Official Scottie All Star Barnes Thread 8

[junot111]

To me it's quite frustrating. I could be wrong but he has the tools to be a scorer. I understand shooting the 3, but he needs to learn a couple moves and that's a higher priority. Last game notwithstanding, he takes too many contested 3 this season that instead imo he should try to get in midrange, and shoot or pass from there.

What moves do you think he can develop? He can't blow by defenders, doesn't have a great shooting touch, doesn't have elite ball control. He takes a lot of 3's because if he makes them, that's the quickest path to opening his offense. It's about time for us to accept that he's not going to be the elite scorer this team needs.

On his 3s yes, on his 2s it's quite a different story.

He's at 54.3% from 10-16ft thus far, indicating the midrange might actually become a thing, depends if he can raise his percentages from 16-3P.

That's a clear outlier compared to his career avg of 36.5%. I'd trust the numerous years of data and eye test footage over 21 games.

[canada_dry]

For the “hE hAs No BaG” people.

S/o Pensare for the tape.

I love Scottie and am super high on him, but you can make a highlight video for any player in the league and it doesn't mean anything. Scottie until he can show that he can do these moves consistently on a game by game basis, will continue to be seen as a weak offensive player with no real go to moves.

The fact that he can put up 20ppg with no real moves is a great sign, but that doesn't mean he is safe from criticism. Scottie does the things showcased in that video like once every game or two, and he averages 16FGA a game, a guy doing something really nice less than 5% of the time doesn't mean he "has a bag". It means he is capable of having a bag.

The only place he's shown any sort of consistency and high level efficiency is under the basket, and his shot diet there has dropped dramatically (8%) since last year.

TLDR; a highlight video is no indication he "has a bag", and for him to be considered as such, those moves need to be seen on a regular basis, not once every couple of games.

Then the criticism should be why doesn’t he show his iso dribbling more often (I can think of a few reasons). Not that he has no bag.

You can think of a few reasons

Its always mysterious outside forces holding scottie back with you. Theres always excuses.

Scase is right. For example if a player shoots 20% from 3 but occasionally makes 1 or 2, we can't say he has a shot he just doesn't show very often. Rather, he has no shot even though he may hit one every once in a while.

A highlight doesn't prove anything. He doesn't have a bag YET. He still needs to develop it.

Pen was right about what a bag is. Its not just handles. Its the tools you have. Its footwork. Its counters. Etc. Scottie isnt particularly good at any of the above, yet.

Unlike a lot of people lately im still holding out hope for him. But lets be honest about where he currently is too.

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[Vampirate]

What moves do you think he can develop? He can't blow by defenders, doesn't have a great shooting touch, doesn't have elite ball control. He takes a lot of 3's because if he makes them, that's the quickest path to opening his offense. It's about time for us to accept that he's not going to be the elite scorer this team needs.

On his 3s yes, on his 2s it's quite a different story.

He's at 54.3% from 10-16ft thus far, indicating the midrange might actually become a thing, depends if he can raise his percentages from 16-3P.

That's a clear outlier compared to his career avg of 36.5%. I'd trust the numerous years of data and eye test footage over 21 games.

As is shooting under 30% the past 2 years in that area.

Also factor in his career averages are being affected by what he's doing in his current year, good and bad.

[Vampirate]

I love Scottie and am super high on him, but you can make a highlight video for any player in the league and it doesn't mean anything. Scottie until he can show that he can do these moves consistently on a game by game basis, will continue to be seen as a weak offensive player with no real go to moves.

The fact that he can put up 20ppg with no real moves is a great sign, but that doesn't mean he is safe from criticism. Scottie does the things showcased in that video like once every game or two, and he averages 16FGA a game, a guy doing something really nice less than 5% of the time doesn't mean he "has a bag". It means he is capable of having a bag.

The only place he's shown any sort of consistency and high level efficiency is under the basket, and his shot diet there has dropped dramatically (8%) since last year.

TLDR; a highlight video is no indication he "has a bag", and for him to be considered as such, those moves need to be seen on a regular basis, not once every couple of games.

Then the criticism should be why doesn’t he show his iso dribbling more often (I can think of a few reasons). Not that he has no bag.

