#30 - Pistons@Lakers - 10:30pm ET

[Cowology]

Maybe it was mentioned already, but there was a graphic the other day; LeBron 41,000 career point. The entire Pistons roster 45,600 career points.

Kinda bonkers.

The real stat should be how many Diddy parties Bron attended

[NYPiston]

They really aren't though. You and a few other posters keep trying to make it an issue, but this is both normal and expected for a team this young.

Is it something that eventually needs to improve in order for the team to continue improving? Yes. But right now you are basically just complaining that the team isn't already playing at a +.500 lvl. It's unrealistic.

Cade in particular has shown an ability to improve. He keeps getting better and we've seen him at times make big shots and big plays in the clutch, so I don't think it's a case of him not being "clutch", so much as he just has to learn how to handle the sort of defensive pressure he's drawing in those situations. That will likely come with time.

It's OK to both acknowledge that we suck at 4th quarter execution, but also understand that it's a work in progress and not something to be overly concerned with right now. Let some of that stuff go.

A team this young? These guys have been playing together for years and it's still a constant of completely choking (or almost in the case of Miami and the Lakers). These aren't rookies and 2nd year players for the most part. Cade's 4th year, Ivey's 3rd, Duren 3rd namely the former two that matter most that fold in clutch moments. They're young but they're not THAT young anymore. The only reason why they pulled out these games against Miami and the Lakers is that those teams ran out of time basically and THJ hit some shots in OT against Miami.

We'll see if they finally learn these lessons but, I'm sorry if you disagree, but I think it's logical to have concerns about their inability to finish games. Cade has had a great year, great player in the first 3 quarters, but his 4th quarter struggles are noteable.
As I said, 13-17 is an improvement and that should be acknowledged but they are one of the worst 4th quarter teams in the league so until it turns around it will continue to be a concern and fans have a right to mention it or complain as you put it.

[Cowology]

IF we were better at closing games, how many more wins do you think we'd have? 2 or 3? Enough to get us over .500?

Again, I just think you are expecting too big a jump. This team was BAD last season. And the decade before that. I get wanting improvement, but being salty that we aren't already winning games in the 4th quarter just seems premature. That's what good teams do. We are still working towards that.

But we can agree to disagree.

[NYPiston]

IF we were better at closing games, how many more wins do you think we'd have? 2 or 3? Enough to get us over .500?

Again, I just think you are expecting too big a jump. This team was BAD last season. And the decade before that. I get wanting improvement, but being salty that we aren't already winning games in the 4th quarter just seems premature. That's what good teams do. We are still working towards that.

But we can agree to disagree.

Don't get me wrong, 13-17 is as good as can be reasonably expected with this group so I'm content with where they are in terms of record although the record is masked a bit by them getting lucky to pull out a few games that were massive chokejobs but they hung on by a thread. My concern lies with the core players shrinking in big moments. I get that they are young but there's other young teams in the Pistons age range that don't shrink in big moments as often although they all have better supporting casts.

My issue with Cade is carelessness and losing his aggression in the clutch and with Ivey it's low IQ plays. Of course there's room for improvement considering their age but I just see too many games like this to not have concerns that it could carry forward. We'll see how they respond. 2-0 on a West Coast trip is a success regardless so hopefully they make it 3 tonight.

[DetroitSho]

IF we were better at closing games, how many more wins do you think we'd have? 2 or 3? Enough to get us over .500?

Again, I just think you are expecting too big a jump. This team was BAD last season. And the decade before that. I get wanting improvement, but being salty that we aren't already winning games in the 4th quarter just seems premature. That's what good teams do. We are still working towards that.

But we can agree to disagree.

Do you ever complain about a player or question why tf did they do that? Y'all keep bringing up people expecting this team to have won more to create a straw man.

If you've ever complained about Duren sleepwalking to start a game or Tobias being invisible or Ivey taking low iq shots, this 4th quarter criticism is no different. Except the difference is, we KNOW this team can play better in the 4th. We see this team some games play great, crisp team basketball for 3 quarters and then completely deviate from it for NO reason. They've been sharing the ball and get open shots, and getting the ball up quick for some good early possessions. Now all of a sudden it's the 4th quarter, now Cade is dragging ass up the floor, barely crossing half court at the 15 second mark, just self sabotaging themselves into bad possessions.

Maybe others are asking for this, but I'm certainly not looking for Cade to come down and drain shots back to back to hold teams at bay. But is it too much to ask to not dribble yourself into sideline traps or cross-court jump pass situations that lead directly to fast break points for the other team? These things have happened too many times in bunches like he just needed to get it out of his system.

Sent from my SM-S918U using RealGM mobile app

[MortSahlfan]

Just FF to the 40 second mark

Watch on YouTube

[tmorgan]

If you want to have positive thoughts; Cade’s a borderline All-Star that can’t get calls, has a weak handle for a PG, and isn’t a very good interior finisher. Clean some of that up, keep refining the shot, keep improving on defense (clearly looks better this year), and that’s an All-NBA level player.

[bstein14]

Cade took a decent sized jump this year (largely due to better 3 point shooting and better defense) and he's clearly now a top 30 player in the league... which is an important thing to have when there are 30 teams not everyone has a top 30 player we haven't had one in a long time. One more jump next season and he's a perennial all-star making it every year (that he's healthy) and he's a fringe all-nba player as well. I know next offseason's jump forward will be even harder but I think he's capable... if he's not content being a play-in team and he desperately wants to bring the Pistons their first playoff win (even a game not a whole series) in over 16 years.

Cade has a pretty realistic chance to be in that tier just outside the top 10 next year. Pretty much a "tier 3" player in the league with Tier 1 being guys like Jokic, SGA, Tatum, Wemby(soon if not already), Giannis, etc.

[zeebneeb]

Cade took a decent sized jump this year (largely due to better 3 point shooting and better defense) and he's clearly now a top 30 player in the league... which is an important thing to have when there are 30 teams not everyone has a top 30 player we haven't had one in a long time. One more jump next season and he's a perennial all-star making it every year (that he's healthy) and he's a fringe all-nba player as well. I know next offseason's jump forward will be even harder but I think he's capable... if he's not content being a play-in team and he desperately wants to bring the Pistons their first playoff win (even a game not a whole series) in over 16 years.

Cade has a pretty realistic chance to be in that tier just outside the top 10 next year. Pretty much a "tier 3" player in the league with Tier 1 being guys like Jokic, SGA, Tatum, Wemby(soon if not already), Giannis, etc.

If Cade scored 3 more ppg, and had 1 less turnover, he would absolutely be viewed differently. He would be in that tier.