PG: Embarrassing loss to ORL

[HEZI]

WCJ really out scored our entire bench by himself in only 26 minutes but our bench is fine

We had 55 total minutes from the bench for a whopping 18 points. Magic had one guy drop 19 in 26 mins. But yes the bench is great lmao

[Jalen Bluntson]

I also just like, want to point out the irony in saying we can't play anyone on the bench because they suck in the postgame thread of a loss to a team who's missing 4 out of 5 of their starters as well as a bench player and still went deeper into their bench than we did.

It's also hilarious than you can go back 12 years and find articles from the Bulls and it sounds exactly the same as now.

The fact Portland had that kind of success shouldn't come as that much of a surprise though, given how much the Bulls have struggled the last few weeks. Their offense isn't moving well, and their defense -- even with Kirk Hinrich and Taj Gibson back in the lineup -- looks as if it's starting to break.

The bigger issue for the Bulls is that they don't seem quite sure how to fix their own problems right now. When asked what needs to change, Noah didn't hesitate.

"I don't know," Noah said.

At this point in the season, the answer appears to be a combination of different things. The minutes racked up by the starters and the problems with injuries appear to have taken their toll.

It's the same with the Wolves, it all sounds exactly the same as now with different names.

Worse, it was another Thibodeau season marked by star injury, as LaVine suffered a torn ACL during a Feb. 3 matchup against the Detroit Pistons and continued laboring on it for six minutes of game action before trainers shut him down. Until LaVine's knee ligament snapped, he had covered more ground per game than any player in the NBA, averaging 2.69 miles a night. That wasn't all: Wiggins and Towns were the only two players in the entire NBA who played over 3,000 minutes last season.

LaVine played with a torn ACL for 6 minutes before he was pulled Remember Mitch breaking his ankle against the Celtics and coming back out for the 2nd half before he was finally pulled?

I was a fool for thinking I would be able to avoid the minutes discussion earlier this season. It's just so mind numbing that people defend it at all costs. Ridiculous honestly. The evidence is there for all to see but, people continue to walk around with blinders on. Strawman this and deflection that. Meanwhile we get our asses handed to us by a team that went ten deep missing most of their starting lineup/best rotation players. We barely managed to go 8 deep in that same game.

[Spree2Houston]

It’s possible that Dadiet just flat out sucks, at least right now. His GLeague numbers look terrible, which indicate he’s just not that good right now. And I mean even for a backup role.

Kolek is just ok but he’s not some major upgrade over Payne. You can say he might not be better than him at all right now. Huk is a defender, don’t think he has much of an offensive game.

I think the FO expected more from guys like Payne, Shamet and Achiuwa. These are the guys you want to take a look at first when you are a win now team. Yes they have sucked but these are the guys that were brought in to help and it doesn’t always work out. Teams bring guys in and it doesn’t work, that happens. But you don’t blame the coach for giving them a chance. These guys are journeymen for a reason

I agree with this. Thibs isn’t holding anyone back. Guys usually get the Thibs bump and have their best seasons when they play with him. They actually play worse when they go elsewhere. With the exception of McBride, the guys coming off the bench probably suck.

[sol537]

The wheels are falling off, folks. Thibs has overworked the engines and has skipped routine maintenance… it was only a matter of time.

If we lose the next game against Toronto… oh boy because the schedule gets way harder for the rest of this month. Thibs could get canned if we go on a major skid…

[DOT]

I also just like, want to point out the irony in saying we can't play anyone on the bench because they suck in the postgame thread of a loss to a team who's missing 4 out of 5 of their starters as well as a bench player and still went deeper into their bench than we did.

They started Caleb Houstan.

As his number one hater due to BAF, and screw that worthless no production perimeter drifting bum forever, I can comfortably affirm that dude **** sucks as an NBA player. And they won.