You can think of a few reasons

Its always mysterious outside forces holding scottie back with you. Theres always excuses.

Scase is right. For example if a player shoots 20% from 3 but occasionally makes 1 or 2, we can't say he has a shot he just doesn't show very often. Rather, he has no shot even though he may hit one every once in a while.

A highlight doesn't prove anything. He doesn't have a bag YET. He still needs to develop it.

Pen was right about what a bag is. Its not just handles. Its the tools you have. Its footwork. Its counters. Etc. Scottie isnt particularly good at any of the above, yet.

Unlike a lot of people lately im still holding out hope for him. But lets be honest about where he currently is too.

Sent from my SM-G960W using RealGM mobile app

I wouldn't say a bag, but i'd say Barnes definitely has a move. Watch how many turnaround jumpers he does and nails around 3-16ft.

I wouldn't call the move smooth yet, but it's been effective.

[HangTime]

I think Nick Nurse was the real problem, we saw flashes of Scottie as a "lead guy". But he was regulated to a 4th-5th option.
It became obvious that he should get way more on ball reps, and played him as a big on defence (since we lacked bigs).

But his ability to do other things, had the local media pushing him in the direction of just being a Big, wanting to limit his game. They've relaxed on it since, but not nearly enough.


He can get you 20 points without really trying.

He by far has the vision on the team, directoring guys to spots.
So, Let him work on his handles now,
and bomb away from 3 when most of the main guys are out.

[Scott Hall]

Scottie Barnes is starting to remind me of Russell Westbrook in terms of...

A guy that will stuff the stat sheet and could possibly get you a triple double on any given night and could get hot from 3 point land but overall not good shooters.

Both have something mentally wrong with them and you could see one of their many brain farts on any given episode of Shaqtin a Fool where they could also be dressed in some cringe outfit.

As someone who was super high on Barnes as a rookie I'm here in year 4 starting to question if he's a fake stats guy like so many.

I like Barnes as a person I think he competes most of the time but sometimes he can be lazy but he does have good intentions but if any fan base knows anything about fake superstars it's Toronto sports fans.

Injuries have to be acknowledged but they can't be used as an excuse when his issues are all mental.

I was asking myself tonight could a team win a Championship with Scottie Barnes as their 3rd best player and the answer is I don't know. Do I want to trade Barnes? no but he definitely isn't untouchable and I'm definitely listening to any offers that filter in.

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[PushDaRock]

The body language needs to improve. You can't just be clapping and energetic after you make a few shots and sulking when things aren't going your way. He was saying the right things at the start of the season and you hoped he turned a corner with his maturity but he's reverted back to those bad tendencies after all this losing.

[mdenny]

The body language needs to improve. You can't just be clapping and energetic after you make a few shots and sulking when things aren't going your way. He was saying the right things at the start of the season and you hoped he turned a corner with his maturity but he's reverted back to those bad tendencies after all this losing.

The mood swings don't even correlate to how the team is doing. They correlate to how scotty is playing as an individual. That should be the biggest concern. Stuff like looking back at a defender to taunt before an open dunk when we are down by 15.

He's in his fourth season and he is the biggest redflag character issue player amongst sigmificant raptor starters for the past 10 to 15 seasons. But the diehard Barnes brigade claim there are media conspiracies against him when word from the trenches leaks into the media coverage.

It's hilarious to watch.

He still has time to mature and adapt. But the chances of that radically decrease each passing season. His brigade is in denial if they don't think his demonstrative sulking and mood swings are a problem.

I'm starting to change my mind about that game against the pacers when he was acting so emotional and Pascal left the game without shaking hands. At the time I appreciated the passion. But there's another interpretation of that end of game sequence where one could say Scotty was being unprofessional and acting like a brat.

Call Pascal what you want. He was never unprofessional or bratty. With scotty....those character flaws are still in question. And he's had 4 years to dispel them.

[Scase]

I have a hunch this year is about getting the movements before the shots in so it becomes more natural. Before the wacky dance he had a very clean move to the right for a pull up corner 3.

(also his 3 point shooting at above the break dead center is at 35%, the picture below is not including last night's game)



He needs one of those 20% or 28% to become over 30%

It's this off season when he actually needs to work on converting them.

