2024 Free Agency

[BlacJacMac]

With Dozier waived, MIN has an open roster spot. The CBA allows 10-day contracts starting January 5, so I took a look at available free agents:

If Gobert goes down:

Bismack Biyombo: long and athletic, but dumber than a box of rocks.
JaVale McGee - Biyombo’s even dumber brother.
Frank Kaminski. Interesting. He’s not good, but he knows how to play. Apparently he’s been playing in Europe, and I bet he’d like playing closer to home.

If Conley goes down:

I assume Finch just uses Dillingham, but if he is trying to protect his confidence by letting him avoid facing starters …

Markelle Fultz
Dennis Smith
Killian Hayes
Malachi Flynn

Honest question because I don’t know the answer. How much does a ten day contract cost in tax?

This is for last season, so I imagine the numbers will be slightly higher for this year:

A 10-day contract for a rookie this season will be worth $64,343, which is 10/174ths of the full-season rookie minimum salary. A one-year veteran will earn $103,550, and a 10-day deal for any veteran with two or more years of NBA service would represent a cost of $116,075 to the team.

Veterans with more than two years of NBA service would earn more than $116,075 on a 10-day contract, but the league would pay the extra freight. However, teams gain no financial advantage if they pass on 10-day agreements with more experienced players in favor of rookies or one-year veterans in an effort to limit their end-of-season luxury tax penalty — those deals count the same as the ones for two-year veterans when the league calculates a team’s salary for tax purposes.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/01/hoops-rumors-glossary-10-day-contract.html

[winforlose]

With Dozier waived, MIN has an open roster spot. The CBA allows 10-day contracts starting January 5, so I took a look at available free agents:

If Gobert goes down:

Bismack Biyombo: long and athletic, but dumber than a box of rocks.
JaVale McGee - Biyombo’s even dumber brother.
Frank Kaminski. Interesting. He’s not good, but he knows how to play. Apparently he’s been playing in Europe, and I bet he’d like playing closer to home.

If Conley goes down:

I assume Finch just uses Dillingham, but if he is trying to protect his confidence by letting him avoid facing starters …

Markelle Fultz
Dennis Smith
Killian Hayes
Malachi Flynn

Honest question because I don’t know the answer. How much does a ten day contract cost in tax?

This is for last season, so I imagine the numbers will be slightly higher for this year:

A 10-day contract for a rookie this season will be worth $64,343, which is 10/174ths of the full-season rookie minimum salary. A one-year veteran will earn $103,550, and a 10-day deal for any veteran with two or more years of NBA service would represent a cost of $116,075 to the team.

Veterans with more than two years of NBA service would earn more than $116,075 on a 10-day contract, but the league would pay the extra freight. However, teams gain no financial advantage if they pass on 10-day agreements with more experienced players in favor of rookies or one-year veterans in an effort to limit their end-of-season luxury tax penalty — those deals count the same as the ones for two-year veterans when the league calculates a team’s salary for tax purposes.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/01/hoops-rumors-glossary-10-day-contract.html

Thank you. I was really asking Shrink about the adjusted number. I cannot remember if we are at 4.5 or 5 in the tax multiplier and I don’t know when that escalates. But using the 4.5 number and $116,075 that means every ten day costs $522,337.50. That is a ton of money for a 2-3 game deal. It is also a problem if we intend to make deals to lower our total below the 2nd apron.

Did Dozier need any guaranteed money to be on our roster (again I don’t know the answer,) because it seems like that one million was a massive waste.

[shrink]

Honest question because I don’t know the answer. How much does a ten day contract cost in tax?

This is for last season, so I imagine the numbers will be slightly higher for this year:

A 10-day contract for a rookie this season will be worth $64,343, which is 10/174ths of the full-season rookie minimum salary. A one-year veteran will earn $103,550, and a 10-day deal for any veteran with two or more years of NBA service would represent a cost of $116,075 to the team.