Not a single guy that played against us is averaging 10 ppg on the season, yet they looked like a decent team

What I'm saying is, if Thibs is as good as people think he is, then he should be able to get 15 mpg out of guys like Dadiet and Kolek. Cause that's what good coaches do, they get the most out of guys

Cause if Thibs gets the most out of guys and he can't get enough out of our bench to outperform the guys the Magic had playing last night, the only logical conclusion from there is whoever's making roster moves is flat-out incompetent and half our roster shouldn't even be in the league.

[G_K_F]

The wheels are falling off, folks. Thibs has overworked the engines and has skipped routine maintenance… it was only a matter of time.

If we lose the next game against Toronto… oh boy because the schedule gets way harder for the rest of this month. Thibs could get canned if we go on a major skid…

He's not going anywhere.

His 'family' run the team.

[HEZI]

whine and complain year after year after year how some youth is being held back and rotation and minutes and this and that

That isn't what I said though

Maybe go back and actually read my argument instead of frothing at the mouth at the slightest criticism of your god.

Maybe you need to read your own argument to see what you said. The Deuce comment is exactly that but you now want to back pedal. Hilarious

[HEZI]

It’s possible that Dadiet just flat out sucks, at least right now. His GLeague numbers look terrible, which indicate he’s just not that good right now. And I mean even for a backup role.

Kolek is just ok but he’s not some major upgrade over Payne. You can say he might not be better than him at all right now. Huk is a defender, don’t think he has much of an offensive game.

I think the FO expected more from guys like Payne, Shamet and Achiuwa. These are the guys you want to take a look at first when you are a win now team. Yes they have sucked but these are the guys that were brought in to help and it doesn’t always work out. Teams bring guys in and it doesn’t work, that happens. But you don’t blame the coach for giving them a chance. These guys are journeymen for a reason

I agree with this. Thibs isn’t holding anyone back. Guys usually get the Thibs bump and have their best seasons when they play with him. They actually play worse when they go elsewhere. With the exception of McBride, the guys coming off the bench probably suck.

Exactly. If you can’t produce under Thibs chances are you probably suck

[NoDopeOnSundays]

I also just like, want to point out the irony in saying we can't play anyone on the bench because they suck in the postgame thread of a loss to a team who's missing 4 out of 5 of their starters as well as a bench player and still went deeper into their bench than we did.

It's also hilarious than you can go back 12 years and find articles from the Bulls and it sounds exactly the same as now.

The fact Portland had that kind of success shouldn't come as that much of a surprise though, given how much the Bulls have struggled the last few weeks. Their offense isn't moving well, and their defense -- even with Kirk Hinrich and Taj Gibson back in the lineup -- looks as if it's starting to break.

The bigger issue for the Bulls is that they don't seem quite sure how to fix their own problems right now. When asked what needs to change, Noah didn't hesitate.

"I don't know," Noah said.

At this point in the season, the answer appears to be a combination of different things. The minutes racked up by the starters and the problems with injuries appear to have taken their toll.

It's the same with the Wolves, it all sounds exactly the same as now with different names.

Worse, it was another Thibodeau season marked by star injury, as LaVine suffered a torn ACL during a Feb. 3 matchup against the Detroit Pistons and continued laboring on it for six minutes of game action before trainers shut him down. Until LaVine's knee ligament snapped, he had covered more ground per game than any player in the NBA, averaging 2.69 miles a night. That wasn't all: Wiggins and Towns were the only two players in the entire NBA who played over 3,000 minutes last season.

LaVine played with a torn ACL for 6 minutes before he was pulled Remember Mitch breaking his ankle against the Celtics and coming back out for the 2nd half before he was finally pulled?

I was a fool for thinking I would be able to avoid the minutes discussion earlier this season. It's just so mind numbing that people defend it at all costs. Ridiculous honestly. The evidence is there for all to see but, people continue to walk around with blinders on. Strawman this and deflection that. Meanwhile we get our asses handed to us by a team that went ten deep missing most of their starting lineup/best rotation players. We barely managed to go 8 deep in that same game.

The deflections are funny to me, because you can just go through old RealGM or Reddit threads about him and you'll see the same exact complaints and defenses regarding him. The same deflections people use are in the Bulls & Wolves threads, this is 14 years old.