I want him to be taking longer shots in general and not be post reliant.



As for the whole narrative that he didn't improve, people need to look at what he's doing on his 2s



Any improvement on his three (like a good month, and suddenly he's a 21-23PPG scorer, keeping in mind he's averaging 20 ppg despite the 3 point slump/regression/whatever you think it is.

I mean yeah, but look at his 16f-3p shooting, he got significantly worse. Him being a legit mid range threat would open up the entire court to him, a 6'9 guy jacking up ATB 3's even at 35% isn't doing half as much for his game. He doesn't have a good enough dribble or first step to blow past someone playing him close, so really unless he's knocking down high volume at like 38%+, he's going to be an easy cover.

This is very much a "The hunter who chases 3 rabbits, catches none" situation. Practising at multiple things at a time spreads you thin and slows down improvement over time.

If he's hitting 35% from ABT overall then his 3P % looks much better than it is now and he's likely a 22ppg 57-58 TS% player.

As for the whole spreading it around, I can argue that he specifically worked in the area at 10-16ft (which has been a sore spot).

Putting it another way if he maintains this to even a .450% percentage at that range, it's still a big sign because then you can argue he can extend out even further (if his 16-3P% doesn't improve, and there's more evidence that he's .350 in that area, but who knows)

Barnes has not just been taking more pull up 3s, but more pullups in general. Last year he took 3.1 pull ups total (2s and 3s) this year he's taking an average of 6 thus far (hitting 47% on his pull up 2s thus far) so to think he didn't work on this part very much is short sighted thinking imo.

If you're thinking he's not using the midrange more he is.

21.7% of his total shots are in the 10-3P range, last year it was 14.8%.

I suspect as the season goes along his shot diet at 3 will drop to 30%, and he seems to be taking less shots from 0-10ft 43.7% this year compared to 53.9% last year. (shooting 56.2% on his 2s so keep doing what you're doing here)

In short, he's evolving as a player, but the results are not exactly pretty atm.

This is very much a "If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a bike" territory. Yes, if he was shooting better, then his efficiency would be better. But he's not, and it isn't.

So until we start seeing that take place, it's kind of a pointless argument. We definitely should see him skew in that direction, but just cause he should, doesn't mean he will.

For the “hE hAs No BaG” people.

S/o Pensare for the tape.

I love Scottie and am super high on him, but you can make a highlight video for any player in the league and it doesn't mean anything. Scottie until he can show that he can do these moves consistently on a game by game basis, will continue to be seen as a weak offensive player with no real go to moves.

The fact that he can put up 20ppg with no real moves is a great sign, but that doesn't mean he is safe from criticism. Scottie does the things showcased in that video like once every game or two, and he averages 16FGA a game, a guy doing something really nice less than 5% of the time doesn't mean he "has a bag". It means he is capable of having a bag.

The only place he's shown any sort of consistency and high level efficiency is under the basket, and his shot diet there has dropped dramatically (8%) since last year.

TLDR; a highlight video is no indication he "has a bag", and for him to be considered as such, those moves need to be seen on a regular basis, not once every couple of games.

Then the criticism should be why doesn’t he show his iso dribbling more often (I can think of a few reasons). Not that he has no bag.

But that's literally the point, you can't say he has a bag, if he never shows it. No one credits Demar or Kahwi as incredible mid range shooters based off them doing it like 30-50 times a season, they get their rep cause they do it multiple times a game, every single game.

Some guy hitting a half court shot at the half time show isn't an incredible 3pt shooter who just isn't showing it. Why ask "why doesn't he show it more" and rather, "maybe he doesn't show it more, cause he doesn't have it."

One of those is a hell of a lot more logical after nigh on 4 years in the league. Scottie can have those "in his bag", eventually. But as of now, he doesn't.

[720]

I mean yeah, but look at his 16f-3p shooting, he got significantly worse. Him being a legit mid range threat would open up the entire court to him, a 6'9 guy jacking up ATB 3's even at 35% isn't doing half as much for his game. He doesn't have a good enough dribble or first step to blow past someone playing him close, so really unless he's knocking down high volume at like 38%+, he's going to be an easy cover.