Veterans with more than two years of NBA service would earn more than $116,075 on a 10-day contract, but the league would pay the extra freight. However, teams gain no financial advantage if they pass on 10-day agreements with more experienced players in favor of rookies or one-year veterans in an effort to limit their end-of-season luxury tax penalty — those deals count the same as the ones for two-year veterans when the league calculates a team’s salary for tax purposes.

https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2024/01/hoops-rumors-glossary-10-day-contract.html

Thank you. I was really asking Shrink about the adjusted number. I cannot remember if we are at 4.5 or 5 in the tax multiplier and I don’t know when that escalates. But using the 4.5 number and $116,075 that means every ten day costs $522,337.50. That is a ton of money for a 2-3 game deal. It is also a problem if we intend to make deals to lower our total below the 2nd apron.

Did Dozier need any guaranteed money to be on our roster (again I don’t know the answer,) because it seems like that one million was a massive waste.

Thanks BlacJac.

Even with Dozier’s money off the books, we’re still at the x4.75 multiplier for lux taxes this year.

I have it as $2.087 x (10/175) = about $120k base
$120k x 4.75 = $570k in luxury taxes
$690k total

That’s a lot of money to get 10 days production from a player that’s still a free agent because they couldn’t make an NBA roster. I suspect we only use it if we’re contending and desperate, like if Rudy was to miss time.

[shrink]

Did Dozier need any guaranteed money to be on our roster (again I don’t know the answer,) because it seems like that one million was a massive waste.

Good question! The $1 mil he got paid is about half the vet min contract, so Taylor is still paying the 4.75 mil lux tax on most of that, so he cost close to $5.75 mil for his production, versus simply leaving that spot empty.

For many years, I have followed the careers of owners and GMs like most fans follow players, and every one has his strengths and faults. I think one of Connelly’s strengths is that he has found nba talent later in the draft. But my biggest concern with him is that he overpays when he thinks he’s right.

In Denver, he was quick to just hand over max deals to Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr without any negotiation. Gobert was his pick in Denver, and he was forced to give him up to Utah by a cheap owner - in MIN he paid a lot of picks to get him. I question if we know enough about Dillingham to know he is worth an unprotected pick and a swap. We added an injured Monte Morris last year (though this is a deal I endorsed). I believe this is the third time Connelly has signed Dozier, who has never shown much. I tend to think the $5.75 of Glen’s money was excessive, paid because Dozier was another one of Connelly’s guys.

[winforlose]

Did Dozier need any guaranteed money to be on our roster (again I don’t know the answer,) because it seems like that one million was a massive waste.

Good question! The $1 mil he got paid is about half the vet min contract, so Taylor is still paying the 4.75 mil lux tax on most of that, so he cost close to $5.75 mil for his production, versus simply leaving that spot empty.

For many years, I have followed the careers of owners and GMs like most fans follow players, and every one has his strengths and faults. I think one of Connelly’s strengths is that he has found nba talent later in the draft. But my biggest concern with him is that he overpays when he thinks he’s right.

In Denver, he was quick to just hand over max deals to Jamal Murray and Michael Porter Jr without any negotiation. Gobert was his pick in Denver, and he was forced to give him up to Utah by a cheap owner - in MIN he paid a lot of picks to get him. I question if we know enough about Dillingham to know he is worth an unprotected pick and a swap. We added an injured Monte Morris last year (though this is a deal I endorsed). I believe this is the third time Connelly has signed Dozier, who has never shown much. I tend to think the $5.75 of Glen’s money was excessive, paid because Dozier was another one of Connelly’s guys.

I agree, but my question was more literal. Was guaranteed money required to add a player of his years to the roster? Or could we simply give him the spot and a guarantee date in January and let him prove himself?

I know some of you guys defend TC but this free agency cycle was a disaster. It was bad before we knew TC was in active discussions to move Karl. It becomes inexcusably bad afterward. To just assume that Mike and Dilly were PG1 and PG2 capable is bad enough, but to have no C behind Rudy, I mean what the actual ****. Meanwhile we have young talent we won’t play who could maybe bridge some of the gap, we are stuck playing Randle over Naz just to keep Randle’s ego in check and hopefully dump him. The Dozier spot could have returned us someone of value. We also should have been the ones to trade for Dennis Schroder. This season didn’t have to look like this, and the team didn’t have to feel like this.