Last year Thibs ran the starters into the ground especially Deng and Rose by playing them too many minutes during the regular season.

Is this going to change this year especially considering the compact schedule?

We have enough talent for 2 complete, distinct squads:
1 ) Rose, Rip, Deng, Booz, Noah

2) C.J. Brew, Kyle, Taj, Asik

I am not saying they should do a NHL style line change just that Thibs has to reduce the minutes of our main guys. Our depth should be a big advantage for us in the regular season, but only if Thibs allows the 2nd team to play enough minutes. Also we have to be better rested entering the playoffs.

Do you see Thibs changing his ways?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1144840

[NoDopeOnSundays]

It’s possible that Dadiet just flat out sucks, at least right now. His GLeague numbers look terrible, which indicate he’s just not that good right now. And I mean even for a backup role.

Kolek is just ok but he’s not some major upgrade over Payne. You can say he might not be better than him at all right now. Huk is a defender, don’t think he has much of an offensive game.

I think the FO expected more from guys like Payne, Shamet and Achiuwa. These are the guys you want to take a look at first when you are a win now team. Yes they have sucked but these are the guys that were brought in to help and it doesn’t always work out. Teams bring guys in and it doesn’t work, that happens. But you don’t blame the coach for giving them a chance. These guys are journeymen for a reason

I agree with this. Thibs isn’t holding anyone back. Guys usually get the Thibs bump and have their best seasons when they play with him. They actually play worse when they go elsewhere. With the exception of McBride, the guys coming off the bench probably suck.

Exactly. If you can’t produce under Thibs chances are you probably suck

A post from 14 years ago.

The minutes thing is an exaggerated non-issue.

They're basketball players. They're conditioned to play big minutes, especially considering most of our guys aren't 15-year vets. We didn't lose to the Heat because of a lack of rest. If you play to conserve minutes, then you're not committed to winning basketball. Our bench is good, but not good enough to play extended minutes all the time.

[Jalen Bluntson]

It's also hilarious than you can go back 12 years and find articles from the Bulls and it sounds exactly the same as now.





It's the same with the Wolves, it all sounds exactly the same as now with different names.






LaVine played with a torn ACL for 6 minutes before he was pulled Remember Mitch breaking his ankle against the Celtics and coming back out for the 2nd half before he was finally pulled?

I was a fool for thinking I would be able to avoid the minutes discussion earlier this season. It's just so mind numbing that people defend it at all costs. Ridiculous honestly. The evidence is there for all to see but, people continue to walk around with blinders on. Strawman this and deflection that. Meanwhile we get our asses handed to us by a team that went ten deep missing most of their starting lineup/best rotation players. We barely managed to go 8 deep in that same game.

The deflections are funny to me, because you can just go through old RealGM or Reddit threads about him and you'll see the same exact complaints and defenses regarding him. The same deflections people use are in the Bulls & Wolves threads, this is 14 years old.

Last year Thibs ran the starters into the ground especially Deng and Rose by playing them too many minutes during the regular season.

Is this going to change this year especially considering the compact schedule?

We have enough talent for 2 complete, distinct squads:
1 ) Rose, Rip, Deng, Booz, Noah

2) C.J. Brew, Kyle, Taj, Asik

I am not saying they should do a NHL style line change just that Thibs has to reduce the minutes of our main guys. Our depth should be a big advantage for us in the regular season, but only if Thibs allows the 2nd team to play enough minutes. Also we have to be better rested entering the playoffs.

Do you see Thibs changing his ways?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1144840

That thread is IDENTICAL to this discussion!!! newsflash, Rose and Deng were never the same after that season!! Thibs will never change is the biggest conclusion we can draw from this entire discussion. No matter what side you are on. Thibs has always been this way and has always left teams with injured players after he gets fired. The list is long enough and the evidence is plain as day. He doesn't play his bench and he overplays his starters. Every team. Every year. He loses is the playoffs as a result. Wash, rinse, repeat.

[DOT]

It's also hilarious than you can go back 12 years and find articles from the Bulls and it sounds exactly the same as now.