This is very much a "The hunter who chases 3 rabbits, catches none" situation. Practising at multiple things at a time spreads you thin and slows down improvement over time.

If he's hitting 35% from ABT overall then his 3P % looks much better than it is now and he's likely a 22ppg 57-58 TS% player.

As for the whole spreading it around, I can argue that he specifically worked in the area at 10-16ft (which has been a sore spot).

Putting it another way if he maintains this to even a .450% percentage at that range, it's still a big sign because then you can argue he can extend out even further (if his 16-3P% doesn't improve, and there's more evidence that he's .350 in that area, but who knows)

Barnes has not just been taking more pull up 3s, but more pullups in general. Last year he took 3.1 pull ups total (2s and 3s) this year he's taking an average of 6 thus far (hitting 47% on his pull up 2s thus far) so to think he didn't work on this part very much is short sighted thinking imo.

If you're thinking he's not using the midrange more he is.

21.7% of his total shots are in the 10-3P range, last year it was 14.8%.

I suspect as the season goes along his shot diet at 3 will drop to 30%, and he seems to be taking less shots from 0-10ft 43.7% this year compared to 53.9% last year. (shooting 56.2% on his 2s so keep doing what you're doing here)

In short, he's evolving as a player, but the results are not exactly pretty atm.

This is very much a "If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a bike" territory. Yes, if he was shooting better, then his efficiency would be better. But he's not, and it isn't.

So until we start seeing that take place, it's kind of a pointless argument. We definitely should see him skew in that direction, but just cause he should, doesn't mean he will.

I love Scottie and am super high on him, but you can make a highlight video for any player in the league and it doesn't mean anything. Scottie until he can show that he can do these moves consistently on a game by game basis, will continue to be seen as a weak offensive player with no real go to moves.

The fact that he can put up 20ppg with no real moves is a great sign, but that doesn't mean he is safe from criticism. Scottie does the things showcased in that video like once every game or two, and he averages 16FGA a game, a guy doing something really nice less than 5% of the time doesn't mean he "has a bag". It means he is capable of having a bag.

The only place he's shown any sort of consistency and high level efficiency is under the basket, and his shot diet there has dropped dramatically (8%) since last year.

TLDR; a highlight video is no indication he "has a bag", and for him to be considered as such, those moves need to be seen on a regular basis, not once every couple of games.

Then the criticism should be why doesn’t he show his iso dribbling more often (I can think of a few reasons). Not that he has no bag.

But that's literally the point, you can't say he has a bag, if he never shows it. No one credits Demar or Kahwi as incredible mid range shooters based off them doing it like 30-50 times a season, they get their rep cause they do it multiple times a game, every single game.

Some guy hitting a half court shot at the half time show isn't an incredible 3pt shooter who just isn't showing it. Why ask "why doesn't he show it more" and rather, "maybe he doesn't show it more, cause he doesn't have it."

One of those is a hell of a lot more logical after nigh on 4 years in the league. Scottie can have those "in his bag", eventually. But as of now, he doesn't.

He clearly has a bag. It’s one thing to hit a half court heave which probably has a make percentage of 1-3 percent (idk just guessing there probably is an actual number out there), and another to say someone can’t dribble the ball and create offense for themselves when they show they can literally every game. Sure he isn’t coming down like Kyrie or Shai and dribbling the air out of the ball every possession but to say he has no bag is wrong.

[LoveMyRaps]

Slowly returning to his all star form.

Can’t wait to pair him with a top prospect from the upcoming draft.

[HumbleRen]

Scottie Barnes is starting to remind me of Russell Westbrook in terms of...

A guy that will stuff the stat sheet and could possibly get you a triple double on any given night and could get hot from 3 point land but overall not good shooters.

Both have something mentally wrong with them and you could see one of their many brain farts on any given episode of Shaqtin a Fool where they could also be dressed in some cringe outfit.

As someone who was super high on Barnes as a rookie I'm here in year 4 starting to question if he's a fake stats guy like so many.

I like Barnes as a person I think he competes most of the time but sometimes he can be lazy but he does have good intentions but if any fan base knows anything about fake superstars it's Toronto sports fans.

Injuries have to be acknowledged but they can't be used as an excuse when his issues are all mental.

