good as some people think here. Big men in college typically have much better efficiency stats than wings. There’s literally no excuse for Flagg except accepting reality. Flagg is a role player and that’s how he will succeed. A high motor player. Nothing about him screams top 2 option on a team because of his drafted team forces him into a scoring role then he will fail just like here

If you want to say Flagg is not generational which at this point is just a term people toss around for a good #1 pick then sure have at it. He probably isn't rookie LeBron, Wemby or maybe even Zion good from day 1. However, you are spiraling out of control for a guy that would be the #1 pick in most drafts, probably would have went #1 in last 4/5 drafts. If you want to say Harper is a really strong prospect and make a case that he should go #1 I think most people would be fine with that as a healthy discussion.

However, calling him horrible, a future role player, saying he can't dribble yada yada for a guy you probably will end up in your top 3 on your big board is going to look bad. You are now in this weird infatuation with comparing him to Tatum, who is a top 10 player in the league. If Cooper is a top 25 player in the league he will be an awesome #1 pick. He doesn't even have to reach a Tatum level for that team to be right, but if you compare them side by side then Cooper even with all the poor shooting is very comparable prospect.


Tatum
OBPM 4.6
DBPM 3.2
BPM 7.9
PER 22
PPG 16.8
RPG 7.3
APG 2.1
TO 2.6
BPG 1.1
SPG 1.3
FTR 38.1
Assist Rate 12.4

Flagg
OBPM 5.2
DBPM 7.3
BPM 12.5
PER 24
PPG 16.6
RPG 9.0
APG 3.6
TO 2.3
BPG 1.6
SPG 1.4
FTR 38.6
Assist Rate 23.4


IDK how anyone can look at this and seriously say Flagg is nowhere near Tatum levels of good in college with a straight face.
You are just basing this off the eye test from 8 years ago when you saw Tatum play, which is whatever but also just a lot of bias.
Also, why do you talk about Flagg as a "big man" you are painting him as some center when he plays much more like a wing, similar to what we saw Tatum do in college. Would also label him a college big?

but yes Tatum at age 26 is a much better player than 17 year old Flagg, I will concede that.
Which means absolutely nothing.

What’s Flagg’s shooting percentage?

[bigboi]

bro, you're really clueless, even about your own team Quick, tell me who leads the Celtics in assists this season. Who finished 2nd in assists the past two seasons? I'll give you a hint, it's the facilitator that the offense goes through i.e. Tatum. The assists Jrue and White get for the most part are swinging the ball around to an open shooter off Tatum and Brown's action. Do you even watch the Celtics??!

My post clearly says the past. Tatum has stepped up as facilitator this season.

You’re not going to tell me about my own team: 22-23 Smart lead the team in assists. 23-24 White lead the team. Once you don’t know wtf you’re talking about at all lmao. It’s actually clownish how wrong you are. Flagg will never be on Tatum’s level offensively in his life nor will he ever be on Tatum’s level as a general player.

Once again, I’m not even sure Flagg hits prime Ben Simmons level

lol this guy ^ doesn't even know his own team apparently.

Tatum has been a point forward for the past several seasons. The offense mostly runs through him. I provided the video proof from the past Finals. He's hovered around 5 apg and has been 2nd in assist on the Celtics the previous three seasons and now leads them this season.

2022 Tatum was 2nd to PG Smart and had nearly 4.5 apg
2023 Tatum was 2nd to PG Smart and had 4.6 apg
2024 Tatum was a close 2nd to White and had 4.9 apg
2025 Tatum is leading the Celtics in assists with 5.5 apg

This is what point forwards do. The offense runs through them and they either score or facilitate. This is similar to Banchero and imo will be the case with Flagg.

Buddy, you were just proven wrong. Stop it. Tatum was never the main facilitator of Celtics nor a point forward until this year. Cut the bs. You don’t watch the Celtics at all. This is basic Celtics 101. Tatum is an mvp candidate, multiple 1st team all nba player. Flagg is never reaching that level, cry about it. As Flagg’s crappy field goal percentage gets worse throughout the season, all these excuses will continue making you look foolish. Tatum played wing in college while Flagg plays forward. Flagg still has a garbage field goal percentage. I have never heard these excuses for anyone else. Time to start a Dybantsa

[JMAC3]

What’s Flagg’s shooting percentage?

If you care this much about shooting % and want to ignore everything else you must have Khaman Malauch top 3 on your board. He is shooting 79% from the field.

[FarBeyondDriven]

My post clearly says the past. Tatum has stepped up as facilitator this season.

You’re not going to tell me about my own team: 22-23 Smart lead the team in assists. 23-24 White lead the team. Once you don’t know wtf you’re talking about at all lmao. It’s actually clownish how wrong you are. Flagg will never be on Tatum’s level offensively in his life nor will he ever be on Tatum’s level as a general player.

Once again, I’m not even sure Flagg hits prime Ben Simmons level

lol this guy ^ doesn't even know his own team apparently.

Tatum has been a point forward for the past several seasons. The offense mostly runs through him. I provided the video proof from the past Finals. He's hovered around 5 apg and has been 2nd in assist on the Celtics the previous three seasons and now leads them this season.

2022 Tatum was 2nd to PG Smart and had nearly 4.5 apg
2023 Tatum was 2nd to PG Smart and had 4.6 apg
2024 Tatum was a close 2nd to White and had 4.9 apg
2025 Tatum is leading the Celtics in assists with 5.5 apg

This is what point forwards do. The offense runs through them and they either score or facilitate. This is similar to Banchero and imo will be the case with Flagg.