It's the same with the Wolves, it all sounds exactly the same as now with different names.






LaVine played with a torn ACL for 6 minutes before he was pulled Remember Mitch breaking his ankle against the Celtics and coming back out for the 2nd half before he was finally pulled?

I was a fool for thinking I would be able to avoid the minutes discussion earlier this season. It's just so mind numbing that people defend it at all costs. Ridiculous honestly. The evidence is there for all to see but, people continue to walk around with blinders on. Strawman this and deflection that. Meanwhile we get our asses handed to us by a team that went ten deep missing most of their starting lineup/best rotation players. We barely managed to go 8 deep in that same game.

The deflections are funny to me, because you can just go through old RealGM or Reddit threads about him and you'll see the same exact complaints and defenses regarding him. The same deflections people use are in the Bulls & Wolves threads, this is 14 years old.

Last year Thibs ran the starters into the ground especially Deng and Rose by playing them too many minutes during the regular season.

Is this going to change this year especially considering the compact schedule?

We have enough talent for 2 complete, distinct squads:
1 ) Rose, Rip, Deng, Booz, Noah

2) C.J. Brew, Kyle, Taj, Asik

I am not saying they should do a NHL style line change just that Thibs has to reduce the minutes of our main guys. Our depth should be a big advantage for us in the regular season, but only if Thibs allows the 2nd team to play enough minutes. Also we have to be better rested entering the playoffs.

Do you see Thibs changing his ways?

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1144840

[TheGreenArrow]

Read on Twitter

?s=46&t=W09F6FrMDfp5_y1gKYgF1g

We need to implement this but Thibs would never!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[HEZI]

I agree with this. Thibs isn’t holding anyone back. Guys usually get the Thibs bump and have their best seasons when they play with him. They actually play worse when they go elsewhere. With the exception of McBride, the guys coming off the bench probably suck.

Exactly. If you can’t produce under Thibs chances are you probably suck

A post from 14 years ago.

The minutes thing is an exaggerated non-issue.

They're basketball players. They're conditioned to play big minutes, especially considering most of our guys aren't 15-year vets. We didn't lose to the Heat because of a lack of rest. If you play to conserve minutes, then you're not committed to winning basketball. Our bench is good, but not good enough to play extended minutes all the time.

No idea who that is or what this even means but if you think I share that opinion then explain to me why I keep asking for a trade to upgrade our depth? I can at least recognize that the bench sucks, you on the other hand want to pretend it’s actually good.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Exactly. If you can’t produce under Thibs chances are you probably suck

A post from 14 years ago.

The minutes thing is an exaggerated non-issue.

They're basketball players. They're conditioned to play big minutes, especially considering most of our guys aren't 15-year vets. We didn't lose to the Heat because of a lack of rest. If you play to conserve minutes, then you're not committed to winning basketball. Our bench is good, but not good enough to play extended minutes all the time.

No idea who that is or what this even means but if you think I share that opinion then explain to me why I keep asking for a trade to upgrade our depth? I can at least recognize that the bench sucks, you on the other hand want to pretend it’s actually good.

I never said the bench was good, I said it was net positive on the season, period. You're the one that is deflecting from the coach doing the same thing he's done for 15 years. You're ignoring a pattern, and you're using the same exact defenses present in that thread, it's comical at this point.


The bench didn't play much post Randle injury last season, he didn't even want to play Burks until there was no other option and the guy scored 15ppg on 50% in the playoffs. He maintained an 8 man rotation after we traded for Burks and Bojan, he simply swapped out Precious for Mitch. We've been using an 8 man rotation for months, the Wolves and Bulls used 8 man rotations, he is never going to change.

You're completely ignoring history of a man that is playing out yet again right in front of you.

[Jeff Van Gully]

I also just like, want to point out the irony in saying we can't play anyone on the bench because they suck in the postgame thread of a loss to a team who's missing 4 out of 5 of their starters as well as a bench player and still went deeper into their bench than we did.

They started Caleb Houstan.

As his number one hater due to BAF, and screw that worthless no production perimeter drifting bum forever, I can comfortably affirm that dude **** sucks as an NBA player. And they won.