I was asking myself tonight could a team win a Championship with Scottie Barnes as their 3rd best player and the answer is I don't know. Do I want to trade Barnes? no but he definitely isn't untouchable and I'm definitely listening to any offers that filter in.

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Mental brain farts is the only real comparison. Westbrook’s compete level is generational, you can not like his game but his motor even at age 40 will always be above Scottie’s.

[Scase]

If he's hitting 35% from ABT overall then his 3P % looks much better than it is now and he's likely a 22ppg 57-58 TS% player.

As for the whole spreading it around, I can argue that he specifically worked in the area at 10-16ft (which has been a sore spot).

Putting it another way if he maintains this to even a .450% percentage at that range, it's still a big sign because then you can argue he can extend out even further (if his 16-3P% doesn't improve, and there's more evidence that he's .350 in that area, but who knows)

Barnes has not just been taking more pull up 3s, but more pullups in general. Last year he took 3.1 pull ups total (2s and 3s) this year he's taking an average of 6 thus far (hitting 47% on his pull up 2s thus far) so to think he didn't work on this part very much is short sighted thinking imo.

If you're thinking he's not using the midrange more he is.

21.7% of his total shots are in the 10-3P range, last year it was 14.8%.

I suspect as the season goes along his shot diet at 3 will drop to 30%, and he seems to be taking less shots from 0-10ft 43.7% this year compared to 53.9% last year. (shooting 56.2% on his 2s so keep doing what you're doing here)

In short, he's evolving as a player, but the results are not exactly pretty atm.

This is very much a "If my grandmother had wheels, she'd be a bike" territory. Yes, if he was shooting better, then his efficiency would be better. But he's not, and it isn't.

So until we start seeing that take place, it's kind of a pointless argument. We definitely should see him skew in that direction, but just cause he should, doesn't mean he will.

Then the criticism should be why doesn’t he show his iso dribbling more often (I can think of a few reasons). Not that he has no bag.

But that's literally the point, you can't say he has a bag, if he never shows it. No one credits Demar or Kahwi as incredible mid range shooters based off them doing it like 30-50 times a season, they get their rep cause they do it multiple times a game, every single game.

Some guy hitting a half court shot at the half time show isn't an incredible 3pt shooter who just isn't showing it. Why ask "why doesn't he show it more" and rather, "maybe he doesn't show it more, cause he doesn't have it."

One of those is a hell of a lot more logical after nigh on 4 years in the league. Scottie can have those "in his bag", eventually. But as of now, he doesn't.

He clearly has a bag. It’s one thing to hit a half court heave which probably has a make percentage of 1-3 percent (idk just guessing there probably is an actual number out there), and another to say someone can’t dribble the ball and create offense for themselves when they show they can literally every game. Sure he isn’t coming down like Kyrie or Shai and dribbling the air out of the ball every possession but to say he has no bag is wrong.

I guess it really boils down to the definition of what a "bag" is. MJ for instance clearly had a fadeaway jumper in his bag (amongst other things obviously), and you could make this argument because as I said before, he did it multiple times a game, every game.

If we want to argue that what Scottie has in his bag, is the ability to pass and find teammates that most other players can't, I agree. But I think most people consider an offensive move that results in a point, or something extremely specific like AI and his absurd crossover skills.

Nothing in Scotties repertoire fits that category. He doesn't have a go to offensive move, he doesn't have the ball on a string, he doesn't have a spin move like Siakam, he doesn't have a 3pt shot, he really doesn't have much of anything in his game that is consistently repeatable, and most importantly, reliable. And to me that's what "having a bag" means, could just be my interpretation obviously, but I feel like that is the general understanding.

What consistent, repeatable, and reliable skill or move does he have? My gut would tell me his back to the basket game, but that fails the first and second categories. I'm not saying you are wrong, I just don't see anything that I would be confident saying is a skill or "move" he has in his bag.

[Scott Hall]

Scottie Barnes is starting to remind me of Russell Westbrook in terms of...

A guy that will stuff the stat sheet and could possibly get you a triple double on any given night and could get hot from 3 point land but overall not good shooters.

Both have something mentally wrong with them and you could see one of their many brain farts on any given episode of Shaqtin a Fool where they could also be dressed in some cringe outfit.

