Jimmy to SAC (w/ LAL & NO)

[OutsidetheNBA]

The best fit for Jimmy is Sacramento -- he is a solid fit between Fox and Sabonis, can still play some good wing defense, and the Kings need a talent infusion if they want to keep Fox and/or compete for the playoffs.

Basic idea is:

Kings get Butler for DeRozan + Filler + 1st
Heat get Ingram + filler for Butler
Lakers get DeRozan for 2nds and Swaps (keep their future 1sts)
NO gets a 1st + filler + bad contract for Ingram


SAC In: Butler
SAC Out: DeRozan, Huerter, 1st (2 yrs after Hawks pick coveys (likely '27 or '28) Top 6 for 2 years, then 2 2nds)

DeRozan doesn't fit, Huerter isn't a long-term piece, and they spend a future pick to raise the ceiling and the floor of the team to make the playoffs this year and resign Fox.

MIA In: Ingram, Gabe Vincent, '25 LAL 2nd
MIA Out: Butler

Get a win-now piece in Ingram, a PG who once succeeded under Spo, and a mid-2nd rounder. The Heat can see if Ingram can fit their culture. Even if he doesn't, he should help them make the playoffs this year and they can walk away from the Butler contract with only Vincent's money on the books for 1 more year.

LAL In: DeRozan
LAL Out: Vando, Vincent, '25 LAL 2nd, '25 LAC 2nd, '26 Swap

DeRozan isn't a perfect fit with Lebron/Davis, but the Lakers get another creator in the backcourt while jettisoning two bad contracts. I think it's about the best they can do while maintaining their future picks for the next superstar trade.

NO In: Huerter, J. Vanderbilt, SAC 1st (2 yrs after Hawks pick coveys (likely '27 or '28) Top 6 for 2 years, then 2 2nds), '25 LAC 2nd, '26 LAL Swap
NO Out: Ingram

Get some value for Ingram who it appears they do not plan to re-sign. They take on some bad money in Huerter and Vando, but the '26 LAL Swap could be value given the age/injury-risk of the Lakers and the Huerter is an expiring next year who they may be able to trade into cap space this summer to a team looking for shooting. This trade signals a rebuild.

[BBallFreak]

I mean, sure for Miami

[MessiahUjiri]

The concept is good. I’d direct atleast one of the small assets (eg LAL 1st swap) to Miami instead of NOP, as Ingram shouldn’t fetch THAT much more than Butler.

[LightTheBeam]

The filler from Sac has to be Huerter + 2 minimum guys (Orlando, Len, Doug).

I think id do it depending on the 1st.

Fox/Monk
Keon/Carter
Butler
Keegan/Lyles
Sabonis

Thats a hell of an 8 man rotation. I don't think it makes them a title team, but they could be sneaky dangerous. Team seems to be responding well now that they have a real coach, we will see if it lasts.

[OxAndFox]

Price just went up on DBo.

[bpcox05]

I'm open to this for SAC.

- Butler is a bit of a better shooter than DeRozan (so he helps improve the spacing a bit)
- Butler is a better defender than DeRozan (helps protect Sabonis more)
- Butler is a better offensive player and more efficient scorer than DeRozan (gives us a strong go-to scorer combo of Fox & Butler)
- Butler has that tough guy mentality (Kings have a bunch of "nice" players. We might need a guy to help set the tone on the floor)

The only thing that gives me pause is how he will ultimately gel with the team. He continues to wear out his welcome with each stop. Would hate for him to disrupt the good locker room vibes we got going. SAC would need to have insight if Butler would be excited and happy to play in SAC first before considering.

[OutsidetheNBA]

The concept is good. I’d direct atleast one of the small assets (eg LAL 1st swap) to Miami instead of NOP, as Ingram shouldn’t fetch THAT much more than Butler.