Buddy, you were just proven wrong. Stop it. Tatum was never the main facilitator of Celtics nor a point forward until this year. Cut the bs. You don’t watch the Celtics at all. This is basic Celtics 101. Tatum is an mvp candidate, multiple 1st team all nba player. Flagg is never reaching that level, cry about it. As Flagg’s crappy field goal percentage gets worse throughout the season, all these excuses will continue making you look foolish. Tatum played wing in college while Flagg plays forward. Flagg still has a garbage field goal percentage. I have never heard these excuses for anyone else. Time to start a Dybantsa

cool story bro

[The-Power]

At the point where Flagg needs to actually make shots soon or I'm going to be very concerned.

A PF with a 50.5% TS% is bad.

He doesn't play the role of a PF, though. If you played him more like a typical PF his scoring efficiency would be way up – but you'd lose other aspects of his game.

[SeattleJazzFan]

At the point where Flagg needs to actually make shots soon or I'm going to be very concerned.

A PF with a 50.5% TS% is bad.

He doesn't play the role of a PF, though. If you played him more like a typical PF his scoring efficiency would be way up – but you'd lose other aspects of his game.

50% TS is horrible for anybody - at any position. even if you love Flagg, it's okay to admit his shooting and scoring efficiency is horrendous.

[The-Power]

At the point where Flagg needs to actually make shots soon or I'm going to be very concerned.

A PF with a 50.5% TS% is bad.

He doesn't play the role of a PF, though. If you played him more like a typical PF his scoring efficiency would be way up – but you'd lose other aspects of his game.

50% TS is horrible for anybody - at any position. even if you love Flagg, it's okay to admit his shooting and scoring efficiency is horrendous.

It's bad (though not necessarily ‘horrible’). I never denied that. And I'm also not someone who sees Flagg as a generational prospect or anything like that, although he's still the #1 or #2 prospect in this draft for me. I'm just pointing out that there's no need to use the moniker ‘PF’ for him when he's not playing the role usually associated with it. You can criticize his efficiency without comparing him to players who play fundamentally different roles.

[clyde21]

if the TS% scares you from picking him #1 then why pick him #2? at what point does it stop being a concern? if your argument is that it makes him #2 instead of #1 in favor of Harper, fine, but if it's a showstopper for you why would you take him #2? or even 3?

like no one is gonna sit here and argue 50% TS is good for Flagg or anyone else. obviously it needs to get (a lot) better. but it's either you believe it will get better as he and his body grow or you don't. and if you don't, how far does he drop for you?

[bigboi]

He doesn't play the role of a PF, though. If you played him more like a typical PF his scoring efficiency would be way up – but you'd lose other aspects of his game.

50% TS is horrible for anybody - at any position. even if you love Flagg, it's okay to admit his shooting and scoring efficiency is horrendous.

It's bad (though not necessarily ‘horrible’). I never denied that. And I'm also not someone who sees Flagg as a generational prospect or anything like that, although he's still the #1 or #2 prospect in this draft for me. I'm just pointing out that there's no need to use the moniker ‘PF’ for him when he's not playing the role usually associated with it. You can criticize his efficiency without comparing him to players who play fundamentally different roles.

He is playing power forward in college. Are yall serious rn lmao. He’s not a wing nor a guard in college

[bigboi]

if the TS% scares you from picking him #1 then why pick him #2? at what point does it stop being a concern? if your argument is that it makes him #2 instead of #1 in favor of Harper, fine, but if it's a showstopper for you why would you take him #2? or even 3?

like no one is gonna sit here and argue 50% TS is good for Flagg or anyone else. obviously it needs to get (a lot) better. but it's either you believe it will get better as he and his body grow or you don't. and if you don't, how far does he drop for you?

Flagg is a future role player, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. I could see him being like a Derrick White in impact. This draft isn’t that great tbh. A lot of the hyped prospects have looked mid to weak. Bailey has disappointed as well so that’s why Flagg will go top 2

[EvanZ]

if the TS% scares you from picking him #1 then why pick him #2? at what point does it stop being a concern? if your argument is that it makes him #2 instead of #1 in favor of Harper, fine, but if it's a showstopper for you why would you take him #2? or even 3?

like no one is gonna sit here and argue 50% TS is good for Flagg or anyone else. obviously it needs to get (a lot) better. but it's either you believe it will get better as he and his body grow or you don't. and if you don't, how far does he drop for you?

Flagg is a future role player, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. I could see him being like a Derrick White in impact. This draft isn’t that great tbh. A lot of the hyped prospects have looked mid to weak. Bailey has disappointed as well so that’s why Flagg will go top 2

Totally disagree with this. It's probably the deepest draft since 2018.

[clyde21]

if the TS% scares you from picking him #1 then why pick him #2? at what point does it stop being a concern? if your argument is that it makes him #2 instead of #1 in favor of Harper, fine, but if it's a showstopper for you why would you take him #2? or even 3?

like no one is gonna sit here and argue 50% TS is good for Flagg or anyone else. obviously it needs to get (a lot) better. but it's either you believe it will get better as he and his body grow or you don't. and if you don't, how far does he drop for you?

Flagg is a future role player, which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. I could see him being like a Derrick White in impact. This draft isn’t that great tbh. A lot of the hyped prospects have looked mid to weak. Bailey has disappointed as well so that’s why Flagg will go top 2

okay, so how low are you taking him?