[shrink]

I agree, but my question was more literal. Was guaranteed money required to add a player of his years to the roster? Or could we simply give him the spot and a guarantee date in January and let him prove himself?.

If you’re asking if unguaranteed vet min deals are legal under the CBA - yes.

If you’re asking whether some guaranteed money was needed to get Dozier to sign? Possibly.

—-

Dozier’s $1 mil was guaranteed to him, even if we cut him the day after signing the deal. However, he was on our roster long enough that we were getting close to $1 mil just in service anyway, as a percentage of the vet min salary for his time on the roster.

[winforlose]

I agree, but my question was more literal. Was guaranteed money required to add a player of his years to the roster? Or could we simply give him the spot and a guarantee date in January and let him prove himself?.

If you’re asking if unguaranteed vet min deals are legal under the CBA - yes.

If you’re asking whether some guaranteed money was needed to get Dozier to sign? Possibly.

—-

Dozier’s $1 mil was guaranteed to him, even if we cut him the day after signing the deal. However, he was on our roster long enough that we were getting close to $1 mil just in service anyway, as a percentage of the vet min salary for his time on the roster.

I was asking the former. I wasn’t sure if at a certain point (years of service,) you couldn’t offer fully non guaranteed deals. As for needing him to get a million, that felt like TC doing him a favor. An expensive favor at that given that it cost someone else (whoever wins the ownership fight,) 5.75 million.

[younggunsmn]

I agree, but my question was more literal. Was guaranteed money required to add a player of his years to the roster? Or could we simply give him the spot and a guarantee date in January and let him prove himself?.

If you’re asking if unguaranteed vet min deals are legal under the CBA - yes.

If you’re asking whether some guaranteed money was needed to get Dozier to sign? Possibly.

—-

Dozier’s $1 mil was guaranteed to him, even if we cut him the day after signing the deal. However, he was on our roster long enough that we were getting close to $1 mil just in service anyway, as a percentage of the vet min salary for his time on the roster.

I was asking the former. I wasn’t sure if at a certain point (years of service,) you couldn’t offer fully non guaranteed deals. As for needing him to get a million, that felt like TC doing him a favor. An expensive favor at that given that it cost someone else (whoever wins the ownership fight,) 5.75 million.

That signing was head scratching from the start.
It not only cost us 5.75 million for a handful of games of garbage time, we gave up a high 2nd round pick to dump Moore's 2.5 mil salary and open that 15th roster spot. Only to waste 1 million on Dozier.
And he didn't even play a position of need for us (1 or 5).

[Domejandro]

If you’re asking if unguaranteed vet min deals are legal under the CBA - yes.

If you’re asking whether some guaranteed money was needed to get Dozier to sign? Possibly.

—-

Dozier’s $1 mil was guaranteed to him, even if we cut him the day after signing the deal. However, he was on our roster long enough that we were getting close to $1 mil just in service anyway, as a percentage of the vet min salary for his time on the roster.

I was asking the former. I wasn’t sure if at a certain point (years of service,) you couldn’t offer fully non guaranteed deals. As for needing him to get a million, that felt like TC doing him a favor. An expensive favor at that given that it cost someone else (whoever wins the ownership fight,) 5.75 million.

That signing was head scratching from the start.
It not only cost us 5.75 million for a handful of games of garbage time, we gave up a high 2nd round pick to dump Moore's 2.5 mil salary and open that 15th roster spot. Only to waste 1 million on Dozier.
And he didn't even play a position of need for us (1 or 5).

Biggest head scratcher was waiving the clearly better Keita Bates-Diop and his guaranteed $2,654,644, instead of cutting P.J. Dozier loose. Would have made more sense to hold onto Keita Bates-Diop to potentially dump with a second at the Trade Deadline (and save a ton of Luxury-Tax cash). Always possible that a trade would have opened up where Minnesota could find a miscellaneous lower salary contract to waive at the deadline for Bates-Diop, just seems financially wasteful.