Interesting. My instinct is that NOP probably needs more value here. Vando is injured, cannot shoot, doesn't fit in NO, and has 3 years left on his contract at $11m/yr. Huerter is neutral imo, but he overlaps with Hawkins, who NOP is trying to develop.

Basically they get a bad contract, a meh contract that doesn't fit, and pretty distant 1st for Ingram. Not sure that's enough, but there aren't many Pelicans fans on the board so I can't say how much they value Ingram at this point.

[OutsidetheNBA]

The filler from Sac has to be Huerter + 2 minimum guys (Orlando, Len, Doug).

I think id do it depending on the 1st.

Fox/Monk
Keon/Carter
Butler
Keegan/Lyles
Sabonis

Thats a hell of an 8 man rotation. I don't think it makes them a title team, but they could be sneaky dangerous. Team seems to be responding well now that they have a real coach, we will see if it lasts.

According to FanSpo, just DeRozan + Huerter works cap-wise, though it would add ~$6.5m to Sacramento's cap this year. I think part of the value Sacramento adds to this trade is it allows all of the other teams to cut a bit of salary.

Proposal for the 1st is Top 6 protected in '27 and '28, 2 2nds thereafter.

[Hoops23]

OP trade is a good return of value for Butler. I like it since Im not the one paying this taxes.
But lets get real, the issue for Miami is the lux tax. Ingram is due for an extension. The Heat already said that in any Butler deal, the contract of the players will be a concern.

give Miami another filler with expiring contract instead of Gabe Vincent.

[SNPA]

Is going from DDR under contract to Jimmy worth a first that ties up Sac’s ability to make deals for like 5 years?

[jayjaysee]

I like Sacramento as a destination. Would either be really good or really bad for Murray.. But I think Sac package should keep them under the tax? At least under the apron though. But given how expensive the team will be for 3 years (hopefully) probably best to duck the tax.

[BoogieTime]

Is going from DDR under contract to Jimmy worth a first that ties up Sac’s ability to make deals for like 5 years?

no. too old. he may be a modicum better than demar, but not in the manner of a first when there are other questions

[bpcox05]

Is going from DDR under contract to Jimmy worth a first that ties up Sac’s ability to make deals for like 5 years?

no. too old. he may be a modicum better than demar, but not in the manner of a first when there are other questions

There’s definitely question marks with how he fits with the locker room, and we’d still be lacking length in the starting unit, but Butler’s impact is a significant upgrade over DeRozan. Here are how they rank in some of the best advanced impact stats…

VPM: Butler = 15th / DeRozan = 124th
EPM: Butler = 22nd / DeRozan = 144th
LEBRON: Butler = 25th / DeRozan = 84th
DARKO: Butler = 18th / DeRozan = 127th
RAPM (2Y): Butler = 50th / DeRozan = 66th

He’s definitely more than a “modicum” better than DeRozan.




As for the starting lineup, we could always look to move Butler to SG, Murray to SF, and trade Monk+ for a starting PF. That would give us…

- A significant upgrade over DeRozan
- A better fit than DeRozan
- More size/length around Sabonis.

You’d still have Ellis and Carter off the bench and Butler can swing up to SF to make sure Ellis and Carter are getting solid minutes. The minutes rotation could look something like…

PG - Fox (34) / Carter (14)
SG - Butler (16) / Ellis (28) / Carter (4)
SF - Murray (24) / Butler (18) / Carter (6)
PF - 3&D PF (28) / Murray (6) / Lyles (14)
C - Sabonis (34) / Len (10) / Lyles (4)

Fox = 34 min
Butler = 34 min
Sabonis = 34 min
Murray = 30 min
Ellis = 28 min
3&D PF = 28 min
Carter = 24 min
Lyles = 18 min
Len = 10 min

[SNPA]

Is going from DDR under contract to Jimmy worth a first that ties up Sac’s ability to make deals for like 5 years?

no. too old. he may be a modicum better than demar, but not in the manner of a first when there are other questions

There’s definitely question marks with how he fits with the locker room, and we’d still be lacking length in the starting unit, but Butler’s impact is a significant upgrade over DeRozan. Here are how they rank in some of the best advanced impact stats…

VPM: Butler = 15th / DeRozan = 124th
EPM: Butler = 22nd / DeRozan = 144th
LEBRON: Butler = 25th / DeRozan = 84th
DARKO: Butler = 18th / DeRozan = 127th
RAPM (2Y): Butler = 50th / DeRozan = 66th

He’s definitely more than a “modicum” better than DeRozan.