As someone who was super high on Barnes as a rookie I'm here in year 4 starting to question if he's a fake stats guy like so many.

I like Barnes as a person I think he competes most of the time but sometimes he can be lazy but he does have good intentions but if any fan base knows anything about fake superstars it's Toronto sports fans.

Injuries have to be acknowledged but they can't be used as an excuse when his issues are all mental.

I was asking myself tonight could a team win a Championship with Scottie Barnes as their 3rd best player and the answer is I don't know. Do I want to trade Barnes? no but he definitely isn't untouchable and I'm definitely listening to any offers that filter in.

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Mental brain farts is the only real comparison. Westbrook’s compete level is generational, you can not like his game but his motor even at age 40 will always be above Scottie’s.

Never compared their compete levels but Westbrook is a guy who put up crazy ungodly numbers but was never a good shooter who had a questionable shot selection and just never had the BBALL IQ to be a true game changer.

He proved he couldn't even be a 3rd man on a championship team. James Harden is another guy who puts up crazy stats hell both him and Westbrook are all over the NBA All-Time stat leaders yet aren't good enough to be a 3rd man on a championship team.

The fine line between true star players that you can win with is so thin. Some of the mental mistakes Barnes makes in year 4 are big red flags. Like others I used to hope it was just youth and learning mistakes but I admit there is something mentally wrong with him or there is some sort of mental issue and there is no cure for that.

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[Raps in 4]

Scottie Barnes is starting to remind me of Russell Westbrook in terms of...

A guy that will stuff the stat sheet and could possibly get you a triple double on any given night and could get hot from 3 point land but overall not good shooters.

Both have something mentally wrong with them and you could see one of their many brain farts on any given episode of Shaqtin a Fool where they could also be dressed in some cringe outfit.

As someone who was super high on Barnes as a rookie I'm here in year 4 starting to question if he's a fake stats guy like so many.

I like Barnes as a person I think he competes most of the time but sometimes he can be lazy but he does have good intentions but if any fan base knows anything about fake superstars it's Toronto sports fans.

Injuries have to be acknowledged but they can't be used as an excuse when his issues are all mental.

I was asking myself tonight could a team win a Championship with Scottie Barnes as their 3rd best player and the answer is I don't know. Do I want to trade Barnes? no but he definitely isn't untouchable and I'm definitely listening to any offers that filter in.

Sent from my SM-G965W using RealGM mobile app

Mental brain farts is the only real comparison. Westbrook’s compete level is generational, you can not like his game but his motor even at age 40 will always be above Scottie’s.

Never compared their compete levels but Westbrook is a guy who put up crazy ungodly numbers but was never a good shooter who had a questionable shot selection and just never had the BBALL IQ to be a true game changer.

He proved he couldn't even be a 3rd man on a championship team. James Harden is another guy who puts up crazy stats hell both him and Westbrook are all over the NBA All-Time stat leaders yet aren't good enough to be a 3rd man on a championship team.

The fine line between true star players that you can win with is so thin. Some of the mental mistakes Barnes makes in year 4 are big red flags. Like others I used to hope it was just youth and learning mistakes but I admit there is something mentally wrong with him or there is some sort of mental issue and there is no cure for that.

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James Harden was one game away from beating the Steph + KD Warriors in the playoffs. He was the only player in the league with more than one playoff win against that team (he beat them 7 times; compare that to LeBron's single win). If KD doesn't join the Warriors, it's very likely that he has a ring. He was a much better player than WB.

[bonjovi0308]

The body language needs to improve. You can't just be clapping and energetic after you make a few shots and sulking when things aren't going your way. He was saying the right things at the start of the season and you hoped he turned a corner with his maturity but he's reverted back to those bad tendencies after all this losing.

The mood swings don't even correlate to how the team is doing. They correlate to how scotty is playing as an individual. That should be the biggest concern. Stuff like looking back at a defender to taunt before an open dunk when we are down by 15.

He's in his fourth season and he is the biggest redflag character issue player amongst sigmificant raptor starters for the past 10 to 15 seasons. But the diehard Barnes brigade claim there are media conspiracies against him when word from the trenches leaks into the media coverage.

It's hilarious to watch.