Even something like Keita-Bates Diop for a minimum contract player making $2,087,519 would have saved over three million dollars (counting Luxury-Tax fees)!

[younggunsmn]

AFAIK KBD is still a free agent so I guess there weren't any offers for him and we would have had to attach assets just to move him.

Yeah he's better than Dozier but it probably just boiled down to TC wanting to keep his promise to Dozier and his agent over a guy he didn't want who was just salary filler in a trade.

[Domejandro]

AFAIK KBD is still a free agent so I guess there weren't any offers for him and we would have had to attach assets just to move him.

Yeah he's better than Dozier but it probably just boiled down to TC wanting to keep his promise to Dozier and his agent over a guy he didn't want who was just salary filler in a trade.

For what it is worth, P.J. Dozier already was locked in for his $1MM guarantee, so he would have been compensated regardless. Could have even bumped the guarantee up slightly, and/or put forward a fully guaranteed G-League offer immediately upon waiving.

My bigger issue is that it feels like poor asset management. Having KBD's $2.6MM contract would have improved Minnesota's flexibility quite a bit, heading into the Trade Deadline, lots of miscellaneous minimum/rookie contract players are on the market. Definitely not a huge fumble or anything, it was just uncharacteristically poor asset management.

[winforlose]

AFAIK KBD is still a free agent so I guess there weren't any offers for him and we would have had to attach assets just to move him.

Yeah he's better than Dozier but it probably just boiled down to TC wanting to keep his promise to Dozier and his agent over a guy he didn't want who was just salary filler in a trade.

Maybe, but KBD is decent 3rd string depth. I don’t know that Dozier is even NBA playable. The promise is null after the trade reshuffles the deck. It was definitely personal as TC had some kind of personal reason to guarantee any money for Dozier. The best argument for it is that PJ might have gone elsewhere had we not, but who cares? PJ should have been an exhibit 10 who went to Iowa after preseason.

[Klomp]

Keeping Dozier for the rest of the season would have cost $6.25 mil. Now that he’s waived, MIN has an open roster spot. The CBA allows 10-day contracts starting January 5, so I took a look at available free agents:

If Gobert goes down:

Bismack Biyombo: long and athletic, but dumber than a box of rocks.
JaVale McGee - Biyombo’s even dumber brother.
Frank Kaminski. Interesting. He’s not good, but he knows how to play. Apparently he’s been playing in Europe, and I bet he’d like playing closer to home.

If Conley goes down:

I assume Finch just uses Dillingham, but if he is trying to protect his confidence by letting him avoid facing starters …

Markelle Fultz
Dennis Smith
Killian Hayes
Malachi Flynn

This has to be part of the reason behind the timing, right?!

[Domejandro]

Keeping Dozier for the rest of the season would have cost $6.25 mil. Now that he’s waived, MIN has an open roster spot. The CBA allows 10-day contracts starting January 5, so I took a look at available free agents:

If Gobert goes down:

Bismack Biyombo: long and athletic, but dumber than a box of rocks.
JaVale McGee - Biyombo’s even dumber brother.
Frank Kaminski. Interesting. He’s not good, but he knows how to play. Apparently he’s been playing in Europe, and I bet he’d like playing closer to home.

If Conley goes down:

I assume Finch just uses Dillingham, but if he is trying to protect his confidence by letting him avoid facing starters …

Markelle Fultz
Dennis Smith
Killian Hayes
Malachi Flynn

This has to be part of the reason behind the timing, right?!

The biggest factor is that the full-guarantee deadline for P.J. Dozier's deal was January 1st.

[Klomp]

Keeping Dozier for the rest of the season would have cost $6.25 mil. Now that he’s waived, MIN has an open roster spot. The CBA allows 10-day contracts starting January 5, so I took a look at available free agents:

If Gobert goes down:

Bismack Biyombo: long and athletic, but dumber than a box of rocks.
JaVale McGee - Biyombo’s even dumber brother.
Frank Kaminski. Interesting. He’s not good, but he knows how to play. Apparently he’s been playing in Europe, and I bet he’d like playing closer to home.