As for the starting lineup, we could always look to move Butler to SG, Murray to SF, and trade Monk+ for a starting PF. That would give us…

- A significant upgrade over DeRozan
- A better fit than DeRozan
- More size/length around Sabonis.

You’d still have Ellis and Carter off the bench and Butler can swing up to SF to make sure Ellis and Carter are getting solid minutes. The minutes rotation could look something like…

PG - Fox (34) / Carter (14)
SG - Butler (16) / Ellis (28) / Carter (4)
SF - Murray (24) / Butler (18) / Carter (6)
PF - 3&D PF (28) / Murray (6) / Lyles (14)
C - Sabonis (34) / Len (10) / Lyles (4)

Fox = 34 min
Butler = 34 min
Sabonis = 34 min
Murray = 30 min
Ellis = 28 min
3&D PF = 28 min
Carter = 24 min
Lyles = 18 min
Len = 10 min

Bring Butler into the locker room and trade Fox’s BF…that’s playing with fire.

[bpcox05]

Is going from DDR under contract to Jimmy worth a first that ties up Sac’s ability to make deals for like 5 years?

no. too old. he may be a modicum better than demar, but not in the manner of a first when there are other questions

There’s definitely question marks with how he fits with the locker room, and we’d still be lacking length in the starting unit, but Butler’s impact is a significant upgrade over DeRozan. Here are how they rank in some of the best advanced impact stats…

VPM: Butler = 15th / DeRozan = 124th
EPM: Butler = 22nd / DeRozan = 144th
LEBRON: Butler = 25th / DeRozan = 84th
DARKO: Butler = 18th / DeRozan = 127th
RAPM (2Y): Butler = 50th / DeRozan = 66th

He’s definitely more than a “modicum” better than DeRozan.




As for the starting lineup, we could always look to move Butler to SG, Murray to SF, and trade Monk+ for a starting PF. That would give us…

- A significant upgrade over DeRozan
- A better fit than DeRozan
- More size/length around Sabonis.

You’d still have Ellis and Carter off the bench and Butler can swing up to SF to make sure Ellis and Carter are getting solid minutes. The minutes rotation could look something like…

PG - Fox (34) / Carter (14)
SG - Butler (16) / Ellis (28) / Carter (4)
SF - Murray (24) / Butler (18) / Carter (6)
PF - 3&D PF (28) / Murray (6) / Lyles (14)
C - Sabonis (34) / Len (10) / Lyles (4)

Fox = 34 min
Butler = 34 min
Sabonis = 34 min
Murray = 30 min
Ellis = 28 min
3&D PF = 28 min
Carter = 24 min
Lyles = 18 min
Len = 10 min

Bring Butler into the locker room and trade Fox’s BF…that’s playing with fire.

It oftentimes is risky when you’re trying to build a contender.

[SNPA]

There’s definitely question marks with how he fits with the locker room, and we’d still be lacking length in the starting unit, but Butler’s impact is a significant upgrade over DeRozan. Here are how they rank in some of the best advanced impact stats…

VPM: Butler = 15th / DeRozan = 124th
EPM: Butler = 22nd / DeRozan = 144th
LEBRON: Butler = 25th / DeRozan = 84th
DARKO: Butler = 18th / DeRozan = 127th
RAPM (2Y): Butler = 50th / DeRozan = 66th

He’s definitely more than a “modicum” better than DeRozan.