Not a single guy that played against us is averaging 10 ppg on the season, yet they looked like a decent team

What I'm saying is, if Thibs is as good as people think he is, then he should be able to get 15 mpg out of guys like Dadiet and Kolek. Cause that's what good coaches do, they get the most out of guys

Cause if Thibs gets the most out of guys and he can't get enough out of our bench to outperform the guys the Magic had playing last night, the only logical conclusion from there is whoever's making roster moves is flat-out incompetent and half our roster shouldn't even be in the league.

while i don't like the tone and look of playing down to an opponent, i agree that could have been an opportunity for the dual benefits of exposure and load management.

[Jalen Bluntson]

A post from 14 years ago.

No idea who that is or what this even means but if you think I share that opinion then explain to me why I keep asking for a trade to upgrade our depth? I can at least recognize that the bench sucks, you on the other hand want to pretend it’s actually good.

I never said the bench was good, I said it was net positive on the season, period. You're the one that is deflecting from the coach doing the same thing he's done for 15 years. You're ignoring a pattern, and you're using the same exact defenses present in that thread, it's comical at this point.


The bench didn't play much post Randle injury last season, he didn't even want to play Burks until there was no other option and the guy scored 15ppg on 50% in the playoffs. He maintained an 8 man rotation after we traded for Burks and Bojan, he simply swapped out Precious for Mitch. We've been using an 8 man rotation for months, the Wolves and Bulls used 8 man rotations, he is never going to change.

You're completely ignoring history of a man that is playing out yet again right in front of you.

We are seeing teams openly admit that they run at us in the second half because they know we will be exhausted. Injuries or not, teams know what Thibs does is stupid and they exploit it. No one is trying to argue that our bench is amazing. Ño one. They aren't the scrubs Thibs lawyers claim they are either. He just doesn't use his bench properly AT ALL. He runs his players into the ground. He has always done this. It has never worked out for the players or the teams. Playoff record is abysmal and this is clearly why.

[spree2kawhi]

Knicks are too deep in the season for a Hart to the bench movement. I really wanted that myself, honestly. One of the things that bothered me about the KAT trade is that it basically destroyed our depth because it meant without a shadow of the doubt that Hart -- who prior to the trade was going to lead the bench -- was going in as a starter.

Donte was going back to the bench

Robinson/Randle/OG/Bridges/JB were the projected starters before the trade and Mitch update. Hart was never starting.

I’m glad it never came to this

[spree2kawhi]

No idea who that is or what this even means but if you think I share that opinion then explain to me why I keep asking for a trade to upgrade our depth? I can at least recognize that the bench sucks, you on the other hand want to pretend it’s actually good.

I never said the bench was good, I said it was net positive on the season, period. You're the one that is deflecting from the coach doing the same thing he's done for 15 years. You're ignoring a pattern, and you're using the same exact defenses present in that thread, it's comical at this point.


The bench didn't play much post Randle injury last season, he didn't even want to play Burks until there was no other option and the guy scored 15ppg on 50% in the playoffs. He maintained an 8 man rotation after we traded for Burks and Bojan, he simply swapped out Precious for Mitch. We've been using an 8 man rotation for months, the Wolves and Bulls used 8 man rotations, he is never going to change.

You're completely ignoring history of a man that is playing out yet again right in front of you.

We are seeing teams openly admit that they run at us in the second half because they know we will be exhausted. Injuries or not, teams know what Thibs does is stupid and they exploit it. No one is trying to argue that our bench is amazing. Ño one. They aren't the scrubs Thibs lawyers claim they are either. He just doesn't use his bench properly AT ALL. He runs his players into the ground. He has always done this. It has never worked out for the players or the teams. Playoff record is abysmal and this is clearly why.

Without reading the rest of your discussion I want to say that this post right here strikes me as the truth

[sol537]

Worst 4th quarter team, lowest bench production, guys dropping like flies… welcome to the Thibs experience.

Rather than fire him, maybe they move him to a front office role to save face.