If Conley goes down:

I assume Finch just uses Dillingham, but if he is trying to protect his confidence by letting him avoid facing starters …

Markelle Fultz
Dennis Smith
Killian Hayes
Malachi Flynn

This has to be part of the reason behind the timing, right?!

The biggest factor is that the full-guarantee deadline for P.J. Dozier's deal was January 1st.

Sure. I was thinking about the limit of time that a team can go below a certain roster size (don't remember if we were at or above that mark before the waiver).

[wolves_89]

If you’re asking if unguaranteed vet min deals are legal under the CBA - yes.

If you’re asking whether some guaranteed money was needed to get Dozier to sign? Possibly.

—-

Dozier’s $1 mil was guaranteed to him, even if we cut him the day after signing the deal. However, he was on our roster long enough that we were getting close to $1 mil just in service anyway, as a percentage of the vet min salary for his time on the roster.

I was asking the former. I wasn’t sure if at a certain point (years of service,) you couldn’t offer fully non guaranteed deals. As for needing him to get a million, that felt like TC doing him a favor. An expensive favor at that given that it cost someone else (whoever wins the ownership fight,) 5.75 million.

That signing was head scratching from the start.
It not only cost us 5.75 million for a handful of games of garbage time, we gave up a high 2nd round pick to dump Moore's 2.5 mil salary and open that 15th roster spot. Only to waste 1 million on Dozier.
And he didn't even play a position of need for us (1 or 5).

My guess is that Connelly saw Dozier as a somewhat known quantity that could provide injury insurance early in the season. I don't think they wanted to depend on Minott, Dillingham, and Shannon before they were confident they were ready. At this point, those guys have established they are capable of playing regular minutes when needed.

[winforlose]

I was asking the former. I wasn’t sure if at a certain point (years of service,) you couldn’t offer fully non guaranteed deals. As for needing him to get a million, that felt like TC doing him a favor. An expensive favor at that given that it cost someone else (whoever wins the ownership fight,) 5.75 million.

That signing was head scratching from the start.
It not only cost us 5.75 million for a handful of games of garbage time, we gave up a high 2nd round pick to dump Moore's 2.5 mil salary and open that 15th roster spot. Only to waste 1 million on Dozier.
And he didn't even play a position of need for us (1 or 5).

My guess is that Connelly saw Dozier as a somewhat known quantity that could provide injury insurance early in the season. I don't think they wanted to depend on Minott, Dillingham, and Shannon before they were confident they were ready. At this point, those guys have established they are capable of playing regular minutes when needed.

Maybe, but Dozier could have been exhibit 10 into a non guaranteed deal. The idea that he would demand the 1 million not to go to Europe is probably the best explanation for what happened. But, Dozier isn’t good enough to get that kind of guarantee and that is a flaw of TC.

[shrink]

This has to be part of the reason behind the timing, right?!

The biggest factor is that the full-guarantee deadline for P.J. Dozier's deal was January 1st.

Sure. I was thinking about the limit of time that a team can go below a certain roster size (don't remember if we were at or above that mark before the waiver).

It probably wasn’t the reason it was done now, but it was the underlying reason the contract was set up that way in the first place.

PJ got paid for a spot, right up until a week before NBA teams could sign 10-day deals.

[younggunsmn]

The biggest factor is that the full-guarantee deadline for P.J. Dozier's deal was January 1st.

Sure. I was thinking about the limit of time that a team can go below a certain roster size (don't remember if we were at or above that mark before the waiver).

It probably wasn’t the reason it was done now, but it was the underlying reason the contract was set up that way in the first place.

PJ got paid for a spot, right up until a week before NBA teams could sign 10-day deals.

He got like 50k beyond his guarantee.
I think the only reason they waited that long is that they didn't want to cut him on or right before christmas.

[younggunsmn]

If Julius Randle opts out, I think there's a real chance we offer Tyus Jones the full MLE next offseason.

Naw probably walks, Mike can either come off the bench, retire, or get bought out.