As for the starting lineup, we could always look to move Butler to SG, Murray to SF, and trade Monk+ for a starting PF. That would give us…

- A significant upgrade over DeRozan
- A better fit than DeRozan
- More size/length around Sabonis.

You’d still have Ellis and Carter off the bench and Butler can swing up to SF to make sure Ellis and Carter are getting solid minutes. The minutes rotation could look something like…

PG - Fox (34) / Carter (14)
SG - Butler (16) / Ellis (28) / Carter (4)
SF - Murray (24) / Butler (18) / Carter (6)
PF - 3&D PF (28) / Murray (6) / Lyles (14)
C - Sabonis (34) / Len (10) / Lyles (4)

Fox = 34 min
Butler = 34 min
Sabonis = 34 min
Murray = 30 min
Ellis = 28 min
3&D PF = 28 min
Carter = 24 min
Lyles = 18 min
Len = 10 min

Bring Butler into the locker room and trade Fox’s BF…that’s playing with fire.

It oftentimes is risky when you’re trying to build a contender.

It’s to risky for half a season. Butler would need to agree to play out his final year so Sac gets two chances at a playoff run. If they went this way I think moving picks for a big forward instead of Monk is the better option.

[bpcox05]

Bring Butler into the locker room and trade Fox’s BF…that’s playing with fire.

It oftentimes is risky when you’re trying to build a contender.

It’s to risky for half a season. Butler would need to agree to play out his final year so Sac gets two chances at a playoff run. If they went this way I think moving picks for a big forward instead of Monk is the better option.

Hence why I said the GM would need to have insight into if Butler would be excited to come here, play with our guys, play for Christie, open to resigning, etc.

[BoogieTime]

Is going from DDR under contract to Jimmy worth a first that ties up Sac’s ability to make deals for like 5 years?

no. too old. he may be a modicum better than demar, but not in the manner of a first when there are other questions

There’s definitely question marks with how he fits with the locker room, and we’d still be lacking length in the starting unit, but Butler’s impact is a significant upgrade over DeRozan. Here are how they rank in some of the best advanced impact stats…

VPM: Butler = 15th / DeRozan = 124th
EPM: Butler = 22nd / DeRozan = 144th
LEBRON: Butler = 25th / DeRozan = 84th
DARKO: Butler = 18th / DeRozan = 127th
RAPM (2Y): Butler = 50th / DeRozan = 66th

He’s definitely more than a “modicum” better than DeRozan.




As for the starting lineup, we could always look to move Butler to SG, Murray to SF, and trade Monk+ for a starting PF. That would give us…

- A significant upgrade over DeRozan
- A better fit than DeRozan
- More size/length around Sabonis.

You’d still have Ellis and Carter off the bench and Butler can swing up to SF to make sure Ellis and Carter are getting solid minutes. The minutes rotation could look something like…

PG - Fox (34) / Carter (14)
SG - Butler (16) / Ellis (28) / Carter (4)
SF - Murray (24) / Butler (18) / Carter (6)
PF - 3&D PF (28) / Murray (6) / Lyles (14)
C - Sabonis (34) / Len (10) / Lyles (4)

Fox = 34 min
Butler = 34 min
Sabonis = 34 min
Murray = 30 min
Ellis = 28 min
3&D PF = 28 min
Carter = 24 min
Lyles = 18 min
Len = 10 min

He’s better than I thought, but how about “in the manner of a first”

The reason he’s being moved is because he’s going on 36 and the Heat don’t trust him to give him 2 more years.

We’re a sub .500 team with a protected pick. Though we’ve played much better recently, Jimmy’s time is now and we haven’t proven ours is.

Cam is a more reasonable timeline.

At this point for me Fox is being moved before Malik, especially given Fox’s sentiments that he could leave if we don’t reach a certain level. Malik is more of a playmaker among other things for me