He still has time to mature and adapt. But the chances of that radically decrease each passing season. His brigade is in denial if they don't think his demonstrative sulking and mood swings are a problem.

I'm starting to change my mind about that game against the pacers when he was acting so emotional and Pascal left the game without shaking hands. At the time I appreciated the passion. But there's another interpretation of that end of game sequence where one could say Scotty was being unprofessional and acting like a brat.

Call Pascal what you want. He was never unprofessional or bratty. With scotty....those character flaws are still in question. And he's had 4 years to dispel them.

Thank God you are not the head coach nor a GM for the raptors

[Jtoneller1]

The body language needs to improve. You can't just be clapping and energetic after you make a few shots and sulking when things aren't going your way. He was saying the right things at the start of the season and you hoped he turned a corner with his maturity but he's reverted back to those bad tendencies after all this losing.

The mood swings don't even correlate to how the team is doing. They correlate to how scotty is playing as an individual. That should be the biggest concern. Stuff like looking back at a defender to taunt before an open dunk when we are down by 15.

He's in his fourth season and he is the biggest redflag character issue player amongst sigmificant raptor starters for the past 10 to 15 seasons. But the diehard Barnes brigade claim there are media conspiracies against him when word from the trenches leaks into the media coverage.

It's hilarious to watch.

He still has time to mature and adapt. But the chances of that radically decrease each passing season. His brigade is in denial if they don't think his demonstrative sulking and mood swings are a problem.

I'm starting to change my mind about that game against the pacers when he was acting so emotional and Pascal left the game without shaking hands. At the time I appreciated the passion. But there's another interpretation of that end of game sequence where one could say Scotty was being unprofessional and acting like a brat.

Call Pascal what you want. He was never unprofessional or bratty. With scotty....those character flaws are still in question. And he's had 4 years to dispel them.

Wholeheartedly agree with this take....the body language/wild gesticulating after his teammates don't get him an assist is really grating. The constant whining and throwing his hands up after every single call against him speaks volumes about his leadership. As you said, the most glaring indictment is that his level of engagement is both very inconsistent and is solely tied to how he's doing individually regardless of the score. If Scottie gets 2-3 buckets/assists in a row, he suddenly starts flexing/dancing/screaming even if the team is down 20. Forget about the obvious skill deficiencies, this guy doesn't have the mental makeup to be a 1st option or a leader. His ceiling is a do-it-all second option who needs a mature, consistent, and driven leader to keep him in line.

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[Boogie!]

The extra curricular **** doesn’t even matter. I mean Scottie can dance and do whatever the **** he wants if he’s playing at an elite level. My concern is that he’s not gonna turn into the player he was hyped up to be. Year 4 and he hasn’t progressed in terms of over skill set and ability over last year. His 3 point shooting has regressed. He still doesn’t have a consistent reliable go to move. He’s still making dumb telegraphed turnovers and has a sloppy handle. He seems pretty close to capped outs… I’ve been saying the only thing that can take him to the next level is how consistent his jumper is… I don’t really care about his antics I care that he’s not gonna that good.

[MiamiSPX]

Not sure why some feel that constantly saying "he will never be a #1" is some sort of big gotcha moment. Even his biggest fans have come to that realization (now).

Has Masai come out and said we are no longer looking for that 1st option because we feel we have one? Lol, no, in fact he has said the opposite if anyone is listening. We are still looking for that "top guy on a contender" like 24 other teams in the league. This is why our FO seems to be guiding the tank along this year and Masai has been scouting the guys at the top of the draft.

[PushDaRock]

Not sure why some feel that constantly saying "he will never be a #1" is some sort of big gotcha moment. Even his biggest fans have come to that realization (now).

Has Masai come out and said we are no longer looking for that 1st option because we feel we have one? Lol, no, in fact he has said the opposite if anyone is listening. We are still looking for that "top guy on a contender" like 24 other teams in the league. This is why our FO seems to be guiding the tank along this year and Masai has been scouting the guys at the top of the draft.

I don't see much #1 option discussion, it's more whether he can be a #2 option on a contending team. Current skillset and projection has him looking more like a #3 maybe #4 IMO. The development of an elite mid range game which we see some small signs of might get him to a #2.